RAM timings that worked fine with 3600 unexpectedly causing crashing with 5900X

Magma

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Feb 1, 2003
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I'm have been running this 32GB kit at 3600MHz with 14-15-15-35 timing for a couple weeks with my Ryzen 5 3600 and Dark Rock Pro 4 air cooler on an MSI X570 Unify board (latest BIOS).

https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-32gb-288-pin-ddr4-sdram/p/N82E16820374048

I got my Ryzen 9 5900X today and swapped out the CPUs, with everything else staying in place. Surprisingly, I was getting game crashes and even a couple reboots. I tried a few different settings but eventually fixed the issue by changing all the memory sub-timings to Auto (still at 3600MHz 1:1:1 ratios), which shows at garbage 18-25-25-58 timings right now with complete stability. I'm a bit confused at why that was happening. While watching HWInfo64 sensor data I never saw a CPU temp over 80c or a DIMM temp over 55c.Is this expected?

I haven't gone back and tried to tighten the timings back down since I'm suspicious that I'm missing some important detail that will let me flip one setting and go right back to the timings that I had before or even better. Is it possible I just need to wait a bit to get another BIOS revision or two out to tweak things for the new CPUs? What might I be missing here?
 

motqalden

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did you manually check the voltage was set to 1.5v as per your kit? sometimes voltage applied for XMP isn't right. Also this has to be B-die memory and i have heard anything over 50c for Bdie can cause stability problems. I have similar timing setup on mine and I ended up pointing a fan at my ram which dropped my temps from high 50's down to low 40 and seems to have helped. supposedly b-die is pretty temp senstive if you are pushing it. Might also be helpfull if you do a slight bump to the SOC voltage like manually setting it to 1.1 or 1.125.
 
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Magma

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The temps are about the same as with the prior CPU but I'll check those things again to be sure. I am not letting it use XMP of 4266MHz so I can keep the 1:1:1 ratios that worked fine with the 3600.Thanks!
 

motqalden

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The temps are about the same as with the prior CPU but I'll check those things again to be sure. I am not letting it use XMP of 4266MHz so I can keep the 1:1:1 ratios that worked fine with the 3600.Thanks!

Well with the 5000 series it is very possible that you can tweak that to 3800mhz with IF at 1900 1/1 with something like 16/16/16/36 timings or perhaps even tighter. If you have not played around with Ryzen Dram Calculator I would give it a go as it has helped me a lot in tweaking my memory and especially sub and tertiary timings and voltages.
 

motqalden

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pretty sure the newest version dropped in may which is v1.7.3 gues it might not have specifics for 5000 series yet but you could extrapolate for the most part i would assume.
 

Magma

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Thanks for the info. To get back to the 3600MHz with 14-15-15-15-35 timings I did indeed to have to manually set the DDR voltage up to 1.50 with the 5900X, unlike with the 3600. The SOC was already bumped up. It seems odd that I'd need to push the voltage up that high to get those timings at 3600MHz when the kit is rated to achieve 4266MHz at 17-18-18-38 with that voltage.

I haven't been able to get IF stable at over 1800MHz no matter what I have tried. I think I'm just going to run it like it is for now. I am sure the urge to push it higher will strike again, possibly after another BIOS version or two makes it easier.
 

thesmokingman

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Thanks for the info. To get back to the 3600MHz with 14-15-15-15-35 timings I did indeed to have to manually set the DDR voltage up to 1.50 with the 5900X, unlike with the 3600. The SOC was already bumped up. It seems odd that I'd need to push the voltage up that high to get those timings at 3600MHz when the kit is rated to achieve 4266MHz at 17-18-18-38 with that voltage.

I haven't been able to get IF stable at over 1800MHz no matter what I have tried. I think I'm just going to run it like it is for now. I am sure the urge to push it higher will strike again, possibly after another BIOS version or two makes it easier.

Go look up gskill's 3600mhz cas 14 ram, check the voltages. They kits run 1.4v to 1.5v. As for 1800mhz... no idea. My 5800x is running 1900 on stock soc voltage, knock on wood.
 

motqalden

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3600MHz with 14-15-15-15-35 is a really good timing. Glad to hear its working (y). I agree enjoy your new chip and tinker later if you have time.
 

MaxHughes

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I'm have been running this 32GB kit at 3600MHz with 14-15-15-35 timing for a couple weeks with my Ryzen 5 3600 and Dark Rock Pro 4 air cooler on an MSI X570 Unify board (latest BIOS).

https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-32gb-288-pin-ddr4-sdram/p/N82E16820374048

I got my Ryzen 9 5900X today and swapped out the CPUs, with everything else staying in place. Surprisingly, I was getting game crashes and even a couple reboots. I tried a few different settings but eventually fixed the issue by changing all the memory sub-timings to Auto (still at 3600MHz 1:1:1 ratios), which shows at garbage 18-25-25-58 timings right now with complete stability. I'm a bit confused at why that was happening. While watching HWInfo64 sensor data I never saw a CPU temp over 80c or a DIMM temp over 55c.Is this expected?

I haven't gone back and tried to tighten the timings back down since I'm suspicious that I'm missing some important detail that will let me flip one setting and go right back to the timings that I had before or even better. Is it possible I just need to wait a bit to get another BIOS revision or two out to tweak things for the new CPUs? What might I be missing here?
3600MHz is an Intel speed. XMP steps are 200MHz. 3000/3200/3400/3600. AMD uses 266MHz steps. 2933/3200/3466/3733. Agesa add on's gave us 133MHz steps, so 3466+133=3600.. This may work on one cpu/board but not all boards. I have seen a hundred complants just like yours. And everyone was an Intel XMP speed. It's like utube wanted it to fail. This info was on AMD's website on launch day for the 1000 series Ryzen chips. Only 'GamerMeld' covered this info.
 

kirbyrj

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3600MHz is an Intel speed. XMP steps are 200MHz. 3000/3200/3400/3600. AMD uses 266MHz steps. 2933/3200/3466/3733. Agesa add on's gave us 133MHz steps, so 3466+133=3600.. This may work on one cpu/board but not all boards. I have seen a hundred complants just like yours. And everyone was an Intel XMP speed. It's like utube wanted it to fail. This info was on AMD's website on launch day for the 1000 series Ryzen chips. Only 'GamerMeld' covered this info.

Good info. I have a set of RAM that works great at 3466, but shits the bed at 3600. I'll have to try it at 3733 :eek:.
 

MaxHughes

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Good info. I have a set of RAM that works great at 3466, but shits the bed at 3600. I'll have to try it at 3733 :eek:.
Yes. How many sticks and single or dual rank can make a difference. 4X8 3200C14 clocked 3466C14 with one click in the bios, but 3733C14 wouldn't boot. Buildzoid cpuldn't get 3800 stable, but got 4000 stable, but with an increase in latency over the stock c14. Samsung B-die works at a bunch of speeds if you don't care about latency. I'm still for 14 14 14 14 34. Small amounts of data to your cpu cashe from your ram is latency. A large dump ssd to ram is MHz speed. 3200 quad channel tops 5000 dual channel. A 12 core Threadripper Pro has 8 channel memory.
 

d3athf1sh

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3600MHz is an Intel speed. XMP steps are 200MHz. 3000/3200/3400/3600. AMD uses 266MHz steps. 2933/3200/3466/3733. Agesa add on's gave us 133MHz steps, so 3466+133=3600.. This may work on one cpu/board but not all boards. I have seen a hundred complants just like yours. And everyone was an Intel XMP speed. It's like utube wanted it to fail. This info was on AMD's website on launch day for the 1000 series Ryzen chips. Only 'GamerMeld' covered this info.
not sure if it's you that keeps talking about 266MHz steps, but AMD themselves say that 3600 is generally reccomended for ryzen performance here's one of the slides from AMD. plus i know my asus board has settings for a whole bunch of different speeds, one being 3600 and i've actually got my 32 gb kit running at 3666/1833 (on a 3800X / Asus Tuf X570 plus) but check this out...

3rd gen ddr4 recc.jpg
 

MaxHughes

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not sure if it's you that keeps talking about 266MHz steps, but AMD themselves say that 3600 is generally reccomended for ryzen performance here's one of the slides from AMD. plus i know my asus board has settings for a whole bunch of different speeds, one being 3600 and i've actually got my 32 gb kit running at 3666/1833 (on a 3800X / Asus Tuf X570 plus) but check this out...

View attachment 310029
Yes.The Agesa mods did add 3000/3400/3600 but 2933/3466/3733 are AMD speeds not Intel XMP. Watching people try XMP for three years is why I say it's hit and miss with XMP. IF is 1:1 at 2666/2933/3200/3466/3733 with the memory clock. AMP speeds. Even the guy that posted the thread said "it worked on a ZEN2 but failed on a ZEN3 chip". IDK on a first GEN Ryzen 3000c15 dominator worked at 2933c15. On a first gen TR it worked at 3000c15. Then I switch to Trident Z 3200c14. BINGO even 3466c14 worked.
 

NickM

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Running my Ripjaws (3600 Cas 16 set) at 3466 Cas 14 on my 2600x. These are Hynix chips. Seems to run fine (only running 1.4 V DRAM and 1.025 SOC)
 
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I'm using 4x8gb 3200 cas14 @ 3733 16-15-15-28 with a 5800x. Stable at 3733 but was unstable @ 3600 with the same timings. 3800 was also unstable.
 

ThreeDee

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hmm .. interesting .. now I have to try some stuff when i get home from work .. Thanks guys!
 

ThreeDee

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With ASRock x570 motherboards (Taichi and Steel Legend) .. running BIOS revisions above AMD AGESA Combo-AM4 V2 1.0.8.0 ..turns stable RAM settings to garbage on Ryzen 3000 chips anyways (3600x,3700x,3800XT) with my Hynix based kits.

That's at 3600 CAS 16 on 3200 CAS 16 RAM. I'll give 3733 a go though with the newer BIOS's and see what happens.
 

Slade

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I got 3866 stable on my 5600 1:1:1 but it took soc voltage to 1.15V and llc to 5 to prevent whea errors when under load. 5K ryzen is tricky to get above 3600 stable.
 

Brackle

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I got 3866 stable on my 5600 1:1:1 but it took soc voltage to 1.15V and llc to 5 to prevent whea errors when under load. 5K ryzen is tricky to get above 3600 stable.
I am still unable to get 3800 to work. I am hoping with the new bios coming out very soon, that it will correct this issue.
 
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