Project H20-Micro a Watercooled 3 Liter system with GTX970

QinX

Limp Gawd
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Intro
I’ve be very intrigued by the Alienware Alpha and the ASUS ROG GR8, systems that are marketed as console replacements. However after doing research on them one thing became evident that made me cry.
The graphics card in them aren’t as good as the can be in that size. Don’t get me wrong we should all be happy they are trying to make a Console replacement, but they only slightly improve on graphics with the Alienware Alpha listing “GTX Graphics” or better known as GTX 860M and the ASUS ROG GR8 has a GTX750Ti.


The Goals
I have 5 goals that I wish to accomplish with this build
1) Under 3 Liters in volume
2) 4K Gaming
3) Watercooled CPU and GPU
4) Clean design
5) Quiet when gaming

The Specs
CPU - Intel Core i7-4790
GPU - Palit GeForce GTX 970 4GB
Motherboard - Asus Q87T
RAM - 2x8GB SODIMM DDR3 1600MHz
Storage - SanDisk X110 128GB (might upgrade it to 256GB)
WiFi - Intel Dual Band Wireless-AC 7260 Plus Bluetooth
PSU - HD-PLEX 250W DC-DC board and 350W External power brick

The Hurdles
In order to get under 3 Liters AND fit a complete watercooling loop in it I’m doing a lot of custom designing for it, here is the shortlist:

CPU Waterblock
Full cover GPU Waterblock
PCIe 4x to 16x Riser PCB
Custom 2x80mm Radiator
Reservoir
Case

The Progress
I have already made a lot of progress which you can find right here

Case
This design is close to ready, once I have all the internal parts completly laid out I will be ordering the case, I would like to hear your opinions on the aesthetic of this case.
Version 1


Version 2


PCIe Riser PCB
I made my initial design as seen and ordered it. Almost finished and ready for testing



Radiator
A supplier of the company I work at made me this custom radiator. You can see a 120mm Fan and a 280mm radiator as a size comparison


CPU Waterblock
I finished the design form my CPU Waterblock


GPU Waterblock
No real progress to show yet, I’ve been doing some designing based of web images but until I’ve gotten my own GTX970 I won’t have a final design to show

Power Supply
So I’m going with a Thin M-ITX motherboard together with a HD-PLEX 250W DC-DC board and an external 350W Power brick. The way it is going to be setup is like follows:
Thin M-ITX motherboards generate their own voltage onboard, just like any notebook motherboard. I have a DC Jack on the back I/O that supplier 20V and the motherboard turns it in 12V, 5V, 3.3V, you name it.
However, Thin M-ITX motherboard are not designed to run with discrete graphics cards, the motherboard only has a physical PCIe 3.0 4x slot and those are limited to only supply 25W instead of the 75W a PCIe 16x slot can deliver, also there are no PCIe 6pin or 8pin connectors present.


This is where the HD-Plex 250W DC-DC board comes in. It is meant for small systems to have an external brick but still have the 24pin, CPU 8Pin, GPU 8Pin and some sata connectivity. I’ll only be using the GPU 8Pin and the board 12V rail to supply the GPU with power.
The PCIe raiser disconnects the 12V that normally comes from the PCIe slot itself in order to allow the HD-Plex board to supply all the needed 12V power to the GPU.

I still have a ways to go but I’m making good progress.
 
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WiSK

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Hi!

There aren't any waterblocks for the "ITX" versions of 970s. If you want to water cool a 970 then it's overall smaller with a reference PCB.
 

QinX

Limp Gawd
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Hi!

There aren't any waterblocks for the "ITX" versions of 970s. If you want to water cool a 970 then it's overall smaller with a reference PCB.
In order to get the size down to what it needs to be the system will sport a custom CPU and GPU waterblock.
 
D

Deleted member 222586

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In order to get the size down to what it needs to be the system will sport a custom CPU and GPU waterblock.
Good luck keeping a reasonable price, then. Let alone the fact that the system won't be upgradeable nor will have optimal cooling capacities.
 

WiSK

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Regardless of a custom block, the PCB of the "ITX" / mini versions of the 970 are actually larger than the reference 970 PCB. In order to fit the compact air cooler, Asus, Gigabyte, etc have had to make the PCB taller.

So if size is your goal, and the GPU will certainly be watercooled, then as I said, 970 cards with reference PCB are overall smaller.
 

rawrr

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Regardless of a custom block, the PCB of the "ITX" / mini versions of the 970 are actually larger than the reference 970 PCB. In order to fit the compact air cooler, Asus, Gigabyte, etc have had to make the PCB taller.

So if size is your goal, and the GPU will certainly be watercooled, then as I said, 970 cards with reference PCB are overall smaller.
The new Zotac ITX one is reference height :)
 

QinX

Limp Gawd
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Good luck keeping a reasonable price, then. Let alone the fact that the system won't be upgradeable nor will have optimal cooling capacities.
True that upgradability will be close to 0, however it would be the same type of system such as a ASUS GR8 or Alienware Alpha.

Regardless of a custom block, the PCB of the "ITX" / mini versions of the 970 are actually larger than the reference 970 PCB. In order to fit the compact air cooler, Asus, Gigabyte, etc have had to make the PCB taller.

So if size is your goal, and the GPU will certainly be watercooled, then as I said, 970 cards with reference PCB are overall smaller.
I misread you reply is see, I will be looking into the reference pcb as well then. save a couple of mm. In terms of IO I would love if some manufacturers release single slot IO cards, let the air cooler be 2 slots but give watercoolers the option to actually make the card single slot with a waterblock.

Edit: Seems PNY answered my wishes already with https://www.pny.com/GTX_970_4096MB_GDDR5_PCI-E_3_0 being a single slot IO card.
Asked them what the size of the PCB is, though is seems slightly longer then 17cm.
 
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akromatic

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it would make more sense to use a T series processor then a K series.

I'd definitely be interested if it has a T series i7 and a window on the case
 

babadook

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I'm curious how you want to get below 3 litres.

A mini-itx mainboard is 17x17x5 cm for a volume of around 1.5 litres all by itself. A short 970 comes in at 17x11x4 cm or 0.75 litres. A single-fan radiator is at least 14x12x3 cm (0.5 litres) and it's fan 12x12x2.5 cm (0.36 litres).

The bare volume of these essential components adds up to 3 litres already. That's without the pump, internal power board and some minimal breathing space for the fan or some hypothetical space to route the tubes.
And you haven't built a case around it yet.
 

iFreilicht

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I'm curious how you want to get below 3 litres.

A mini-itx mainboard is 17x17x5 cm for a volume of around 1.5 litres all by itself. A short 970 comes in at 17x11x4 cm or 0.75 litres. A single-fan radiator is at least 14x12x3 cm (0.5 litres) and it's fan 12x12x2.5 cm (0.36 litres).

The bare volume of these essential components adds up to 3 litres already. That's without the pump, internal power board and some minimal breathing space for the fan or some hypothetical space to route the tubes.
And you haven't built a case around it yet.
You have to remember, the GPU will only take up one slot when watercooled. Also OP said he would use a custom waterblock, so he may try to make one that incorporates a pump between GPU and CPU.

Also, you don't need a res in a watercooling loop. It of course makes everything easier, but if you know how to do it, you can do it without.

Still, 4 Liters would be more realistic.
 

QinX

Limp Gawd
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it would make more sense to use a T series processor then a K series.

I'd definitely be interested if it has a T series i7 and a window on the case
Well seeing as I can support up to a 4790K which is 88W TDP anything below it will also be possible.

I'm curious how you want to get below 3 litres.

A mini-itx mainboard is 17x17x5 cm for a volume of around 1.5 litres all by itself. A short 970 comes in at 17x11x4 cm or 0.75 litres. A single-fan radiator is at least 14x12x3 cm (0.5 litres) and it's fan 12x12x2.5 cm (0.36 litres).

The bare volume of these essential components adds up to 3 litres already. That's without the pump, internal power board and some minimal breathing space for the fan or some hypothetical space to route the tubes.
And you haven't built a case around it yet.
All valid, this is what I meant by doing custom stuff. Believe me that my current design is sub 3 Liters.
 
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babadook

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All valid, this is what I meant by doing custom stuff. Believe me that my current design is sub 3 Liters.
Can't wait to see you design. Honestly!
My thoughts right now:

Minimum footprint is obviously 17x17 centimeters.

1. A risercard folds the gpu across the mainboard. Folding away from the mainboard as in steambox style cases will always result in too much volume. Folding under the mainboard as in the A4 concept would increase the footprint as the tubes would have to routed on one side.

2. The internal power board fits next to the gpu above the mainboard.

3. You probably have to use Thin MITX board.

4. You must have modded the 970's dvi connectors to make it single slot.

5. You use slim radiator. Maybe you've found one slimmer than 30mm?

6. You use a slim 120mm fan.

So you got a sandwhich of 17x17cm footprint.
Bottom layer is thin-mitx (3cm), next layer is gpu/psu (2cm), then the radiator/pump (3cm) and a slim fan on top (1.2cm). You need at least 0.3cm breathing room between gpu/psu layer and radiator.
Your sandwhich is 0.5cm high, giving it a bare volume of 2.75 litres. Even with a unibody style case of 1mm thickness that almost shrinkwraps around that sandwhich, you're breaking 3 litres...

Color me intrigued!
 
D

Deleted member 222586

Guest
Can't wait to see you design. Honestly!
My thoughts right now:

Minimum footprint is obviously 17x17 centimeters.

1. A risercard folds the gpu across the mainboard. Folding away from the mainboard as in steambox style cases will always result in too much volume. Folding under the mainboard as in the A4 concept would increase the footprint as the tubes would have to routed on one side.

2. The internal power board fits next to the gpu above the mainboard.

3. You probably have to use Thin MITX board.

4. You must have modded the 970's dvi connectors to make it single slot.

5. You use slim radiator. Maybe you've found one slimmer than 30mm?

6. You use a slim 120mm fan.

So you got a sandwhich of 17x17cm footprint.
Bottom layer is thin-mitx (3cm), next layer is gpu/psu (2cm), then the radiator/pump (3cm) and a slim fan on top (1.2cm). You need at least 0.3cm breathing room between gpu/psu layer and radiator.
Your sandwhich is 0.5cm high, giving it a bare volume of 2.75 litres. Even with a unibody style case of 1mm thickness that almost shrinkwraps around that sandwhich, you're breaking 3 litres...

Color me intrigued!
I don't know, it doesn't seem feasible at all.
 

iFreilicht

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I don't know, it doesn't seem feasible at all.
To me it sounded like the primary goal was a custom build, small production would only be done when there was any interest.

I think it is an interesting project, and it is feasible in that context. But I agree that selling the case wouldn't make a great deal of sense.
 

QinX

Limp Gawd
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Can't wait to see you design. Honestly!
My thoughts right now:

Minimum footprint is obviously 17x17 centimeters.

1. A risercard folds the gpu across the mainboard. Folding away from the mainboard as in steambox style cases will always result in too much volume. Folding under the mainboard as in the A4 concept would increase the footprint as the tubes would have to routed on one side.

2. The internal power board fits next to the gpu above the mainboard.

3. You probably have to use Thin MITX board.

4. You must have modded the 970's dvi connectors to make it single slot.

5. You use slim radiator. Maybe you've found one slimmer than 30mm?

6. You use a slim 120mm fan.

So you got a sandwhich of 17x17cm footprint.
Bottom layer is thin-mitx (3cm), next layer is gpu/psu (2cm), then the radiator/pump (3cm) and a slim fan on top (1.2cm). You need at least 0.3cm breathing room between gpu/psu layer and radiator.
Your sandwhich is 0.5cm high, giving it a bare volume of 2.75 litres. Even with a unibody style case of 1mm thickness that almost shrinkwraps around that sandwhich, you're breaking 3 litres...

Color me intrigued!
You are pretty much on the money.
Correct on: 1, 2, 3, 5, 6

4: I was planning to do but as mentioned earlier I am swapping my ASUS GTX970 mini for the PNY GTX970, smaller and no soldering required, I even get more IO with it.

5: radiator will be custom made for me 29mm thick

6: they are slim fans but not 120mm.

I have tested the radiator+fan combination and it will be make for a very silent system unless you really push to ambient temperatures over 30C/86F.

They way I have it all layed out i'm staying under 3 Liters with the change of GPU I can reduce the footprint some more.

I'm positioning the Res+Pump in such a way that you can have the system in 2 positions, horizontal like the Logic Supply MC600 and vertical like the Lian-Li PC-Q12.

To me it sounded like the primary goal was a custom build, small production would only be done when there was any interest.

I think it is an interesting project, and it is feasible in that context. But I agree that selling the case wouldn't make a great deal of sense.
It's a Custom Build first! the more interest to more likely I can get lower prices for some of the custom parts. Though I have decent contacts through my regular work already so pricing shouldn't be awful.

Selling just a kit(Case, Waterblocks etc.) might not be the way to go, unless you want to tinker with building it yourself and save a few bucks on the normal hardware.
 
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QinX

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What kind of external power supply do you plan on using?
I have a ASUS G750 for my work which has a 19.5V 11.8A brick, so I'm using that for now.
I'll be buying the Hp CLGYA-0802 a 350W/20V/17.5A brick soon to have a dedicated external power supply. Now I need to switch between testing and using my notebok :p
 

Bieberfever

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The one orientation I've put together on a test bench that does work (using a PNY 970 as well) is with an EK-Supremacy and a 60mm riser that puts the graphics card back over the motherboard. With a 60mm riser you end up with about a 5mm gap between the underside of GPU and the top of the Supremacy. This would easily put the board and GPU inside of a ~2 liter footprint. I can do photos if people want. It works out quite nicely.
 

dondan

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3L with water is possible if the radiator goes outside. With aircoolling 3,2L could possible. If you use ThinITX and a HDPlex with a modified power on signal solution. Because Thinitx has no 24pin connector. I have very similar idears for my next case, but all this is only possible with an external brick.


Here are some pictures out of an german forum where i start a thread how it could be possible:




http://extreme.pcgameshardware.de/c...tem-mit-gtx-750-ti-gtx-760-unter-3-liter.html
 

QinX

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The one orientation I've put together on a test bench that does work (using a PNY 970 as well) is with an EK-Supremacy and a 60mm riser that puts the graphics card back over the motherboard. With a 60mm riser you end up with about a 5mm gap between the underside of GPU and the top of the Supremacy. This would easily put the board and GPU inside of a ~2 liter footprint. I can do photos if people want. It works out quite nicely.
I currently have a total height of 47.6mm.

Bieberfever, can you measure the PNY 970 for me? is it actually ITX sized eg. 17cm?
I contacted PNY and they say they can't measure it because they tech support doesn't have a PCB -_-'

3L with water is possible if the radiator goes outside. With aircoolling 3,2L could possible. If you use ThinITX and a HDPlex with a modified power on signal solution. Because Thinitx has no 24pin connector. I have very similar idears for my next case, but all this is only possible with an external brick.
You are also part of my inspiration for this case with the A4 case, been lurking there quite a bit.

I've got the radiator on the inside, again it's a custom radiator so it's made to fit.
Currently I'm hovering just below 2.8L the switching from the taller ASUS GTX970 to the PNY 970 will give me almost 1cm reduction in width so that puts be just under 2,7L.

Also because I'm not supplying the CPU with the HD-PLEX I'm well under the 250W max so hoping that it can stay passive.
 

Bieberfever

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Pretty sure it is ITX (17.1), but I'll measure it when I get home tonight. Also I have the Galax card as well which I believe is also reference design and comes out to about 17.4cm with the shroud and everything. Also if you're looking at that CAD orientation Dondan, you can actually put a Flex ATX PSU under the riser and it will fit perfectly while only adding about 40mm to the case height. Athena Power makes a 500W 150mm PSU now and their 400W was quite well reviewed last year (yes I know Athena traditionally has a reputation for being crap).
 

Ulti

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As a user who has ditched his build for an Alienware Alpha, I think something like this is very interesting.

Only potential problem is pricing. With everything custom, I doubt this will work out cheap.

I'm actually surprised at how cheap they sell the Alienware Alpha for.
 

Siba

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Do these designs also consider that a lot of mobos have a 4 or 8pin cpu power connector to the motherboard? How would something like that be plugged in with the video card in the way? sata cables? video card power? All of the other power and cable connections for the rest of the components?
 

Bieberfever

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If anyone (OP included) is interested in doing a custom/reproducable ultra SFF gaming case I have one of these (http://carbide3d.com) coming in the next month or so for the purposes of making such a case. Could use some help/expertise.
 

QinX

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As a user who has ditched his build for an Alienware Alpha, I think something like this is very interesting.

Only potential problem is pricing. With everything custom, I doubt this will work out cheap.

I'm actually surprised at how cheap they sell the Alienware Alpha for.
I'm from the Netherlands and the Alpha is not avaible here yet, but I've taken the parts they use and put the in a partpicker for the US market. Similar hardware to the top model Alpha would be about $ 769.33 including the OS. So it's OK for the price given the small size. How is the noise from the Alpha under load?

Do these designs also consider that a lot of mobos have a 4 or 8pin cpu power connector to the motherboard? How would something like that be plugged in with the video card in the way? sata cables? video card power? All of the other power and cable connections for the rest of the components?
My design is all about Thin M-ITX motherboards, they are a standard for even smaller(in height) motherboards then normal M-ITX motherboards. Part of this standard is the lack of any cables for power delivery and no need for an internal power supply. You just plug in a 12V up to 19V external power supply(like you get with most notebooks) and all the conversions to 5V 12V 3.3V etc are done on the motherboard itself.

Note: Most Thin M-ITX board are targeted at DIY All In Ones, not the watercooler kind but the Screen+Computer kind.

However as you state how to supply hard drives with power? and GPU? My board has a SATA power to SATA power connector to connect a couple of drives. But GPU support is mostly non existent for Thin M-ITX, they don't have the power circuitry to provide power and most don't even have a PCIe slot let alone a 16x slot. But I'm using a small board that supplies only the GPU with 12V power and this motherboard has a PCIe 3.0 4x slot.
 

Ulti

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I'm from the Netherlands and the Alpha is not avaible here yet, but I've taken the parts they use and put the in a partpicker for the US market. Similar hardware to the top model Alpha would be about $ 769.33 including the OS. So it's OK for the price given the small size. How is the noise from the Alpha under load?
I'm just comparing the base configs and it basically equalled to what it would cost me if I built it myself. Maybe parts in the UK cost a bit more. I then replaced it with 8GB RAM and an i5 myself as it was cheaper than to get it through Alienware like that.

Whilst idle or with light loads, the Alpha is effectively silent. However, when I'm playing an MMO for quite long or running benchmarks like Prime95 it does get whisper loud (new term?). Think of a 120mm fan spinning at around 1200rpm. I'm used to really silent machines (tend to go fanless on an i5 with no more than 2 120mm case fans spinning at 800rpm max and I don't go for top of the range GPUs) so the Alienware Alpha did seem loud to me at first but when I use my parent's NUC or my brother's machine, I see that the Alpha in comparison is actually pretty quiet.
 
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QinX

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How do you syncing power on of the 12V dc board and the motherboard itself? Do you use this powerboad: http://www.mini-box.com/DCDC-USB-200?sc=8&category=981 ?
I have the ASUS GTX 970 Mini here and have been testing with it. Tomorrow i'm returning it to swap for the PNY GTX970.

I've plugged in the PCIe 8pin from the HD-PLEX 250W to the GPU and just run it. Although I've been getting insane coil whine when the system is idle everything seemed stable. I do however notice lower performance. a GX970 should get almost 4500 point in unigine Valley
http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/graphics/2014/09/19/nvidia-geforce-gtx-970-review/10
but if I run the same settings and benchmark I get almost 3800 points. I think the card is not getting enough power, though it did pull around 180W which should be enough or it's starved for bandwidth. the ASUS Q87T I'm using only has PCIe 3.0 4x, but that shouldn't bottleneck it a lot.
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/NVIDIA/GTX_980_PCI-Express_Scaling/21.html
GTX980 only suffers 6% performance hit at low resolutions but only 1% at 4K

However it is not connected directly to the CPU but goes through the Q87 PCH.

Not really sure what the problem is.

Edit:
I'm making a PCIe 4x to 16x riser that takes of the 12V rail that normally comes from the motherboard, that should resolve the syncing issues that might occur.

I've made a quick render of the case design I have now.
 
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Siba

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What are the current dimensions of it as shown in that picture? Do you have a picture that would show the internal layout/orientation of things as well?
 

SaperPL

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Hmm, its a nice thing that you can have 95% of performance on PCI-E x4.

I think optimal dimensions should be something like 285 width, 175 depth and 50mm height making it 2.5L case for TM-ITX + ITX VGA with external brick.

Nice platform, that TM-ITX is.
 

QinX

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Hmm, its a nice thing that you can have 95% of performance on PCI-E x4.

I think optimal dimensions should be something like 285 width, 175 depth and 50mm height making it 2.5L case for TM-ITX + ITX VGA with external brick.

Nice platform, that TM-ITX is.
You are fairly close to the actual dimensions, however you must at a little more depth and width because of the watercooling components.
 

SaperPL

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Yeah, I know - I just stated that if you're using something low profile like NH-L9 and VGA lays next to board, not above, that would be enough space to fit those components there. Don't know about the PSU though.

I also just noticed that thin mITX doesn't give you the PEG cables so you need another psu connected for the card if its something bigger than GTX 750TI.
 

veryrarium

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Hi, I saw your thread first at OCN so posted a question there, to which you have already answered on OCN and thank you for your reply. Here is the exchange we had:
veryrarium said:
A friend of mine I consulted warned me that letting the motherboard provide 12V/3.3V power (up to 25W max) through the PCIe x4 socket which is down converted from the 19V input and providing auxiliary 12V power from the 6pin/8pin PEG connector(s) that is sourced either from the same power power brick down converted to 12V via a DC-DC board or from a 12V power brick is risky when I can't make sure the actual voltage measurements of the two 12V inputs are close enough to each other and possibly cause a disaster. Also it's cumbersome to make a relay to trigger a secondary power input. I thought about using the on-board SATA power port to draw 12V to the GPU, but didn't think it was going to be enough for GTX970.
QinX said:
I'm making a custom PCIe 4x to 16x riser and am going to implement 12V supply for it, so the GPU shouldn't take any 12V from the motherboard. the PCIe 6 pins are being supplied by a HD-PLEX 250W DC-DC board that I have soldered a short on to always keep on. I'm looking into making a PCB that is made to only supply stable 12V instead of have all the circuitry for 3.3V 5V etc. It would be much like the daughter board of the ASUS Impact series but then to supply 12V to the GPU.
Assuming you haven't done a custom PCB work yet, it looks like you are already operating Q87T with GTX970 with two independent 12V sources into GTX970 without frying anything.

I think the card is not getting enough power, though it did pull around 180W which should be enough or it's starved for bandwidth. the ASUS Q87T I'm using only has PCIe 3.0 4x, but that shouldn't bottleneck it a lot.
This "180W" is exactly what you are measuring? The power consumption of the entire system or the whole GPU or just the power fed through the PCIe 8pin PEG? If the entire system, then is that the AC measurement on the wall?

Also, if I understand your answer correctly, power is constantly fed to the GPU whether the power to the motherboard is on or off. I don't think that's what people like to have, hence dondan's question on how you're planning to let the power-on of the Thin Mini-ITX trigger the 12V input to the GPU. I was thinking you're going to provide a relay.

Another thing I have been wondering and I believe I have asked this question in dondan's A4 thread when we talked about a Thin Mini-ITX and high-end GPU combo, but I still don't know the answer (yes it's probably a dumb question but I'm clueless on this): when the GPU is being asked to do the kind of task that would draw, say, 50W from the mobo thru a PCIe x16 socket, how does it work if it is actually connected via PCIe x1/x4/x8 that is set to 25W max? Is it designed so that whatever the extra amount is required over 25W will be drawn from the PEG connector, or will the GPU simply try to cope with the task with less power and throttle down?
 

veryrarium

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If anyone (OP included) is interested in doing a custom/reproducable ultra SFF gaming case I have one of these (http://carbide3d.com) coming in the next month or so for the purposes of making such a case. Could use some help/expertise.
Yes I'm interested in this. (Interested in QinX's and dondan's solutions as well.) When you said a 60mm riser, did you mean a 60mm long flex riser or a rigid left-angle (left when looking from the rear ports) riser that is 60mm tall from the top surface of the mobo? In the latter case it seems a bit too tall to achieve an USFF size.
 

iFreilicht

[H]ard|Gawd
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Yeah, I know - I just stated that if you're using something low profile like NH-L9 and VGA lays next to board, not above, that would be enough space to fit those components there. Don't know about the PSU though.

I also just noticed that thin mITX doesn't give you the PEG cables so you need another psu connected for the card if its something bigger than GTX 750TI.
mITX has a small 2pin Molex MiniFit Jr. Connector you can supply 19V through, but the current Gigabyte thin-mITX with a 1150 socket have a wide input range of 12V to 19V. They said that only in a press release, and I asked customer support about it, they confirmed the information.

So you can use the HDPlex PSU to supply voltage to all components, including the motherboard.
 

SaperPL

[H]ard|Gawd
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Yeah, again, I know that. It's just It would be good if you were to support card from the thin mITX itself without HDPlex PSU.

If standard was meant to support AIO with external PSU why couldn't they integrate something like hdplex into board and draw power from it to other things like the AIO screen.

If you look at it this way you'll notice that those AIO's will have its own power supplies and the board connector which is unused if I'm not wrong.
 

dondan

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Another thing I have been wondering and I believe I have asked this question in dondan's A4 thread when we talked about a Thin Mini-ITX and high-end GPU combo, but I still don't know the answer (yes it's probably a dumb question but I'm clueless on this): when the GPU is being asked to do the kind of task that would draw, say, 50W from the mobo thru a PCIe x16 socket, how does it work if it is actually connected via PCIe x1/x4/x8 that is set to 25W max? Is it designed so that whatever the extra amount is required over 25W will be drawn from the PEG connector, or will the GPU simply try to cope with the task with less power and throttle down?
As i maybe told, i have a thread in a german forum where i shared the idea of an 3L thin itx system for about 7 month. But not for doing it be my own, only share how it could be possible and the hope that somebody else will do it. And somebody in germany actually do it. He said, that the PCIe gives 25W and the other remainig 50W will the card pull of the 6 pin or 8pin connector. So you dont need to inject it directly in the raiser.

By the way here is a picture how to sync hdplex and thin itx out of my thread:



(the picture is some month old so i don't remove the powercable to the riser)

You can also try to contact Larry from HDplex or Frank of Picoboxfactory to produce a DC board that converts 19-24v to 12v with 250W and only pcie plugs. Syncing could be done by a special cable between sata-power port and dcboard. Perfect would be a thin itx board that has already 8pin pcie out and 16x pcie port.
 
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Siba

Limp Gawd
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Keep in mind that Nvidia with the 9xx series has implemented something similar to Intel's FIVR, which means a 145w TDP does not translate directly to 145w of power consumption.

It's a gross simplification I think, but those cards could draw 250w of power for 1/2 of a second, and 40w for the other half of a second to average out at 145w of total heat to be dissipated for that second. I think it's a large part of why Maxwell cards have a lot of complaints about coil whine - the power regulators are switching many times, on the order of multiple times every few hundred nanoseconds? This switching could place a lot more load on the PSU since the consumption swings so wildly and quickly

Here we go, a source:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/nvidia-geforce-gtx-980-970-maxwell,3941-11.html
"Even though the average power consumption is only 176 W, the GPU draws almost 300 W when it's necessary. Above that, the GPU slows down."
 
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