Polaris 20/21/12 as RX580/570/560/550.

[Shintai]

https://benchlife.info/radeon-rx-500-with-14nm-finfet-lpp-process-03192017/

Polaris 10 gets renamed to Polaris 20 and will be in the RX580 and RX570 cards.
Polaris 11 gets renamed to Polaris 21 and will be in the RX560 card.
Polaris 12 is a new chip and will be in the RX550 card. (640SP)

 

[TheLAWNoob]

You missed the most important change: they are going from 14nm LPE to 14nm LPP.

AMD is going to join the frequency game with nVidia now.

Maybe they will clock the 480 high enough to compete with the 1070, and market it as the RX 580.

 

[Shintai]

You missed the most important change: they are going from 14nm LPE to 14nm LPP.

AMD is going to join the frequency game with nVidia now.

Maybe they will clock the 480 high enough to compete with the 1070, and market it as the RX 580.

Polaris already uses 14LPP.

 

[TheLAWNoob]

Then that means the article is complete bullshit.

 

[Ieldra]

Then that means the article is complete bullshit.

Indeed, and some "reputable" hardware websites have been parroting this bullshit about LPP/LPE and looking like the damned fools they are !

 

[Rvenger]

I still bet this will clock higher. No point in a rebrand unless it has improved.

 

[Ieldra]

I still bet this will clock higher. No point in a rebrand unless it has improved.

What are you betting on

 

[Decko87]

There's nothing indicating the chips will be different at all, the 290x and 390x were the same chip as well. I'd like some improvement(anyone would), but I wouldn't bank on it what so ever.

 

[Rvenger]

Hopefully see nothing short of 1400mhz clocks. Would GDDR5x give any performance benefit over 8gbps? My guess is it would drive the price out of midrange though.

 

[whateverer]

Hopefully see nothing short of 1400mhz clocks. Would GDDR5x give any performance benefit over 8gbps? My guess is it would drive the price out of midrange though.

Nvidia already announced 9GHz GDDR5 for the GTX 1060 refresh, so AMD would be stupid not to offer the same.

http://diit.cz/clanek/pascal-refresh-geforce-gtx-1060-gtx-1080

The 390X refresh (5% faster core, 20% faster ram) got us a 10% performance boost.

The only problem with the Polaris 10 refresh is that, while the 290 was just a hair slower than the 970, and the 290X was severely beaten by the 980, the 10% faster 390 sailed past the 970, while that 10% performance boost put the 390X fairly close tot he 980, for a lot less.

The RX 480 is nowhere near that level of performance - it would need a 20-30% boost to make things interesting, and I just don't see that happening from process improvements alone. You'd also need to jump up to GDDR5X to power it, driving up price to 1070 territory.

But I definitely believe a re-brand is coming, because the RX 480's price has fallen drastically over the last few months.

 

[TheLAWNoob]

I still bet this will clock higher. No point in a rebrand unless it has improved.

Theres the R9 380 and 370 that made no sense to rebrand. Also the 280X if you assume all 7970 owners are smart enough to overclock it to 1Ghz or more.

I just hope Vega can clock higher than Polaris. My 480 is not nearly good enough for 4k.

 

[NKD]

Theres the R9 380 and 370 that made no sense to rebrand. Also the 280X if you assume all 7970 owners are smart enough to overclock it to 1Ghz or more.

I just hope Vega can clock higher than Polaris. My 480 is not nearly good enough for 4k.

if these can clock to 1450-1500 with an overclock that is a good sign for Vega. Since Vega NCU is confirmed by AMD to have higher clock design, so those should benefit from the better process. If Vega can get 1450 to 1500 boost it should do pretty well against 1080 and sneak in between the 1080 and 1080ti at the very least. I think vega will land at around 1500 boost clock.

 

[Shintai]

Hopefully see nothing short of 1400mhz clocks. Would GDDR5x give any performance benefit over 8gbps? My guess is it would drive the price out of midrange though.

No GDDR5X controller to begin with. Its plain rebrands with clock as the only option to change.

 

[CSI_PC]

Indeed, and some "reputable" hardware websites have been parroting this bullshit about LPP/LPE and looking like the damned fools they are !

And the irony is those sites mentioning this LPE/LPP also reported back in rumour days of Polaris 4xx the Chinese senior engineer profile that clearly mentioned LPP as part the background development
Short memory these sites.
Cheers

 

[razor1]

Hmm is there an LPE 14nm process? I though 14nm from GF and Samsung was one process (LPP) for all design types lol??????

Where did LPE come from?

 

[CSI_PC]

Hmm is there an LPE 14nm process? I though 14nm from GF and Samsung was one process (LPP) for all design types lol??????

Where did LPE come from?

LPE was 1st followed by LPP then I think by LPCC (not really different to LPP from a performance perspective), and Samsung now has LPU although they are very vague about performance benefit (do not put it on any of their performance charts while happily showing 10nm LPE and 10 LPP) but mention cost benefits so probably same performance while slightly better voltage at cheaper cost model.
Cheers

 

[razor1]

LPE was entirely replaced by LPP was my undestanding. (14nm)

 

[Shintai]

Samsung had LPE for mobile devices. Glofo never had it.

 

[dook43]

390x has 8GB and 1500mhz capable gddr5. Its a much better card than the 290 on newer games due to that

 

[cfdfireman]

390x has 8GB and 1500mhz capable gddr5. Its a much better card than the 290 on newer games due to that

Agreed. My 390x has no issues with any game I have thrown at it @ 2560x1440

 

[Shintai]

 

[N4CR]

The only problem with the Polaris 10 refresh is, while the 290 was just a hair slower than the 970, and the 290X was severely beaten by the 980, the 10% faster 390 sailed past the 970, while that 10% performance boost put the 390X fairly close tot he 980, for a lot less.

What century old 980 vs 290x benchmarks are you looking at - launch? The throttling, reference 290x was beaten, sure. These days it's much closer with non ref cards. Case in point - the 290X and the 390X are the same chip with slightly different memory latencies... in fact people have flashed the rare 8gb 290X to 390X without issue.

I really don't see them re-spinning the 480 to occupy '580' territory. It would drag the performance tier bump back to last years mid range tech... Maybe instead for 570 and below. Vega, like most other past releases should occupy the top two slots. E.g. 290 + 290x, 7970/50 etc.
Thing is we know they are using the 580/590 from past leaks/slips on their website... so if not, then Vega is its' own product like Fury again and they'll tarnish the 80/90 nomenclature with mid range Polaris? Don't see them doing that tbh... hurt them in the past before.

View attachment 21222

Hoping like fuck that's fake, C7 to E7 revision.... everything else checks out though god damnit.

 

[Darakian]

Considering these will launch either along side vega or within a month I doubt people will really care that much.

 

[whateverer]

What century old 980 vs 290x benchmarks are you looking at - launch? The throttling, reference 290x was beaten, sure. These days it's much closer with non ref cards. Case in point - the 290X and the 390X are the same chip with slightly different memory latencies... in fact people have flashed the rare 8gb 290X to 390X without issue.

Not quite. The 3rd-party coolers did help with the noise and throttling, but they still overclocked like shit on-release. Early Hawaii yields were crap, which was why they couldn't meet demand for the first year.

But the 290X was ALWAYS slower than the GTX 980, and slightly faster than the 970. But I suppose benchmarks form February 2017 are "old?"

https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/MSI/GTX_1060_Armor/30.html

TODAY, The GTX 980 is STILL faster than a 290X = 390, even today. See here, where the GTX 970 is slightly slower than the 390, and the GTX 980 is faster. This is the same as things were at-launch.

STOCK 980 >= STOCK 390X > 390/290X > 970 > 290.

The Maxwell cards overclock significantly higher, so if you want to talk factory-overclocked performance improvement, you're barking up the wrong tree comparing Hawaii with GM204.

 

[Master_shake_]

is 45 higher than 42?

i always forget.

but it's 4k so.... you know i must be cherry picking.

 

[ccityinstaller]

Not quite. The 3rd-party coolers did help with the noise and throttling, but they still overclocked like shit on-release. Early Hawaii yields were crap, which was why they couldn't meet demand for the first year.

But the 290X was ALWAYS slower than the GTX 980, and slightly faster than the 970. But I suppose benchmarks form February 2017 are "old?"



TODAY, The GTX 980 is STILL faster than a 290X = 390, even today. See here, where the GTX 970 is slightly slower than the 390, and the GTX 980 is faster. This is the same as things were at-launch.

STOCK 980 >= STOCK 390X > 390/290X > 970 > 290.

The Maxwell cards overclock significantly higher, so if you want to talk factory-overclocked performance improvement, you're barking up the wrong tree comparing Hawaii with GM204.

Yields didn't have anything to do with the shortage of 290/X parts..The shortage was due to the explosion in price of LiteCoin and AMD's continued kick ass performance in mining.

As far as the on-release cards OC'ing like shit? Both my 290s (launch week Sapphire reference cards under koolance blocks) did 1250 and 1275 on the core and have been punished nonstop for the last 3 years. /Shrug.

 

[razor1]

Yields didn't have anything to do with the shortage of 290/X parts..The shortage was due to the explosion in price of LiteCoin and AMD's continued kick ass performance in mining.

As far as the on-release cards OC'ing like shit? Both my 290s (launch week Sapphire reference cards under koolance blocks) did 1250 and 1275 on the core and have been punished nonstop for the last 3 years. /Shrug.

Shortage wasn't due to mining, market share figures wouldn't be the way they were if miners were buying up all those 290's. Remember after the launch of the 2xx GCN series AMD market share was flat and even a quarter prior to the nV 9xx series AMD dropped market share suddenly, almost like no one wanted their products anymore, most likely OEM's shifting over to nV cause they knew about Maxwell and how it would benefit their costs. End result nV flooded the OEMs with left over 7xx parts at less cost, increasing their market share in the interim till the 9xx series came out, and OEMs just went with them and the market share woes continued for AMD. Probably not yields either, if yields were bad on the chip, AMD would not produce the chip till yields get better. Most likely component shortages caused the shortage of cards in retail.

 

[Master_shake_]

Shortage wasn't due to mining, market share figures wouldn't be the way they were if miners were buying up all those 290's. Remember after the launch of the 2xx GCN series AMD market share was flat and even a quarter prior to the nV 9xx series AMD dropped market share suddenly, almost like no one wanted their products anymore, most likely OEM's shifting over to nV cause they knew about Maxwell and how it would benefit their costs. End result nV flooded the OEMs with left over 7xx parts at less cost, increasing their market share in the interim till the 9xx series came out, and OEMs just went with them and the market share woes continued for AMD. Probably not yields either, if yields were bad on the chip, AMD would not produce the chip till yields get better. Most likely component shortages caused the shortage of cards in retail.

stfu jesus christ....

http://www.digitaltrends.com/comput...e-hikes-due-chinese-new-year-litecoin-miners/

Virtually all of the companies that make graphics cards based on AMD GPUs like Sapphire, XFX, ASUS, MSI and others, are based in Taiwan and China, along with their manufacturing facilities. Ask yourself then, what notably holiday occurred recently that might garner the attention of a significant amount of people in Asia?

The Chinese New Year.


Read more: http://www.digitaltrends.com/comput...inese-new-year-litecoin-miners/#ixzz4dc83gsrq
Follow us: @digitaltrends on Twitter | DigitalTrends on Facebook

do you just make shit up at this point and see if it sticks?

 

[razor1]

stfu jesus christ....

http://www.digitaltrends.com/comput...e-hikes-due-chinese-new-year-litecoin-miners/



do you just make shit up at this point and see if it sticks?

And that is BS, if that was the case, AMD would have just sat there with market share lol, dude there is no way around it if miners were buying up cards market share would go up. Doesn't matter if it was to gamers or to miners ok?

Market share figures don't shift based on who is buying the product.

This is the reason that AMD gave for its shortages, and that doesn't fly with you look at JPR or Mercury market share figures!

Then you have the chinese new year, that didn't affect nV's cards lol, why is that? What is a phenomenon that will only affect AMD cards which have less sales to begin with? You think that would hurt nV more because they need to keep inventory up and keep their OEM partners happy by making sure supply doesn't get tight.

Common get real, so other shit happened that AMD doesn't want to talk about. And that is it.

 

[Master_shake_]

chinese new year isn't real?

things literally don't shut down for 2 weeks?

litrecoin mining was a figment of imaginations?

wow.

take off those green glasses.

 

[razor1]

chinese new year isn't real?

things literally don't shut down for 2 weeks?

litrecoin mining was a figment of imaginations?

wow.

take off those green glasses.

OH wow it didn't affect nV sales did it, a company that has even more marketshare than AMD it would have affected them more! Foxconn would have had more issues supplying nV if the reason was Chinese new years.

And that isn't realistic is it?

Use a little common sense should tell us something else happened.

You just need to stop wearing glasses to night clubs lol ok, its not cool.

Chinese New Years is a two weeks long the shortage of 2xx products was 2 quarters! That is 6 months! That is 24 weeks!

Yeah *sarcasm* 2 weeks = 24 weeks.

 

[Master_shake_]

heres common sense

see q4 2013 and right when chinese new year hit a sudden drop in AMD marketshare.

right around whats' it called.... oh yeah chnese new year.

 

[razor1]

heres common sense

see q4 2013 and right when chinese new year hit a sudden drop in AMD marketshare.

right around whats' it called.... oh yeah chnese new year.

LOL 2 weeks = 24 weeks of drop? Does that make any sense? Why didn't nV get hurt more at the same time.

Its all just excuses. Foxconn makes stuff for both AMD and nV, if it was due to Chinese new years, it would have affected both companies more so on nV's side just because of sheer volume they would need to sustain their sales.

 

[Master_shake_]

LOL 2 weeks = 24 weeks of drop? Does that make any sense? Why didn't nV get hurt more at the same time.

2 weeks of people ordering cards and having no stock causes the price to go sky high.

people were buying 4-5 amd cards at a time to mine at a time when people were using nvidia for gaming.

that causes prices to soar and after the new year they were likely frantically trying to catch up with demand.

so when prices were 900 for a 290x https://www.pcper.com/news/General-Tech/AMD-Radeon-R9-290X-Hits-900-Newegg-Thanks-coin

people bought nvidia cards. and amd never recovered.

then when mining went tits up so did amd getting shit loads of sales for it.

 

[razor1]

2 weeks of people ordering cards and having no stock causes the price to go sky high.

people were buying 4-5 amd cards at a time to mine at a time when people were using nvidia for gaming.

that causes prices to soar and after the new year they were likely frantically trying to catch up with demand.

so when prices were 900 for a 290x https://www.pcper.com/news/General-Tech/AMD-Radeon-R9-290X-Hits-900-Newegg-Thanks-coin

people bought nvidia cards. and amd never recovered.

then when mining went tits up so did amd getting shit loads of sales for it.

2 weeks of no cards on nV's side that didn't happen either.

And no AMD cards were out of stock for months as I stated before. And prices remained high for 2 quarters. Not just 2 weeks or 4 weeks if it was production from Foxconn issues.

Price is an offshoot of demand vs. supply doesn't matter where the supply got hit, if it gets hit the price goes up. The article date was Feb 14 of 2014, 1 month after chines new years, 2 weeks of full production, prices didn't drop till mid q2 of 2014, that is 4 months after the supposed Chinese New Year shortage. Something doesn't add up.

 

[Master_shake_]

2 weeks of no cards on nV's side that didn't happen either.

And no AMD cards were out of stock for months as I stated before. And prices remained high for 2 quarters. Not just 2 weeks or 4 weeks if it was production from Foxconn issues.

Price is an offshoot of demand vs. supply doesn't matter where the supply got hit, if it gets hit the price goes up. The article date was Feb 14 of 2014, 1 month after chines new years, 2 weeks of full production, prices didn't drop till mid q2 of 2014, that is 4 months after the supposed Chinese New Year shortage. Something doesn't add up.

people weren't buying a shit load of nvidia cards for mining.

nvidia cards sucked at mining.

that's why they never had a shortage.

 

[razor1]

people weren't buying a shit load of nvidia cards for mining.

nvidia cards sucked at mining.

that's why they never had a shortage.

LOL then why didn't AMD's marketshare go up.

BTW it was April of 2014 when AMD's cards stabilized prices

yeah 2 quarters it took for the supply issues to stop, not the 2 weeks

http://www.kitguru.net/components/g...eon-r9-290-series-are-over-price-tags-freeze/

The r2xx series was launched Oct of 2013 that to April of 2014, had pricing problems, supply constraints.

Not the 2 weeks of Chinese New Years.

 

[Master_shake_]

LOL then why didn't AMD's marketshare go up.

BTW it was April of 2014 when AMD's cards stabilized prices

yeah 2 quarters it took for the supply issues to stop, not the 2 weeks

http://www.kitguru.net/components/g...eon-r9-290-series-are-over-price-tags-freeze/

The r2xx series was launched Oct of 2013 that to April of 2014, had pricing problems, supply constraints.

Not the 2 weeks of Chinese New Years.

i guess if this guy started playing games on his cards then it probably would have.

buy then the damage was done and used amd cards flooded the market.

remember that mining crash?

http://wccftech.com/gpu-miners-crash-2014-arrives-graphic-card-market-shrinking-fall-40/

also you do know that we have access to cards price history right?

look at the surge in pricing,

it stayed at msrp for about 3 weeks.

it took about a year for prices to stabilize.

that article is from 2015 2 years after the release? wtf were you trying to say there?

 

[razor1]

i guess if this guy started playing games on his cards then it probably would have.

buy then the damage was done and used amd cards flooded the market.

remember that mining crash?

http://wccftech.com/gpu-miners-crash-2014-arrives-graphic-card-market-shrinking-fall-40/

also you do know that we have access to cards price history right?

look at the surge in pricing,

it stayed at msrp for about 3 weeks.

it took about a year for prices to stabilize.

that article is from 2015 2 years after the release? wtf were you trying to say there?

Market share figures don't support that man, They JUST DON'T. IF miners were buying up all the stock of AMD cards, yes price goes up, but market share figures should have still went UP. That didn't happen. So there were supply issues that weren't caused by Mining and Mining craze just increased the price MORE because they too couldn't get the cards!
And the MSRP of the r290 was 550 bucks. So any price less than that means less demand then the MSRP could sustain.

How can you split up demand between miners and gamers, when demand is base function off all buyers that want the card?

You can't.

 

[Master_shake_]

Market share figures don't support that man, They JUST DON'T. IF miners were buying up all the stock of AMD cards, yes price goes up, but market share figures should have still went UP. That didn't happen. So there were supply issues that weren't caused by Mining and Mining craze just increased the price MORE because they too couldn't get the cards!

you know that artilce you posted was from april 2015 not 14 right?