Philips BDM4065UC - 40" 4K 60Hz monitor thread

samuelmorris said:
Input lag on the Philips is, as far as I recall, 21ms as well, so that shouldn't be difficult.
Click to expand...

Actually, that figure that I posted for the Samsung was incorrect. Input lag has been found to actually be better than originally thought, due to flawed testing. The Samsung has been found to have less than 1 frame (16.7ms) of input lag, which is excellent!

bryanlasren said:
My reading of that thread led me to the opposite conclusion. Reports are that the PWM on that Samsung TV is 120Hz, and that there is still PWM even at full brightness.
Click to expand...

Oops, you're right, I missed those posts for some reason. But, the good news is, it (PWM) is very minimal at the full brightness setting.

Ziran has posted some settings that work well for him; I'm going to try them when mine arrives:

"I am happy with mine, hopefully you will like yours too. These are the settings i use atm:

required for 4-4-4 (connected to HDMI 1)
HDMI UHD color on
Input Type: PC
Input Name: "PC"

HDMI black level: low (auto seems same as low. don't set it to normal as it completely washes out the blacks)
back-light 15-20 (set contrast to 90 for 20 back light)
brightness 60 (50 is too dark with HDMI black level low, more then 60 starts to wash out the blacks again)
contrast: 90 (setting of 100 fails the contrast test. I cant distinguish 30-32 in this test: http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/contrast.php. Setting of 90 is better as can distinguish 1-32 boxes in the contrast test).

Also setting contrast to 90 helps with high back-light. At setting of 90 I find the back-light 20 tolerable in a lit room even in large white windows.

rest of settings at default.

I also realized that the curved monitor helps deal with reflections since it is reflecting from a narrower angle (basically only directly behind you). So avoid shiny objects on your desk but having a window off to the side is not a problem."
 
That's the 7500 series; it was always that price. See chart on previous page.
 
Well, if my monitor was going to arrive on April 2, Amazon should have shipped today. I got no such notification. Anybody have a projected arrival date earlier than that? Have you shipped yet?
 
I'm really interested to know if there's an easy way round the ghosting problem as that's my only main bugbear with the screen now. The size I'm starting to get used to, the gloss I'm kind of getting used to, the couple of dead pixels mine has are mildly irritating but they're not in immediately obvious places so not a massive issue. The ghosting though is still a real problem, it makes focusing on games and TV/film difficult as it's just impossible to see anything moving more than a couple of hundred pixels a second. The fact that the ghosting is very pixelated and blocky rather than a smooth streak is suggesting to me it might be a problem with the source rather than the display - it's not an issue I had on the UP3214Q but then since that was tiled, it's not really a fair comparison. I'm going to try a different cable first as my existing one's not long enough and have had to prop my PC up on a box for it to reach all the way up to the top of the screen, but if that doesn't sort it I might try popping an AMD card in again to see if that makes any odds. The TFTCentral review says there is no inherent ghosting, yet mine is dreadful to the point it'd make normal end users complain, let alone professional reviewers - given there aren't any other defects with my screen (no backlight bleed that I've noticed, brightness uniformity is as per-reviewed, about 35% lower round the edges) other than the couple of dead pixels, I'm not willing to believe it's a faulty unit just for that. Hoping I can get it sorted as if I can work that out, it'll probably be here to stay.
 
igluk said:
Yeah, I meant that some of the postprocessing bling bling of TVs can increase input lag, and those options are usually greyed out in [Game] mode with the lowest input lag.
But this concerns mostly stuff for movies like local dimming, motion enhancement etc. Should not have an effect on colors.

This is from hdtvtest review of the flagship 65'' model:
" In [Game] mode, the UE65JS9500 returned an astonishingly low input lag measurement of 21.4ms from a Leo Bodnar device.
There’s some deterioration in picture quality (no local dimming or judder-free 24fps playback, among others), but that’s how game mode works: it cuts off unnecessary video processing to boost controller-to-screen response time. We believe that responsiveness takes precedence over PQ for competitive gaming especially in reflex-based games (e.g. first-person shooters), but if you’re a casual gamer who prefers eye candy, input lag figures in [Movie] and [PC] modes were at 78ms and 65ms respectively."
Click to expand...

Well that's a bummer because I am a competative minded gamer that needs Low Input Lag but Im also weak for eye candy, so I want to have the highest quality visuals, colors, blacks etc. So I'm gonna stick with my Philips monitor until a 40+" PLS or IPS panel is released.
 
shadow85 said:
Well that's a bummer because I am a competative minded gamer that needs Low Input Lag but Im also weak for eye candy, so I want to have the highest quality visuals, colors, blacks etc. So I'm gonna stick with my Philips monitor until a 40+" PLS or IPS panel is released.
Click to expand...
I doubt [Game] mode will deteriorate the image quality noticeably, if any. You'd have to ask someone in the Shamesung thread.
Its mostly postprocessing for movies, image smoothing algorithms, motion interpolation and the likes that get greyed out. And the local dimming function that creates some lag is only good for black bars on edge-lit TVs.
Only the overpriced JS9500 model has the more effective full array dimming.

samuelmorris said:
I'm really interested to know if there's an easy way round the ghosting problem as that's my only main bugbear with the screen now. The TFTCentral review says there is no inherent ghosting, yet mine is dreadful to the point it'd make normal end users complain, let alone professional reviewers. The fact that the ghosting is very pixelated and blocky rather than a smooth streak is suggesting to me it might be a problem with the source rather than the display.
Click to expand...

other than slow full black to full white rise time (20ms), the Philips has rather fast transition times throughout, and no overshoot as long as smartresponse is off. this has been verified not only by tftcentral but also by other reviewers like prad and hardware.info
if you notice the ghosting only on black and white, its the response times, otherwise its something else...
PWM artifacts? if so, it should go away at 100% brightness.
if its neither of those there is something wrong with your connection or the monitor is faulty.
 
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samuelmorris said:
I'm really interested to know if there's an easy way round the ghosting problem as that's my only main bugbear with the screen now. The size I'm starting to get used to, the gloss I'm kind of getting used to, the couple of dead pixels mine has are mildly irritating but they're not in immediately obvious places so not a massive issue. The ghosting though is still a real problem, it makes focusing on games and TV/film difficult as it's just impossible to see anything moving more than a couple of hundred pixels a second. The fact that the ghosting is very pixelated and blocky rather than a smooth streak is suggesting to me it might be a problem with the source rather than the display - it's not an issue I had on the UP3214Q but then since that was tiled, it's not really a fair comparison. I'm going to try a different cable first as my existing one's not long enough and have had to prop my PC up on a box for it to reach all the way up to the top of the screen, but if that doesn't sort it I might try popping an AMD card in again to see if that makes any odds. The TFTCentral review says there is no inherent ghosting, yet mine is dreadful to the point it'd make normal end users complain, let alone professional reviewers - given there aren't any other defects with my screen (no backlight bleed that I've noticed, brightness uniformity is as per-reviewed, about 35% lower round the edges) other than the couple of dead pixels, I'm not willing to believe it's a faulty unit just for that. Hoping I can get it sorted as if I can work that out, it'll probably be here to stay.
Click to expand...

Hmm, I'd be really curious to see what you're talking about. I wish there was a way for you to make a video and show us, but sadly I don't think that would depict the issue.
 
Oh no, the ghosting is for all colours, and is just as noticeable throughout, but bright flashes (e.g. muzzle flash from a gun in an FPS title, especially in darkness) really highlight it - you see big blocky patches for a brief instant. It seems like it's still there at 100% brightness as far as I can tell.
If it helps - it kind of looks like this
samsung-galaxy-s4-smearing-ghosting.jpg

i.e. there often appears to be more than one pixel between the separations, but not always. If I drag a page with a coloured image around - I can see a smooth coloured band trailing behind it.
 
Disappointingly I tried dropping the resolution to 2560x1440 then 1920x1080 and also switching between 60Hz and 59Hz, to no avail - the issue persists at all settings, so it's not a DP stream bandwidth problem. I'm hoping another cable might cure it, though it is the same cable I was using before with no issues, so I'm not holding my breath. The real oddity is that certain MP4 files won't play at all properly (like, below 10fps) since introducing the monitor - there have been no other changes... That's one of the things that's making me wonder if it's graphics related. Similarly, there is stuttering in some other video files which I know to be smooth.
 
It does look a little like that but smartresponse is most definitely off. Smartresponse makes the situation worse, but does not really remove the original problem. The PWM thing is a possibility but seems unlikely given my previous monitor has the same PWM frequency as this one, 240Hz, and I didn't notice it there.

Will try a clean GPU driver reinstall to see if that makes any difference.
 
Acceptable_Risk said:
Yeah, I've got a range of April 2 - April 24. Amazon is usually pretty good about hitting the early end of those kinds of things, though.
Click to expand...

Yeah not with this monitor, at least when I bought it, amazon was only able to hit close to the end date of the range they gave me.
 
imyourzero said:
Actually, that figure that I posted for the Samsung was incorrect. Input lag has been found to actually be better than originally thought, due to flawed testing. The Samsung has been found to have less than 1 frame (16.7ms) of input lag, which is excellent!
Click to expand...
Unless that test was conducted against a fast CRT (I'll be testing mine against my Sony FW900), the input lag is not that low. You need to add the lag of the other LCD to that figure.
 
ForgedReality said:
Unless that test was conducted against a fast CRT (I'll be testing mine against my Sony FW900), the input lag is not that low. You need to add the lag of the other LCD to that figure.
Click to expand...

OK, admittedly I don't know much about accurately testing input lag but many people are throwing around results obtained with a Leo Bodnar device which NCX (resident monitor guru) found to be flawed. See here.

Either way though, those input lag numbers are pretty impressive.
 
Changed the cable and tested with another PC - granted it's only an HD7770 but it has the capability to run DP 1.2 and generate a 60Hz signal no issue. Tested it and the exact same issue comes up there too - the ghosting issue is clearly a defect with the monitor - having read some more 'user' reviews it seems like it's a design issue, rather than just a defective sample, so there's little point me exchanging it. Curious why other professional sites didn't pick up on it as an issue though.

Ultimately I'm never going to be happy with a monitor that has such severe ghosting you can't watch TV on it, so it's going to have to go back. Very disappointing, apart from the fact there's no similar product in its class, that also means a lot of effort in packing it for return. Back to the land of MST and graphics bugs I go I suppose. If the UP3214Q's vastly superior panel could only be packaged with a display controller that could do SST I would happily trade up - as it is, I'll just need to save up for the 32" Samsung and try that instead.

For those who asked to see it:
It's tricky to record, especially with just a phone, but here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=186ZkpUJaC8&feature=youtu.be
Pay close attention to the edge of the red horizontal bar where it meets the white space - moving the window leaves a pale red trace behind.
 
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ForgedReality said:
Unless that test was conducted against a fast CRT (I'll be testing mine against my Sony FW900), the input lag is not that low. You need to add the lag of the other LCD to that figure.
Click to expand...

The mentioning of the FW900 made me nostalgic for a moment. I remember back then going back and forth whether to get the FW900 or the F520 eventually going with the F520 which never gave me reason to regret choosing it - if I had more room it would still be with me till this day.
 
samuelmorris said:
Changed the cable and tested with another PC - granted it's only an HD7770 but it has the capability to run DP 1.2 and generate a 60Hz signal no issue. Tested it and the exact same issue comes up there too - the ghosting issue is clearly a defect with the monitor - having read some more 'user' reviews it seems like it's a design issue, rather than just a defective sample, so there's little point me exchanging it. Curious why other professional sites didn't pick up on it as an issue though.

Ultimately I'm never going to be happy with a monitor that has such severe ghosting you can't watch TV on it, so it's going to have to go back. Very disappointing, apart from the fact there's no similar product in its class, that also means a lot of effort in packing it for return. Back to the land of MST and graphics bugs I go I suppose. If the UP3214Q's vastly superior panel could only be packaged with a display controller that could do SST I would happily trade up - as it is, I'll just need to save up for the 32" Samsung and try that instead.

For those who asked to see it:
It's tricky to record, especially with just a phone, but here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=186ZkpUJaC8&feature=youtu.be
Pay close attention to the edge of the red horizontal bar where it meets the white space - moving the window leaves a pale red trace behind.
Click to expand...

Yet, TFT Central saids there's no ghost?

In practice the Philips BDM4065UC showed pretty low levels of motion blur, and no obvious ghosting. There was some some slight trailing in the best case images as you can see above but overall the movement felt quite good...
Click to expand...

http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/philips_bdm4065uc.htm
 
Since I now have had a BDM4065UC on my desk for a few hours I think reporting how it might be of value.
  • I expected having to acquire a monitor arm in order to get the display as low as possible, but as it sits now on the stand I'm not sure I need to. So my tip for now is to give it a try rather than order an arm right away.
  • I have no dead pixels and really I haven't noticed any issues at all regarding image quality. All I have really done so far is to set Display Port to 1.2 mode, change the colour temperature to 7500K and make the user key trigger the input menu (The user key is what one triggers by moving the joystick down). I'll of course fine tune the colour settings, but so far so good.
  • What I have noticed is that the Philips is more reflective that IPS panels I usually run. This was expected, partly because of the bigger screen having a bigger surface and partly because the price of a deeper black tends to be a more reflective surface (I'll have to rearrange some lights in my home office and I can see sunny days being a challenge).
  • The choice in included cables seem rather silly. Among the ones included is serial cable which I suspect very few will get to use and a VGA cable which guess even fewer still will use and instead I would have liked a USB 3 cable for the hub and a mini DP to DP cable would have been nice as well. Since there is even software that lets you tweak the moitor through USB it seems really silly there is no USB cable included.
  • Finally I must report that I too find the white LED too bright and that I plan to mask it with a piece of tape. Also the plastic wrapping that protects the shiny frame on the monitor was also partly trapped on this one - some annoying and some disassembly seems needed to remove it (or maybe it can be done with a scape l?)

All in all I must say that I am pretty pleased with my purchase :cool:

Naturally I haven't really had time to do much gaming, but I have check how it works out with my 7970 and as expected Civilization V is gonna work fine, but surprisingly even Farcry 4 isn't totally hopeless so I should be okay gaming wise till the next AMD generation arrives. The youtube 4Kat 60Hz videos on the other hand are not really playing smoothly :rolleyes:;)

Note - it seems the supply situation as least here in Europe is finally sorted. Originally I ordered mine at a shop for almost a month ago where they expect delivery after little over a week only to see them push the delivery date repeatedly - so finally come Monday I gave up on them taking advantage of other shops now reporting they had stock. So in effect I moved my order to another shop two days ago and I now have the monitor up an running, had it not been for some computer issues at the delivery company that cause a days delay I would even have had the thing after just one day.
 
BlindZenDriver said:
The mentioning of the FW900 made me nostalgic for a moment. I remember back then going back and forth whether to get the FW900 or the F520 eventually going with the F520 which never gave me reason to regret choosing it - if I had more room it would still be with me till this day.
Click to expand...

I love my FW900. Best monitor ever made, if you ask me. 2560x1600 back in 1992? What an amazing piece of hardware. :D It's still got great color accuracy and gamut. I normally use it at 2304x1440 though as it's got a higher refresh rate (80 vs 60), and thus is easier on the eyes. It's actually my second one. My first one had the flyback transformer start to fail. I still have it and may repair it one day, but for now, there's no reason to. LCD was a major step backward in basically every way other than footprint, imho.

My order still says:

Arriving Thu, Apr 16 - Wed, Jun 3
Not yet shipped

:(
 
BlindZenDriver said:
Since I now have had a BDM4065UC on my desk for a few hours I think reporting how it might be of value.
  • I expected having to acquire a monitor arm in order to get the display as low as possible, but as it sits now on the stand I'm not sure I need to. So my tip for now is to give it a try rather than order an arm right away.
  • I have no dead pixels and really I haven't noticed any issues at all regarding image quality. All I have really done so far is to set Display Port to 1.2 mode, change the colour temperature to 7500K and make the user key trigger the input menu (The user key is what one triggers by moving the joystick down). I'll of course fine tune the colour settings, but so far so good.
  • What I have noticed is that the Philips is more reflective that IPS panels I usually run. This was expected, partly because of the bigger screen having a bigger surface and partly because the price of a deeper black tends to be a more reflective surface (I'll have to rearrange some lights in my home office and I can see sunny days being a challenge).
  • The choice in included cables seem rather silly. Among the ones included is serial cable which I suspect very few will get to use and a VGA cable which guess even fewer still will use and instead I would have liked a USB 3 cable for the hub and a mini DP to DP cable would have been nice as well. Since there is even software that lets you tweak the moitor through USB it seems really silly there is no USB cable included.
  • Finally I must report that I too find the white LED too bright and that I plan to mask it with a piece of tape. Also the plastic wrapping that protects the shiny frame on the monitor was also partly trapped on this one - some annoying and some disassembly seems needed to remove it (or maybe it can be done with a scape l?)

All in all I must say that I am pretty pleased with my purchase :cool:

Naturally I haven't really had time to do much gaming, but I have check how it works out with my 7970 and as expected Civilization V is gonna work fine, but surprisingly even Farcry 4 isn't totally hopeless so I should be okay gaming wise till the next AMD generation arrives. The youtube 4Kat 60Hz videos on the other hand are not really playing smoothly :rolleyes:;)

Note - it seems the supply situation as least here in Europe is finally sorted. Originally I ordered mine at a shop for almost a month ago where they expect delivery after little over a week only to see them push the delivery date repeatedly - so finally come Monday I gave up on them taking advantage of other shops now reporting they had stock. So in effect I moved my order to another shop two days ago and I now have the monitor up an running, had it not been for some computer issues at the delivery company that cause a days delay I would even have had the thing after just one day.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the review. Can you quickly test out 1080P on the monitor and see if text is sharp on the monitor? My S32D850 arrived and it's interpolation from 1080P to 1440P is actually pretty good. If 1080P on the BDM4065 is just as good, I may return the S32 and wait for the BDM which hopefully start shipping soon.
 
Cyph said:
Thanks for the review. Can you quickly test out 1080P on the monitor and see if text is sharp on the monitor? My S32D850 arrived and it's interpolation from 1080P to 1440P is actually pretty good. If 1080P on the BDM4065 is just as good, I may return the S32 and wait for the BDM which hopefully start shipping soon.
Click to expand...

Sure thing. I tried the 1080p resolution and it looks good to me and really it should as each pixel is simply represented by four pixels from the monitor, so no fancy math needed. I also tried out the 2560x1440 and that looks good also.

I did notice one thing which was annoying. After having done the tests I of course switched back to 3820x2160 but somehow Windows decided that running 4K in 60hz was no longer an option and it reverted back to 30hz. And not only that I had to power off the monitor and turn it on again to make Windows realize that 60hz was an option (rebooting Windows would likely also have fixed it).
I suspect this is either a Windows or maybe a graphics card issue since when checking the info page in the monitors OSD it stated clearly in red text that running in 60hz was recommended and that one should do that (meaning the monitor did not forget 60hz was an option).
 
ForgedReality said:
I love my FW900. Best monitor ever made, if you ask me. 2560x1600 back in 1992? What an amazing piece of hardware. :D It's still got great color accuracy and gamut. I normally use it at 2304x1440 though as it's got a higher refresh rate (80 vs 60), and thus is easier on the eyes. It's actually my second one. My first one had the flyback transformer start to fail. I still have it and may repair it one day, but for now, there's no reason to. LCD was a major step backward in basically every way other than footprint, imho.

My order still says:

Arriving Thu, Apr 16 - Wed, Jun 3
Not yet shipped

:(
Click to expand...
Hopefully you won't have to wait till June. That is long time it will be faster to row a boat to Europe, pick up a monitor here and row back across the pond.

I must admit to having had to let my F520 go a couple of years ago. I was an investment when I bought it, but I still remember how playing UT in 2048x1536 back when most people was stuck with 1024x768 gave me an edge essentially allowing for sniping on the fly without using the scope :D

Actually I ashamed to admit, but when I moved on from the F520 it was simply because of lack of space. With a 24" and a 27" on the desk it took up to much space so I tried to find a good home for it only asking that any taker would have to pick it up at my place, but no one would go for it so eventually it ended up going to a recycle center!
 
BlindZenDriver said:
I must admit to having had to let my F520 go a couple of years ago. I was an investment when I bought it, but I still remember how playing UT in 2048x1536 back when most people was stuck with 1024x768 gave me an edge essentially allowing for sniping on the fly without using the scope :D

Actually I ashamed to admit, but when I moved on from the F520 it was simply because of lack of space. With a 24" and a 27" on the desk it took up to much space so I tried to find a good home for it only asking that any taker would have to pick it up at my place, but no one would go for it so eventually it ended up going to a recycle center!
Click to expand...

I had one of those beasts. Epic refresh rates worked really well for 3d shutter glasses.

Heaviest monitor I've ever owned. Mine had a cracked housing but I just duct-taped it together and used it another 3 years or so. I think I ultimately threw it away at some point after Nvidia stopped supporting the shutter glasses stuff in the drivers and video cards after the 6000 series cards.
 
Interesting, Amazon USA has now completely removed their (Prime) purchase option from the Philips product listing (used to be available for $799 - now it's gone...)
Only a single 3rd-party marketplace vendor option is currently offered for May 1st for $1,235.
Not a great sign for those waiting for the USA release... :(

eBay/SquareTrade is still a viable option for USA buyers (see my prior post http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1041516130&postcount=2282)..
 
As an Amazon Associate, HardForum may earn from qualifying purchases.
Wow @ Amazon listing disappearance :-/

Maybe I lucked out in being too impatient to wait. Ended up ordering one second-hand from a seller in the US. Hoping it has no issues when it arrives next week.
 
I just emailed Amazon this question. I'm waiting to hear back from them...

Hello. I noticed this monitor is no longer available on your site as a Prime purchase directly through Amazon. Could you verify for me that this order is still good and I can expect to receive this item within the given arrival time? Thanks.
 
I just changed my payment method and I lost my original shipping estimate. This is a real bummer. It's obvious that demand exceeds supply, and Phillips has delayed their shipment to Amazon again.
 
rennervision said:
I just emailed Amazon this question. I'm waiting to hear back from them...

Hello. I noticed this monitor is no longer available on your site as a Prime purchase directly through Amazon. Could you verify for me that this order is still good and I can expect to receive this item within the given arrival time? Thanks.
Click to expand...

I got an answer but I have a funny feeling they never even read my question. Two hours later I received back an 11 paragraph (yes - 11!) apology with statements like:

Paragraph 2 - "I'm sorry about this delay - we certainly didn't expect that this would happen."

Paragraph 11 - "I hope you'll give us one more chance to prove our standard and service to win your heart."

It just goes on and on without ever addressing my question.
 
rennervision said:
I got an answer but I have a funny feeling they never even read my question. Two hours later I received back an 11 paragraph (yes - 11!) apology with statements like:

Paragraph 2 - "I'm sorry about this delay - we certainly didn't expect that this would happen."

Paragraph 11 - "I hope you'll give us one more chance to prove our standard and service to win your heart."

It just goes on and on without ever addressing my question.
Click to expand...

That's amazing.

POST IT.
 
These guys went from one of the best options for a 40" 4k monitor to the lest likely to actually get bought. Really fell off the ball on this one Phillips.
 
BlindZenDriver said:
Since I now have had a BDM4065UC on my desk for a few hours I think reporting how it might be of value.

I expected having to acquire a monitor arm in order to get the display as low as possible, but as it sits now on the stand I'm not sure I need to. So my tip for now is to give it a try rather than order an arm right away.
Click to expand...

Can you measure how high is the upper edge of the 40" screen over your desk now, what is the viewing distance and the distance of eye level from the desk? I am simulating viewing conditions with different monitor sizes by raising my current 24" and 27" to various heights and it comes that 40" would be way too high even if lowered down to touch the desk. Raising it even more woul d be unbearable for me. At this point I am concluding that most comfortable size for me would be 32" lowered for bezel almost touching the desk. In fact even now I am typing this on 24" monitor raised to simulate the height of 32" and it is very comfortable, I do not have to raise up eyes/head.
 
ubernaut said:
That's amazing.

POST IT.
Click to expand...

LOL, I know. It reminds me of some of the jargon on the ASUS website when I was checking out laptops a few years ago.

"FAST HEART BEATING. SPIRIT SMILE. THEM FEELS."

I just looked again and they've done a major redesign. It looks like now they actually got someone who speaks native English to write the descriptions.
 
SuperMar1o said:
These guys went from one of the best options for a 40" 4k monitor to the lest likely to actually get bought. Really fell off the ball on this one Phillips.
Click to expand...

I think they waited too long. It should have hit US shelves much sooner.
I had a pre-order in for over a month and researching it since October.

Samsung swooped in and provided stock immediately. Tells me a lot about Phillips manufacturing and supply limitations.
 
WorldExclusive said:
I think they waited too long. It should have hit US shelves much sooner.
I had a pre-order in for over a month and researching it since October.

Samsung swooped in and provided stock immediately. Tells me a lot about Phillips manufacturing and supply limitations.
Click to expand...

Are you referencing the Samsung 40" TV from the other thread? As has been noted before there's a critical issue: DisplayPort. AFAIK, the Phillips has it and the Samsung doesn't. The Seiki has DP but I don't trust that brand at all for a purchase like this at a premium price.
 
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