Parliament Voted To Grant Asylum To Edward Snowden

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The European Parliament has voted to grant asylum to Edward Snowden...still wants to capture Julian Assange. :D

MEPs voted 285 votes to 281 in favour of a resolution that the NSA whistleblower should be allowed to seek safe asylum in the EU. The resolution, which isn't binding, is nonetheless a strong signal from MEP's that EU member states should grant Snowden protection.
 

The_Controller

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It should be appreciated what he did to wake us up to the reality that the government collects information on us, but he's still an American traitor. The EU, being NATO states dependent on the US for security, should have more responsibility to
the country that butters their socialist bread. Odd that that vote needed a simple majority.

But America is evil and blah blah blah so screw the US. Like we invented imperialism or something. :rolleyes:
 
D

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I got no problem with it, but it'll (most likely) never happen here in the US. I just wish anyone in a similar situation that knows laws are being broken (and I don't want to start a massive debate over it - laws are being broken, period) would come forward and speak out about it but I know that people want to protect themselves more than doing the right thing the overwhelming majority of the time.

That's humanity for ya. :(
 

dgz

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These threads always attract the craziest [H] users. I mean ex or current military types.
 

NickJames

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I got no problem with it, but it'll (most likely) never happen here in the US. I just wish anyone in a similar situation that knows laws are being broken (and I don't want to start a massive debate over it - laws are being broken, period) would come forward and speak out about it but I know that people want to protect themselves more than doing the right thing the overwhelming majority of the time.

That's humanity for ya. :(

Yeap, safer to keep quiet and it's kind of hilarious because I keep seeing those "See something, say something" ads all over the place.
 

PiSquared

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This makes some sense given that one of the things revealed is how much we spy on our European allies. I'm not saying it's justified but I can see the reasoning behind it.

That said...is it justified? There is a point at which laws and interpretation of those laws are no longer just to the people being governed. How does the public find out when we are at one of those points? Was this one of those times? We have years to see how Snowden's leaks play out but we could potentially avoid something Orwell feared.

Then again, I'm sure Orwell wouldn't have dreamed that people would voluntarily share every small bit of their life through the medium that is social networking. In his age, the kind of information you could gleam from social media would be the result of some serious spying. And now, people just offer it up to anyone that is willing to read it. We also have adapted to reading and processing information in bite-sized chunks, also lowering our literacy as a society.

Getting back on topic, I can see why Europe voted this way but need to see more to gauge how this will ultimately affect people. It will be very interesting to see how history judges this.
 

lcpiper

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So does this mean that this largely symbolic gesture might draw Ed, all happy and a skippy, into leaving safety in Russia, into being arrested and deported from somewhere in the EU?

PiSquared things it was a revelation to France and Germany and others that we spy on them, OK.

Anyone who works for a foreign government's Intelligence Services could not help but know, and fully understand, that there is a Releasability designation called "Five Eyes", which countries it references, and that if your not "in", your obviously "out". There was an older one called CANUKAS if I remember right, Canada, New Zealand,UK, Australia. The USA makes 5. Anyone and everyone else takes a back seat on the trust bus. But not everyone really get's that.
 

Dr. Righteous

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Parliament?



Snowden getting funky up in here!
 

Spidey329

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It should be appreciated what he did to wake us up to the reality that the government collects information on us, but he's still an American traitor. The EU, being NATO states dependent on the US for security, should have more responsibility to
the country that butters their socialist bread. Odd that that vote needed a simple majority.


You see traitor, many see patriot. He's a whistleblower for the American people against an out-of-control domestic surveillance program. By definition of the word, all whistleblowers are traitors. But there's a very specific reason why they're given special protection when they do so without personal gain but for a greater good.
 

Red Squirrel

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Great news! Only issue, does EU have extradition protection or can the US just extradite him? This almost seems like a risk, but I guess if they're willing to do this they are probably willing to protect him as well in case the US tries to extradite him.
 

Retronym

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I continue to be amazed at people who see it more important to punish one person than educate the public on their government's lies.
 

xJ321x

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I continue to be amazed at people who see it more important to punish one person than educate the public on their government's lies.

This! Edward Snowden is unimportant, the information he gave us is though. People attacking the messenger and not listening to the actual message are straight up stupid, period, or they happen to work for the government (not biased in anyway). :D
 

lcpiper

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You see traitor, many see patriot. He's a whistleblower for the American people against an out-of-control domestic surveillance program. By definition of the word, all whistleblowers are traitors. But there's a very specific reason why they're given special protection when they do so without personal gain but for a greater good.

Tomato tomato.

You say that "by definition, all whistleblowers are traitors", but William Binney and some of his friends were whistleblowers, but they weren't traitors. William was Ed's hero, Ed said so himself. William tried reporting what he thought was wrong from inside while he still worked for the NSA, nothing happened that he could see, so he went higher, went to the IG in the NSA, still nothing. He quite and left his retirement on the table, went outside the NSA, still nothing. He pushed it so far that he actually did attract attention and trouble from the DoJ, still nothing. William was never convicted of anything. Ed never tried to do any of these things. Ed isn't a whistleblower cause he didn't blow any whistle. He didn't stand up and put his ass on the line for what he believes. Whistleblowers are given special protections so they CAN stand up and blow that whistle, call people out, and tell us all what's wrong. Ed didn't do this and there is now way around it.
 

xJ321x

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Ya us crazies who have actually left our borders and know a thing or two. Way to be a douche

Regular citizens can still leave the country. Just an FYI. I also know a thing or two. One being our own government overreaches every single day on its intended purpose and its excuses for doing so overused.
 

TwistedAegis

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He didn't stand up and put his ass on the line for what he believes. Whistleblowers are given special protections so they CAN stand up and blow that whistle, call people out, and tell us all what's wrong. Ed didn't do this and there is now way around it.

I'm pretty sure his ass is on the line right now.

And the Obama administration has been very harsh on government whistleblowers, all while encouraging private sector whistleblowers; not a supportive environment to be in.

Further, with the constant over-classification of information, informing the American people of a significant amount of the workings of the US government is now illegal under the espionage act.
 

mstersmith80

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Regular citizens can still leave the country. Just an FYI. I also know a thing or two. One being our own government overreaches every single day on its intended purpose and its excuses for doing so overused.

Most dont. They sit here and bad mouth their Govt behind the bubble wrap. Its cool I live for the day the shoe drops.
 

xJ321x

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You say that "by definition, all whistleblowers are traitors", but William Binney and some of his friends were whistleblowers, but they weren't traitors.
They also failed in getting the peoples attention that way which is precisely why Edward Snowden didn't do it that way. You always seem to miss that part though.

William was never convicted of anything.
Yet was harassed, lost hundreds of thousands of dollars, had all his shit taken, and had a gun pointed in his face like he did.

After he left the NSA in 2001, Binney was one of several people investigated as part of an inquiry into the 2005 New York Times exposé. on the agency’s warrantless eavesdropping program. Binney was cleared of wrongdoing after three interviews with FBI agents beginning in March 2007, but one morning in July 2007, a dozen agents armed with rifles appeared at his house, one of whom entered the bathroom and pointed his gun at Binney, still towelling off from a shower. In that raid, the FBI confiscated a desktop computer, disks, and personal and business records. The NSA revoked his security clearance, forcing him to close a business he ran with former colleagues at a loss of a reported $300,000 in annual income. In 2012, Binney and his co-plaintiffs went to federal court to get the items back. Binney spent more than $7,000 on legal fees.
Some people don't like FBI agents putting guns at their faces deciding if they live or die.
"His dick looked like a gun so we fired" - FBI. Yes, this happens everyday especially if black (but happens to whites, too).


William tried reporting what he thought was wrong from inside while he still worked for the NSA, nothing happened that he could see, so he went higher, went to the IG in the NSA, still nothing. He quite and left his retirement on the table, went outside the NSA, still nothing. He pushed it so far that he actually did attract attention and trouble from the DoJ, still nothing.
I'm just guessing here but maybe, just maybe, this is why Edward Snowden did things differently. Maybe... :rolleyes:


Ed didn't do this and there is now way around it.

Hate to tell you news from 2013 but Edward Snowden got around it. What?

" In Binney's view this is a totalitarian approach, which had previously been seen only in dictatorships"
 

viscountalpha

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I got no problem with it, but it'll (most likely) never happen here in the US. I just wish anyone in a similar situation that knows laws are being broken (and I don't want to start a massive debate over it - laws are being broken, period) would come forward and speak out about it but I know that people want to protect themselves more than doing the right thing the overwhelming majority of the time.

That's humanity for ya. :(

Many of us knew but kept our traps shut. I don't agree with Snowden tactics but I don't condemn him either. It's just a matter of time before the media loses their grip on the people and then it will all be over.
 

DPI

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These threads always attract the craziest [H] users. I mean ex or current military types.

Seriously. What Snowden did for privacy will only make sense one day in retrospect.
 

Wiffle

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Not even sure what all the hubub about snowden ever about. The only thing he ever did was confirm 100% exactly what everyone who knew anything about computers already knew. Snowden is basically a Kardashian at this point... simply a media whipping boy to help stir up more media buzz and line their pockets with more ad revenue!
 

xJ321x

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Not even sure what all the hubub about snowden ever about. The only thing he ever did was confirm 100% exactly what everyone who knew anything about computers already knew.

Most people don't know much about computers, that's probably why.
 

Retronym

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You say that "by definition, all whistleblowers are traitors", but William Binney and some of his friends were whistleblowers, but they weren't traitors. William was Ed's hero, Ed said so himself. William tried reporting what he thought was wrong from inside while he still worked for the NSA, nothing happened that he could see, so he went higher, went to the IG in the NSA, still nothing. He quite and left his retirement on the table, went outside the NSA, still nothing. He pushed it so far that he actually did attract attention and trouble from the DoJ, still nothing. William was never convicted of anything. Ed never tried to do any of these things. Ed isn't a whistleblower cause he didn't blow any whistle. He didn't stand up and put his ass on the line for what he believes. Whistleblowers are given special protections so they CAN stand up and blow that whistle, call people out, and tell us all what's wrong. Ed didn't do this and there is now way around it.

This reads exactly opposite of his statements.
 

Hagrid

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I got no problem with it, but it'll (most likely) never happen here in the US. I just wish anyone in a similar situation that knows laws are being broken (and I don't want to start a massive debate over it - laws are being broken, period) would come forward and speak out about it but I know that people want to protect themselves more than doing the right thing the overwhelming majority of the time.

That's humanity for ya. :(
Weird that those laws were made by the government for the government..... or I could be wrong.
 

Skripka

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Tomato tomato.

You say that "by definition, all whistleblowers are traitors", but William Binney and some of his friends were whistleblowers, but they weren't traitors. William was Ed's hero, Ed said so himself. William tried reporting what he thought was wrong from inside while he still worked for the NSA, nothing happened that he could see, so he went higher, went to the IG in the NSA, still nothing. He quite and left his retirement on the table, went outside the NSA, still nothing. He pushed it so far that he actually did attract attention and trouble from the DoJ, still nothing. William was never convicted of anything. Ed never tried to do any of these things. Ed isn't a whistleblower cause he didn't blow any whistle. He didn't stand up and put his ass on the line for what he believes. Whistleblowers are given special protections so they CAN stand up and blow that whistle, call people out, and tell us all what's wrong. Ed didn't do this and there is now way around it.

Yea...

Thing is...Almost EVERYONE who you'd think and they themselves thinks is a whistle blower...COMPLETELY FAILS at meeting the ridiculously high bar set in statutory and case law for whistle blower protections. Seriously, the rejection rate of whistle blower protections suits is over 90%. Edward Snowden didn't apply for whistle blower status, because he knows that there's no way in f'ing hell he'd be protected. Any arm chair lawyer who reads the various acts and rulings on the topic can say as much.


That you and so many others harp on the fact that he somehow did wrong by not seeking whistle blower status...speaks volumes about how abysmally uninformed about your own country's whistle blower laws you are.
 

jtm55

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Hi All

I believe history will determine if Eric Snowden is or isn't a traitor. Folk now in my opinion are to biased to make a impartial decision.
 

Retronym

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Well, history has already decided the government is a bunch of liars.

So there's that.
 

Red Squirrel

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What I find funny is people who call him a traitor because he broke the law... yes he broke the law... he broke the law that the evil side created.

Law and morals are two different things. Morals matter more. What Snowden did was good for humanity, the fact that it's illegal is a moot point because the ones that made it illegal are not moral.
 

Tgrove

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This! Edward Snowden is unimportant, the information he gave us is though. People attacking the messenger and not listening to the actual message are straight up stupid, period, or they happen to work for the government (not biased in anyway). :D

Those type of people make up a surprising amount in our country.
 

potency

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Seriously. What Snowden did for privacy will only make sense one day in retrospect.

What exactly has he done? What exactly is different? Do you really believe anything has changed? What he has done is endanger the lives of many fellow Americans abroad, individual Americans that risk far more than he ever has or will. What Snowden did was irresponsible, and though he'll never admit it, he definitely knows it.


These threads always attract the craziest [H] users. I mean ex or current military types.

These threads always attract the craziest [H] users. I mean the ones that pop nerd-boners every time they hear the name Snowden, or the American-educated middle-class hypocrites with their Che Guevara posters. Talk shit about our soldiers all you want, but our military is the ONLY reason you have the freedom to peck away at that keyboard that was manufactured by some poverty stricken child half way around the globe.


He's a whistleblower for the American people against an out-of-control domestic surveillance program.

The average American doesn't really give two shits about gov't surveillance. The media is the one making the biggest deal out of this. Since at least the 20th century, the average American just wants to enjoy all the benefits of being an average American, and doesn't really give a shit about anything until it directly affects or threatens their way of life. If voters cared, Congress wouldn't have renewed the Patriot Act.
 

Vercinaigh

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What exactly has he done? What exactly is different? Do you really believe anything has changed? What he has done is endanger the lives of many fellow Americans abroad, individual Americans that risk far more than he ever has or will. What Snowden did was irresponsible, and though he'll never admit it, he definitely knows it.

He got people's attention, all that mattered.


These threads always attract the craziest [H] users. I mean the ones that pop nerd-boners every time they hear the name Snowden, or the American-educated middle-class hypocrites with their Che Guevara posters. Talk shit about our soldiers all you want, but our military is the ONLY reason you have the freedom to peck away at that keyboard that was manufactured by some poverty stricken child half way around the globe.


Way to not be better than your piers and belittle yourself in the process. Now you can't be taken seriously. Also, the only reason any of that is relevant is because of militaries in general. More than one side to that coin, and it's a long drawn debate that has no winning scenario of pacifist vs militant vanguard.



The average American doesn't really give two shits about gov't surveillance. The media is the one making the biggest deal out of this. Since at least the 20th century, the average American just wants to enjoy all the benefits of being an average American, and doesn't really give a shit about anything until it directly affects or threatens their way of life. If voters cared, Congress wouldn't have renewed the Patriot Act.

Ignorance doesn't amount to willful uncaring, might want to ponder the differences.

All I really care to say is bolded.
 
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