nvidia surround?

Tamlin_WSGF

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If they had faked it and were using SoftTH, is SoftTH compatible with 3D Surround? Obviously they were in 3D mode in that demo.

The first link shows how to setup softTH with 3D vision on 3 screens, which was an answer to sbucklers question of how it could be possible to show this if the drivers weren't ready.

Nvidia might have things ready, but its not impossible that the setup can be a mockup as well. JHH showed with Fermi and wooden screws that they are not above showing mockups of products to come.

My point is that its pointless to "show they have it", since they also were supposed to launch it already, have advertised it and sold it as surround capable and not delivering.
 

dook43

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It's really amazing how people are still giving Nvidia the benefit of the doubt.
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Matrices

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Only among the delusional fanboys at EVGA.com (you should've seen the denial flare up when I posted over there about this). I don't see too many people giving them the benefit of anything here or at Anand.
 

Tamlin_WSGF

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Only among the delusional fanboys at EVGA.com (you should've seen the denial flare up when I posted over there about this). I don't see too many people giving them the benefit of anything here or at Anand.

I saw that :p

31655.jpg


I almost started an account there just to defend you in this. Especially when Chizow started ranting on dates. People are not supposed to go trawling the homepages to see if or when a product that is labeled on the package actually works.

Either it works after you take it out of the store and into your computer, or the product you bought DOESN'T support surround. That a product may support surround on a later stage, is irrelevant. Then there should be clearly stated on the box "disclaimer: this product is not supported, but might be supported once we get our fingers out of the ***".

As it is now, they are selling a feature-set advertised on the box that doesn't exist (and with Nvidia saying "scheduled summer 2010", means that they don't have a date even when it will be ready). Surround gamers are getting screwed. It might not matter to you that you are getting screwed and you might even enjoy getting screwed, but nevertheless, what the box says and what the content can do doesn't match.

It doesn't matter when they printed the boxes or how they printed them, or how much it costs to print them. They are selling as of today a feature-set that they don't have or intend to give yet to those who bought it.

Worst of all is that they have gone into hiding for a while and don't intent to inform their customers when they get what they paid for. Kyle emailed them from the 26th of April and got answer first yesterday. In this answer, he was told that some other guy would give him an answer. YEY!

I just thought of a good business idea for some of those guys!:

I sell them boxes saying "contains a GTX480". Inside, there is a greeting card saying:
Wait for a driver to bring you this card sometime this summer! I mean, some of those guys would probably pay for boxes without the product thats advertised outside it. And best of all, they will not feel screwed doing so! :D

Then I can push the "scheduled date for delivery" as long as I want, since they still will not feel screwed. :cool: If someone should ever take me to court, I can only say "what have I done wrong?, Nvidia also sold boxes without the product advertised inside!". :p

(ATI did this to when advertising HDCP capable on the boxes. They got rightfully drawn to court:
http://aticlassaction.com/)
 
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struggles

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Well if this gets drawn out past summer I am sure many will be looking for compensation. There is no doubt damages involved, many have purchased products to work in conjunction with the GTX 470/480's advertised features that have not been available to use them, not to mention the purchase of the cards themselves.
 

wadec22

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selling a product, advertising features as active that won't arrive for 2 to 5 months... that's just flat out fucking shady.

i started this thread as an excited fan and am now in the process of switching camps.

this is only opinion and personal experience, but i've always valued nvidia's superior drivers and sli scaling (just my experience). if they are going to bribe, lie and do magic tricks to try and one-up ATI,screw them. maybe we all would have been better off if 3dfx had survived.
 

Tamlin_WSGF

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Thats the thing. The only ones earning money on this delay is ATI. Its not that I am against them earning money, its just that I don't care how much they earn.

People should get what they pay for and its arrogant of Nvidia when they stick it to the users like this without even so much as a press-release (hopefully Kyle got something more then just a PR spin from Nvidia).

Don't sell the card. Do as the retailers and ship them the box with accessories and take the money for it as they do. If they should ask why the box doesn't have the card, say that you have scheduled a driver in summer to bring it to them (a schedule you might change later). If they then would say that they need the entire product to give you the money, then tell them: "finally, now you understand my point, you didn't deliver the entire product to me either, but took my money"! :D
 

shansoft

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Only among the delusional fanboys at EVGA.com (you should've seen the denial flare up when I posted over there about this). I don't see too many people giving them the benefit of anything here or at Anand.

ever wonder why true enthusiast never go to EVGA forums?

its a fanboy base there....
 

night_2004

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*sigh*

I'm done waiting for Surround. I have it now. It's called "Eyefinity."

Now I just need my third monitor to arrive.
 

NKD

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There are some decent, and some smart people there.


They just never post :p

I post there sometimes. It is true that there is a big fan base there. Nothing but praise for the EVGA Gods. Evga is a good company, but I evga x58 board pissed me off when it comes to usb devices. I just wanted to split it in half. It would randomly decide to stop recognizing my usb devices and on 2 of the ports my Logitech G15 didn't work at all. It worked in the other 6. So I returned the board and got a gigabyte x58a, usb 3, and better features for less price. I have not had an issue since.

Yea and I did do the bios update that was supposed to fix the USB issue, but that didn't help either.
 

vjcsmoke

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Apparently my 5970 has been fixed and will be shipped back to me soon. :D Looks like decision time coming up! To SLI (and wait indefinitely for Surround) or to Eyefinity?? :eek:
 

heatlesssun

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ever wonder why true enthusiast never go to EVGA forums?

its a fanboy base there....

There's a LOT of good technical information there but sure its an nVidia fan base mostly since eVGA doesn't sell AMD GPUs at the moment.

All of this debate is intresting but honestly the only thing that matters once this does come out is how well it actually works. If it is substiantly better than the competition this delay will be forgotten in short order. If not then of course nVidia will have shot itself in the foot yet again.

There is a chance here for nVidia to recover nicely from most that has gone wrong with Fermi is SLI and Surround support a lot of games out of the box with a solid performance lead of the HD 5000s. Or it could go the other way and that's really the part that fascinates me about this. Is Surround going to be nVidia's ace in the hole or Waterloo? There's nothing I've heard about it one way or the other and apparently I'm not alone.
 

jeremyshaw

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There's a LOT of good technical information there but sure its an nVidia fan base mostly since eVGA doesn't sell AMD GPUs at the moment.

All of this debate is intresting but honestly the only thing that matters once this does come out is how well it actually works. If it is substiantly better than the competition this delay will be forgotten in short order. If not then of course nVidia will have shot itself in the foot yet again.

There is a chance here for nVidia to recover nicely from most that has gone wrong with Fermi is SLI and Surround support a lot of games out of the box with a solid performance lead of the HD 5000s. Or it could go the other way and that's really the part that fascinates me about this. Is Surround going to be nVidia's ace in the hole or Waterloo? There's nothing I've heard about it one way or the other and apparently I'm not alone.

It's probably not going to be the waterloo for nVidia, it's a feature that requires two of their GPU, to begin with :eek:, and three monitors.


Now, if what people said about bandwidth saturation is true, expect a Fermi GTX4xx out, with a special "Fermi Surround Edition", or something, that has special connectors where the SLI bridge would normally be.

Or just wait for dualFermi (I'm waiting for nVidia to say: screw PCIe 1.x :p) cards to come out. Sure, it may need a stock watercooling setup, but it would alleviate the initial problem of bandwidth, somethat :D
 

Tamlin_WSGF

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There's a LOT of good technical information there but sure its an nVidia fan base mostly since eVGA doesn't sell AMD GPUs at the moment.

All of this debate is intresting but honestly the only thing that matters once this does come out is how well it actually works. If it is substiantly better than the competition this delay will be forgotten in short order. If not then of course nVidia will have shot itself in the foot yet again.

There is a chance here for nVidia to recover nicely from most that has gone wrong with Fermi is SLI and Surround support a lot of games out of the box with a solid performance lead of the HD 5000s. Or it could go the other way and that's really the part that fascinates me about this. Is Surround going to be nVidia's ace in the hole or Waterloo? There's nothing I've heard about it one way or the other and apparently I'm not alone.

It can go both ways, but I doubt it can ever be substantially better then the competition. Nvidia faces the same limitations that ATI did when they considered to go with a software or hardware solution:
ATI considered a software only approach a while ago, but ultimately vetoed it for a couple of reasons. With the software-only solution you need to have a multi-GPU capable system. That means a more expensive motherboard, a more powerful PSU and a little more hassle configuration wise. Then there were the performance concerns.

One scenario is that you have very noticeable asymmetry as you have one card driving one display and the other card driving two displays. This can cause some strange problems. The other scenario is that you have all three displays coming off of a single card, and in alternating frames you send display data from one GPU to the next either via PCIe or a CF/SLI connector. With 6 displays, Carrell was concerned that there wouldn’t be enough bandwidth to do that fast enough
.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/2937/10

Nvidia might have overcome these challenges or they might have these issues, but consider the solution "ok" to launch and rather focus on what they can do with 3D.

From what I've seen of released documentation, their solution seems more strict then Eyefinity and that might be a result of these challenges. Softth is the least restrictive method of multi-mon gaming and the only one that supports PLP (in fullscreen, you can do Eyefinity in PLP if you use windowed mode). softth doesn't support SLI or Crossfire though, so they can "afford" to be less restrictive.

The good news, is that there will be wider support for multi-mon gaming, which can lead to:
better support among developers, screens with smaller bezel and a boost in multi-mon tech in general due to competition. Games that support multi-mon usually have better FOV for widescreens as well, so single screen gamers can benefit from this as well.

Should Nvidia's software solution prove to be inferior, it most likely won't stay that way forever, so they might come stronger back with the next crossroad.

The important thing is that they release the drivers, so people can actually start using Nvidia surround. Then they can improve the tech while people game and give them feedback. This is not hardware, so its not like they can't do anything after they have released the drivers, even if beta. Its better they take some crap for the beta, then ripping people off by not giving them what they bought and are already entitled to.
 

BlueStorm

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The wait isn't that much longer. I suggest people stop grandstanding since it's only been a month since the products were released. Also exaggerating is pretty much uncalled for.. no one has said anything about 5 months.

I think people will be pretty happy with the performance levels. It will be released like any other major product/feature with an organized round of reviews.
 

Tamlin_WSGF

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The wait isn't that much longer. I suggest people stop grandstanding since it's only been a month since the products were released. Also exaggerating is pretty much uncalled for.. no one has said anything about 5 months.

I think people will be pretty happy with the performance levels. It will be released like any other major product/feature with an organized round of reviews.

I'd like to correct you there: Its been over a month since the product were sold. They advertised it as a feature on the package, sold it as a feature on the package and failed to deliver it.
4409278395_da36d0f8b6.jpg

People in this very thread bought the product due to the feature advertised top left in this picture. They have taken the money and still not delivered according to package description. That is a ripoff. Just as if you buy a frozen pizza that says with meatballs and there are no meatballs.

Nvidia surround should be delivered with the first package they sold, as long as its advertised and sold as a feature. There is no dancing around there. Nvidia has to relate to this as any other who sell stuff in boxes. The content and features they advertise actually has to be there upon date of purchase.

So far, nvidia is continuously selling something they don't have and there is not even a press release explaining why people don't get what they pay for.

This said, its good news if it gets released soon, but when is soon? days, weeks, months? Do you have any official links where Nvidia has released this info, or is this only hearsay?
 

BlueStorm

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I'd like to correct you there: Its been over a month since the product were sold. They advertised it as a feature on the package, sold it as a feature on the package and failed to deliver it.

People in this very thread bought the product due to the feature advertised top left in this picture. They have taken the money and still not delivered according to package description. That is a ripoff. Just as if you buy a frozen pizza that says with meatballs and there are no meatballs.

Nvidia surround should be delivered with the first package they sold, as long as its advertised and sold as a feature. There is no dancing around there. Nvidia has to relate to this as any other who sell stuff in boxes. The content and features they advertise actually has to be there upon date of purchase.

So far, nvidia is continuously selling something they don't have and there is not even a press release explaining why people don't get what they pay for.

This said, its good news if it gets released soon, but when is soon? days, weeks, months? Do you have any official links where Nvidia has released this info, or is this only hearsay?

It's only been out a month.. launched April 12th. How the hell are you going to sit there and say it's been "more than a month"? Ridiculous.

However Surround is just around the corner, so relax. Given the amount of time you will own and use the products for, a month or two is pretty reasonable. If it were beyond that I could understand the frustration.. but it's not. The fact that people are for some reason assuming it will be 5 months, then going and bitching about that is illogical and pretty trollish.

What's the right solution, according to you? Not print it on the box and make it confusing for consumers who see boxes printed from before Surround was available, thinking it doesn't support it even after the driver is released? Have them questioning if this product will ever support Surround?

What about AMD launching with supposed Eyefinity and CrossfireX support? They didn't work together until a couple months ago. What about AMD offering that magical "CrossfireX sideport" that everyone was sure to increase performance and was never enabled with the 3870x2. The lesson is sometimes shit happens, but to sit here and whine about class action lawsuits and BBB complaints (as if the BBB has any relevance) is just grandstanding and childish... especially for something that is obviously very close. You're not doing yourself any favors. Use your best judgement to figure out what "soon" is.. it's obviously not months.

Have you ever considered that maybe.. just maybe... NVIDIA is not some evil entity trying to screw you, and is actually working to give you the best possible experience as soon as you install that first driver, so that you don't have to deal with the headaches yourself? Or that maybe.. just maybe, they want to get the best performance possible so you can know what it's capable of when reading reviews?
 
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jeremyshaw

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It's only been out a month.. launched April 12th. How the hell are you going to sit there and say it's been "more than a month"? Ridiculous.

However Surround is just around the corner, so relax. Given the amount of time you will own and use the products for, a month or two is pretty reasonable. If it were beyond that I could understand the frustration.. but it's not. The fact that people are for some reason assuming it will be 5 months, then going and bitching about that is illogical and pretty trollish.

What about AMD launching with supposed Eyefinity and CrossfireX support? They didn't work together until a couple months ago. What about AMD offering that magical "CrossfireX sideport" that everyone was sure to increase performance and was never enabled with the 3870x2. The lesson is sometimes shit happens, but to sit here and whine about class action lawsuits is just grandstanding and childish... especially for something that is obviously very close. You're not doing yourself any favors.

Side port was a HD4870X2 feature (not present in final SKU).

Eyefinity over Crossfire was never promised, but was assumed, due to the possibility of a HD5870X2 (later the HD5970), and because it was mentioned Eyefinity would be a feature of all Evergreen stack GPU.

AMD did get slapped with a class action lawsuit, for HDCP and the X1000 series, way back :p

Other than those minor points, you are correct on all other counts.
 

Tamlin_WSGF

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It's only been out a month.. launched April 12th. How the hell are you going to sit there and say it's been "more than a month"? Ridiculous.

However Surround is just around the corner, so relax. Given the amount of time you will have the products for a month or two is pretty reasonable. If it were beyond that I could understand the frustration.. but it's not. The fact that people are for some reason assuming it will be 5 months, then going and bitching about that is illogical and pretty trollish.

Don't forget AMD offered that magical "CrossfireX sideport" that was "sure to increase performance" and was never enabled with the 3870x2. The lesson is sometimes shit happens, but to sit here and whine about class action lawsuits is just grandstanding and childish.

I count from 26th of March as launch date.

You keep saying "just around the corner". Do you have any solid information as a date? Preferably with some evidence backing this up?

I really don't care what AMD did in the past(as the HDCP lawsuit I mentioned earlier) or what Intel have done. I have no stocks in either company. Its the products I am talking about.

Nvidia advertised and sold the product "Nvidia 3D vision surround". People bought the product and it says on the package what they bought. BUT, they never received the product.

These things matter for the widescreen community and Nvidia is currently selling vaporware. If you have any connections in Nvidia, ask them to get the finger out and deliver what they sold.

Didn't catch your edit:
Right solution would have been:
Advertising and selling Nvidia surround as an upcoming feature at least with a sticker at minimum.
Given a press release when they failed to deliver in April.
Given an exact delivery date to people who bought the product.
At minimum, release it as beta and rather explain why its beta.

AND, I am not saying that Nvidia is some evil that tries to screw you over. I am saying that Nvidia is an arrogant company that already screwed people over without even a pressrelease explaining why, and not because they are evil, but because of $$$ which is why they have a company.
 
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BlueStorm

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I count from 26th of March as launch date.

You keep saying "just around the corner". Do you have any solid information as a date? Preferably with some evidence backing this up?

I really don't care what AMD did in the past(as the HDCP lawsuit I mentioned earlier) or what Intel have done. I have no stocks in either company. Its the products I am talking about.

Nvidia advertised and sold the product "Nvidia 3D vision surround". People bought the product and it says on the package what they bought. BUT, they never received the product.

These things matter for the widescreen community and Nvidia is currently selling vaporware. If you have any connections in Nvidia, ask them to get the finger out and deliver what they sold.

Didn't catch your edit:
Right solution would have been:
Advertising and selling Nvidia surround as an upcoming feature at least with a sticker at minimum.
Given a press release when they failed to deliver in April.
Given an exact delivery date to people who bought the product.
At minimum, release it as beta and rather explain why its beta.

Why would someone give an exact date for something that is still being worked on? It's the same reason developers like iD and Valve don't give them.. they say "it will be released when it's ready". Setting a hard date is setting yourself up for failure, because if it's not ready then they have to go and answer to angry customers. To avoid disappointing people they are not making promises.. it seems they can't win either way.

No company is going to press release a delay to deliver something... press releases cost money and they're not going to highlight negatives.. common sense.

For new major features betas take the impact out of reviews, and reviewers don't have "exclusive stuff to cover" then. Less reviewers are interested in making stories around things that are already widely available to the public.

And you should know that even anyone with knowledge couldn't divulge dates :)
 

BlueStorm

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They said Fermi was "just around the corner" for 6 months...

And it genuinely was. Perpetually :) It's not a lie... sometimes there are unforeseen challenges associated with a ground-up brand new architecture with 3B transistors.
 
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Tamlin_WSGF

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Why would someone give an exact date for something that is still being worked on? It's the same reason developers like iD and Valve don't give them.. they say "it will be released when it's ready". Setting a hard date is setting yourself up for failure, because if it's not ready then they have to go and answer to angry customers. To avoid disappointing people they are not making promises.. it seems they can't win either way.

Question is, why would Nvidia sell a product, print on the package what consumer get and then not have a foggiest idea themselves when it will be ready!?!

No company is going to press release a delay to deliver something... press releases cost money and they're not going to highlight negatives.. common sense.

Companies do press-releases about delays all the time. Nvidia actually sold this product, so they have a responsibility explaining why people are not getting what they paid for.

For new major features betas take the impact out of reviews, and reviewers don't have "exclusive stuff to cover" then. Less reviewers are interested in making stories around things that are already widely available to the public.

I don't care about Nvidia PR and what they earn more money on. Its the consumers that matters in my book and Nvidia PR have already screwed this up by advertising something they don't even know when will be ready. This is a product Nvidia has sold and continues to sell while its vaporware. If Nvidia will release a beta, reviewers will do a follow up anyway when the WHQL is released.

As a note, I wouldn't spend time arguing this with you unless I actually find Nvidia surround important. But, my concern is about the users and not Nvidia and don't mix ATI into this anymore. If I would care, ATI is actually earning money now the more Nvidia surround is delayed, so for them its best I don't push it. :p
 

BlueStorm

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Question is, why would Nvidia sell a product, print on the package what consumer get and then not have a foggiest idea themselves when it will be ready!?!



Companies do press-releases about delays all the time. Nvidia actually sold this product, so they have a responsibility explaining why people are not getting what they paid for.



I don't care about Nvidia PR and what they earn more money on. Its the consumers that matters in my book and Nvidia PR have already screwed this up by advertising something they don't even know when will be ready. This is a product Nvidia has sold and continues to sell while its vaporware. If Nvidia will release a beta, reviewers will do a follow up anyway when the WHQL is released.

Sorry guy, you're being overly dramatic. There's a difference between saying "we don't know if/when it will be ready" and "it will be ready soon, but we can't tell you the exact day because that's changed before and we don't want to disappoint".

I think it's safe to say the bottom line is they're not going to make any long delays... it's pretty much ready.
 

jeremyshaw

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Sorry guy, you're being overly dramatic. There's a difference between saying "we don't know if/when it will be ready" and "it will be ready soon, but we can't tell you the exact day because that's changed before and we don't want to disappoint".

Of course, neither had been confirmed, nor denied :p
 

Tamlin_WSGF

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Sorry guy, you're being overly dramatic. There's a difference between saying "we don't know if/when it will be ready" and "it will be ready soon, but we can't tell you the exact day because that's changed before and we don't want to disappoint".

I think it's safe to say the bottom line is they're not going to make any long delays... it's pretty much ready.

You are aware that you are contradicting yourself? You say its pretty much ready and just around the corner, while you also say that Nvidia don't have the foggiest idea when it will be ready and therefore cannot set a date of when they will deliver a product they already sold.
 

BlueStorm

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You are aware that you are contradicting yourself? You say its pretty much ready and just around the corner, while you also say that Nvidia don't have the foggiest idea when it will be ready and therefore cannot set a date of when they will deliver a product they already sold.

Not in the slightest. I just told you there isn't an exact date, because things come up, dates change slightly. But in general it is very close. I'm not sure why this is so hard to comprehend..

By the way, I especially like how you write this from the standpoint of some harmed consumer, as if they have no method of recourse. If they are depending on having that feature *today*, they can simply return their cards. It's a fairly impulsive decision to make (given that you will not wait long, and yet you will likely live with your decision on a replacement purchase for some time), but it's a perfectly valid option. No need to get all high and mighty with the consumer "protection" complaints.

It's not as if average joe gamers will just go buy 3 monitors because they read something on the box... the tiny percentage of people who want the feature already know about it. These people research and actively pursue this type of setup, and know very well what's up on average.
 
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Tamlin_WSGF

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Not in the slightest. I just told you there isn't an exact date, because things come up, dates change slightly. But in general it is very close. I'm not sure why this is so hard to comprehend..

Because very close in Nvidia time can mean months. Schedule has been pushed to summer 2010 and not June or July. "Very close" and "just around the corner" is meaningless.

People are jumping ship already from Nvidia to ATI due to this. However, if they at least got a date to relate to, many wouldn't jump ship and people who didn't get what they paid for at least would know when they will get it. Summer covers 3-4 months depending on their definition of summer.

Its actually disturbing that Nvidia can't even give a month nevertheless a date of when they will release Nvidia surround, but that didn't stop them from printing and selling it with the package, now did it?

Regardless of how you twist it, Nvidia is overdue from the time they sold their first box with 3D vision surround printed on it. its not people who has to understand why Nvidia do this and that, but Nvidia that needs to understand that people actually want to have what they paid for. Is that so hard to understand?

Nvidia continues to sell boxes with "3D vision surround" and no disclaimer that its a future product, even though they know its vaporware. That is ripping people off and everyone have a right to get pissed by this.
 

BlueStorm

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Because very close in Nvidia time can mean months. Schedule has been pushed to summer 2010 and not June or July. "Very close" and "just around the corner" is meaningless.

People are jumping ship already from Nvidia to ATI due to this. However, if they at least got a date to relate to, many wouldn't jump ship and people who didn't get what they paid for at least would know when they will get it. Summer covers 3-4 months depending on their definition of summer.

Its actually disturbing that Nvidia can't even give a month nevertheless a date of when they will release Nvidia surround, but that didn't stop them from printing and selling it with the package, now did it?

Regardless of how you twist it, Nvidia is overdue from the time they sold their first box with 3D vision surround printed on it. its not people who has to understand why Nvidia do this and that, but Nvidia that needs to understand that people actually want to have what they paid for. Is that so hard to understand?

Nvidia continues to sell boxes with "3D vision surround" and no disclaimer that its a future product, even though they know its vaporware. That is ripping people off and everyone have a right to get pissed by this.

To which I reply a big fat "OH WELL".

Seriously dude, take a chill pill and see what happens :) This is hardcore enthusiast feature which something like a fraction of a fraction of a percent will use. It takes a lot of engineering to put together into a very solid and well performing package, and it's coming soon. This is the last time I will re-iterate this for you.
 

jeremyshaw

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To which I reply a big fat "OH WELL".

Seriously dude, take a chill pill and see what happens :) This is hardcore enthusiast feature which something like a fraction of a fraction of a percent will use. It takes a lot of engineering to put together into a very solid and well performing package, and it's coming soon. This is the last time I will re-iterate this for you.

Considering every GT200 is also eligeable, I doubt it's a "fraction of a fraction" of people. True, not every GT200 owner has dual+ monitors, but it's not that far of a stretch :p
 

BlueStorm

Gawd
Joined
Jan 2, 2009
Messages
738
Considering every GT200 is also eligeable, I doubt it's a "fraction of a fraction" of people. True, not every GT200 owner has dual+ monitors, but it's not that far of a stretch :p

By that logic, SLI would be hugely popular because it works with 6-series, 7-series, 8-series, 9-series, GTX 2xx series, and GTX 4xx series.. but every Steam survey, it's still less than 2 percent of users (with Crossfire far behind that).

Now factor in the fact that for Surround, it takes 2 GPUS in SLI *and* 3 displays. That's a subset of a subset.... a subset of the 1.81% SLI users. It's a fraction of a fraction.
 

Tamlin_WSGF

2[H]4U
Joined
Aug 1, 2006
Messages
2,988
To which I reply a big fat "OH WELL".

Seriously dude, take a chill pill and see what happens :) This is hardcore enthusiast feature which something like a fraction of a fraction of a percent will use. It takes a lot of engineering to put together into a very solid and well performing package, and it's coming soon. This is the last time I will re-iterate this for you.

And guess where this fraction comes from. Take also a note in my profile where I come from.

I hope this is a solid and well performing package that would supersede anything we have seen before, but that doesn't change the fact that Nvidia has already sold this as a finished product with print on the package and all. This is the last time I will re-iterate this for you:

Nvidia needs to step up and take some responsibility for a product they are selling which are not ready.
 

jeremyshaw

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Aug 26, 2009
Messages
12,512
By that logic, SLI would be hugely popular because it works with 6-series, 7-series, 8-series, 9-series, GTX 2xx series, and GTX 4xx series.. but every Steam survey, it's still less than 2 percent of users (with Crossfire far behind that).

Now factor in the fact that for Surround, it takes 2 GPUS in SLI *and* 3 displays. That's a subset of a subset.... a subset of the 1.81% SLI users. It's a fraction of a fraction.

Yep, because every PC gamer has steam, or even cares to submit their results into the optional survey. :)


At any rate, multimonitor works with two displays, too (though it's hard as hell to aim :mad:... in my experience. Maybe other people are better with the bezels than I am).

Now where you get the "accurate" numbers, do tell :p
 

Astrodave

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Apr 20, 2005
Messages
1,082
Right solution would have been:
Advertising and selling Nvidia surround as an upcoming feature at least with a sticker at minimum.
Given a press release when they failed to deliver in April.
Given an exact delivery date to people who bought the product.
At minimum, release it as beta and rather explain why its beta.

^---This

I think Tamlin's point is that nvidia screwed a LOT of people here. The least they could have done if they were going to screw us is give us a reach around. It really is false advertising and THAT is the crux of the issue. The wait times and the semantics aside, it is printed right on the box as a feature. Game, set, match.
 

harmattan

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Feb 11, 2008
Messages
4,889
And guess where this fraction comes from. Take also a note in my profile where I come from.

I hope this is a solid and well performing package that would supersede anything we have seen before, but that doesn't change the fact that Nvidia has already sold this as a finished product with print on the package and all. This is the last time I will re-iterate this for you:

Nvidia needs to step up and take some responsibility for a product they are selling which are not ready.

This pretty much somes it up. I'd refer back to my earlier in-depth posts on consumer protection law, but there is absolutely NO GREY AREA here, legal or otherwise. nV is selling a product with an advertised feature that is doesn't work.

No one is grandstanding here: if you spend $1000+ based on an advertised feature that doesn't work, ss Kyle mentioned, you have a right to be pissed. Furthermore, you are due a direct refund if preferred.

The way this will likely play out, in any case, is nV will release a hacked up version with 3D Vision support and say the 3D Surround is on it's way so they can say at least part of the feature is working (albeit the part no one uses). And if the hypothosized hardware limitations are true, they'll string out full support for months upon months.
 
Joined
May 15, 2006
Messages
2,062
Why would someone give an exact date for something that is still being worked on? It's the same reason developers like iD and Valve don't give them.. they say "it will be released when it's ready". Setting a hard date is setting yourself up for failure, because if it's not ready then they have to go and answer to angry customers. To avoid disappointing people they are not making promises.. it seems they can't win either way.

No company is going to press release a delay to deliver something... press releases cost money and they're not going to highlight negatives.. common sense.

:rolleyes: If this were how business was done in the real world, nothing would ever get accomplished. When a customer places an order with a company, you give an exact date as to the latest you will deliver the goods. I don't care if it's apples, bolts, cars, or video cards. You give this date because doing otherwise would basically amount to holding the customers needs for ransom. When a supplier can't meet a deadline, they have some serious explaining to do.

The entertainment industries (developers, and production studios) sometimes get leeway with deadlines because of creative processes inherit to their product. Hardware manufacturers do not get this luxury after they've given a hard date for a product. If it gets in the hands of the customer and it's DOA or not functioning in some advertised way then they have some explaining to do. "When it's ready!" is not good enough.

If a customer placed an order for product with my company, and then asked "When can we expect delivery?" and we said "When it's ready!" that would be the end of the conversation and the last time we would be able to do business with that customer.
 
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