Nvidia Responds To Witcher 3 GameWorks Controversy, PC Gamers On The Offensive

Well, I'm not happy. I have a GTX 670 and the best I can do is run at 30 FPS on high in the Witcher 3. Not only that but it goes down to 20FPS in cut scenes!
 
xLokiX said:
So, new tech is faster than old tech...GTFO. Never expected that.
Click to expand...

Not sure if serious. But if you are, you might want to consider going through TPU's 960 review and see how the 960 stacks up against the 780 in 20 different games before making such statements.
 
Nice to see the r9 290x still holding its own! Simply amazed at how poor the 780ti is so far, almost went with that over a 290. There must be a patch or driver incoming to fix this.
 
PRIME1 said:
NVIDIA goes out of their way to make sure games run better for their customers.

Meanwhile AMD has not released a driver since last year.
Click to expand...

you talk so much shit it isn't funny....theres been at least 5 drivers since last year or more
 
primetime said:
you talk so much shit it isn't funny....theres been at least 5 drivers since last year or more
Click to expand...

I'm using AMD's site as a reference.

EaDgSYM.jpg
 
PRIME1 said:
I'm using AMD's site as a reference.

EaDgSYM.jpg
Click to expand...

which goes to show you don't know shit or how to use there site...your like a broken record and it never stops...yea we know you think nvidia can do nothing wrong and any competitor they have is a horrible company...give it a rest will yea
 
One worrying thought. If NV continues to play with Game works and nothing changes, what will stop AMD from trying to even the odds, take gloves off and do the same? They can get lock some tech and give it to chosen devs too. Imagine the Battlefront suddenly dropping frames on NV hardware...

This would require having two gpus to actually play games with eye candies from both camps.
 
MorgothPl said:
One worrying thought. If NV continues to play with Game works and nothing changes, what will stop AMD from trying to even the odds, take gloves off and do the same? They can get lock some tech and give it to chosen devs too. Imagine the Battlefront suddenly dropping frames on NV hardware...

This would require having two gpus to actually play games with eye candies from both camps.
Click to expand...

They already tried this with Mantle.
 
ocellaris said:
You mean that beta driver for GTA5 while Nvidia manages to release WHQL drivers for a game not even a day old? That really isn't helping AMD much right there.
Click to expand...

It's not helping your argument either.

*sigh* f*n b*ys
 
Bowman15 said:
It's not helping your argument either.

*sigh* f*n b*ys
Click to expand...

Where is AMD supporting launch day Witcher 3 players?

Neither company is perfect, however Nvidia generally does better supporting new games compared to AMD. Nvidia keeps chalking up wins with better gamer support, AMD keeps posting betas and having issues with new games, regardless of who is at fault.
 
crusty_juggler said:
Ah, I see. You guys are trying to say the non-WHQL beta driver for GTA V is the real driver. The patch notes are hilarious. There are more known issues than fixed issues. Literally.

Welp, I guess that's why it's a beta driver.
Click to expand...

LOL...all of the sudden it has to be WHQL qualified now, which means basically nothing. I thought you were actually looking and not thread crapping. I see how this is going. I'm out...
 
I don't know who's fault it is, but a non-working crossfire driver on release is bullshit. I'm getting tired of AMD, even if it's not their fault.
 
Bowman15 said:
*sigh* f*n b*ys
Click to expand...
You can say fanboy here, this isn't the Steam forums.

Anyway, I have no allegiance to either GPU manufacturer. I've owned more AMD/ATI cards than Nvidia cards, and I'm interested in what 390X will bring to the table. That being said, I go where the support and performance is, and that place is Nvidia.

If AMD can produce better drivers and better hardware, then I'll gladly purchase their products. Proprietary fur and hair technology or a vendor specific ambient occlusion method aren't what's holding AMD back, AMD is. They need to step up their game in order to compete. Sadly, it doesn't look like they have the manpower or financial strength to do so.
 
Well Nvidia has always been like this from what i can remember, when games were "optimized" for nvidia.
 
crusty_juggler said:
You can say fanboy here, this isn't the Steam forums.

Anyway, I have no allegiance to either GPU manufacturer. I've owned more AMD/ATI cards than Nvidia cards, and I'm interested in what 390X will bring to the table. That being said, I go where the support and performance is, and that place is Nvidia.

If AMD can produce better drivers and better hardware, then I'll gladly purchase their products. Proprietary fur and hair technology or a vendor specific ambient occlusion method aren't what's holding AMD back, AMD is. They need to step up their game in order to compete. Sadly, it doesn't look like they have the manpower or financial strength to do so.
Click to expand...

Yeah I went with Nvidia for better drivers etc... as well but if they don't fix how the Kepler cards are preforming in new games, that is the last of Nvidia for me.
I am just lucky I only bought a 780, I'd hate to say I bought a Titan after seeing the new witcher 3 benchmarks.
 
GameWorks and DSR are ways for Nvidia to eat up as much gpu power on your system as possible. So you'll grab that second 980, etc.
 
You guys have been around pcs for what a hole year or you just never learned anything. You think that whql tag means jack shit? Trust me, I had issues over the years with Nvidia whql that was far worse then anything i encountered with amd beta drivers. You guys do know there are issues whether or not they claim to be "known" by both camps...Theres always issues:D

Fanboy clowns and noobs
 
Time and time again, a game comes out and Nvidia is always right there with an optimized day one driver. You can count on it. Today its Witcher 3, and the SLI scaling is fantastic - day one.

Meanwhile at AMD, Crossfire is broken in the game and driver is nowhere to be seen. There is simply no excuse for AMD's lazy "we'll get around to it" driver release pacing.

Zealots on both sides of fanboi wars are useless, but I do know one thing: Nvidia supports their products. And boo hoo gameworks, if a company spends millions in R&D to enhance the performance and features of their products and give their business a competitive edge, do people really expect them to just email their competitors the source code? Seriously? Get a grip. They're running a business.
 
Last edited:
odditory said:
Time and time again, a game comes out and Nvidia is always right there with an optimized day one driver. Today its Witcher 3, and the SLI scaling is fantastic.

Meanwhile at AMD, Crossfire is broken in the game and driver is nowhere to be seen.

Zealots on both sides of fanboi wars are useless, but I do know one thing: Nvidia supports their products. And boo hoo gameworks, if a company spends millions in R&D to give themselves a competitive edge, do people REALLY expect them to just email AMD the source code? Get a grip.
Click to expand...
Is this really a huge surprise? The Witcher 3 is bundled with NVIDIA products, uses NVIDIA GameWorks tech and CDPR has a very close relationship with NVIDIA. If I was a betting man, I'd guess that AMD doesn't have the same access to the game that NVIDIA does.

It sucks, but that's the state of the industry right now.
 
Rizen said:
Is this really a huge surprise? The Witcher 3 is bundled with NVIDIA products, uses NVIDIA GameWorks tech and CDPR has a very close relationship with NVIDIA. If I was a betting man, I'd guess that AMD doesn't have the same access to the game that NVIDIA does.

It sucks, but that's the state of the industry right now.
Click to expand...

I really don't care how the sausage is made. Not my problem. All I know is support was there day one.

And it doesn't change what I said that pretty much every major game release will have an Nvidia optimized driver on day one. Call Witcher 3 an exception, but it doesn't disprove the rule.

Let's put it this way: If we took the last 30-40 AAA releases and we compared the game specific driver release date for both Nvidia and AMD, which do you think would be there day one 99+% of the time? And which would be seen weeks or months later? This isn't even an argument.
 
I wasn't making an argument. It's simply the way the industry is, like I said. Fortunately, I expect we should have a bit better experience once Vulkan and DX12 start to take over.

I will say, I haven't really had a problem with AMD drivers so far with TW3. Aside from CrossFire not working, which is disappointing, the game runs flawlessly. I imagine there will be better performance with upcoming drivers and eventually CFX support, but there's nothing wrong with the 15.4.1 betas.
 
You know I can't help but draw parallels with Tomb Raider's TressFX issues on nVidia cards at launch. Basically before nVidia had access to TressFX's source code for optimization it ran like dog poo with unplayable framerates. Which led nVidia to apologize for the poor performance:

Andrew Burnes@nVidia said:
We are aware of performance and stability issues with GeForce GPUs running Tomb Raider with maximum settings. Unfortunately, NVIDIA didn’t receive final game code until this past weekend which substantially decreased stability, image quality and performance over a build we were previously provided. We are working closely with Crystal Dynamics to address and resolve all game issues as quickly as possible.

Please be advised that these issues cannot be completely resolved by an NVIDIA driver. The developer will need to make code changes on their end to fix the issues on GeForce GPUs as well. As a result, we recommend you do not test Tomb Raider until all of the above issues have been resolved.

In the meantime, we would like to apologize to GeForce users that are not able to have a great experience playing Tomb Raider, as they have come to expect with all of their favorite PC games.
Click to expand...

Let's just get the 800lb gorrilla out of the way and say no, getting the final code days before launch certainly won't do nVidia any favors, and one could probably drum up some AMD conspiracy theories. But let's look closer at the second paragraph:

Please be advised that these issues cannot be completely resolved by an NVIDIA driver. The developer will need to make code changes on their end to fix the issues on GeForce GPUs as well. As a result, we recommend you do not test Tomb Raider until all of the above issues have been resolved.
Click to expand...

So I have to ask, if nVidia couldn't optimize for AMD's TressFX without having the dev "make code changes on their end", how do people expect AMD to optimize for nVidia's GameWorks library? The difference in Tomb Raider's case was that Crystal Dynamics could share the source code since TressFX is open source.

Seems to me this really goes beyond your typical "AMD drivers are terrible!" kneejerk response, unless I'm missing something. I anticipate the arguments will probably be that if AMD had better dev relations, they wouldn't find themselves in the position they're in today. Such is reality I suppose.
 
Support for Nvidia's GW implementation means that small developers will get squeezed out. It's pay to play. Or, pay to program and fix bugs. I don't like a lot of the crapware being peddled and over-hyped by some of the big gaming houses. The cutscenes have more effort put into them than the gameplay.

Innovation is the purview of the small developer. (A lot of flops, some spectacular successes.)

AMD needs to step up with better drivers, better support to developers, better support for OpenGL. Yes, OpenGL: it's the "cheap" solution for small teams. By "small", I mean 2 to 5 guys and gals who're sinking their credit card balances into a dream.

Nvidia is using its market-dominance to squeeze out AMD. I'm a free-market guy. I don't think that Nvidia's actions are "evil", but I do see it as something which will increase their profits. They will be able to increase their prices without (serious) competition. AMD, right now, is that competition. (Just like small devs are the competitors to EA/Ubisoft/etc.) One possible end-game is that Nvidia wins, AMD disappears (at least from gpu work) and a GRAND UNIFIED ERA OF GPU USE is ushered in. Prices go up, innovation stalls, and, eventually, another competitor will try to step in. (Will Nvidia follow the MS model and buy up every potential competitor while they are still a non-threat?)

Shrug.

The 390X release will tell the tale.
 
Can't wait for AMD to fail so that so many of you can get what you want. A rerturn to the 8800 days and worse.

Lucky :rolleyes: for me, most of the big publishers are already on my do not buy list, and I am already slowly withdrawing out of the PC gaming hobby due to that. AMD will prolly hold on long enough that I will have already left the hobby b4 Nv being on my do not buy list causes me any issues.
 
odditory said:
I really don't care how the sausage is made. Not my problem. All I know is support was there day one.

And it doesn't change what I said that pretty much every major game release will have an Nvidia optimized driver on day one. Call Witcher 3 an exception, but it doesn't disprove the rule.

Let's put it this way: If we took the last 30-40 AAA releases and we compared the game specific driver release date for both Nvidia and AMD, which do you think would be there day one 99+% of the time? And which would be seen weeks or months later? This isn't even an argument.
Click to expand...

And quick drivers don't mean 100% fix. Been plenty of Nvidia drivers that went backwards with performance. Even some of these quick drivers.
 
Game runs like shit even on my older 3 SLI'd 6GB stock Titans. I have to turn Hairworks off. I'm running @ 4k/60Hz tho. I'll definitely need to pick up some new cards once they come out.:(
 
c3k said:
AMD needs to step up with better drivers, better support to developers, better support for OpenGL. Yes, OpenGL: it's the "cheap" solution for small teams. By "small", I mean 2 to 5 guys and gals who're sinking their credit card balances into a dream.
Click to expand...

Which games use OpenGL that it's even worth investing resources into OpenGL driver support? IdTech5 games? Anything else? OpenGL development was stagnant for years, and it fell behind. Vulkan may matter; we'll see.

AMD has a head-start on Vulkan, which is being based off of AMD's Mantle.
 
A couple of points:

1. Why do we have so many people on this board that actively hate competition, think Nvidia is God/life, and refuse to admit that AMD is really not that far behind? Even if AMD is behind, you still need competition to motivate other companies like Nvidia. Also, AMD's work on Mantle may not end up as a long-term solution but DirectX 12 and perhaps the new Vulkan API are here to compete. Without Mantle, it would have taken longer for us to get those updates, probably. If AMD were to go out of business, every single effect on the marketplace would be negative. Neither Intel nor Nvidia would have ANY competition (if you're thinking ARM right now, shut up) and that would only be good for them, not the consumer. Every effect on the consumer would be negative.

2. Why are people blaming Nvidia for releasing this library rather than game developers for using it? If it can't be optimized for AMD then CD Projekt Red is at fault for choosing Gameworks.


^ Fair opinion that is neither pro-Nvidia nor pro-AMD. Way too much lack of logic in the other posts in this thread. Very disappointing. Use some logic. Understand how markets work.
 
Last edited:
If I had a dime for every tech company that crashed an burned over the years, I could buy AMD.

If AMD truly is at the end of days they could at least go out gracefully, instead of blaming everyone for their failures.

Competition is good, but AMD has not been competing for a long time now.
 
PRIME1 said:
Competition is good, but AMD has not been competing for a long time now.
Click to expand...

Yes, they actually have been competing just fine. They're not that far behind. They haven't had first-place performance for a bit now, but they're not lagging far behind. And no matter how poor a job you think they are doing at competing, competition is ALWAYS better than no competition. No matter what. There would not be a single positive effect of AMD going under.

Some of you seem to think that a company either needs to be THE best in their field or they need to go out of business. Does anyone here understand how markets work?
 
when Direct X came out it was supposed to put and end to all of these different APIs...now here we are some 20 years later and nothing has changed...and exactly why does Nvidia need this api? could it be their performance in DX is not what it would be?
 
Last edited:
^^ Gameworks isn't API - it's a set of libraries for DX11.

Rizen said:
I wasn't making an argument. It's simply the way the industry is, like I said. Fortunately, I expect we should have a bit better experience once Vulkan and DX12 start to take over.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't bet on it - getting closer access to hardware means there's also higher chance of catastrophic fuckups by devs.

Kinda like writing assembler code where even placing of code matters vs. high level language like Java
 
dandragonrage said:
Yes, they actually have been competing just fine. They're not that far behind. They haven't had first-place performance for a bit now, but they're not lagging far behind. And no matter how poor a job you think they are doing at competing, competition is ALWAYS better than no competition. No matter what. There would not be a single positive effect of AMD going under.

Some of you seem to think that a company either needs to be THE best in their field or they need to go out of business. Does anyone here understand how markets work?
Click to expand...

Sorry I disagree, they haven't been competing well for quite some time. The fact that Nvidia has a 70% market share is proof enough of that. Nvidia was only about 60%-65% market share in 2013 when Tomb Raider 2013 was released with TressFX. And that wasn't enough to gain back any market share in fact it lost even more after that.
http://i.imgur.com/bNqJYgA.png

AMD has to blow everyone out of the water with the 390x, but early rumors are it's faster than a 980 but slower than a Titan X. That would have done wonders for them if they got that out before or at the same time as the 970/980 was released especially after the 3.5GB fiasco, but at this time it is not what I would consider blowing the competition away. Tech wise they are not that far behind and sometimes ahead of the competition (HBM memory), problem is they are always late to the party.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top