Nvidia plans to lock Game Ready drivers behind GeForce Experience registration

Flogger23m said:
It still doesn't offer anything useful. The current driver update process works perfectly. And that is all I need, timely driver updates. The rest is garbage, aside from perhaps Shadow Play. Only reason I don't use it is because it is bundled with GFE.

A gaming computer will soon look like the typical user's PC. Full of worthless, contradicting start up programs and crap that just slows down their computer. Run software for your damn mouse, keyboard, a client for each game, and now to get timely drivers.
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I would consider ShadowPlay pretty useful. I've used it in the past, it's the easiest method I've found of recording decent quality gameplay.

It's 2015 and I have 16GB of RAM and a 4 core processor at 4400MHz, I'm not too worried about a few CPU cycles for otherwise benign background processes. I cared about this stuff back in the days of single core processors but nowadays, unless you are experiencing actual issues, I wouldn't waste my time worrying about it. I have actually benchmarked my computer with all of my normal background applications running and without, there is no noticeable difference.
 
The Avalon said:
If a "typical user's PC" is one full of startup bullshit, that's your own fault.
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That is what GFE is. Typical user bullshit that slows down your PC. Enjoy auto syncing, auto updating, pop up software and DRM so you can type with your keyboard or load a 3D application. If you buy/install software like GFE and Razer's bloatware you're no better than the typical idiot you're bashing.
 
Flogger23m said:
That is what GFE is. Typical user bullshit that slows down your PC. Enjoy auto syncing, auto updating, pop up software and DRM so you can type with your keyboard or load a 3D application. If you buy/install software like GFE and Razer's bloatware you're no better than the typical idiot you're bashing.
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GFE has never once ever caused a pop-up or any other sort of interfering instances, ever. So if you would stop talking out of your ass, that'd be great.
 
5150Joker said:
They're destroying the industry by pushing their GameReady drivers to GFE? So what if they require registration, use a fucking junk mail account if it bothers you so much or don't install GFE and wait for other websites to mirror the driver. The sky isn't falling, some of you guys need to get out more.
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Its a signal. THIS ONE situation is not that bad: If I have to install GFE, then so be it. Not a huge loss: I'm pissed that I have to, but hey, GFE AT THE MOMENT is not that intrusive. But the creep of monopoly is gradual. If this same thing happened 5 years ago, people would have thrown a shitstorm of biblical proportions, and Nvidia would have quickly retreated and reversed the decision. Now that Nvidia is the only game in town, there is no end to the amount of crap that can be done by them to ensure every last dollar is squeezed from the industry.

The Avalon said:
GFE has never once ever caused a pop-up or any other sort of interfering instances.
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Yet.
 
Flogger23m said:
That is what GFE is. Typical user bullshit that slows down your PC. Enjoy auto syncing, auto updating, pop up software and DRM so you can type with your keyboard or load a 3D application. If you buy/install software like GFE and Razer's bloatware you're no better than the typical idiot you're bashing.
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All of that can be disabled and you are factually wrong about the performance impact. Run actual tests and prove it slows your computer down. You're just posting typical FUD that you've read elsewhere and I bet you have zero actual experience with the tool itself.

Is the idea to gate the drivers behind GFE a bad idea? Yes, for hopefully obvious reasons - you shouldn't have to register and install a second application just to install drivers.

But GFE as an actual video capture tool, streaming tool, or adjusting game settings tool isn't bad at all. Everything obnoxious about GFE can be disabled if you take the 10 seconds necessary to change the settings. If you haven't noticed, much of the growth of PC gaming has been with F2P games like League, CS:GO, etc and streaming is pretty big business right now. It makes total sense for NVIDIA to bake those tools into their software as a marketing point, and honestly if streaming is something you care about then NVIDIA would have the best access to the video card to make that as seamless and performance free as possible. AMD did the same thing by partnering with Raptr for the Gaming Evolved App, and having used both, NVIDIA's is much nicer.

You shouldn't HAVE to install it, but those of you criticizing it for being shitty bloatware are wrong, sorry. If you've had problems, that's understandable - literally nothing is bug free - but you are probably the exception, or NVIDIA wouldn't be doing this in the first place.
 
Rizen said:
All of that can be disabled and you are factually wrong about the performance impact. Run actual tests and prove it slows your computer down. You're just posting typical FUD that you've read elsewhere and I bet you have zero actual experience with the tool itself.

Is the idea to gate the drivers behind GFE a bad idea? Yes, for hopefully obvious reasons - you shouldn't have to register and install a second application just to install drivers.

But GFE as an actual video capture tool, streaming tool, or adjusting game settings tool isn't bad at all. Everything obnoxious about GFE can be disabled if you take the 10 seconds necessary to change the settings. If you haven't noticed, much of the growth of PC gaming has been with F2P games like League, CS:GO, etc and streaming is pretty big business right now. It makes total sense for NVIDIA to bake those tools into their software as a marketing point, and honestly if streaming is something you care about then NVIDIA would have the best access to the video card to make that as seamless and performance free as possible. AMD did the same thing by partnering with Raptr for the Gaming Evolved App, and having used both, NVIDIA's is much nicer.
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All of this is true and I agree with most of it: you seem to have a good head on your shoulders.

Rizen said:
You shouldn't HAVE to install it, but those of you criticizing it for being shitty bloatware are wrong, sorry. If you've had problems, that's understandable - literally nothing is bug free - but you are probably the exception, or NVIDIA wouldn't be doing this in the first place.
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This, however, requires a reality check. As I'm trying to help people understand, Nvidia is now a monopoly. There is NO PRESSURE for them to waste money QCing something if there is literally no risk consumer backlash. In the past, Nvidia has tried hard to be the 'premium' and 'exclusive' experience compared to AMD, but with AMD likely going the way of the Dodo within the decade, we are left with an Nvidia that has NO obligation to make people happy. Zero risk= Zero effort. They wake up in the morning, sit on the couch, go to bed in the evening and they've made their money. The only thing left to do is to ensure they make MORE money than last year.
 
KazeoHin said:
All of this is true and I agree with most of it: you seem to have a good head on your shoulders.



This, however, requires a reality check. As I'm trying to help people understand, Nvidia is now a monopoly. There is NO PRESSURE for them to waste money QCing something if there is literally no risk consumer backlash. In the past, Nvidia has tried hard to be the 'premium' and 'exclusive' experience compared to AMD, but with AMD likely going the way of the Dodo within the decade, we are left with an Nvidia that has NO obligation to make people happy. Zero risk= Zero effort. They wake up in the morning, sit on the couch, go to bed in the evening and they've made their money. The only thing left to do is to ensure they make MORE money than last year.
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Thanks.

I don't necessarily agree that we will see NVIDIA release crap products/software even as a de facto monopoly. They still need to sell video cards, and integrated graphics from Intel are rapidly approaching the point of being "good enough" for some of the popular PC titles for the average consumer. If it gets to the point that NVIDIA is a painful experience and Intel is a viable alternative, NVIDIA would simply lose all low-end hardware sales, which is where a lot of volume is. Much like Intel and AMD right now, where Intel is so far ahead with desktop CPUs that they are basically only competing with themselves. Despite that being the case since at least 2011, we still haven't seeing big increases in price or a drop in quality.
 
I never install GFE because I don't use any of its features- I use MSI Afterburner instead of ShadowPlay, don't want automatic driver checks/installs/SLI profiles etc...I did use it once to turn off the LED lights on my video card (also stupid that they tied this into GFE)...I don't know how much of a resource hog it is but I don't like to have anything running in the background that I don't specifically want or need...anyone know how much memory/resources it uses?

I also highly doubt Nvidia's claims that 90% of users are using GFE to update their drivers...please!...there can't be that many stupid people...there are way too many hardware enthusiasts who prefer to manually remove drivers each time and reinstall them (I never over-write drivers)...I generally only upgrade drivers every 3 months or so anyway so maybe this will turn out to be fine but it's the principle that sucks...these 'Game Ready' drivers don't offer huge performance gains most of the time anyway
 
Master race can't run GFE in a proper way lol.
GFE runs fine for me and I appreciate the options it comes with.
 
How come nobody ever complains about MS being a monopoly? I mean the whole PC gaming industry is based on one big monopolized platform. But nobody here ever thinks that that is bad or does anything to counter it.

If you don't like GFE, come over to Linux. You get driver updates automatically pushed (if you want) within a day or two of them being available, without worrying about any software running in the background.
 
Rizen said:
snip--



where Intel is so far ahead with desktop CPUs that they are basically only competing with themselves. Despite that being the case since at least 2011, we still haven't seeing big increases in price or a drop in quality.
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keep in mind we have seen a 5-10% increase in CPU IPC per year since 2011.

The i7-980X was a FULLY enabled, unlocked top-teir piece of silicon released at the consumer level. 100% of the cores unlocked for $1k. Intel did not have any chips that had more cores or had higher clockspeeds until they released the 990X

The i7 3960X was a 6-core chip with 2 additional cores disabled. 75% of the cores unlocked for 1K. Server/enterprise (where there is stiff competition) saw an increase of 33% core-count, consumer (no competition) saw no core count increase.

The i7 4970X was a 6-core chip, and the lowest-end piece of a three-die lineup of enterprise and consumer products. The highest-end enterprise chips of this generation were 12-core models. Server/enterprise (where there is stiff competition) saw an increase of 33% core-count, consumer (no competition) saw no core count increase. The highest-end unlocked consumer chip was 50% of that core count. 50% cores unlocked for $1K

The i7 5960X was an 8-core chip, and the lowest-end piece of a three-die lineup of enterprise and consumer products. The highest-end enterprise chips of this generation were 18-core models. Server/enterprise (where there is stiff competition) saw an increase of 33% core-count, consumer (no competition) saw a 33% core count increase (the first increase in 4 years). The highest-end unlocked consumer chip was 44% of that core count. 44% cores unlocked for $1K.

So in 5 years, we've gone from Intel having competition in the desktop and workstation space, to having none. In the beginning, when there was still competition, Intel was making available 100% of the available silicon in the form of unlocked processors. Now, we have less than 45% of those cores unlocked, for the same price. If that isnt coasting, I don't really know what is...
 
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KazeoHin said:
keep in mind we have seen a 5-10% increase in CPU IPC per year since 2011.

The i7-980X was a FULLY enabled, unlocked top-teir piece of silicon released at the consumer level. 100% of the cores unlocked for $1k. Intel did not have any chips that had more cores or had higher clockspeeds until they released the 990X

The i7 3960X was a 6-core chip with 2 additional cores disabled. 75% of the cores unlocked for 1K. Server/enterprise (where there is stiff competition) saw an increase of 33% core-count, consumer (no competition) saw no core count increase.

The i7 4970X was a 6-core chip, and the lowest-end piece of a three-die lineup of enterprise and consumer products. The highest-end enterprise chips of this generation were 12-core models. Server/enterprise (where there is stiff competition) saw an increase of 33% core-count, consumer (no competition) saw no core count increase. The highest-end unlocked consumer chip was 50% of that core count. 50% cores unlocked for $1K

The i7 5960X was an 8-core chip, and the lowest-end piece of a three-die lineup of enterprise and consumer products. The highest-end enterprise chips of this generation were 18-core models. Server/enterprise (where there is stiff competition) saw an increase of 33% core-count, consumer (no competition) saw a 33% core count increase (the first increase in 4 years). The highest-end unlocked consumer chip was 44% of that core count. 44% cores unlocked for $1K.

So in 5 years, we've gone from Intel having competition in the desktop and workstation space, to having none. In the beginning, when there was still competition, Intel was making available 100% of the available silicon in the form of unlocked processors. Now, we have less than 45% of those cores unlocked, for the same price. If that isnt coasting, I don't really know what is...
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At the very high end, yes. For the mainstream i7 line, not really. They split the CPUs into enthusiast and workstation classes after the Nehalem i7, most people aren't investing in the LGA2011 chips. You're still correct, but I don't think that's entirely apples to apples. From Sandybridge to Skylake there has been very little increase in price. And I mean, quality hasn't dropped - the processors aren't getting worse. It's also partially that the focus has shifted to mobile because that is where the growth is - if Intel focused solely on the desktop they will eventually die.

Also worth considering that volume production of those chips has gotten more expensive so I don't know how yields factor into their decision.

Personally, I want to see a Skylake 6/8 core with a large L4 cache, but I'm probably willing to pay more money than most.
 
Rizen said:
At the very high end, yes. For the mainstream i7 line, not really. They split the CPUs into enthusiast and workstation classes after the Nehalem i7, most people aren't investing in the LGA2011 chips. You're still correct, but I don't think that's entirely apples to apples. From Sandybridge to Skylake there has been very little increase in price. And I mean, quality hasn't dropped - the processors aren't getting worse. It's also partially that the focus has shifted to mobile because that is where the growth is - if Intel focused solely on the desktop they will eventually die.

Also worth considering that volume production of those chips has gotten more expensive so I don't know how yields factor into their decision.

Personally, I want to see a Skylake 6/8 core with a large L4 cache, but I'm probably willing to pay more money than most.
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At the low consumer, the increases have been even more subtle, with IPC and integrated graphics being the only real improvement.

You have a chicken-egg situation: Did the lack of competition in the consumer desktop space lead to hardware stagnation, and thus software demand stagnation? Or did the software demand stagnation lead to a lower demand for high-end CPU power, thus reducing the growth of the market?

Its a genuine question we need to look into. As a power user, I could REALLY use more CPU strength in things like rendering, baking, realtime manipulation of complex assets, etc: There is no shortage of software demand. Really, Intel's silicon is growing in-line with Moore's law. We just aren't allowed to buy it unless we want a locked Xeon, and pay more per-core. Imagine an alternate world where AMD's competitiveness means we have access to 18-core i7 Extreme edition CPUs for $1K. Imagine what we could buy for $399.

None of this is OUR fault, per se: AMD is one of the most piss-poorly managed companies I've ever witnessed exist. But when the creepy tentacles of monopoly start sliding into places they previously were barred, I DO blame the people who welcome it, and I DO point the finger at them.
 
This seems like much ado about nothing. And is not even implemented yet. I wonder how many of the people complaining about the possibility of this also blindly installed Windows 10 - which is far far worse as far as intrusive software goes.

Personally I'm a fan of Shadowplay since it let's me grab lucky gaming moments without having to record every game, so I have GFE for that anyway. Unless Nvidia starts datamining and serving ads then I have other things more deserving of Internet outrage.
 
Rizen said:
All of that can be disabled and you are factually wrong about the performance impact. Run actual tests and prove it slows your computer down.
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The same can be said about most spyware and other shady browser plug ins that people install. One is okay, add in 10-15 and you'll see a slow down. But go ahead, run GFE, your always on keyboard DRM, your mouse software, your headset software, your monitor software, and all that other crap you want.

Rizen said:
If you haven't noticed, much of the growth of PC gaming has been with F2P games like League, CS:GO, etc and streaming is pretty big business right now. It makes total sense for NVIDIA to bake those tools into their software as a marketing point...
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Great, so shitty lowest common denominator neckbeard games are what they're catering to. And to think we used to look down at console games. ;) Although point taken, people are stupid. Which is fine, anyone who wants to use the program can. The issues comes with the driver deployment process. The options here are:

1) Use GFE, enjoy it. Good. I have no problem with it, install away.

2) You don't want to use GFE. Then you're fucked and don't get drivers as quick as possible. In the event of a like Tomb Raider like release waiting ~3 months is unacceptable.


KickAssCop said:
GFE runs fine for me and I appreciate the options it comes with.
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Good for you. If I wanted shitty bloatware and auto updating I'd get an Xbox or use my iPhone. :D
 
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KazeoHin said:
I'm trying to help people understand, Nvidia is now a monopoly. There is NO PRESSURE for them to waste money QCing something if there is literally no risk consumer backlash. In the past, Nvidia has tried hard to be the 'premium' and 'exclusive' experience compared to AMD, but with AMD likely going the way of the Dodo within the decade, we are left with an Nvidia that has NO obligation to make people happy. Zero risk= Zero effort. They wake up in the morning, sit on the couch, go to bed in the evening and they've made their money. The only thing left to do is to ensure they make MORE money than last year.
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It would help you to first understand what a monopoly is (and isn't). AMD is still shipping GPU 's, and Intel integrated GPU's also factor. Hardly a monopoly.

The rest of that is wishful thinking. The myth we've always heard that Nvidia would be pricing all their cards $1000+ if AMD didn't exist does not wash. They'll still have to compete with themselves, people simply won't buy cards past a certain point. We haven't seen the mythical $1000 consumer CPU's that doomsday sayers predicted either, in the absence of any real competition for Intel.
 
I posted this on Anandtech but I don't really understand this move from Nvidia's side. It just seems like a possible PR nightmare due to it upsetting a vocal minority but where is the gain? There doesn't seem to be an significant cost savings. If the point is to force more GFE usage this does not seem like an effective method either.

staknhalo said:
ITT - GFE literally cause the Ebola outbreak. LITERALLY.
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"Get Free Ebola"
 
Flogger23m said:
Great, so shitty lowest common denominator neckbeard games...
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Heh, those shitty neckbeard games consistantly pump out thousands and thousands of dollars in cash and prizes for local and worldwide torunaments and have majority of viewers.
 
jwcalla said:
How come nobody ever complains about MS being a monopoly? I mean the whole PC gaming industry is based on one big monopolized platform. But nobody here ever thinks that that is bad or does anything to counter it.

If you don't like GFE, come over to Linux. You get driver updates automatically pushed (if you want) within a day or two of them being available, without worrying about any software running in the background.
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Wait until Nvidia makes you register your Linux Game ready drivers before you can launch a game. :p Or sign into their service before you can game. :p
 
Clearly they arn't getting the telemetry data they need through user experience surveys.

Hopefully a reliable source extracts these drivers and hosts them as they are released.
 
VulcaN said:
Clearly they arn't getting the telemetry data they need through user experience surveys.

Hopefully a reliable source extracts these drivers and hosts them as they are released.
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I joked about "Driverz" earlier, but I seriously wonder if any legal web site hosting these "modified" drivers would be opening themselves up to cease and desist letters from nvidia. Since nvidia cannot guarantee the authenticity of these drivers and it could tarnish their image if they were tampered with.

This seems to be the "walled garden" approach nvidia working towards.
 
Yakk said:
I joked about "Driverz" earlier, but I seriously wonder if any legal web site hosting these "modified" drivers would be opening themselves up to cease and desist letters from nvidia. Since nvidia cannot guarantee the authenticity of these drivers and it could tarnish their image if they were tampered with.

This seems to be the "walled garden" approach nvidia working towards.
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Look how much money Apple is making with their "walled garden". Honestly if my customer base didn't care, I would do the same thing. I'd go so far as to sell some data to advertisers too. Works for FaceBook. Why not Nvidia?

Well at least Nvidia takes their security seriously. Didn't their forums get hacked at one time or another? I remember having to change my password for that. And now they want user registration data and who knows what more. Give me your data SOB's. Do it now!
 
Guys, I see no problem here. Just sit down and take it... they have to do something to leverage you to do what they want. This is typical Nvidia.

Nothing like getting forced (GeForced) to install something unwanted.

/eats popcorn
 
This is probably so they can charge a subscription for game ready drivers down the line.

IE Pay 50$/year for game ready drivers or wait for our quarterly free drivers.

Why give away something for free when you can charge for it ?
 
cageymaru said:
Look how much money Apple is making with their "walled garden". Honestly if my customer base didn't care, I would do the same thing. I'd go so far as to sell some data to advertisers too. Works for FaceBook. Why not Nvidia?

Well at least Nvidia takes their security seriously. Didn't their forums get hacked at one time or another? I remember having to change my password for that. And now they want user registration data and who knows what more. Give me your data SOB's. Do it now!
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Agreed, the walled garden approach does greatly increase the amount of money you can extract from your customers directly. Gives you telemetry, usage data, and every bit of information you want to get. On top of reselling this information it also gives a lot of leverage to use as nvidia may decide.
 
Cool Vibrations said:
Guys, I see no problem here. Just sit down and take it... they have to do something to leverage you to do what they want. This is typical Nvidia.

Nothing like getting forced (GeForced) to install something unwanted.

/eats popcorn
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LMAO! You were "GeForced"!

Taking it like that would NOT involve any sitting. :p

LuckyB said:
This is probably so they can charge a subscription for game ready drivers down the line.

IE Pay 50$/year for game ready drivers or wait for our quarterly free drivers.

Why give away something for free when you can charge for it ?
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Marketing Gold.

I can see " Bundle Deals" with Game Ready drivers/profiles and the Grid Service thingy to push that more and have people pay monthly for something that was free.
 
what about beta drivers, I don't think they will be part of this, so there probably will be a way to install drivers outside of GE
 
razor1 said:
what about beta drivers, I don't think they will be part of this, so there probably will be a way to install drivers outside of GE
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Beta drivers before Day 1 drivers?

Hmm... something doesn't seem right here...
 
LuckyB said:
This is probably so they can charge a subscription for game ready drivers down the line.

IE Pay 50$/year for game ready drivers or wait for our quarterly free drivers.

Why give away something for free when you can charge for it ?
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Lol, in a way thats like EVGA charging extra for the "binned ASIC" crap.
 
Nvidia is hoping to sell more cards to customers like this. They would rather buy a video card than actually buy curtains. The "enthusiast".
IcMLTxt.jpg
 
more people are just going to stick with older drivers if Nvidia tries to force GFE (Girlfriend Experience) on users
 
THUMPer1 said:
Nvidia is hoping to sell more cards to customers like this. They would rather buy a video card than actually buy curtains. The "enthusiast".
IcMLTxt.jpg
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LOL that's some funny shit :D, this neckbeard is giddy about his sweet bulletproof 980ti. I guess if hes getting swatted and bullets are flying his video card will be safe:p
 
The Avalon said:
Yeah, if you're a manchild who never grew up. None of you would say shit like that to a person's face, but are quick to be keyboard warriors.
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Oh I would. I firmly believe that one should always tell the truth. Holding back only does people a disservice.
 
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