NVIDIA - Anti-Competitive, Anti-Consumer, Anti-Technology

Ieldra

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AdoredTV..

"Nvidia is doomed"
"Polaris >1080"
"Vega > TXp"
"Vega will evolve in time and outperform Volta"

How do you even listen to this guy, I hate people who talk with their mouth full and AMD doesn't seem to be pulling out of it anytime soon.
 

Unoid

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AdoredTV..

"Nvidia is doomed"
"Polaris >1080"
"Vega > TXp"
"Vega will evolve in time and outperform Volta"

How do you even listen to this guy, I hate people who talk with their mouth full and AMD doesn't seem to be pulling out of it anytime soon.
Did you watch the whole video? be honest. Attack his points he makes and his sources from the video.

If you can't do that why should anyone here listen to you?
 

Meeho

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AdoredTV..

"Nvidia is doomed"
"Polaris >1080"
"Vega > TXp"
"Vega will evolve in time and outperform Volta"

How do you even listen to this guy, I hate people who talk with their mouth full and AMD doesn't seem to be pulling out of it anytime soon.
Those are very interesting observations regarding the content of this video. Please, tell us more.
 

Stoly

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Anti-competitive--- probably
Anti-consumer--- don't think so, but lets say maybe
Anti-technology-- No way
AdoredTV..

"Nvidia is doomed"
"Polaris >1080"
"Vega > TXp"
"Vega will evolve in time and outperform Volta"

How do you even listen to this guy, I hate people who talk with their mouth full and AMD doesn't seem to be pulling out of it anytime soon.
Even Charlie stopped preaching for the eventual nvidia's fall.

I can see how nvidia could be anti-competitive, (which would be business as usual) but don't think for a second AMD wouldn't do the same if they were in that position.
But being anti-consumer or anti technology? I don't think so.
 

Ieldra

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Did you watch the whole video? be honest. Attack his points he makes and his sources from the video.

If you can't do that why should anyone here listen to you?
Why would I watch the video? I am attacking his points, just not from this video. If I were to allow him the benefit of the doubt I would go down the slippery slope of having to validate the relevance of his opinion and watch ***all of his videos*** which sounds about as pleasant as having four simultaneous aneurysms.

AdoredTV isn't a tech journalist, he's a crowd masturbator, the content of his videos is designed to simply provide extra pleasure to the people whose opinions are already solidly anti-NV/pro-AMD.

He is cashing in on your need to feel validated, and he's doing that by just spewing whatever contrived shit tickles your pickle the most.
 
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Uvaman2

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I would agree some of what he mentioned is just being a competidor, and going to the mat nothing too nefarious anyway. That said nVidia on cursory review seems like a toxic partner, maybe they will pay for that?...

In truth, other than nVidia growing, and AMD, nobody else big gave a shit about graphics.. Intel, supposedly now.. in 2018. Intel, that couldn't be bothered to buy Imagination Technologies after Apple fucked them over. IT along with their patents.. at a nothing price went to the Chinese (hoping maybe even AMD would buy them too)... Oh yeah.. Plus AMD has licensing agreements with some Chinese companies.. maybe we will see Chinese GPUs? .. i guess what i am saying yeah, the market has been allowed to be 2 horse race, and yeah one horse will be winning.. lazy fucks everyone else that doesn't want to get in.. its not even barrier of entry, yes i know its a lot of money, but many tech companies have war chests of billions and billions.
 

Ieldra

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I would agree some of what he mentioned is just being a competidor, and going to the mat nothing too nefarious anyway. That said nVidia on cursory review seems like a toxic partner, maybe they will pay for that?...

In truth, other than nVidia growing, and AMD, nobody else big gave a shit about graphics.. Intel, supposedly now.. in 2018. Intel, that couldn't be bothered to buy Imagination Technologies after Apple fucked them over. IT along with their patents.. at a nothing price went to the Chinese (hoping maybe even AMD would buy them too)... Oh yeah.. Plus AMD has licensing agreements with some Chinese companies.. maybe we will see Chinese GPUs? .. i guess what i am saying yeah, the market has been allowed to be 2 horse race, and yeah one horse will be winning.. lazy fucks everyone else that doesn't want to get in.. its not even barrier of entry, yes i know its a lot of money, but many tech companies have war chests of billions and billions.
I don't know what exactly you mean by toxic partner, but Nvidia is serving its role as a money maker while actually producing the best hardware, bar none. Adored droned on about Nvidia doom and gloom for an entire video series, chastising their decision to market a 'midrange gpu' as a high end one with GP104, criticizing their' nefarious' pricing schemes and claiming that their focus on large dies would be their end as AMD can match their performance with Polaris, and transparent mgpu, and fusing your brain directly with the chip, and 40% performance gains from async compute, and pascal isn't dx12 compliant. You get my point. Then Polaris launches and pretty much matches gp106 performance and pricing, Vega does the same with GP104 albeit two years later... Meanwhile I'm sitting here thinking anyone who buys his shit is mentally challenged or willingly deluded

I'm sorry, but it's true.
 

Uvaman2

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I don't know what exactly you mean by toxic partner, but Nvidia is serving its role as a money maker while actually producing the best hardware, bar none. Adored droned on about Nvidia doom and gloom for an entire video series, chastising their decision to market a 'midrange gpu' as a high end one with GP104, criticizing their' nefarious' pricing schemes and claiming that their focus on large dies would be their end as AMD can match their performance with Polaris, and transparent mgpu, and fusing your brain directly with the chip, and 40% performance gains from async compute, and pascal isn't dx12 compliant. You get my point. Then Polaris launches and pretty much matches gp106 performance and pricing, Vega does the same with GP104 albeit two years later... Meanwhile I'm sitting here thinking anyone who buys his shit is mentally challenged or willingly deluded

I'm sorry, but it's true.
I guess I am more specifically thinking how Tesla broke off with them, which honestly, I can't imagine its so easy for Tesla to just substitute them (maybe it is?) so for them to say screw you Nvidia I am done, looked pretty bad to me anyway.
Also how Sony went AMD, how MS went AMD.. all that we need is that Nintendo goes AMD for the switch2..
I guess that what is more in mind when thinking toxic partner.. maybe they are too demanding? too expensive?.. of course this is my very lightly informed judgment.
 

Stoly

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I guess I am more specifically thinking how Tesla broke off with them, which honestly, I can't imagine its so easy for Tesla to just substitute them (maybe it is?) so for them to say screw you Nvidia I am done, looked pretty bad to me anyway.
Also how Sony went AMD, how MS went AMD.. all that we need is that Nintendo goes AMD for the switch2..
I guess that what is more in mind when thinking toxic partner.. maybe they are too demanding? too expensive?.. of course this is my very lightly informed judgment.
how? that's easy, price... :D:D
 

Ieldra

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I guess I am more specifically thinking how Tesla broke off with them, which honestly, I can't imagine its so easy for Tesla to just substitute them (maybe it is?) so for them to say screw you Nvidia I am done, looked pretty bad to me anyway.
Also how Sony went AMD, how MS went AMD.. all that we need is that Nintendo goes AMD for the switch2..
I guess that what is more in mind when thinking toxic partner.. maybe they are too demanding? too expensive?.. of course this is my very lightly informed judgment.
I don't know much about the reasons for breaking off the relationship with Tesla but iirc Tesla hired Jim Keller, among others, to lead their chip division which seems consistent with their desire to remain in control of supply chain. Consoles AMD offers SOCs NV can't offer, I guess it's not lucrative enough for NV to push prices down to contend for the contract.
 

IdiotInCharge

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Also how Sony went AMD, how MS went AMD..
Of course they did!

AMD was the only company with a competent GPU and competent CPU that could be packaged together quickly, and since they were so desperate for cash...

Now with Intel pushing their GPU tech beyond IGPs and Nvidia pushing ARM a bit (and ARM having evolved a bit itself), either could provide a next-gen console option eventually.
 

NKD

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Anti-competitive--- probably
Anti-consumer--- don't think so, but lets say maybe
Anti-technology-- No way


Even Charlie stopped preaching for the eventual nvidia's fall.

I can see how nvidia could be anti-competitive, (which would be business as usual) but don't think for a second AMD wouldn't do the same if they were in that position.
But being anti-consumer or anti technology? I don't think so.
This right here is the entire porblem. To say somehow it’s okay because you can guarantee AMD would do the same thing like Nvidia GPP bullshit. Please tell me my future I want to know too. You can’t say that because that hasn’t happened when it does I’ll be there with you. Until then you are giving Nvidia a pass on a speculation that AMD would be the same.
 

J3RK

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About half way through but had to pause and comment on it. Interesting that they were big parts in the downfall of 3dfx and Herccules. Shameful that they did the same things they called out Hercules on.

They have a lengthy track record of being anti-consumer. Physix not playing with ati cards? Sheesh, and I thought gameworks was bad. Cheating in 3dfx and having there Ubisoft boyfriend kill directx 10.1 in A.C. as well as Hawx 2 garbage really drives the point home.

As for the shills outsourced, well that is probably the most shameful. They made good bed fellows with Sony during that era as we all remember the PSP blogs.

Great link Kyle!
Actually, 3DFX killed 3DFX. It’s not a poor 3DFX situation. They sat on the same tech for years. They just added more chips instead of trying to design new ones. They didn’t implement 32bit rendering for WAY too long. They were already hurting before Nvidia was truly competitive.
 

wizzi01

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I just finished watching the whole thing. Am I the only one who noticed that he was running Adblockers when he did his website pics, but not always?

I'd like to see some investigative work on how ATI/AMD is. I know nVidia is a horrid company, but I don't want to throw my money at AMD without knowing that side of the story either.
Why are you waiting for someone else to do the work? Go get the information you desire and make a video about it.
 

J3RK

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I guess I am more specifically thinking how Tesla broke off with them, which honestly, I can't imagine its so easy for Tesla to just substitute them (maybe it is?) so for them to say screw you Nvidia I am done, looked pretty bad to me anyway.
Also how Sony went AMD, how MS went AMD.. all that we need is that Nintendo goes AMD for the switch2..
I guess that what is more in mind when thinking toxic partner.. maybe they are too demanding? too expensive?.. of course this is my very lightly informed judgment.
Nvidia has their policies, prices, and balls. AMD is cheaper, and will bend over backwards, partially due to their position. That’s attractive to someone implementing a GPU.

It would be nice if Nvidia was more flexible, but that’s just not how they operate. Never has been. It’s lost them some clients for sure, but they are still going.
 

Ieldra

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This right here is the entire porblem. To say somehow it’s okay because you can guarantee AMD would do the same thing like Nvidia GPP bullshit. Please tell me my future I want to know too. You can’t say that because that hasn’t happened when it does I’ll be there with you. Until then you are giving Nvidia a pass on a speculation that AMD would be the same.
No he's saying it's okay because it's not illegal and that's just how companies operate within the confines of the law, and AMD would do the same if it were in a position to, which it unfortunately isn't.
 

J3RK

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It’s not necessarily ok for companies to be shitty. However, they all are in some way from time to time. No large corporation is immune, because they are run by humans. Humans are flawed.

I’m sure we’d all like some happy fifty-fifty good clean competition utopia, but that’s not how the world works. In fact if we did have a tech utopia we would have more than two valid choices.

It’s silly to just pick the corporation that you personally favor and think they can do no wrong. They all do wrong. It’s not really ok, but we as humans don’t really organize to make them change or they already would have.

You can vote with your wallet but that only works when enough people do, and sometimes that means choosing an inferior product.

Personally, I buy the product I wantbased on the product itself. I still manage to sleep at night, so whatever.
 

juanrga

Pro-Intel / Anti-AMD Just FYI
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I guess I am more specifically thinking how Tesla broke off with them, which honestly, I can't imagine its so easy for Tesla to just substitute them (maybe it is?) so for them to say screw you Nvidia I am done, looked pretty bad to me anyway.
Also how Sony went AMD, how MS went AMD.. all that we need is that Nintendo goes AMD for the switch2..
I guess that what is more in mind when thinking toxic partner.. maybe they are too demanding? too expensive?.. of course this is my very lightly informed judgment.
Of course they did!

AMD was the only company with a competent GPU and competent CPU that could be packaged together quickly, and since they were so desperate for cash...

Now with Intel pushing their GPU tech beyond IGPs and Nvidia pushing ARM a bit (and ARM having evolved a bit itself), either could provide a next-gen console option eventually.
Both Sony and Microsoft wanted ARM, but then ARM was only 32bits. There was a competition with prototypes tested, but both companies decided 32bit wasn't enough, so x86 was selected. This left Nvidia out the console race.

Once ARM64 was ready Nintendo chose it.
 

c3k

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Okay. Finished it. A tour de force of investigative, and revelatory, press. Nicely done.

That 1070ti I've been thinking about? Nah. Now it'll be a Vega56 (or two) to tide me over to the next AMD release.

I have a wallet.
 

SickBeast

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I much rather my current nVidia cards over AMD cards that would run hot and loud with worse performance, worse drivers, less features, and no overclocking ability. If that's "anti-consumer and anti technology" I'll eat my hat.
 

Ranulfo

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(on a sidenote: If NVIDIA is purely evil, how come they perform faster? I would suffice to say that in order for the preposition to be true, NVIDIA would have to perform slower, but use their "evilness" to keep their market-share.)
You clearly didn't watch the video.
 

Pieter3dnow

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Wow so many off topic comments by the usual suspects talking about not watching the video. When you can't make your point shoot the messenger.

It is funny because Jim has said a few times that the tech press is guilty of carrying old baggage around on one vendor that sticks (read the off topic comments about AMD above this post) but no one reminds people of how Nvidia operates.
For him it apparently drives him doing such amount of work.

For reference Jim (Adoredtv) burned Vega with a vigour that would give Braveheart a boner for a week, he still got a liquid cooled Vega which he still reviewed.
 

Unoid

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This right here is the entire porblem. To say somehow it’s okay because you can guarantee AMD would do the same thing like Nvidia GPP bullshit. Please tell me my future I want to know too. You can’t say that because that hasn’t happened when it does I’ll be there with you. Until then you are giving Nvidia a pass on a speculation that AMD would be the same.
Just because a company is publicly traded does not mean they will ALWAYS commit illegal practices like GPP or be anti competitive. You can assume or guess that IF AMD were the #1 that they'd break the law, but they deserve the benefit of the doubt until proven guilty of illegal behavior to set such precedence
 
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Vercinaigh

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You didn't state what kinds of issues you're having with your 1080Ti. I've had my pair since launch last year and they've been fantastic across 4k, VR and my 3x 1080p 144hz 3D monitors. I've had issues with installation with a number of Geforce driver versions the last 6 months or so where the installer either didn't work on my Surface Book 2 or got stuck with 3D Vision drivers on my sig rig but nVidia released a hot fix version a few days later addressing those problems. Why the same problem kept cropping up after it was fixed in a hotfix driver is a little concerning though.

As others have said, especially at the higher end, nVidia is as dominant now in PC gaming as it's ever been and could soon extend that lead depending on how the 11xx series turns out. For all of the recent nonsense around GPP nVidia has executed very well technically regardless. So of course more competition is the answer but it's going to be a while/
Doesn't really matter what kind of issues i'm having in the end, just that I am. They are known issues, some of them for many gens of cards apparently. Not trying to sell a GPU brand to no one, merely stating what -I- am experiencing and how -I- feel about that. Not looking for tech support, plenty capable of that on my own. :D
 

Zion Halcyon

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Except ALL corporations do it. I'm not using that in defense of any particular one, or trying to push one over the other, but it's true. ALL corporations use their fair share of tactics to get themselves ahead. Some are shady, some aren't, but all of them have a healthy mix of both.
No doubt but that doesn't excuse it either. Just because one does it doesn't excuse another to do it too. That justification fails any morality check.

You see, a normal person who hates corruption wouldn't justify either side or try to make one side more noble. They would condemn both sides and leave it at that.

But in marketing, taking a negative and then trying to spin it as less negative than your opponent is a standard tactic. It's not something normal rational people do when it comes to issues like this.

Anyone who has been exposed to professional marketing banter and damage control can spot these shills a mile away.

Of course that does allow for those who have been sold Kool-Aid by the Shills to join in but understand the goal of the shill is to create a mob mentality mob action that is fueled not on logic but on emotion. Emotional people are more easily manipulated than rational people.

Get them emotional and with a well-placed shill pretending to be a normal person you can get the mob to do whatever you want.

I reject and abhor any of that. Which is why any attempt at justification of wrongdoing that a child could figure out It's wrong will always read as someone being manipulative with intent.

I don't give a crap if both Nvidia and AMD have shills. It sucks and it should be done away with on all counts.

But I reject anyone who tries to defend one side over another. Who argues disingenuously and tries to move the goalposts. I reject mob mentality, and as a free thinker will not be dictated to by some wolf in sheep's clothing pretending to be a normal person, trying to steer my thoughts in the direction advantageous for the people who hired them. Fuck that, and fuck anyone who works for those pieces of shit whoever they are...
 

heatlesssun

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Doesn't really matter what kind of issues i'm having in the end, just that I am. They are known issues, some of them for many gens of cards apparently. Not trying to sell a GPU brand to no one, merely stating what -I- am experiencing and how -I- feel about that. Not looking for tech support, plenty capable of that on my own. :D
If they are known issues it shouldn't be that hard to name one specifically, just curious. I drive my 1080 Tis pretty hard across 4k and VR gaming and for the money they've been fantastic. I'm not trying to sell a GPU either, it's simply a fact that the 1080 Ti is a kick ass gaming card and when it comes to VR especially AMD's got nothing close currently. Again, we need competition.
 

SickBeast

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What pisses me off the most about all this is I've heard about paid shills for both sides for decades at this point.. and I haven't been offered a red cent. Can I get some free shit already?! :mad:

:ROFLMAO:
Kyle seems to do a good job of keeping them out of here. So thankfully it's not a major issue for us here. I avoid forums where they frequent. Reddit is by far the worst.
 

TurboGLH

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Evidence? It is time to expose these black op shills! Perhaps we can try to take down their secret society from the inside. At the very least, we should be able to get a free Vega out of it for "testing purposes"...
Don't bother asking, he went on a similar rant in a thread about shareholder lawsuits against AMD over specter. He believes that AMD has their fingers in all sorts of pies, buying off forum members and site owners to spin things their way, and have been doing so for years.

My issue is with Spectre in general. AMD either outright denied that they were affected, or downplayed it big time, while it was the most serous bug in terms of performance loss. Their spin doctors were out in full force and they deserve to be sued. What's really shocking is that Lisa Su herself made a lot of these comments.

I don't know how you can claim AMD didn't know they were affected. They have been working on patching this since the summer.
You can believe and say what you wish. I have a friend in the industry that showed me direct proof from the chief of AMD's PR department that he is a corrupt liar and he is trying to convert legit hardware websites like this one into AMD flog sites. And he's also trying to take over legit tech forums with AMD viral marketers. I'm sure you two know all about that part, though.
 

SickBeast

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Don't bother asking, he went on a similar rant in a thread about shareholder lawsuits against AMD over specter. He believes that AMD has their fingers in all sorts of pies, buying off forum members and site owners to spin things their way, and have been doing so for years.
I do have evidence and I have shared it here. However Kyle shut it down and warned me, for whatever reason I don't know.

For you guys to call me out instead of actually considering that it just might be true is pretty telling. I'm not sure why you would willfully ignore the shilling. It's a big problem.
 

heatlesssun

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I do have evidence and I have shared it here. However Kyle shut it down and warned me, for whatever reason I don't know.

For you guys to call me out instead of actually considering that it just might be true is pretty telling. I'm not sure why you would willfully ignore the shilling. It's a big problem.
That's why at the end of the day when we're talking about hardware it's all about how well that hardware works. Seriously, how the fuck is someone supposed to make objective decisions about large corporate ethics? nVidia is evil so I'll spend money on and AMD GPU that doesn't perform well for my needs. That's not competition. That's the worst kind of political correctness.
 

Nightfire

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Yeah, it is telling. It says we like to see some evidence before grabbing the pitchforks.

It tells the rest of the community that we are not going to be distracted from criticizing documented wrong doings with empty allegations from a random forum user.

Also, if we ignore the shillings from AMD, doesn't that make the shillings ineffective?
 

SickBeast

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Yeah, it is telling. It says we like to see some evidence before grabbing the pitchforks.

It tells the rest of the community that we are not going to be distracted from criticizing documented wrong doings with empty allegations from a random forum user.

Also, if we ignore the shillings from AMD, doesn't that make the shillings ineffective?
No. You are enabling them. And I quoted a very credible source. It's not from a "random forum user". The allegations come from the owner of a tech website. But I'm done talking about it with you. I find it frustrating that people are willing to turn a blind eye to AMD's BS.
 

_l_

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I always wonder how it becomes okay just because everyone does it lol! This is a debate worth having, no one should just get a pass. Hey they all do it, so its okay? Not sure if that is exactly what you are saying.
"This is a debate worth having, no one should just get a pass."

I agree with you and I ment what I said as a not good way to do business. Society's mindset (morals) have fallen. Used to be you dropped a jar of mayo in a store and you knew enough to offer to pay for it. Today most folks will say, "I own you nothing, I didn't buy it."
 
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