No More Pirated Games In Two Years

nilepez

[H]F Junkie
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Jan 21, 2005
Messages
11,821
your statements even on the previous page contradict your own points made on this one. ive already clearly delineated why it isnt theft. you refuse to address any point ive made (& ive been crystal clear) since you dont have any rational point, just a knee jerk ethical objection.

literally the only reason sharing copied data of any IP is illegal is cos of corrupt lobbying by media conglomerates who for all practical purposes wrote the law in order to extort money from the public at large when their antediluvian business practices were threatened by the very existence of the internet. cry some more.

Which 18th century media conglomerates are you referring to?
 

M76

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jun 12, 2012
Messages
12,513
What on earth... That is nowhere the same thing.

So, using a credit card that doesn't belong to you is only theft if the owner of the card decides to pay the bill for the amount that charged to the card? Prior to the owner paying the bill, there hasn't been a void created in the owners checkbook.

It's exactly the same thing, and it's just as illegal. But it's still not theft. Try driving a replica Ferrari in Italy, it will be seized and destroyed, just as pirated software and movies are often destroyed.

I don't even know what you're trying to say in the second part. If you use someone else's credit card, then the debt is already created in their account. It's irrelevant if the owner pays it to the bank or not. But if you make a copy of a software that doesn't create a debt in the publisher's account.
 

M76

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Jun 12, 2012
Messages
12,513
your statements even on the previous page contradict your own points made on this one. ive already clearly delineated why it isnt theft. you refuse to address any point ive made (& ive been crystal clear) since you dont have any rational point, just a knee jerk ethical objection.

Because he would rather take everyone for fools than utter the magic words: "I was wrong"

The other thing many people unable to say is: "I don't know" They must have an opinion on everything even if it's based on nothing. And if it turns out to be false, they'll try to weasel their way out of admitting their mistake. Like it's happening in this case.
 

alxlwson

You Know Where I Live
Joined
Aug 25, 2013
Messages
8,289
your statements even on the previous page contradict your own points made on this one. ive already clearly delineated why it isnt theft. you refuse to address any point ive made (& ive been crystal clear) since you dont have any rational point, just a knee jerk ethical objection.

literally the only reason sharing copied data of any IP is illegal is cos of corrupt lobbying by media conglomerates who for all practical purposes wrote the law in order to extort money from the public at large when their antediluvian business practices were threatened by the very existence of the internet. cry some more.

Lol. You're hilarious.
 

alxlwson

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Aug 25, 2013
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8,289
Because he would rather take everyone for fools than utter the magic words: "I was wrong"

The other thing many people unable to say is: "I don't know" They must have an opinion on everything even if it's based on nothing. And if it turns out to be false, they'll try to weasel their way out of admitting their mistake. Like it's happening in this case.

I'm not wrong, so your point is moot.
 

FireBean

Gawd
Joined
Apr 12, 2010
Messages
994
Nobody has provided any logical argumentation that can change my mind. You're not going to convince me that using something that someone else created without paying for it, isn't theft.

Also, you can shove your intellectual discourse up your own ass. Your attempt of intelligent belittling is poor at best.

Familiar with this? No? Work the argument out in it.
image-a.jpg


I honestly would like to know what that is!! :D
 

tetris42

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Apr 29, 2014
Messages
4,518
Wow, 3 pages of people arguing on whether piracy is theft or not. That's productive. Here's the cheat answer guys:

It's technically not theft and isn't quite as bad since the owner isn't deprived of anything, however, their livelihood is based on the expectation that people pay for their product, so it's mostly harmful for the industry. If somebody wants to call it theft, it's close enough, both sides should get over it.

The exception to piracy being harmful are cases like abandonware or online games that are killed by the publisher, in which case piracy becomes the only way to even play the game later on, but that's on a much different timeframe years after release.
 

M76

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Messages
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Wow, 3 pages of people arguing on whether piracy is theft or not. That's productive. Here's the cheat answer guys:

It's technically not theft and isn't quite as bad since the owner isn't deprived of anything, however, their livelihood is based on the expectation that people pay for their product, so it's mostly harmful for the industry. If somebody wants to call it theft, it's close enough, both sides should get over it.

The exception to piracy being harmful are cases like abandonware or online games that are killed by the publisher, in which case piracy becomes the only way to even play the game later on, but that's on a much different timeframe years after release.
OK, so we should call anything anything if you can rationalize it with some similarity. That doesn't seem a reasonable argument to me.


I'm not wrong, so your point is moot.

Says the guy who refuses to address or acknowledge any argument that contradicts his world views. This is starting to sound like a religion now.

Saying you're right doesn't make it so. But if you keep repeating it enough times you might convince yourself. You seem quite proficient at that.
 

alxlwson

You Know Where I Live
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Messages
8,289
OK, so we should call anything anything if you can rationalize it with some similarity. That doesn't seem a reasonable argument to me.




Says the guy who refuses to address or acknowledge any argument that contradicts his world views. This is starting to sound like a religion now.

Saying you're right doesn't make it so. But if you keep repeating it enough times you might convince yourself. You seem quite proficient at that.

As do you! You've presented no facts, only your flawed opinion on the subject. You have no first hand experience with any of this. I do.
So unless you've spent four years of your life being monitored by a parole officer, then I suggest shutting the fuck up. Its theft you idiot.
 

tetris42

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Apr 29, 2014
Messages
4,518
OK, so we should call anything anything if you can rationalize it with some similarity. That doesn't seem a reasonable argument to me.
OK, so we should call anything anything if you can rationalize it with some similarity. That doesn't seem a reasonable argument to me.
Yeah, nice hyperbole. The point is you're getting hung up over semantics rather than look at the larger issue. It's not hard:

piracy = illegal, affects a seller's profits negatively
theft = illegal, affects a seller's profits negatively

Yes, there are differences, but it's nuanced, the larger point is the same. So rather than discuss piracy as an issue, let's focus on exact definitions like complete nerds. If somebody says "my house got robbed!" would you say "Oh that's awful, what happened? Who do you think did it? Can it be prevented in the future?" or would you hound them over and over again about their house was NOT robbed, but burglarized? Because that's what this fixation on piracy v. theft looks like to me.
 

FireBean

Gawd
Joined
Apr 12, 2010
Messages
994
Let me clear this then and keep it straight...

do you have to use a legal tender to acquire it?
...Yes

Did you take it without paying, knowingly or not, weather or not you can afford it or not.
... That is theft... Which is illegal.

If it was given to you, and it was stolen, and knowingly or not, you accepted
...That is accessory to theft... Which is illegal.

Interpretation of said law based and the circumstances around it are to left to judge/jury.
 

illram

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Sep 19, 2011
Messages
1,472
Piracy/theft/infringement. Does it matter? You shouldn't do it. How it is labeled obviously has benefits for people on either side of the moral argument, i.e. it isn't that bad (infringement) or it is morally wrong (theft/piracy). But whatever you want to call it, every rational person older than, say, 19, should be able to nonetheless admit that you should not do it. Creators of content deserve compensation for their work, and taking it without their permission is bad and you shouldn't do it.

Now with that boring part out of the way, more interesting to me is how piracy forces development and advancement of content publishing and distributing. Take the music industry as a case study. In my opinion, piracy was one of the biggest, if not the biggest, impetus for the rapid advancement of easily obtainable, cheap online music. Some smart people in the industry realized, correctly, that the best way to combat piracy was not lawsuits scaring the crap out of everyone, but making legit music purchases super duper easy and seemingly cheap. (I say seemingly because in reality buying a whole album remains sort of not cheap.) Most pirates/infringers/thiefs, including the 18 year old version of yours truly circa 1999, lost interest in downloading free music once we had a confluence of three things: (1) higher risk; (2) ease and low cost of acquiring music; and (3) becoming a responsible law abiding adult. I see the gaming industry developing the same way with how easy and cheap it is to acquire games legally. I love this progress and think it is great and wonder why the hell anyone even bothers pirating games now, even if you think it is morally OK.
 

FireBean

Gawd
Joined
Apr 12, 2010
Messages
994
Piracy/theft/infringement. Does it matter? You shouldn't do it. How it is labeled obviously has benefits for people on either side of the moral argument, i.e. it isn't that bad (infringement) or it is morally wrong (theft/piracy). But whatever you want to call it, every rational person older than, say, 19, should be able to nonetheless admit that you should not do it. Creators of content deserve compensation for their work, and taking it without their permission is bad and you shouldn't do it.

Now with that boring part out of the way, more interesting to me is how piracy forces development and advancement of content publishing and distributing. Take the music industry as a case study. In my opinion, piracy was one of the biggest, if not the biggest, impetus for the rapid advancement of easily obtainable, cheap online music. Some smart people in the industry realized, correctly, that the best way to combat piracy was not lawsuits scaring the crap out of everyone, but making legit music purchases super duper easy and seemingly cheap. (I say seemingly because in reality buying a whole album remains sort of not cheap.) Most pirates/infringers/thiefs, including the 18 year old version of yours truly circa 1999, lost interest in downloading free music once we had a confluence of three things: (1) higher risk; (2) ease and low cost of acquiring music; and (3) becoming a responsible law abiding adult. I see the gaming industry developing the same way with how easy and cheap it is to acquire games legally. I love this progress and think it is great and wonder why the hell anyone even bothers pirating games now, even if you think it is morally OK.

QTF
 

ZodaEX

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Sep 17, 2004
Messages
4,136
Piracy/theft/infringement. Does it matter? You shouldn't do it. How it is labeled obviously has benefits for people on either side of the moral argument, i.e. it isn't that bad (infringement) or it is morally wrong (theft/piracy). But whatever you want to call it, every rational person older than, say, 19, should be able to nonetheless admit that you should not do it. Creators of content deserve compensation for their work, and taking it without their permission is bad and you shouldn't do it.

Now with that boring part out of the way, more interesting to me is how piracy forces development and advancement of content publishing and distributing. Take the music industry as a case study. In my opinion, piracy was one of the biggest, if not the biggest, impetus for the rapid advancement of easily obtainable, cheap online music. Some smart people in the industry realized, correctly, that the best way to combat piracy was not lawsuits scaring the crap out of everyone, but making legit music purchases super duper easy and seemingly cheap. (I say seemingly because in reality buying a whole album remains sort of not cheap.) Most pirates/infringers/thiefs, including the 18 year old version of yours truly circa 1999, lost interest in downloading free music once we had a confluence of three things: (1) higher risk; (2) ease and low cost of acquiring music; and (3) becoming a responsible law abiding adult. I see the gaming industry developing the same way with how easy and cheap it is to acquire games legally. I love this progress and think it is great and wonder why the hell anyone even bothers pirating games now, even if you think it is morally OK.

You are right that you shouldn't do it, but yes it does matter what label it is. I wouldn't let a thief into my home, but I would let a pirate in. Big difference to me so it does mater (to me) and my opinion is just as valid as yours is.
 
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