Night mode could actually be worse for your sleep pattern, study finds

erek

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Hmm...

"This makes basic sense: daylight is yellow, twilight is blue, and sunrise and sunset are pretty reliable ways to tell your body clock what time it is. Of course, at this point, we only know it works on mice – and mice don’t have phones. “We think there is good reason to believe it’s also true in humans,” says Dr Brown.


There is perhaps a more obvious truth to be drawn – if your phone is telling you to switch to night mode, it is time to put down your phone.

It is not the colour of the screen that is keeping you awake; it is all the stuff your phone offers as an alternative to sleep at 2am. There is only one real night-mode switch: the off button"


https://www.theguardian.com/technol...ur-phones-night-mode-may-be-keeping-you-awake
 

sirmonkey1985

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Wait..... phones have a night mode? Why have I never heard of this before? Then again, I rarely use my phone when I am home. Why would I browse on a tiny 1080P screen when I have a 27" 1440P computer monitor?
older phone feature but think samsung and apple still have it where it automatically changes all white backgrounds to black based on room brightness.. i think by now everyone has just manually set all their apps to black backgrounds anyways, lol..
 

blandead

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My phone has a tiny 1440p screen... Night mode is more for saving battery life. For actual night time use, blue light filter mode is better for your eyes.
 

[21CW]killerofall

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older phone feature but think samsung and apple still have it where it automatically changes all white backgrounds to black based on room brightness.. i think by now everyone has just manually set all their apps to black backgrounds anyways, lol..
Well that makes a bit of sense. I have never had an iPhone and the last Samsung phone I had was a Galaxy S2 (LG G2 and Moto G6 since).
 

T4rd

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My phone has a tiny 1440p screen... Night mode is more for saving battery life. For actual night time use, blue light filter mode is better for your eyes.
People here seem to be confusing night mode for dark mode. The article is referencing night mode that most phones and Windows have built into them to block blue light on the display in order mitigate eye strain and to facilitate melatonin production.
 

Youn

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I've found my years of increasing eye strain and trouble sleeping went away soon after using night mode (like a brown tint over everything) on my PC and phone... maybe just a coincidence, but the few times I don't use it I notice the trouble return the very next day, so I'm convinced
 

PhaseNoise

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The article is odd. Right - not sleeping is not sleeping. The point of night mode is that you go to bed when you normally do, but your lizard brain doesn't think its 3pm.
 

HAL_404

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what mode you got enabled for hardforum anyhow?
Dark Theme of coarse ... I like the different shades of grey and I don't need sunglasses to fight off the glare from a white page

BTW ... thanks for all the neat posts you've been making the past weeks :)
 
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Ebernanut

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People here seem to be confusing night mode for dark mode. The article is referencing night mode that most phones and Windows have built into them to block blue light on the display in order mitigate eye strain and to facilitate melatonin production.
On my Samsung phone night mode is the dark theme and the blue light filter is called exactly that, and then there's also adaptive brightness.
 

KazeoHin

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Blue Light filters greatly help with my ability to fall asleep.

Remember that for tens of thousands of years, our brains probably got used to seeing ONLY warm shades at night due to being near a fire.
 
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Youn

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and also the warm light of the sun setting since before we used fire all the time
 

BB Gun

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"This makes basic sense: daylight is yellow, twilight is blue, and sunrise and sunset are pretty reliable ways to tell your body clock what time it is.
Daylight is actually pretty fukin blue. Not as blue as twilight, but it's sure as fuk not yellow. It's sunset/artificial incandescent light that is golden/yellow.

upload_2019-12-17_19-5-2.png
 

Nobu

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Youn

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don't forget about dim to warm lights, starting to be used more and more, basically it's the future to have lights at night be soft and warm again, some asian countries probably will be the last to convert as many over there seem to love insanely white/blue light as it makes their skin look whiter - no joke, spent nearly a year there and they just don't like how they look lit with warm lights... they also don't go out in the sun, no surprise they have an increasing suicide rate and vitamin D deficiencies (maybe subconsciously that's also why they like white lights, their body thinks it's like the sun?)
 
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N4CR

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I didn't realise night mode was to 'help you sleep', I just thought it was better when there is less background light..
 

DeathFromBelow

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The article is odd. Right - not sleeping is not sleeping. The point of night mode is that you go to bed when you normally do, but your lizard brain doesn't think its 3pm.
The point is that there's a lot of marketing BS going on, particularly regarding the effects of blue light. This sort of reporting is exactly what I've expected since all the marketing buzz about blue light filtering for night mode and 'eye protection' started showing up.

There's no evidence that blue light in particular 'tells your lizard brain it's 3pm,' and in fact they found the opposite effect in testing, with low-brightness blue light actually being less disruptive than low brightness yellow, and overall that brightness was far more important than color as far as disrupting sleep, which makes sense.
 

Tsumi

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older phone feature but think samsung and apple still have it where it automatically changes all white backgrounds to black based on room brightness.. i think by now everyone has just manually set all their apps to black backgrounds anyways, lol..
My LG V20 has a night mode... It dims the blue spectrum. Dark mode is completely different and always enabled on my phone.

don't forget about dim to warm lights, starting to be used more and more, basically it's the future to have lights at night be soft and warm again, some asian countries probably will be the last to convert as many over there seem to love insanely white/blue light as it makes their skin look whiter - no joke, spent nearly a year there and they just don't like how they look lit with warm lights... they also don't go out in the sun, no surprise they have an increasing suicide rate and vitamin D deficiencies (maybe subconsciously that's also why they like white lights, their body thinks it's like the sun?)
I'm waiting for when Honda would get smart about their LED headlights and go with something warmer. The Civic and Accord LED headlights produce a crap ton of glare even to a HD pickup truck.
 

Nobu

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The point is that there's a lot of marketing BS going on, particularly regarding the effects of blue light. This sort of reporting is exactly what I've expected since all the marketing buzz about blue light filtering for night mode and 'eye protection' started showing up.

There's no evidence that blue light in particular 'tells your lizard brain it's 3pm,' and in fact they found the opposite effect in testing, with low-brightness blue light actually being less disruptive than low brightness yellow, and overall that brightness was far more important than color as far as disrupting sleep, which makes sense.
Yeah, dunno about that. I do know that cold light always strained my eyes and gave me headaches. First thing I do when I get a new display is lower the brightness/backlight and change the color temperature.

How it effects my sleep, I don't really know or care.
 

N4CR

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Daylight is actually pretty fukin blue. Not as blue as twilight, but it's sure as fuk not yellow. It's sunset/artificial incandescent light that is golden/yellow.

View attachment 208253
Alright, light and colour is my life and my job so listen up, class commences! That graphic isn't really correct.
Colour temp varies throughout the day significantly more than what is listed. Often 5-7k is mostly around midday give or take a few hours. As the sun gets lower in the sky (as others have mentioned) it will decrease.
Often in morning the CCT (Colour temp) is a little higher than when it sets, due to pollution over the course of a day - your sunsets are more orange than sun rise. In sunset you can often get literally orange light, it's barely 'white' at this point and would be close to 1700k or less.
The eye also will adjust to colour temperature variations so you do not notice it over the day except when you see the reflected light from a surface/tree/etc vs a known colour or reference.
E.g. under completely red lights without any other white light, your eyes will see sunlight when exposed shortly after as greenish. The shift is intense!

I run some still pretty rare 2000k lights (custom built.. I do custom LEDs as a side gig) in my kitchen. 2m long MBPCB setup with excellent heatsinking. They are selectable to 4000k also or mixed. After about 10am they are better around 4000k (matches outside light) and before then a mix. During the evenings/sunrise sunset within a few hours, the 2000k setting is best.
My next version of these lights will have individually addressed channels without a common ground and I will program an interface to match CCT of the sun without having to manually do it.

brightness was far more important than color as far as disrupting sleep, which makes sense.
This is correct. The eye also has multiple vision modes as it adjusts to light levels. At near-completely dark light adjustment, it is much more sensitive to the cyan range. Where as when you are adjusted to high light levels, green-yellow is the brightest (centre at 555nm).
However I personally find an orange/red light can be useful to trick the body into thinking it's sunset (e.g. if you have to sleep as sunrise happens after a night shift). It's also just much nicer to be around than white light to relax in. It's also probably something to do with 'a different space/light' to accustom to so your mind gets used to the 'orange/red light = sleep time. But blue/yellow at low power also does work in my experience too. I change it up sometimes :)
 

blandead

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Also blue light has a smaller wavelength, and therefore more energy. So it makes sense to filter out the highest energy source from going into your retina.
 

Arcygenical

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N4CR

Use an arduino to sync an rgbw/ww strip to the sun colour temp and intensity. Duh. Lol.

Id like some 2000k white LEDs btw. Thanks for the idea. I run some 2200k cob filament edisons. Id like some similar spot lighting.

My diy 500w watercooled mixed white led plate is pretty bomb too. 3500, 6500 and 20kk. Mmm.
 

N4CR

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N4CR

Use an arduino to sync an rgbw/ww strip to the sun colour temp and intensity. Duh. Lol.

Id like some 2000k white LEDs btw. Thanks for the idea. I run some 2200k cob filament edisons. Id like some similar spot lighting.

My diy 500w watercooled mixed white led plate is pretty bomb too. 3500, 6500 and 20kk. Mmm.
Arduino is the obvious choice of course :) Just need a 10V boost circuit to dim most of the decent MW drivers. Green is very inefficient still last time I looked. Only good for growing cucumbers or traffic lights lol.

Nichia makes the 2k. https://www.led-tech.de/de/50cm-Alustreifen-mit-42-NICHIA-LEDs-2000k
You're going to need some sort of linear 80° optic to use them if you need more directional light, sadly they are still quite low power max 1k mAh. I think there are some bridgelux or similar COBs that are dim to warm which might be more suitable but they are only 2700k sadly. 2700k is a great colour also but doesn't have the warm and homely feeling 2k has.
https://www.led-tech.de/de/NICHIA-757-auf-Mini-Square-Platine-2000k
Those could be better for lensing.

They also have 4k/2k strips (what I use) if you look but I am looking to do a custom run of the 2k modules as they are perfect for wooden houses, lets just say the price is a lot lower in a smaller run than what you see online. Really nice and warm and get a lot of comments about them.

Is that WC rig a Reef or umm.. 'agricultural' ;)? 20k I have never heard of!! Must be blue as hell. What leds??
 

Nobu

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Arduino is the obvious choice of course :) Just need a 10V boost circuit to dim most of the decent MW drivers. Green is very inefficient still last time I looked. Only good for growing cucumbers or traffic lights lol.

Nichia makes the 2k. https://www.led-tech.de/de/50cm-Alustreifen-mit-42-NICHIA-LEDs-2000k
You're going to need some sort of linear 80° optic to use them if you need more directional light, sadly they are still quite low power max 1k mAh. I think there are some bridgelux or similar COBs that are dim to warm which might be more suitable but they are only 2700k sadly. 2700k is a great colour also but doesn't have the warm and homely feeling 2k has.
https://www.led-tech.de/de/NICHIA-757-auf-Mini-Square-Platine-2000k
Those could be better for lensing.

They also have 4k/2k strips (what I use) if you look but I am looking to do a custom run of the 2k modules as they are perfect for wooden houses, lets just say the price is a lot lower in a smaller run than what you see online. Really nice and warm and get a lot of comments about them.

Is that WC rig a Reef or umm.. 'agricultural' ;)? 20k I have never heard of!! Must be blue as hell. What leds??
Technically, it's super duper violet.
 

Comixbooks

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Night Light for Wins 10 might make you feel relaxed at first but the enemic light will bother you once your outside or at work.
So I don't use it anymore. I used to test out various Windowblinds for Windows XP you knew which ones worked depending on the colors.
 
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