Does lowering contrast setting more or less work for dimming purposes?
Honestly Samsung engineers are a bunch of morons for forcing such a low pwm setting. It literally costs nothing to set a higher freq or at least make it an option somewhere.
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New Samsung 4k for everyone.
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Does lowering contrast setting more or less work for dimming purposes?
Honestly Samsung engineers are a bunch of morons for forcing such a low pwm setting. It literally costs nothing to set a higher freq or at least make it an option somewhere.
Nenu
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Good post.
I agree that a UHD setting "shouldnt" be needed to switch between 4:2:0 - > 4:4:4, this should be automatic. Although mistakes can be made so perhaps it is to give a foolproof counter to that.
WorldExclusive
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So the TV should know whether or not you have a HDMI 2.0 compatible source? Not possible.
It's a TV that has to be set, unlike a monitor that runs in 4:4:4 natively.
Nenu
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YcBcR colour compression isnt HDMI 2 specific.
WorldExclusive
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Why is that even being considered?
If you have a HDMI 2.0 source for "this" TV use that.
Anything else is a waste of time and money.
Nenu
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I answered you because you quoted me and said this:
You brought it up, I qualified that your point isnt valid.
Then you ask "Why is that even being considered?"
??
Did you turn off Eco sensor? If it's not off your backlight is automatically adjusted based on lighting condition.
You may want to call ahead and ask to order for pickup as the 40" is scarce. It's pretty much sold out at every Fry's.
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IMO, Vudu's 1080 HDX streams looks superior to Netflix's 4k streams. I've been watching Daredevil on Netflix and it's kind of disappointing. Not much better than 1080p. It's too bad these TV's don't support HDR, but then we'd be in a whole other price level. I won't do a lot of TV/Movie watching on it.
What's people's firmware version? Mine is A053100. The people at UltraFlix say I should have their app with the latest firmware, I don't see it.
What's people's firmware version? Mine is A053100. The people at UltraFlix say I should have their app with the latest firmware, I don't see it.
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SixFootDuo
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Here is the fixed linked to the:
Offical Samsung UDH 4K Germany Demo. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6jiNS_4CEug
It's pretty impressive.
Offical Samsung UDH 4K Germany Demo. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6jiNS_4CEug
It's pretty impressive.
Nobu
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Probably, different EDIDs depending on which connector you use on a monitor isn't new, and neither are funky EDIDs--I wouldn't be surprised to see a monitor change an EDID based on it's settings. Possible reasons: to work around funky sources that don't support 4:4:4 well but also don't have a setting to change to another mode.
The Netflix 4k demos I've seen have looked OK, not too bad all things considered, but my thought the past two years has always been that while compression algorithm improvement is nice, streaming is (will be) no substitute for physical media when source material bitrates are as high as they are for most 4k material.
Some of it seems to be pretty good (the YouTube stuff actually looks better than Netflix's own original content?) but I have a feeling that we'll all be happy to rush back to physical media one 4k Blu-Ray ships later this year, despite its inherent limitations and cost.
This is true, at my Frys I got the last 48" they had on Friday, and the 40" sets were already gone when I asked out of curiosity.
I think this single thread is the leading source of sales so far for the 40/48, especially the 6500/6700 lol...
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Sorry for the delay - I was doing a bit of re-wiring on my setup.
I played an episode of Stargate SG-1 which is definitely SD through Plex on Amazon FireTV in HDMI2. It looked bad. I then played the same episode via VLC Player on my PC full screen and it looked bad as well.
There really isn't a lot that can make such low resolution look good.
Nenu
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Distance lol.
Hmm, when I try to watch the football demos they both lag, but the other demo clips works fine, weird.
I hope that's not the experience we will get when we will watch 4K football on TV in the future.
I hope that's not the experience we will get when we will watch 4K football on TV in the future.
Yes lowering the contrast works for dimming purposes. You can run with back light 20 and constrast 50. That is similar to back light 10 and contrast 90
Thanks for the idea.
We need some more gaming impressions.
I'm still deciding between this and one of those G-SYNC/144Hz monitors.
How are FPS games on this?
Some say they are great. Some say ok but a little laggy. Which is it?
How are games in 1080p, or 1440p (incase my card can't push 4k)
How are games like Civilization, Diablo 3, or Starcraft 2?
My assumption is that in those type games, the monitor really shines, but in FPS's it will not be so great.
Please weigh in.
Has anyone had an ROG Swift or similar gsync and moved to this? What were the trade offs?
Thanks,
-Mike
I'm still deciding between this and one of those G-SYNC/144Hz monitors.
How are FPS games on this?
Some say they are great. Some say ok but a little laggy. Which is it?
How are games in 1080p, or 1440p (incase my card can't push 4k)
How are games like Civilization, Diablo 3, or Starcraft 2?
My assumption is that in those type games, the monitor really shines, but in FPS's it will not be so great.
Please weigh in.
Has anyone had an ROG Swift or similar gsync and moved to this? What were the trade offs?
Thanks,
-Mike
Only FPS I have installed is Borderlands 2. It plays about what I remember it on my dell 3007wfp. Guild Wars 2 is amazing at 48", I usually play zoomed out to the max with max FOV so I would guess it's pretty similar to Diablo 3 or Civ/Starcraft 2.
Lateralus
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It really depends on what you're coming from. In just the past year, I've gone from a 27" 120 Hz to a 32" 1440p VA to a 34" ultrawide IPS to a curved 34" ultrawide IPS to this...and I don't find the lag to be bad at all. It's not as lightning quick as a 120 Hz TN, no...but it's very playable (and I'm not even using Game mode which reduces the lag even further).
Screenshots of 1080p were posted a few pages back and to me, it looks very good if your card can't handle 4K. I haven't tried 1440p. I run mine at 4K because I have the GPU horsepower to do so, but it's nice that it seems to perform well at lower resolutions.
Dan D. came from 3 x ROG Swifts to this monitor and I believe he said that it's obviously not as fast, but it's still very good. He made the transition successfully...I'll let him chime in with any further thoughts that he might have.
In the end you really have to decide which trade-offs you're most willing to live with. A gigantic 4K VA and a 144 Hz G-Sync monitor are pretty much on opposite ends of the spectrum. For me, size trumps everything else due to the immersion factor, as long as there are no downsides that make the size irrelevant (e.g. I wouldn't buy a huge monitor that had poor image quality, 100ms lag, and quality issues). For me, this monitor has the winning combination of size, speed, image quality, etc. but for someone else who values speed over everything else, a 144 Hz G-Sync may be the way to go.
I did. In fact I switched from 3 ROG Swifts to the Samsung JU6700. The pixel pitch is slightly better on the Swift and G-Sync was nice to have. Honestly though at 4k I can max out most games but I rarely break 60FPS and between frame rate limiters on some games, V-Sync with triple buffering, and adaptive V-Sync I haven't missed G-Sync all that much. Yes FPS games were slightly nicer in the responsiveness area but I had 3x 30" Dell 3007WFP-HC's for years. The response of this TV is similar in game mode.
For me the only real loss is G-Sync and as I've explained I've mitigated that loss somewhat anyway. For me the advantages outweigh the drawbacks. Another drawback of having three ROG Swifts was that they were TN panels so their viewing angles (vertical) were horrible. I liked portrait mode because it was useful in all games but I either had to arrange the monitors oddly or sit in a weird position to compensate for the poor viewing angles. Landscape was virtually useless with those as the ultra wide FOV creates a fish eye effect on the peripheral monitors and that aspect ratio was so wide that I couldn't take it all in without moving my head more significantly to do it. That doesn't bother me as much as it would for some people and we do that in real life anyway so it isn't the end of the world, its just something I noticed.
A questionably useful ultra-wide FOV wasn't worth the trade off compared to the loss of vertical space running in portrait. And again not all games supported that ultra wide FOV in 7680x1600 (Dell) or 7680x1440 (ASUS ROG). The 27" ROG Swifts' lack of vertical space (16:9) also pushed the bezels together close than I would have liked. Ultra wide FOVs are also rarely supported in most games without third party tools like widescreen fixer or the FOV offers very little real utility. In 3x1 landscape I found the bezels to be a minor issue but in 3x1 portrait I hated them. But once your used to that 47" of viewing area in portrait mode you can't go back.
The advantage of the JU6700 is the ability to have 48" display with no bezels, better color reproduction (in 4:4:4 at least) and a standard resolution. Its tough to get wallpapers for 7680x1600 / 1440 or 4320x2560. I couldn't use the Dells in Portrait mode at all without ultra expensive mounting solutions or custom mounting hardware.
To me the JU6700 48" is Eyefinity or NVSurround without the bullshit that goes along with it.
I find the input lag to be perfectly acceptable in PC mode. It's the blur (pixel response) that felt like I took a slight step back from my IPS Z30i with overdrive. At backlight 10, I think the PWM has become a non-issue, where it most definitely was before. If there's a particular part of an FPS that includes a fast vibrating motion (a perfect example is the AA in BF4 zoomed-in while firing.) That will just start a blur fest and my eyes just glaze over sometimes. Sitting further back helps. I think it's tolerable in my case, but may not be for others. Input lag, again, is totally acceptable.
Even scrolling the [H] forum window, I can see the white text 'fade-in' when I'm done scrolling. On my Z30i, I didn't see this behavior.
Even scrolling the [H] forum window, I can see the white text 'fade-in' when I'm done scrolling. On my Z30i, I didn't see this behavior.
Because there is almost no PWM at 20 backlight, does it work to "disable" PWM that way by settting backligt at 20 and lowering contrast?
How does it feel at 10 bakligt, not too bright?
If you plan on connecting a PS4 or play at 1080P this is the 4k panel to get. Many if not all computer monitors don't know how to scale properly. The scaler on this thing is one of the biggest selling point for me. I would not consider a pure computer monitor for this reason.
Sorry, but answering is a waste of time. Not because the questions aren't valid (they're very valid), but because only YOU can determine how important ms lag times are to your gaming experience.
If you're truly interested, buy one of each display you're interested in and try them in your own home. Plenty of liberal return policies out there.
Best of luck.
WorldExclusive
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@imyourzero Can you compare picture/text sharpness between the 40 and 48? Desktop apps and games.
I want to see if the 40 has more or equal the quality of the 48 because of ppi.
I want to see if the 40 has more or equal the quality of the 48 because of ppi.
Lateralus
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I don't have any pics, but my first impression upon using the 48" was that text was sharper on the 40" (of course). Thanks to the pixel density, it is still sharp enough on the 48" that I'm not bothered by it. It's very usable.
I'm sure that games are the same way, but because there is so much color and motion (i.e. you're not just looking at static windows and text), I don't notice any decrease in sharpness on the 48"...but I definitely noticed the size difference.
Even though I slightly prefer the sharper text on the 40", in gaming the difference in pixel density and overall quality/sharpness is unnoticeable IMO.
The 48" still feels huge - maybe a bit too much (I agree with the person earlier who said that it'd be awesome if there was a 44" version...like in the Goldilocks story, it would be "just right") but the slight decrease in sharpness is outweighed by the increase in size which makes gaming pretty incredible. I still think the top of the monitor is higher than I'd like, so if I keep it I might look into a way to sit it flush on my desk or increase my chair height. I still really, really like the 40" from a productivity standpoint but my humble opinion is that the 48" does edge it out for gaming.
SixFootDuo
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Personally, you're splitting hairs ( inches ) The 48" is actually 47.5" or a hands width more vs. a 40" or so. Use the 48" along with it's 4K for several weeks and I promise you will not go smaller in panal size or resolution ever again .
Going back to 1080p after using 4K is like finding a youtube video on a subject dear to your heart only to realize it's 240p in resolution. Something like that.
Going back to 1080p after using 4K is like finding a youtube video on a subject dear to your heart only to realize it's 240p in resolution. Something like that.
Okay, so I broke down and exchanged my 6500 for 7100 because I had to find out the difference. For a little over a dollar a day, I just cannot go on living having the blur bother me. =) Let me know what you guys want to test, and I'll try my best. It's going to have to be tomorrow though.
Things I noticed, the glossy does reflect more when the screen is black. No two ways about it, but when the screen has pictures and/or games on, there is very little reflection! If there are light sources, however, you do see it, but it looks very similar to light source reflections of the semi-gloss. Colors on the glossy, is very impressive. Black is, unbelievably black. It is blacker than my F8500 Plasma! Incredible!
The 19 degrees is the same as the 178 degrees on the Bl3200. On the BL3200, colors start to fade at around 19 degrees as well. There is no difference between the measured 19 degrees that Rting measured and the advertised 178 degrees of the Bl3200 and SD32. They both starts to fade at 19 degrees, but the viewing angle is extremely good (albeit a little faded) all the way to 178.
UHD color is adjustable on all 4 inputs.
Here is the big one... PWM is NOT the same as a normal monitor. It is a hybrid, meaning the "on" pulse is much longer than the "off" pulse. If you have a camera, test it out on the J6500/J6700. There are only three pulse on my camera when I set my camera to 1/100, however the "on" pulse is fat and gigantic, and the off "pulse" is thin. Therefore, I believe this is a hybrid PWM system.
The pulse looks like this [ ON ][ON]. Notice how the off is much smaller than on, and the on is much longer than the off? At 20, it's one continuous blur [ ON ]. If someone have a SLR that can be set at 1/100, please try it on your JU6500, 7100. At 1/25 shutter speed, the line is one continuous blur. If it's anything like the 7100, even if the PWM is 120, the on state is longer than the off state. It's a hybrid system. At shutter speed of 1/25, level 10 back light is almost one continuous blob. At 20, it's continuous. At backlight 15, at shutter 1/100, it's two pulse, one thin one, and one thick, which is strangely not consistent.
If the PWM on the J6500/6700 is anything like the 7100, I don't think 120 PWM is that bad, as the backlight stays on much longer than it's off. Hopefully somebody who is much better at testing for PWM can confirm. I'm inclined to believe that the backlighting on these new 2015 panels is a more advanced form. The motion blur is not as pronounced on the 7100, that's confirmed, for sure.
Things I noticed, the glossy does reflect more when the screen is black. No two ways about it, but when the screen has pictures and/or games on, there is very little reflection! If there are light sources, however, you do see it, but it looks very similar to light source reflections of the semi-gloss. Colors on the glossy, is very impressive. Black is, unbelievably black. It is blacker than my F8500 Plasma! Incredible!
The 19 degrees is the same as the 178 degrees on the Bl3200. On the BL3200, colors start to fade at around 19 degrees as well. There is no difference between the measured 19 degrees that Rting measured and the advertised 178 degrees of the Bl3200 and SD32. They both starts to fade at 19 degrees, but the viewing angle is extremely good (albeit a little faded) all the way to 178.
UHD color is adjustable on all 4 inputs.
Here is the big one... PWM is NOT the same as a normal monitor. It is a hybrid, meaning the "on" pulse is much longer than the "off" pulse. If you have a camera, test it out on the J6500/J6700. There are only three pulse on my camera when I set my camera to 1/100, however the "on" pulse is fat and gigantic, and the off "pulse" is thin. Therefore, I believe this is a hybrid PWM system.
The pulse looks like this [ ON ][ON]. Notice how the off is much smaller than on, and the on is much longer than the off? At 20, it's one continuous blur [ ON ]. If someone have a SLR that can be set at 1/100, please try it on your JU6500, 7100. At 1/25 shutter speed, the line is one continuous blur. If it's anything like the 7100, even if the PWM is 120, the on state is longer than the off state. It's a hybrid system. At shutter speed of 1/25, level 10 back light is almost one continuous blob. At 20, it's continuous. At backlight 15, at shutter 1/100, it's two pulse, one thin one, and one thick, which is strangely not consistent.
If the PWM on the J6500/6700 is anything like the 7100, I don't think 120 PWM is that bad, as the backlight stays on much longer than it's off. Hopefully somebody who is much better at testing for PWM can confirm. I'm inclined to believe that the backlighting on these new 2015 panels is a more advanced form. The motion blur is not as pronounced on the 7100, that's confirmed, for sure.
Thanks Cyph. I'm seriously considering ordering a 7500 to replace my 6700 so I'm very interested in your post.
When you say motion blur is better, are you talking pixel response? There's significantly faster pixel response on the 7100? That's my biggest complaint at the moment about the 6700.
As far as PWM goes, are you saying it is different (better) on your new 7100 vs your old 6500? Do you think you can get away with turning the brightness down more without inducing negative PWM flicker on the 7100, vs the 6500?
I'm about to hit checkout on a 7500 right now...
When you say motion blur is better, are you talking pixel response? There's significantly faster pixel response on the 7100? That's my biggest complaint at the moment about the 6700.
As far as PWM goes, are you saying it is different (better) on your new 7100 vs your old 6500? Do you think you can get away with turning the brightness down more without inducing negative PWM flicker on the 7100, vs the 6500?
I'm about to hit checkout on a 7500 right now...
I can't really say if the pixel response is better as I have no way of measuring that. However, the 7100 has clear motion rate 240, which is a combination of tech that includes a strobed backlight to improve motion. All I can tell you is that there's not as pronounced ghosting (trailing images) as the 6500. I have no idea if it's improved backlight (PWM), strobed backlight, or some other combination.
All I know is that these Samsung panels are clearly better than the BL3200/SD32. This is why I'm willing to pay more for the 7100 versus going for the 32" BL3201.
Diablo 3 on the 48" is awesome! I'm running a single GTX 980 and I don't have any issues. It is very immersive and I see more detail than I did when playing it on my Dell 30".
Haven't done any FPS lately, so no info there.
Ok, this sounds exactly like the 'overdrive' setting on my HP Z30i. It really worked well to reduce blur. I think I'm going to have to order a 7500. Ouch. It irks me knowing there's a faster version of what I own for a bit more money - ok, a LOT more money. But I can still send it back if it's not worth the difference. I hope the gloss screen is going to be ok.
Lateralus
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Sounds like we need some more clarification on what effect, if any, the additional features of the 7xxx series have on PC use.
EVGA Titan X SC back in stock (strangely as it was out of stock earlier today but suddenly is back in stock on a Sunday night?). No surcharge above the MSRP of $1029 for the SC, pulled the trigger and ordered, for use with the 48JU6700.
We'll see if they cancel it tomorrow and it was just a typo or error.
We'll see if they cancel it tomorrow and it was just a typo or error.
For the curved crowd, the 7100 is the same as the 7500. Man, big price diff there but definitely worth it if the ghosting is present in the 6500/6700 and reduced in the 7100/7500.
Surprised though that not one of the gaming 6500/6700 owners have seen any ghosting to speak of though...makes me wonder if you had a unique setting Cyph that caused it, or some other anomaly?
Either way will be interesting to see the comparisons, thanks!