New Samsung 4k for everyone.

aadik said:
Does these TV act like computer monitors when you shut pc off then screen goes automatically standby or you must every time use tv remote to turn on and off? And does screen turn off same way like monitor if you have power settings 10 min screen off in control panel?
Click to expand...

I answered you question in the other thread.
 
Incoming wall of text.

I got a 48" JS8505 (curved European model) about two months ago and to be honest I'm kind of disappointed. It's not terrible but there are just so many issues with it both big and small. I guess I just expected more at that price, and I still got it at 30% off. It would have been pretty bad value at the regular price.

Everything is fine and dandy and looks good during the day or when you're displaying something bright and colorful, but as soon as you're watching a dark movie or playing a dark game in a darkened room, that's when the problems creep up.

The first major issue is that the base black level when the backlight-dimming "Smart LED" function is off is awful. The last TN monitor I had (23" HP something) looked better than this, at least I don't remember ever being this annoyed with it, and I watched movies on it for years.

Second, the viewing angles are really bad. Granted I sit very close but what's the point of a big screen if you're just going to sit at the other end of the room anyway? The edges very quickly lose contrast, black level and get that slightly bluish tint I thought nowadays was reserved for cheapo 15" notebook panels. However worst is the "solarization" effect or whatever you call it which distorts the contrast in shadows, really separating brightness values that head-on would be very close. When you display a very dark image and move your head, scanning across the panel, you'll get an extremely small circle with proper blacks and contrast and everything else just looks gradually more distorted from there.

This makes such dark content pretty much unwatchable with Smart LED off. Turning it on looks much, much better, but it has a fair amount of side-effects and overall displaying something relatively dark like Blade Runner the black level isn't really much better than on my 24" Iiyama XB2483 VA without any such enhancement... (and which cost 1/10th of the Samsung.)

The drawbacks to Smart LED are mainly noticeable fluctuations in brightness when stuff cuts from dark to light, sometimes even outright flickering, as well as brighter portions against an otherwise very dark image getting darkened more than they should and so on. Also it sucks in combination with edge-lighting. I've learned my lesson now, but unfortunately too late. You have a completely black screen with only a tiny white cursor in the lower-right corner and the entire bottom 1/3 of the panel lights up...

This is also the first 24Hz-capable (in Movie mode) screen I've owned and I thought I would finally get proper, smooth plackback, but instead I've traded the 3:2 judder for flickering. Not sure if that's just the nature of it or if it's another problem of this particular display. Using the de-judder option in the "Auto Motion Plus" menu fixes it, but then you immediately get the soap-opera effect and artifacts so that's out of the question. The de-blur options does absolutely nothing on 24Hz content. The LED clear motion helps a bit and I find it the best option for watching movies, but it's still pretty flickery. Also it's annoying because you have to go into the picture options and turn up the backlight to twice the normal amount, and it starts to flicker like crazy when you display 60Hz, so if you want to use the Movie mode for other stuff than 24Hz movie playback (and I'll tell you why in a second) you have to constantly change these options back and forth because Samsung has apparently never heard of something called quick presets.

There is also an excellent function called Cinema Black which darkens the edge-lights at the top/bottom so you get deeper blacks in the letterbox bars on 2.40:1 movies. At least it's excellent in theory but in practice it's pretty much unusable because it keeps intermittently turning itself off and on, even when displaying a paused image. In game mode it works better and I managed to fool it so it remained constant thoughout an entire movie, but of course game mode doesn't have completely judder-free 24Hz playback...

So let's move on to PC/gaming. 4K 60Hz 4:4:4 is nice and it was one of my requirements, but why in the heck is only the "native" color space available in this mode? It's some kind of expanded gamut where already saturated colors get even more saturated, very noticeable in bright reds in particular. Tried to figure out some way to counteract it by converting the PC output to some similar colorspace but haven't found any solution yet.

So despite some supersaturated colors desktop viewing is pretty nice but unfortunately both PC and Game mode are in my opinion barely usable when gaming, and the reason is the motion handling. I don't really mind the soft motion blur you often get on LCDs, but what's on the Samsung could barely be called blur, it's more like a double-image. Whenever something is panning or moving across the screen at a constant rate you don't get blurred edges, but rather each edge gets split into one sharp inner edge and one sharp outer edge. I tried playing Bioshock Infinite like this at first and had to stop after 5 minutes because it was unbearable.

This is where the Movie mode comes in again. The only way to get rid of this horrible effect is to enable the de-blur option in "Auto Motion Plus". As I mentioned it doesn't work at all at 24Hz however it does work at 60Hz, but of course "Auto Motion Plus" is only available in Movie mode so then you're back to 4:2:0...

I guess you can see the pattern here that nothing on this TV is working properly as intended, you have to use game mode for certain movie functions and movie mode to play games properly, always with some kind of drawback and overall it's just a big headache.

Anyway I got a bit carried away but the real reason I was going to post is that I have it connected through HDMI from a GTX970, but for some reason I cannot use GPU scaling with it because the option is not there in the drop-down box in the Nvidia drivers. Anyone have the same problem and know of a solution? I have created several custom resolutions and when applied these use GPU scaling, however I cannot override 1920x1080 and 1280x720 with custom modes, these resolutions always get sent out as is to the TV, which sucks because the display upscaling looks pretty ugly (filtering/sharpening etc.) and there is a huge amount of added input lag when you feed it 1080p instead of 2160p.
 
rtrings gave it good score
But is it true what he said that with game mode on colors in games are worse than with pc mode?
 
aadik said:
rtrings gave it good score
But is it true what he said that with game mode on colors in games are worse than with pc mode?
Click to expand...

You'll find this discussed extensively in this thread,but the short version is yes.

4:4:4 chroma is full color. This is used in PC mode.

It drops to 4:2:2 chroma in game mode.

While there technically is color loss, it is worth noting that 4:2:2 was used only in high end video systems of the analogue era, and good portions of the digital era, so it is still quite good.

In the games I can not tell the difference between 4:4:4 and 4:2:2. The only time it is evident is when reading some brightly colored blue and red lines of text, which I have never encountered in game.

You can read more about chroma levels here, on wikipedia.
 
Yes I know all that but it seemed weird he said that chroma thing doesn't mess colors and mess with only text different color backround than white.
 
aadik said:
Yes I know all that but it seemed weird he said that chroma thing doesn't mess colors and mess with only text different color backround than white.
Click to expand...

Consider that Blu Ray movies are encoded in 4:2:0.
Video at 4:2:0 and gaming at 4:2:2 look ok if you havent seen how good 4:4:4 can look at the same time.
Some people can immediately tell, but most arent bothered by the difference.

But pixel thin lines in text require a sharpness that we are very used to when its not enlarged/zoomed.
When not 4:4:4, there is red/blue bleed on the edges of white text.
4:2:0 is terrible for text.
4:2:2 is much better but 4:4:4 is what you really want.
 
Has anyone tried 40" and a 48"? Is the extra real estate worth it?

4x20" monitors still seems like it would give a good amount of screen space for multi tasking with 4 windows. Also with 40" you would not have to turn your head as much.

4x24" monitor array is tempting but it seems fairly easy to under-utilize the real-estate.
 
Its the same amount of real estate.
All that changes is how far away you sit from it.
 
I got the 40'' and I'm very happy, pixel density feels right. I haven't used a 48'' but I would think that even though it is 4k, the pixel density might be lacking slightly. that is a personal preference of mine though. it may be fine for you
 
Dose any of you have problems displaying BIOS on this TV-s? I recently bought European version of 40" JU6500, along with MSI GTX 960 Gaming 4G? I get "NO SIGNAL" message all the time.

First I go through Tantalus punishment just to install drivers. I did not get any signal at all on Samsung TV. I somehow managed to install drivers by connecting PC to a Panasonic GT60 plasma TV. But with lots of trials and errors, swiping cables in and out. In the end, plasma recognized HDMI input . Actually DVI from the card and HDMI from plasma TV (DVI-HDMI adopter cable). After installing newest nVidia drivers, i try it on Samsung TV, and also head to try numerous cable configuration. In the end it finally worked with HDMI to HDMI1 input, and DVI to TV-s HDMI2 input. But refused to work with only singular HDMI cable. Yesterday I try again on plasma TV and again didn't worked. Swapped cabals and this time it worked with single HDMI on plasma, than again didn't worked with Samsung until i connected only DVI-HDMI cable. Subsequently i tryed just single HDMI to HDMI1 on the Samsung TV set, and its finally working, but I can get picture only when Windows almost entirely boot up. Prior to Windows boot i only get "NO SIGNAL" mesige. Once in the Windows image Is displayed properly with 60hz 4:4:4 chroma subsampling.

Prior to MSI GTX 960 Gaming 4G card in my PC configuration, ASUS GTX 560Ti was inherent part of my sistem.

Here is the rest of my configuration:

AMD Phenom II x6 1100T
Gigabyte - GA-880GMA-USB3
MSI GTX 960 Gaming 4G
16GB Ram Kingston

Addendum.
I use HDMI cable that came bundled with PS4 console.
 
ZippZopp said:
I got the 40'' and I'm very happy, pixel density feels right. I haven't used a 48'' but I would think that even though it is 4k, the pixel density might be lacking slightly. that is a personal preference of mine though. it may be fine for you
Click to expand...

I tend to agree.

I have a 48", and I think it is just a tad big and just a tad low on the ppi side.

As it stands my 48" has the same density as a 24" 1920x1080 screen. (91.8ppi) I would have preferred it a little bit higher, probably the same as my old 2560x1600 30" screen (100.6ppi)

The 4k @ 40" is actually a little higher than that, at 110.1ppi and might eb a little too high for my tastes.

If it existed, I think a 44" version of the JS9000 would be my pick. Sadly the 48" was the smallest.
 
Zarathustra[H];1041895089 said:
I tend to agree.

I have a 48", and I think it is just a tad big and just a tad low on the ppi side.

As it stands my 48" has the same density as a 24" 1920x1080 screen. (91.8ppi) I would have preferred it a little bit higher, probably the same as my old 2560x1600 30" screen (100.6ppi)

The 4k @ 40" is actually a little higher than that, at 110.1ppi and might eb a little too high for my tastes.

If it existed, I think a 44" version of the JS9000 would be my pick. Sadly the 48" was the smallest.
Click to expand...

I am on 27" 1080 now so for me 90ppi is fine.
 
S0L0 said:
I am on 27" 1080 now so for me 90ppi is fine.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that's ~81.6ppi, which is lower than any of these we are discussing. You'd get approximately the same PPI out of these (81.1ppi) if you went with the 55" model.
 
Based on the Surface Pro 4 announcement today, anyone know whether it will be able to drive 4K@60 (4:4:4)?

Or in other words, which Skylake GPU parts are supposed to support this?

EDIT: It will require a mini-DP to HDMI adaptor. I wonder if the Microsoft branded ones are HDMI 2.0...
 
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kabobi said:
Based on the Surface Pro 4 announcement today, anyone know whether it will be able to drive 4K@60 (4:4:4)?

Or in other words, which Skylake GPU parts are supposed to support this?

EDIT: It will require a mini-DP to HDMI adaptor. I wonder if the Microsoft branded ones are HDMI 2.0...
Click to expand...

I had thought that Skylake would have HDMI 2.0, but that is looking to not be the case now. :(

From Anand's (or Anandtech I should say, no more Anand there) article:

HDMI 2.0 is not supported by default <snip>

A DP to HDMI 2.0 converter, specifically an LS-Pcon, is required
Click to expand...

So it looks like some motherboards / laptops will come with an on board DP to HDMI2.0 converter, but that Skylake DOES NOT, contrary to early reports, natively support HDMI 2.0.
 
kabobi said:
EDIT: It will require a mini-DP to HDMI adaptor. I wonder if the Microsoft branded ones are HDMI 2.0...
Click to expand...

I tried to get this out of them in the Microsoft store when I was in there chatting a while back.

It was clear the sales associates had no idea what they were talking about, and there were no specs on the standard Microsoft DP to HDMI adapter indicating compatibility or not. In fact, there were no specs at all...
 
Zarathustra[H];1041895324 said:
....So it looks like some motherboards / laptops will come with an on board DP to HDMI2.0 converter, but that Skylake DOES NOT, contrary to early reports, natively support HDMI 2.0.
Click to expand...

Hmmm. Well, there's definitely no Alpine Ridge on the SP4/Book, so if there is an LS-Pcon, it would have to be a third party one.

I guess we'll have to wait for a review/tear down to find out. The inability to drive 4k@60:4:4:4 with SP4/Book would be a major oversight...though I still don't understand why the new Lumias have USB-C and the SP4/Book do not, so anything is possible I guess.
 
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UN48JU6800 Apparently uses quantum dots, anyone know what type of panel it is and back-light type?

Perhaps these are B-grade 9000 series?
 
Arioch said:
What's wrong with this series specifically?
Click to expand...

The reviews aren't favorable as a TV or Gaming monitor. It's middle of the road, not great at anything.
The internal specs are to low to drive the high end QD panel. So you end up with mediocre performance.
 
I'm finding the 40" @ 4k to be perfect for me.

It has ~110 ppi and the 27" monitor it replaced was ~108

I've had to do a few adjustments in games like MMOs.. mainly moving the chat boxes closer to the center so I don't have to shift my head as much, but it is working out great.
 
any thoughts on viewing angles? i'm coming from a 30'' dell monitor that is a semi gloss IPS display. I'm having a bit of a hard time adjusting to the viewing angles. slight shifts in my head create shifts in contrast on the display. anyone else notice this on the 7500?

and a question. i have the samsung 40'' hoooked up via hdmi and 2 dell 20'' hooked up as well. whenever i turn off the samsung, my open windows get assigned to the other monitors...is there a way to keep this from happening?
 
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I upgraded from a low range 40" 1080p TV to 48" JS9000 so that was quite an upgrade for me :)
And since I used a 40" before I got 48" it was no problem to adjust. I think 40"-50" is perfect, bigger would be a problem.
I could not go back to anything lower than 40" though. When I'm playing CSGO with a friend who's using a 27" monitor, I'm yelling at him "pick up the hand grenade, there, quick!" and he's like "where, I don't see it?!". Also, it's much easier for me to spot enemies that are further away and appear tiny. For him, they are tiny, and he often doesn't see them at the right moment. I do though :)
 
Nebell said:
I upgraded from a low range 40" 1080p TV to 48" JS9000 so that was quite an upgrade for me :)
And since I used a 40" before I got 48" it was no problem to adjust. I think 40"-50" is perfect, bigger would be a problem.
I could not go back to anything lower than 40" though. When I'm playing CSGO with a friend who's using a 27" monitor, I'm yelling at him "pick up the hand grenade, there, quick!" and he's like "where, I don't see it?!". Also, it's much easier for me to spot enemies that are further away and appear tiny. For him, they are tiny, and he often doesn't see them at the right moment. I do though :)
Click to expand...

He must sit pretty far from his 27" screen.

I find that it is rarely screen size that has held me back, but more often screen resolution, because with a few extra pixels I can make out detail I previously couldn't.
 
I sort of struggle to get sharp text. I just got my macro lens yesterday, and just for fun, took some text samples of my TV.

The results are nothing but baffling. If a single pixel got a darker neighbouring pixel, it is dimmed.

If a single pixel got lighter neighbouring pixels, it is remains the same, or sometimes get values it simply should not have. Just look at the low sharpness image.

Text look simply dreadfull because of it.

If this is a windows "feature" I do not know. Samples are from Gimp and the image viewer in Windows ten. Also, the text abc is from Gedit for windows.

I simply cannot get the chess pattern to display as it should. Any ideas? Can anyone else run a similar test on their TV. Mine is the 65" 7005.

I knew I had a sharpness issue, just not this bad. One pixel is 2*3 color pixels. Seems like the main issue is with the top row, if the neighbor is black. The resulting pixel is almost half as bright as it should be.

Chess pattern:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0ByvGmR8E2nlUZTE4N2JDbTJrZnM

100% chess pattern
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0ByvGmR8E2nlUbnhXUVpqRDdfZ28

200% chess pattern
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0ByvGmR8E2nlUWTJ1RWdhamh0VjQ

50% chess pattern
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0ByvGmR8E2nlUU3pmc1dESHp0ZWc

Text in Gedit 50% sharpness
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0ByvGmR8E2nlUTnlVaWM3dlZXTlU/view

Text in Gedit 0% sharpness
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0ByvGmR8E2nlURVZPZDE3MHowRVE
 
Did a manual update check for my 48" js9000. Been on 1220 since I bought the TV. Tonight it says 1403 is available. The Samsung download section for the JS9000 lists 1220.8 as the latest version. Kinda Leary about installing it. Anyone update yet?
 
Do not alter the contrast or brightness settings. Leave them at default.

If altered, the relationship between the pixels will be heavily altered, resulting in significant alteration of the rendering. Pixels might loose up to 50% percent of the intensity, depending on the neighboring pixels.

In short, any adjustment apart from native that works, is the backlight. Everything else is simply broken.

I made a chess pattern and displayed it at 100%. This is the pattern:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0ByvGmR8E2nlUZTE4N2JDbTJrZnM

It should look like this:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0ByvGmR8E2nlUeHh3eThzYklCUVk

If you lower the contrast to about 75 and brightness to about 42, the result will be this:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0ByvGmR8E2nlUbnhXUVpqRDdfZ28

The rendering of intensity is not fixed, as it should be. All the pixels should be either black or white. They are all over the place. They seem to vary by the neighbor in the vertical axis. Pretty hefty variances.

The only rendering that is correct, is the one at default.

If left at default, the text is significantly sharper. The difference is simply huge. Everything becomes a lot sharper. To get the screen dim enough, it needs to be dimmed down to like 3-5 for backlight. A potential PWM nightmare. The colors are off to, and the only way to correct them is by computer software.

I use the 65" 7005.

Edit: Fixed the link to the messed up sample.
 
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Island said:
Did a manual update check for my 48" js9000. Been on 1220 since I bought the TV. Tonight it says 1403 is available. The Samsung download section for the JS9000 lists 1220.8 as the latest version. Kinda Leary about installing it. Anyone update yet?
Click to expand...

I have yet to figure out how Samsung's update scheme works.

I replaced my Once Connect box (which contains the TV firmware) a while back. The one I had was updated to 1223. When I replaced it, I updated the replacement box, but it never updated beyond 1220.

I wonder if they pushed 1223, then pulled it for some reason, which is why my second box never got it.

It also appears as if they have some sort of randomization scheme for when different One Connect boxes get updates. I've noticed that some people on here post about getting the latest update, while others don't get it for weeks.

I suspect they do this to avoid overloading their update server, but I am not sure.

It's too much of a black box which I don't understand right now.
 
Zarathustra[H];1041901143 said:
I have yet to figure out how Samsung's update scheme works.

I replaced my Once Connect box (which contains the TV firmware) a while back. The one I had was updated to 1223. When I replaced it, I updated the replacement box, but it never updated beyond 1220.

I wonder if they pushed 1223, then pulled it for some reason, which is why my second box never got it.

It also appears as if they have some sort of randomization scheme for when different One Connect boxes get updates. I've noticed that some people on here post about getting the latest update, while others don't get it for weeks.

I suspect they do this to avoid overloading their update server, but I am not sure.

It's too much of a black box which I don't understand right now.
Click to expand...

Well, I just did the update this morning after some coffee and the TV went through it's install process turning off and back on, and everything went perfectly. After it installed, 5 minutes later, there even was a pop up on my screen stating that the update was successful. I don't know if it is a placebo effect, but the picture looks a little brighter and crisper. Everything looks good as is functioning well.
 
Funny how everyone is updating from 122x and I'm still on 1217 and keep getting "you have the latest version" messages.
 
Frode B. Nilsen said:
Do not alter the contrast or brightness settings. Leave them at default.

If altered, the relationship between the pixels will be heavily altered, resulting in significant alteration of the rendering. Pixels might loose up to 50% percent of the intensity, depending on the neighboring pixels.

In short, any adjustment apart from native that works, is the backlight. Everything else is simply broken.

I made a chess pattern and displayed it at 100%. This is the pattern:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0ByvGmR8E2nlUZTE4N2JDbTJrZnM

It should look like this:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0ByvGmR8E2nlUeHh3eThzYklCUVk

If you lower the contrast to about 75 and brightness to about 42, the result will be this:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0ByvGmR8E2nlUbnhXUVpqRDdfZ28

The rendering of intensity is not fixed, as it should be. All the pixels should be either black or white. They are all over the place. They seem to vary by the neighbor in the vertical axis. Pretty hefty variances.

The only rendering that is correct, is the one at default.

If left at default, the text is significantly sharper. The difference is simply huge. Everything becomes a lot sharper. To get the screen dim enough, it needs to be dimmed down to like 3-5 for backlight. A potential PWM nightmare. The colors are off to, and the only way to correct them is by computer software.

I use the 65" 7005.

Edit: Fixed the link to the messed up sample.
Click to expand...
Is this in PC or Game mode?
 
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