New Processors Are Now Blocked from Receiving Updates on Old Windows

[BulletDust]

I think ever since DOS, yes, Windows has always been the dominant platform for PC gaming. You know something I'm forgetting?

There was a platform called 68k, it was the dominant gaming platform in the day and the mere notion that an x86 based Windows office machine could be a gamer was quite laughable. It wasn't until the advent of Quake that the PC began to show promise as a gamer, and ironically enough that was running OGL as DX was a mess.

DOS never dominated gaming, 68k smashed it until real 3D accelerators came along and that wasn't until about 96/97 and still running OGL.

It was one of the most unlikely scenarios ever, but 68k was toppled in favour of the x86 platform and pushed the whole time by none other than Gabe Newell, the individual behind probably the most successful modern day push towards Linux gaming yet.

The present unpredictable and downright laughable decisions of Microsoft as late aren't in any way compatible to the Microsoft of the past. The decisions of Microsoft as late are based around pure desperation to find an alternate revenue base, and people don't like it.

 

[Nenu]

Yep, Atari ST and then Amiga machines were the nads!

 

[BulletDust]

Yep, Atari ST and then Amiga machines were the nads!

As someone that lived through the era they most definately were.

 

[BulletDust]

Except it was the Amiga followed by the ST. The Amiga with its standard blitter chip and dedicated chip ram was always the better gamer in the early days.

In relation to DirectX, if it wasn't for Gabe Newell DX probably never would have seen the light of day.

 

[tetris42]

There was a platform called 68k, it was the dominant gaming platform in the day and the mere notion that an x86 based Windows office machine could be a gamer was quite laughable. It wasn't until the advent of Quake that the PC began to show promise as a gamer, and ironically enough that was running OGL as DX was a mess.

DOS never dominated gaming, 68k smashed it until real 3D accelerators came along and that wasn't until about 96/97 and still running OGL.

It was one of the most unlikely scenarios ever, but 68k was toppled in favour of the x86 platform and pushed the whole time by none other than Gabe Newell, the individual behind probably the most successful modern day push towards Linux gaming yet.

The present unpredictable and downright laughable decisions of Microsoft as late aren't in any way compatible to the Microsoft of the past. The decisions of Microsoft as late is based around pure desperation to find an alternate revenue base, and people don't like it.

You say it was the dominant gaming platform, I can see that for part of the 80s, but the way I remember it, DOS was in the lead for the 90s. If I walked into a software store or went to a computer show, it was DOS games that were all over the place, with Macs being second. Unless you have some numbers showing otherwise, I'm not buying it.

I mean you say not until Quake, but companies like Sierra and Lucasarts got their rise on PC gaming, and a big part of their sales were from DOS. Hell, Apogee and Epic were the big names in PC gaming at the time and they were making a killing via shareware copies. It wasn't until DirectX that Windows started to get a foothold with gaming, but by then, it was mostly competing against DOS; the same way 10 is competing against 7 today.

EDIT:
Take a look at this and organize it by date:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_PC_games

I'm seeing a lot of DOS and Mac games on that list, not the 68k. Again, the 80s were a different story, but acting like Microsoft didn't have pc gaming dominance until Quake I think is fantasy. Microsoft has a good 25 years under its belt of dominating the market for PC gaming.

 

[mat9v]

I think ever since DOS, yes, Windows has always been the dominant platform for PC gaming. You know something I'm forgetting?

As for Vulkan, I see that mostly as opening up the options for Linux ports. Windows is still going to get the lead skew on the PC because that's where the money is. Like you said, Windows is forced to the consumer. So for every victory Linux is making and every misstep Microsoft is taking, that gets undermined every time a new PC is sold with Windows pre-installed.

You're comparing different markets. Here, how is Windows doing on the DESKTOP:

http://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/worldwide/

84%, with Mac in second at 11%. Now how is it doing for PC GAMING?

http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey

96%. That sounds like utter dominance to me. You're comparing all of computing uses against PC gaming. Not the same markets at all. If I need to monitor power fluctuations across circuits for a hydroelectric plant, I don't necessarily need Windows. If I want to run Resident Evil 7, I need Windows.

The thing is, markets can split, and that still doesn't shake what Windows retains. So yes, mobile is huge right now, but the games that sell big on mobile often aren't the same kinds of games that sell big on the PC. There will be some overlap, then there will be other games that no headway is made at all, because the formfactor + perpetually being behind dedicated gaming hardware holds many games back. Are people really playing lots of things like MMORPGS on their smartphones? It sounds like you're arguing that mobile games will become so dominant that ALL OTHER games will cease being developed, which I don't see happening. Here's what Linux is up against from my perspective:

Early 90s - DOS dominates PC gaming
Late 90s - Windows dominates PC gaming
Early 00s - Windows dominates PC gaming
Late 00s - Windows dominates PC gaming
Early 10s - Windows dominates PC gaming
Present day - Windows dominates PC gaming

Consoles have risen and fallen this entire time, yet PC gaming kept on trucking, and on Windows. PC gaming didn't cease to exist during times when consoles were more popular, because again, they were different markets, even if there was a lot of overlap. With mobile I think there's a lot LESS overlap than there is between consoles and the PC. Linux has gained massively more game titles than it used to, yet barely made a dent in marketshare and seem to be backsliding, despite more titles being added.

Now if you're arguing Windows is going to DIE in about 10 years, then yes, that would kill the dominance. All I can say to that though is that I've heard predictions about that happening for a lot longer than 10 years. As stupid as MS is, they're not exactly going to let themselves go down quietly if they're being threatened.

Don't get me wrong, I would LIKE to see that happen, but some of these posts seem to completely underestimate just how much influence MS wields in computing and how many resources it has its disposal, ESPECIALLY pc gaming. When we start seeing double digits for consumer PCs being pre-installed with Linux or gamers on Linux, then I can see some potential for change. Until then, this really doesn't feel that drastically different than what's come before.

Sure, Windows is king of desktop gaming, I was just pointing out that people are using it (both Windows and desktop) less and less. Along with that trend will come marginalizing Windows and relegating it to work OS. Think about it, it is a not so distant future, I will give it 10 years for Windows to be a work horse along with maybe gaming platform. While OpenGL was a disaster, Vulkan seems to be the opposite, adopted on Windows, Linux and what is more important on Android. It remains to be seen if consoles adapt it as it would be a perfect match for slower CPUs that they tend to use.
Remember that Windows gaming remained that way due to lack of alternatives, but when a lot of task can be completed on Android, and Android apps can be used on Linux desktop systems, it just may bring new generation of users to the new system.
I'm arguing that when a lot of games are running on an open platform, with common graphic API it is easier to port it to the other system, more so when there are already people who can program for the platform very well. Hey I will take console or Windows port to Android/Linux over not having it in the first place. Games for mobile are different from desktop mostly because hardware constraints, take a desktop with Android and you can do the same as on Windows desktop. Windows is not the dedicated gaming OS, consoles are and with AMD being consoles king and it's push for Vulkan you can be certain that it will take place there. You have Nvidia Shield console based on Android, you have Steam Box on Linux. If my words made you think I suggest people will just leave high quality graphic heavy games that they enjoy on Windows on great hardware then I would like to state that NO I do not think so, but with common API it will be easier then ever to make cross platform versions and it just may so happen that Android and Windows games will find a common hardware/software point on desktop Android/Linux box.
Frankly I would expect double digits of consumer PC to come with Android not with Linux, just wait for some distro to launch with Android desktop as the default one with all apps and typical settings that users are used to
Corporate will keep Windows, again unless the software they use has no equal alternative in other system land. Corporate must keep in mind initial costs along with upkeep, personel training and servicing costs so the offer to migrate would have to be very lucrative to be considered.

 

[BulletDust]

You say it was the dominant gaming platform, I can see that for part of the 80s, but the way I remember it, DOS was in the lead for the 90s. If I walked into a software store or went to a computer show, it was DOS games that were all over the place, with Macs being second. Unless you have some numbers showing otherwise, I'm not buying it.

I mean you say not until Quake, but companies like Sierra and Lucasarts got their rise on PC gaming, and a big part of their sales were from DOS. Hell, Apogee and Epic were the big names in PC gaming at the time and they were making a killing via shareware copies. It wasn't until DirectX that Windows started to get a foothold with gaming, but by then, it was mostly competing against DOS; the same way 10 is competing against 7 today.

Well into the early 90's the 68k platform had the technical edge. DOS based PC's of the time were limited in relation to maximum displayable colours and had woeful sound capabilities with no more than software based graphics. Yes, there were Lucasarts and comparable titles available for the PC, the Amiga, the Mac, the Atari ST and even the C64. But out of all of those machines the 68k based units reigned supreme until around 97 as gamers, with the 68k reign drawn out by 68k equipped consoles (well, the Mac struggled with no real graphics hardware, everything was done in software and it was monochrome).

Even dedicated arcade machines with vastly superior graphics for the time used the 68k platform.

The Wintel platform was by no means always the dominant computing gaming platform, not by a country mile.

 

[ManofGod]

I have to say, those two are always very entertaining and very, very loyal to ms.

Well, it happens when you no longer give two hoots what others think of you. You then start to see things in a more positive light. I am sure you will get there one day as well, just give it time. The best thing is, I started up my Windows 10 computer, it just worked and did not have to fix a thing. That and I did not have to worry about installing updates, I take care of that myself.

 

[BulletDust]

Well, it happens when you no longer give two hoots what others think of you. You then start to see things in a more positive light. I am sure you will get there one day as well, just give it time. The best thing is, I started up my Windows 10 computer, it just worked and did not have to fix a thing. That and I did not have to worry about installing updates, I take care of that myself.

I also have a Windows 10 PC that starts and I don't have to do a thing. I also have a workshop full of Windows users machines that weren't so lucky. Your choice of OS does not imply superiority.

 

[mat9v]

Well, it happens when you no longer give two hoots what others think of you. You then start to see things in a more positive light. I am sure you will get there one day as well, just give it time. The best thing is, I started up my Windows 10 computer, it just worked and did not have to fix a thing. That and I did not have to worry about installing updates, I take care of that myself.

Hey I like that "living in bliss" attitude, just close your eyes to reality. If only I could earn my pay the same way

 

[ManofGod]

Well into the early 90's the 68k platform had the technical edge. DOS based PC's of the time were limited in relation to maximum displayable colours and had woeful sound capabilities with no more than software based graphics. Yes, there were Lucasarts and comparable titles available for the PC, the Amiga, the Mac, the Atari ST and even the C64. But out of all of those machines the 68k based units reigned supreme until around 97 as gamers, with the 68k reign drawn out by 68k equipped consoles (well, the Mac struggled with no real graphics hardware, everything was done in software and it was monochrome).

Even dedicated arcade machines with vastly superior graphics for the time used the 68k platform.

The Wintel platform was by no means always the dominant computing gaming platform, not by a country mile.

Well, unfortunately, superior back in the day because of the hardware did not mean it was more successful. The Amiga blew away all other systems in it's time for gaming and yet, it died anyways, a few years before 1997. By that time, Windows was the dominant platform for gaming because it also could be booted into straight up DOS mode to play your older games, if needed. Also, you could play some of your games from a DOS prompt inside of Windows, I remember doing that with 2 different games at the same time, it was beautiful.

Before folks forget, DOS belonged to Microsoft, regardless of things like DrDOS and others like it. During the mid 90's, I was using OS/2 Warp 3 which I could play my DOS games through without any issues, that I can recall. WIndows is definitely not going anywhere, even in the home and consumer market but, it will not be a significant as it was 10 years ago in comparison. It still comes down to what someone is using at work and what they use at home is often the same thing.

 

[ManofGod]

I also have a Windows 10 PC that starts and I don't have to do a thing. I also have a workshop full of Windows users machines that weren't so lucky. Your choice of OS does not imply superiority.

*Shrug* Why do you see the need to defend and depress? I sit down in front of a LInux machine, Mac machine or Windows Machine, they are all the same and troubleshooting is down the same. Once I realized that, I became a lot more comfortable overall in my profession.

 

[ManofGod]

Yep, Atari ST and then Amiga machines were the nads!

Nah, just the Amiga, you heathen!

 

[tetris42]

Well into the early 90's the 68k platform had the technical edge. DOS based PC's of the time were limited in relation to maximum displayable colours and had woeful sound capabilities with no more than software based graphics. Yes, there were Lucasarts and comparable titles available for the PC, the Amiga, the Mac, the Atari ST and even the C64. But out of all of those machines the 68k based units reigned supreme until around 97 as gamers, with the 68k reign drawn out by 68k equipped consoles (well, the Mac struggled with no real graphics hardware, everything was done in software and it was monochrome).

Even dedicated arcade machines with vastly superior graphics for the time used the 68k platform.

The Wintel platform was by no means always the dominant computing gaming platform, not by a country mile.

Ah, we're talking about "dominance" differently. I'm talking about MARKETSHARE dominance, which is my point in all of this. I think you're undermining your own argument. You're pointing to 68k platforms as being technically superior to DOS, fine, I'm not arguing that. In the same way 68k may have been the superior platform, Linux could be the superior OS, but if it doesn't get the marketshare and userbase for gaming, then it still doesn't get anywhere. That's my point. For all the progress Linux has made over the years in gaming, it has barely even DENTED MS's utter stranglehold on PC gaming. Unless people buying new gaming PCs are getting Linux as their go-to OS, I don't see how this is going to change. The argument you're currently making is Linux gaming now is as to 68k gaming in the 90s. Not an optimistic analogy for the future of Linux gaming!

 

[zero2dash]

Seems like it's the April updates that are doing this. So what to do? Just don't update?

Won't do you any good. The updates now are all cumulative, including security-only.
This patch was added even to that, not just the security and quality rollup.
Going forward, if there's any doubt whether your CPU may get flagged incorrectly, you can't update. Even worse, again, the update, once installed, cannot be removed. You have to either restore a backup, or reimage from scratch.

If you're not already making routine backups of your OS drive, I strongly recommend grabbing Veeam Endpoint Backup Free and start, before you install any updates going forward.

 

[almalino]

I personally see no problem with this. This move is not apparently about server hw because when people prefer W7 over W10 they compare UI. For a desktop machines I barely see Win 7 machines around in the business and all new machines are either Win 10 or Linux. So why the hell MS should support shrinking population of Win 7 users?

 

[grtitan]

Well, it happens when you no longer give two hoots what others think of you. You then start to see things in a more positive light. I am sure you will get there one day as well, just give it time. The best thing is, I started up my Windows 10 computer, it just worked and did not have to fix a thing. That and I did not have to worry about installing updates, I take care of that myself.

And my almost perfectly running W10 gaming pc is freezing for no reason, after the stupid creators update.

I will have to once again, do a wipe and fresh reinstall.

And thanks to some hipster at Redmond, now i also have to edit the registry to change my fonts size, but its ok, MS doe not make mistakes.

And about the shill, sorry dude, but both of you are either getting paid or suffer from some serious fanboism or worse, you are just trolling.

Either way, i hate doing this, but will start using the ignore button, you two are that annoying.

edit. words.

 

[mat9v]

BTW anyone here know good backup utility that can restore system backup to Intel HM87 based RAID drive? Problem is in the damn RAID drivers. EASUS does not work.
Preferably not binary backup because my RAID is over 2.8TB in size and only 30% is in use - a big time saver to restore only data not blank space.

I personally see no problem with this. This move is not apparently about server hw because when people prefer W7 over W10 they compare UI. For a desktop machines I barely see Win 7 machines around in the business and all new machines are either Win 10 or Linux. So why the hell MS should support shrinking population of Win 7 users?

This move is without reason on the whole, it's against common sense. MS should just let us be and worry about how the system works on our machines ourselves with just a warning about incompatibility. If they had any original thought between them all they would post such a warning and then with few next updates just sour performance and/or stability. But that would probably require a lot of careful programming to let it stay below radar, more then allegedly keeping compatibility, because the truth is there is no incompatibility problem, there is only one more user group that should be encouraged to move to Windows 10.
Hopefully guys behind Simplix and other such "update helpers" will remove this one stupid update from the pack and release next version without it.

 

[Nenu]

Except it was the Amiga followed by the ST. The Amiga with its standard blitter chip and dedicated chip ram was always the better gamer in the early days.

Yep, I should have said thats the timeline we followed here not the release order.

 

[tetris42]

This move is without reason on the whole, it's against common sense. MS should just let us be and worry about how the system works on our machines ourselves with just a warning about incompatibility. If they had any original thought between them all they would post such a warning and then with few next updates just sour performance and/or stability. But that would probably require a lot of careful programming to let it stay below radar, more then allegedly keeping compatibility, because the truth is there is no incompatibility problem, there is only one more user group that should be encouraged to move to Windows 10. Hopefully guys behind Simplix and other such "update helpers" will remove this one stupid update from the pack and release next version without it.

Oh I disagree, there's a very compelling reason for them to do this. I think the reasoning behind it is "fuck you, use Windows 10." If you follow that logic, then this move seems to be perfectly aligned in their interests.

 

[heatlesssun]

What do you mean compatibility? As in, after update my program will no longer work where before it did? Did it keep compatibility or break it? Updates will never "keep compatibility" they can only "break compatibility".
Unless you mean one computer being compatible with some other because an update changed how some software piece worked between versions.
Or did you mean that without installing one update you would not be able to install some other?

Could you expand on those mysterious compatibility issues between machines having updates and not having them in the same branch? Preferably with at least few examples?

Is every version of Linux compatible with all Linux software?

 

[mat9v]

Is every version of Linux compatible with all Linux software?

I don't care about Linux, don't divert the topic. Answer about this mysterious Windows incompatibility.

Oh I disagree, there's a very compelling reason for them to do this. I think the reasoning behind it is "fuck you, use Windows 10." If you follow that logic, then this move seems to be perfectly aligned in their interests.

I'm very sorry to have missed such an obvious answer, I will endevour to do better /s
What other logic is there to follow anyway?

 

[heatlesssun]

And about the shill, sorry dde, but both of you are either getting paid or suffer from some seious fanboism or worse, you are just trolling.

And what have I said that is unreasonable here? How is it possible for me to be called a shill when the first thing I said about this was that Microsoft SHOULDN'T have done this?

And different people have different experiences. I've upgraded 7 machines now to the CU include,including my packed full of games sig rig. No major problems. But hey if Windows 10 is working fine for one and they state, they must be a shill, for simply not experiencing problems.

 

[heatlesssun]

I don't care about Linux, don't divert the topic. Answer about this mysterious Windows incompatibility.

Ok, is every version of Windows compatible with all Windows applications?

 

[mat9v]

Ok, is every version of Windows compatible with all Windows applications?

Do I have to spell it with BIG LETTERS or small words?
Point us at incompatibilities that prevent Windows 7 running on KL/Ryzen before and after recent update we are talking about.

 

[heatlesssun]

Do I have to spell it with BIG LETTERS or small words?
Point us at incompatibilities that prevent Windows 7 running on KL/Ryzen before and after recent update we are talking about.

I never said that Windows 7 is totally incompatible with Ryzen/KL. I've said from day one the newer processors should work fine overall but yeah, there'd be exceptions like with KL new power states and support for certain kinds of DRM tied to KL. For instance you can't run 4k Netflix under Windows 7. Now these things are necessarily big deals to everyone but the power state stuff could be an important factor in better battery life for mobile devices. I've not seen any battery tests with KL mobile devices comparing Windows 7 and 10 battery life. So I'm just pointing out the feature, what real world impact it might have, have no data to make any real world claims about that.

 

[Hagrid]

I never said that Windows 7 is totally incompatible with Ryzen/KL. I've said from day one the newer processors should work fine overall but yeah, there'd be exceptions like with KL new power states and support for certain kinds of DRM tied to KL. For instance you can't run 4k Netflix under Windows 7. Now these things are necessarily big deals to everyone but the power state stuff could be an important factor in better battery life for mobile devices. I've not seen any battery tests with KL mobile devices comparing Windows 7 and 10 battery life. So I'm just pointing out the feature, what real world impact it might have, have no data to make any real world claims about that.

Can't run 4K netflix under Win 7? I did not know Win 7 could not run 4K content? Or did MS pay them off to make it Win 10 only?(Like lots of other software/hardware)
New power states is good for laptops or tablets yes.(though not a deal breaker) Though I am sure the bios could be done for it.

 

[heatlesssun]

Can't run 4K netflix under Win 7? I did not know Win 7 could not run 4K content? Or did MS pay them off to make it Win 10 only?(Like lots of other software/hardware)
New power states is good for laptops or tablets yes.(though not a deal breaker) Though I am sure the bios could be done for it.

Intel was the one that added the support for this DRM to its chips. It doesn't even work under Windows 10 without KL and you have to use KL's GPU as well. Same goes for UHD BD.

 

[naib]

Can't run 4K netflix under Win 7? I did not know Win 7 could not run 4K content? Or did MS pay them off to make it Win 10 only?(Like lots of other software/hardware)
New power states is good for laptops or tablets yes.(though not a deal breaker) Though I am sure the bios could be done for it.

ignore the shill.. he has again selectively reported the issue..

Netflix enabled 4k Dec 2016 & initially for EDGE only, thus windows10 only. They did not say it was windows10 exclusive...

http://techblog.netflix.com/2017/03/update-on-html5-video-for-netflix.html

But this is just the beginning. We launched 4K Ultra HD on Microsoft Edge in December of 2016, and look forward to high-resolution video being available on more platforms soon. We are also looking ahead to HDR video. Netflix-supported TVs with Chromecast built-in—which use a version of our web player—already support Dolby Vision and HDR10. And we are working with our partners to provide similar support on other platforms over time.

 

[heatlesssun]

ignore the shill.. he has again selectively reported the issue..

Netflix enabled 4k Dec 2016 & initially for EDGE only, thus windows10 only. They did not say it was windows10 exclusive...

http://techblog.netflix.com/2017/03/update-on-html5-video-for-netflix.html

LOL! Good grief did you even read what you linked? I'm a shill for reporting EXACTLY WHAT'S IN THE LINK YOU PROVIDED?

We are pleased to add Windows 10 and 7th Gen Intel® Core™ CPUs to that list.

http://techblog.netflix.com/2017/01/netflix-now-supports-ultra-hd-4k-on.html

Report facts, get called a shill. That's just insane.

 

[mat9v]

Can't run 4K netflix under Win 7? I did not know Win 7 could not run 4K content? Or did MS pay them off to make it Win 10 only?(Like lots of other software/hardware)
New power states is good for laptops or tablets yes.(though not a deal breaker) Though I am sure the bios could be done for it.

Actually, probably Intel did. The only way for Netflix 4K content to play on PC was/is to get Intel CPU (Kaby Lake) because it has a correct version of content encryption, so much better to safeguard Netflix rights and prevent piracy. Oh, and that works only under Windows 10 WDM 2.0, so yeah, perfect artificial reason.

I never said that Windows 7 is totally incompatible with Ryzen/KL. I've said from day one the newer processors should work fine overall but yeah, there'd be exceptions like with KL new power states and support for certain kinds of DRM tied to KL. For instance you can't run 4k Netflix under Windows 7. Now these things are necessarily big deals to everyone but the power state stuff could be an important factor in better battery life for mobile devices. I've not seen any battery tests with KL mobile devices comparing Windows 7 and 10 battery life. So I'm just pointing out the feature, what real world impact it might have, have no data to make any real world claims about that.

So in other words, you have no such examples to show to support your statement, there is no reason to block updates for now; if you are using Win 7 on new hardware you MAY not profit from performance/power enhancements. No compatibility problems, systems will not suddenly stop working, loose all data and so on. I think we should close this line of reasoning, it's a dead end. You can't defend such a decision from any angle.

 

[DeathFromBelow]

Intel was the one that added the support for this DRM to its chips. It doesn't even work under Windows 10 without KL and you have to use KL's GPU as well. Same goes for UHD BD.

Sounds like a good reason not to use this 'feature' altogether.

How again does this prevent Windows 7 from running on Ryzen or Kaby Lake? I don't run Windows anymore, but my Asus X370 Prime included full support for Windows 7 out of the box. You just put the Asus CD in and boot the Windows 7 installer from a USB drive like normal.

 

[ManofGod]

And my almost perfectly running W10 gaming pc is freezing for no reason, after the stupid creators update.

I will have to once again, do a wipe and fresh reinstall.

And thanks to some hipster at redmond, now i also have to edit the registry to change my fonts size, but its ok, MS doe not make mistakes.

And about the shill, sorry dde, but both of you are either getting paid or suffer from some seious fanboism or worse, you are just trolling.

Either way, i hate doing this, but will start using the ignore button, you two are that annoying.

Take the time to figure it out over wiping and reinstalling, it makes a big difference. If the only thing you ever do is wipe and reinstall, then you learn nothing. Looks like this troll, fanboy and shill knows more about computers and troubleshooting techniques than you do, if wiping and reinstalling is all you do. I am willing to offer advice, if you are willing to hear it.

 

[ManofGod]

Actually, probably Intel did. The only way for Netflix 4K content to play on PC was/is to get Intel CPU (Kaby Lake) because it has a correct version of content encryption, so much better to safeguard Netflix rights and prevent piracy. Oh, and that works only under Windows 10 WDM 2.0, so yeah, perfect artificial reason.



So in other words, you have no such examples to show to support your statement, there is no reason to block updates for now; if you are using Win 7 on new hardware you MAY not profit from performance/power enhancements. No compatibility problems, systems will not suddenly stop working, loose all data and so on. I think we should close this line of reasoning, it's a dead end. You can't defend such a decision from any angle.

Since he is not defending anything at all, just giving the actual reasons that MS would do something like this, deal with it, or don't, not my problem. Guess this is why I am good at what I do, I do not try to make things other than what they are, I deal with things as they are.

 

[ManofGod]

Ah, screw it, forget it, not going to change his mind anyways.

 

[ManofGod]

Hey I like that "living in bliss" attitude, just close your eyes to reality. If only I could earn my pay the same way

Seeing thing in a positive light and living in bliss are hardly the same thing. Oh well, reality is not hating on everything, after all.

 

[ManofGod]

LOL! Good grief did you even read what you linked? I'm a shill for reporting EXACTLY WHAT'S IN THE LINK YOU PROVIDED?



http://techblog.netflix.com/2017/01/netflix-now-supports-ultra-hd-4k-on.html

Report facts, get called a shill. That's just insane.

I agree with you there, but, then again, getting called a shill on the internet by someone I do not know and really do not care much about? LOL I have been called far worse by people I know and that does bother me, this, not so much. I have not redone my computer from scratch since September of 2015 and it has gone through 3 complete hardware configuration changes. So that means, original Windows 10, update for November 2015, Anniversary Update and now the Creators update, no instability, locking up or BSOD's.

This build has gone from Intel Z170, AMD FX 970 AM3+ and now on X370 AM4+. It went from a AMD R9 290, then a EVGA 980 Ti and now 2 x Sapphire R9 Furies Non X. All I had to do is put my WIndows 8 Pro product key in, activate and it works. It does appear that one of my drive letters changed on one of my hard drives but, that will be fixable. (Icons are missing for some games which is why I think a drive letter change occurred.)

 

[mat9v]

Since he is not defending anything at all, just giving the actual reasons that MS would do something like this, deal with it, or don't, not my problem. Guess this is why I am good at what I do, I do not try to make things other than what they are, I deal with things as they are.

No, not really, he doesn't know the reasons, he is speculating only. It falls to us to decide if those reasons as speculated are reasonable enough to support the decision. They aren't from our point of view and that is the only thing that matters. We are users and not Microsoft and what is good for them is not necessarily good for us. If you mean "mudding the water" then you are good at it, we actually know nothing about what you are good at in life outside this forums so no way to check your boasts.

I have not redone my computer from scratch since September of 2015 and it has gone through 3 complete hardware configuration changes. So that means, original Windows 10, update for November 2015, Anniversary Update and now the Creators update, no instability, locking up or BSOD's.

This build has gone from Intel Z170, AMD FX 970 AM3+ and now on X370 AM4+. It went from a AMD R9 290, then a EVGA 980 Ti and now 2 x Sapphire R9 Furies Non X. All I had to do is put my WIndows 8 Pro product key in, activate and it works. It does appear that one of my drive letters changed on one of my hard drives but, that will be fixable. (Icons are missing for some games which is why I think a drive letter change occurred.)

What worth is such a statement, even when completely truthful? You only stated that your hardware/software config survived the changes, good for you. I have a Windows laptop based on Haswell with the Windows 7 that started on Core2Duo desktop setup, survived migration to SandyBridge laptop with GF570, then SSD migration, then I got my Hasswell setup with GTX970 and lastly migrated it to 3xSSD Raid (SuperRaid card for 3 SSD drives for MSI power laptops). Does it mean that Windows 7 is a better system then Windows 10 is because it served with distinction longer?
No, how good they work on particular setup is irrelevant and of no consequence to the topic of this [H] discussion.
But for me it means that when I migrate to Ryzen based APU I will have to say goodbye to my still working well Windows setup along with specialized data recovery, disk, sdcard, flash memory and smartphone mounting apps that do not work on Windows 10, or will have to get a separate machine to do all that under good old Windows 7.
Or maybe just use tools like Simplix to install updates without this stupid block...

 

[ManofGod]

No, not really, he doesn't know the reasons, he is speculating only. It falls to us to decide if those reasons as speculated are reasonable enough to support the decision. They aren't from our point of view and that is the only thing that matters. We are users and not Microsoft and what is good for them is not necessarily good for us. If you mean "mudding the water" then you are good at it, we actually know nothing about what you are good at in life outside this forums so no way to check your boasts.

Nope, no boasting, I just simply, with my friends help over the years, realize what I am good at, that is all. (In this case, IT stuff and computers, which is my profession.) There are logical reasons that things like that were done but, hey, ignore the part where heatless says he thinks it is a bad idea. After all, it must be either or, eh?

 

[mat9v]

Nope, no boasting, I just simply, with my friends help over the years, realize what I am good at, that is all. (In this case, IT stuff and computers, which is my profession.) There are logical reasons that things like that were done but, hey, ignore the part where heatless says he thinks it is a bad idea. After all, it must be either or, eh?

I can accept that you support people for free or for money, that's the same thing I do for fun and for a living. We just don't agree on MS decision, you say they have reasons (without stating them, or explaining), I say they have reasons (stating them as greed for user data).
Please if You wish to restate that keeping updates for KL and Ryzen on Windows 7 would cause them undue hardship, be kind to provide just one example of an update they included in the pack that actually can be broken by using different CPU.
I think we can narrow such a discussion to kernel related changes as they are the only relevant, right?