never owned a USB DAC, but i have few questions.

T

TroyX

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jan 17, 2012
Messages
1,461
do they make streaming youtube audio sound better?

is the Nuforce DAC worth $450?
 
Last edited:
You are wasting your money if you are buying a dedicated DAC just for youtube music (crap in, crap out).

How much of a difference will depend on the quality of your speakers or headphones.
 
fss69 said:
You are wasting your money if you are buying a dedicated DAC just for youtube music (crap in, crap out).

How much of a difference will depend on the quality of your speakers or headphones.
Click to expand...

i own Denon AHD2000 headphoes and Titanium HD sound card.
 
MrGuvernment said:
you cant. it isnt streamed with high quality in mind.
Click to expand...

then where do you buy your favorite music, songs, etc on bluray discs if that's the case?


or maybe its better if i just stick with the Titanium hd?
 
If you want high quality music, by far the best way to get it is Compact Disc. They're easy to find online, relatively cheap, and the sound quality of CD is so good that when the Audio Engineering Society did blind testing of high-quality 24/96 files and "normal" CD quality files, the listeners were only correct 49.8% of the time after 550 trials. In other words, for the vast majority of people, CD is the best possible quality, and getting higher sound quality than that is a matter of guessing.

As long as you do not need to take your sound device to different places, keep the Titanium HD. Creative has published the performance of the Titanium HD using an audio analyzer, and the test results show that it is transparent to the ears. Mind you, I am talking about the line output, Creative has not published measurements for the headphone output. So if you want the absolute best sound quality with headphones, you should buy a headphone amplifier to connect to the Titanium HD.

And no NuForce products as a whole are probably not worth your money. NuForce's design philosophy is to "design by ear", which is highly flawed. That's like someone trying to design an automobile engine and driving the cars around to assess the performance, instead of using a dynamometer and other test equipment. I personally wouldn't trust NuForce as a brand.
 
XacTactX said:
If you want high quality music, by far the best way to get it is Compact Disc. They're easy to find online, relatively cheap, and the sound quality of CD is so good that when the Audio Engineering Society did blind testing of high-quality 24/96 files and "normal" CD quality files, the listeners were only correct 49.8% of the time after 550 trials. In other words, for the vast majority of people, CD is the best possible quality, and getting higher sound quality than that is a matter of guessing.

As long as you do not need to take your sound device to different places, keep the Titanium HD. Creative has published the performance of the Titanium HD using an audio analyzer, and the test results show that it is transparent to the ears. Mind you, I am talking about the line output, Creative has not published measurements for the headphone output. So if you want the absolute best sound quality with headphones, you should buy a headphone amplifier to connect to the Titanium HD.

And no NuForce products as a whole are probably not worth your money. NuForce's design philosophy is to "design by ear", which is highly flawed. That's like someone trying to design an automobile engine and driving the cars around to assess the performance, instead of using a dynamometer and other test equipment. I personally wouldn't trust NuForce as a brand.
Click to expand...

thanks, that was helpful.

so what kind of headphone amp would you pair the Denon AHD 2000 with?
 
What is your budget for an amp/DAC?

What sources will you use? Do you need analog or SPDIF inputs?
 
No, infact a DAC will make youtube sound WORSE. A good DAC will make 320 mp3's sound like 128's. If you want the best sound, Skip the USB and get a soundcard that can transport SPIDF bit-perfect.
 
blinx said:
No, infact a DAC will make youtube sound WORSE. A good DAC will make 320 mp3's sound like 128's. If you want the best sound, Skip the USB and get a soundcard that can transport SPIDF bit-perfect.
Click to expand...

Not really true. 320 LAME vs FLAC, has yielded results like CD vs. FLAC. For all intents and purposes, properly ripped 320s yield Identical sound quality, even on Hi-Fi systems. Further, a Denon Ah-D2000 is NOT Hi-Fi at all, and any difference the OP may hear will almost assuredly be due to subjective bias after reading a lot of the snake oil regarding 320vsFLAC. This is especially true for pretty much all music that isn't acoustic in nature (Symphony, harmonic, Jazz), as such music tends to be mastered for compressed formats.

Cheers,
 
I'd also like to add that the Denons DO NOT need an amp, no matter what anyone tells you. They are ultra efficient, low impedance headphones (25 ohm). I've run them through high watt and low watt amps and really it makes things worse than better. Your onboard is most likely more than suitable. If you have an Ipod, that will easily be able to drive your Denon to their maximum potential.

However, if you REALLY want a discrete DAC, I strongly suggest waiting for the assembled ODAC coming at the end of next month. It will be $100-$200 and preliminary results suggest it rivals much more expensive equipment.

Cheers,
 
The reason OP needs a headphone amp is NOT because of the driving power. He needs a headphone amp because the headphone output of the Titanium HD does not have published specs. We don't know if it's 100% transparent or not. But based on Creative's published measurements, we do know that the line output is audibly transparent. So if OP pairs a headphone amp like the Objective2 with the Titanium HD he will get the best possible sound and it will be the end of the road for him in terms of upgrades. Plus, it's the cheapest and most straightforward thing to do.

Also, the people above are spot on when comparing high bitrate MP3 to CD. They're going to sound identical unless you have really good gear or really well trained ears. If you want to test this, you can download Foobar 2000 with the ABX Comparator plugin. That will allow you to take two music files and try to match them up correctly without knowing which is which. If you can do it successfully then you know you have something to gain with lossless music. If not, well then good for you because it makes life easier.

If you decide that MP3 quality is good enough for you, check out MOG and Spotify. They both let you stream high quality MP3 at 256/320k for $5 or $10 per month.
 
XacTactX said:
The reason OP needs a headphone amp is NOT because of the driving power. He needs a headphone amp because the headphone output of the Titanium HD does not have published specs. We don't know if it's 100% transparent or not. But based on Creative's published measurements, we do know that the line output is audibly transparent. So if OP pairs a headphone amp like the Objective2 with the Titanium HD he will get the best possible sound and it will be the end of the road for him in terms of upgrades. Plus, it's the cheapest and most straightforward thing to do.

Also, the people above are spot on when comparing high bitrate MP3 to CD. They're going to sound identical unless you have really good gear or really well trained ears. If you want to test this, you can download Foobar 2000 with the ABX Comparator plugin. That will allow you to take two music files and try to match them up correctly without knowing which is which. If you can do it successfully then you know you have something to gain with lossless music. If not, well then good for you because it makes life easier.

If you decide that MP3 quality is good enough for you, check out MOG and Spotify. They both let you stream high quality MP3 at 256/320k for $5 or $10 per month.
Click to expand...

I have to disagree. He should just upgrade his DAC and run directly from that. There is no need to get an amp. Running from his already unpublished DAC to a transparent amp isn't going to help any. He's better off running into a transparent DAC and from there directly to his cans, IMO.

Cheers,
 
Feedling headphones directly with the line output of a DAC? That's a bad idea. EDIT actually, the AH-D2000 has a really flat frequency response, so if you want, try to run it directly from the line output and see what happens. The bass might sound loose or boomy though.

Creative has published performance for the Titanium HD. It is audibly transparent (the line outputs).
http://connect.creativelabs.com/PR/... Blaster X-Fi Titanium HD Reviewers Guide.pdf
 
XacTactX said:
Feedling headphones directly with the line output of a DAC? That's a bad idea. EDIT actually, the AH-D2000 has a really flat frequency response, so if you want, try to run it directly from the line output and see what happens. The bass might sound loose or boomy though.

Creative has published performance for the Titanium HD. It is audibly transparent (the line outputs).
http://connect.creativelabs.com/PR/... Blaster X-Fi Titanium HD Reviewers Guide.pdf
Click to expand...

Just for more information, I was confused what you meant. If you have a transparent amp, that won't change the response curve for your headphones. If you have a transparent DAC and run directly from the output, that won't change the response curve of your headphones. So why would running directly from the output of the DAC be a bad thing? The only reason you need an amp is to get more juice into the drivers, AFAIK, not to change the response curve (unless you like tube amps, then by all means enjoy your distortion). The AH-D2000 doesn't qualify for that, nor do any of the other Denon models IMO.

Cheers,
 
Yeah, sorry, I misunderstood that part. I confused the resistance with the output impedance. Some guy on the Creative site says the Titanium HD has an output impedance of 0.01 Ohms so that's going to be fine for driving headphones. http://forums.creative.com/archive/index.php?t-697041.html

But what about the resistance? :confused: The resistance on the Titanium HD is 10,000 Ohms. I wonder if that's going to be alright.
 
OP doesn't need any new gear whatsoever imo... Just needs to stop listening to crap quality streams on Youtube. Even MP3s off Amazon/iTunes/Google Play will sound vastly better. I still prefer to buy full albums when it's a band/singer I really enjoy, mostly so I can encode it myself, archive it in FLAC, etc... Ever so often I still get the odd encode w/glitches from the major stores (1 in 20-30 maybe?), kinda annoying, I've never checked what their policy is regarding that kinda issue... I keep buying singles online just because it's convenient tho.
 
Streaming Youtube for music is probably one of the lowest quality formats for listening to music.

Go download Spotify and enjoy. Its free and has a catalog 15+ million strong. For $9.99 a month you get 320kbps (versus 128k streams which still sound great) quality streams and the ability to download all your playlists for local play and if you own a smartphone you can listen to Spotify there as well.

Problem solved.
 
Godmachine said:
Streaming Youtube for music is probably one of the lowest quality formats for listening to music.

Go download Spotify and enjoy. Its free and has a catalog 15+ million strong. For $9.99 a month you get 320kbps (versus 128k streams which still sound great) quality streams and the ability to download all your playlists for local play and if you own a smartphone you can listen to Spotify there as well.

Problem solved.
Click to expand...

Spotify does some truly bizzare EQing on some of their tracks IMHO. I was listening to a baroque violin sonata with harpsichord accompaniment...some tool cranked the bass like you'd find at a rock show.
 
Skripka said:
Spotify does some truly bizzare EQing on some of their tracks IMHO. I was listening to a baroque violin sonata with harpsichord accompaniment...some tool cranked the bass like you'd find at a rock show.
Click to expand...

It all depends on how the mastered was mixed and which master they used since there can be more than one master per release. You might have encountered an odd master simply because Spotify was given that as the only option to license (since they don't pay artists up front like Amazon or iTunes they probably don't get a crack at all the best master copies to upload). So I wouldn't lay the blame at there feet. And its a free service ..hard to knock them for EQing when its free.

The only one I know that offers mastered for compressed audio tracks is iTunes and that's only a recent feature and only for a limited (very limited in fact) amount of there total catalog. Plus its arguable if that even makes a bit a difference as there hasn't been much testing done to confirm it.

If something sounds a bit off than just download Equalify for Spotify and tweak it to whatever you want.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top