Netflix Password Sharing May Soon Be Impossible Due to New AI Tracking

Discussion in 'HardForum Tech News' started by Megalith, Jan 12, 2019.

  1. Megalith

    Megalith 24-bit/48kHz Staff Member

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    UK-based Synamedia has unveiled new artificial intelligence software that could put an end to password sharing on streaming services. The product relies on machine learning, which can “analyze account activity and recognize unusual patterns, such as account details being used in two locations within similar time periods.” Companies claim they have lost billions due to credential sharing.

    The idea is to spot instances of customers sharing their account credentials illegally and offering them a premium shared account service that will authorize a limited level of password sharing. "Casual credentials sharing is becoming too expensive to ignore. Our new solution gives operators the ability to take action," said Jean Marc Racine, Synamedia's chief product officer.
     
  2. Uvaman2

    Uvaman2 2[H]4U

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    Hehehe hoboho... You needed "AI" for this bullshit?
    Besides, its irrelevant if the company doesn't care about password sharing
     
  3. Eshelmen

    Eshelmen 2[H]4U

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    Wouldn't putting a device # cap be easier?

    For instance -

    My 4 user allowed Netflix account can have 4 users simultaneously use it.

    If Netflix was to lock in the first device each user logged in with, then wouldn't this be better?

    On top of that, a device management UI for the owner of the account to switch or delete different devices for each account. New phone? No problem, add that new phone to allowed devices and remove the other.

    Pain in the ass for the consumer side, but how does this software know someone doesn't have several devices, or better yet how does this software know that 4 legally allowed Netflix users on one account has or doesn't have several devices of their own too?
     
  4. Snooble

    Snooble Gawd

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    I have a premium account. I have 2 TV's, 4 PC's, 2 phones that access them. That is just my family that uses Netflix on our own devices. Netflix has no business deciding who gets to use my account on 4 simultaneous devices.
     
  5. Grimham

    Grimham [H]ard|Gawd

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    If I'm at my house then go to my vacation house in Maine or my condo in Florida while the wife and kids are at home how does it know for sure? I've read no details that leads me to believe the AI will work without incident. I have neither a house in Maine or a Condo in Florida btw. Just saying.
     
  6. ChoGGi

    ChoGGi [H]ard|Gawd

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    Netflix may not care, but the companies they've signed contracts with probably have some take reasonable actions wording that they care about, though just having a login limit like Eshelmen said certainly sounds easier to me. I assume Synamedia needs to make their VCs happy which is why we're hearing about them recently.
     
  7. ecuador

    ecuador Limp Gawd

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    This is not related to Netflix at all. Just a bogus company trying to cash in on the "AI" fad and use Netflix as an example without any involvement of Netflix themselves.
    If Netflix decides they want to stop pass sharing, they can easily do it themselves and with no pretend-AI involved...
     
  8. Cyraxx

    Cyraxx 2[H]4U

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    Because plenty of houses have TONS of devices. For instance, we have 3 tablets, 3 smartphones, 3 laptops, 1 desktop, 3 TVs, and 3 Chromecasts. Each of those are different devices that can access Netflix, no?

    Also plenty of devices expire. We just replaced a TV not too long ago.
     
  9. Briguyatx

    Briguyatx Limp Gawd

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    Netflix has alternative user profiles for a reason. Somehow I don't think 1 person needs 4 different profiles.....
     
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  10. idiomatic

    idiomatic n00b

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    The idea is to be better than Plex, not worse.
     
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  11. DukenukemX

    DukenukemX [H]ardness Supreme

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    This is the same concept with DRM in video games. Just cause you put DRM in games doesn't mean people are going to buy it suddenly. Just cause you stop people from sharing their Netflix service doesn't mean people will start paying for the service. You're just pissing off the people who do indeed own the service by tripping a lock whenever their IP is detected to be too far away to possibly be the same person. Everyone else will just torrent.
     
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  12. DukenukemX

    DukenukemX [H]ardness Supreme

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    You mean Emby.
     
  13. Cyraxx

    Cyraxx 2[H]4U

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    Correct-o

    Same thing happened with music. If we would JUST make it impossible to rip CDs, everyone would buy them! This song was downloaded 5 million times - therefore thats 5 million lost sales!

    At least with the music industry they EVENTUALLY wised up to it and streaming services came out.
     
  14. PeaKr

    PeaKr Gawd

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    Netflix knows exactly how people use their subs. The real metric here is the value of Netflix. Is it worth 11$ a month for 2 steams? 3$ more gets you 2 more streams and UHD. There are a few bright spots but much of their original content is garbage. I suffered through 3 eps of Lost in Space before giving up. I like comedy, excluding a few old school standouts their comedy specials are filled with too much sjw crap. Remove more value and people may start dropping subs.
     
  15. nilepez

    nilepez [H]ardForum Junkie

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    This will inevitably happen, but I doubt Netflix would do it now. So long as they have solid growth, they're not going to rock the boat. When growth flattens, that's when they're going to start working on ending sharing.
     
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  16. ChadD

    ChadD 2[H]4U

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    I spend days away from home while the wife and kid are there. If Netflix was to try and force me into paying for a second account I would just go back to torrents 100% of the time. They cap the # of streams. If they feel 4 devices running at once is costing them money then they should reduce the number of streams....

    Its not like even the people that are sharing are giving their netflix accounts to 20 people... doesn't work that way. So I fail to see how sharing is costing Netflix anything. My adult kids all have their own netflix accounts... like I would want my streams shutting off cause the wife at home is streaming and the adult kids are as well. F that. Their current solution works fine.
     
  17. Master_shake_

    Master_shake_ [H]ardForum Junkie

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    this is stupid.

    i've got a family of 4 if 2 of us are at home watching 2 different devices and 2 of us are mobile how the fuck can it ever know who is the rightful user/bill payer?

    with the shit selection they have they are lucky i've allowed them to charge me 17 dollars a month.
     
  18. Eshelmen

    Eshelmen 2[H]4U

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    That's my point


    I'd rather us manage our own devices on our own account than some software accidentally red flag us and we're banned or something.
     
  19. viper1152012

    viper1152012 [H]ard|Gawd

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    I have 13 streaming capable devices and I use a premium account so if they capped it to 4 devices peroid i'd dump them Hulu amazon EVERYONE and just use my VPN to get the content anyway.

    Dont make it hard for consumers to consume.
     
  20. Ocellaris

    Ocellaris Ginger @le, an alcoholic's best friend.

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    Y’all realize Netflix didn’t mention this tech, comment for this story, or get mentioned by the company trying to sell this tech, right? The Independent clckbaited the article by putting Netflix in the title and then H regurgitated the clickbait. Some of you fall for everything...
     
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  21. DukenukemX

    DukenukemX [H]ardness Supreme

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    Inevitably Netflix will have other problems to deal with than people sharing their Netflix accounts. As a consumer I have problems with companies like Disney who are leaving Netflix to start their own service. Even in gaming with even Bethesda leaving Steam to start their own service. I wouldn't have a problem with this as long as everyone can sell the same licensed content, but they won't. So we may run into issues where we consumers have to pay for multiple streaming services to get what we want, which brings us back to the days of cable where you pay over $200 to watch a handful of content.

    What does this mean for Netflix? Nothing yet as Netflix's content isn't something that people can't live without like HBO or Disney, but at some point when Netflix stops ruining their content then they can comfortably push people to individually own a Netflix service, and they can easily do this just like how Steam does it without any fancy AI. For some people this means they buy a VPN and pirate their brains out, which we shouldn't complain as this is a form of protest to poor business practices. When companies start pushing anti-consumer but totally legal practices then piracy is the best course of action. I can't convince Disney to license content to Netflix just as much as I can convince Nintendo to port their games to PC, but they can all enjoy not getting a cent if I pirate away.


     
  22. MNKyDeth

    MNKyDeth Limp Gawd

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    The real problem is if they put to many restrictions in place. Those do it yourself people out there will have there own streaming servers setup anyways.

    If I have a Netflix account with 4 people on it then I don't care where they are those four people should be able to use it. If it's two people on the account it's the same thing.

    If they want to restrict people sharing then limit the account to one person only.

    But that brings us back to the do it yourself crowd that have there own streaming servers setup with a bigger and larger selection then what Netflix and prime have to offer combined.
     
  23. T_A

    T_A Limp Gawd

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    First time i hear of it , i have a lifetime sub for Plex and i use it on tons of devices , have a NUC server and also a backup server on my NAS
    how is Emby any better? i see its also sub based for premium features
     
  24. nilepez

    nilepez [H]ardForum Junkie

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    What you're saying is an excuse. There's absolutely no reason you have to have every service at the same time for 12 months/year. This is especially true with CBS All Access and Hulu (since I only watch Handmaids tale). I can sign up for the former for one month and Binge ST. A few months later, I can do it again and watch The Good Fight or if I'm patient, then I could just wait for the last 4 eps of The Good Fight and binge both shows in a single month. I have no idea what Disney is going to do, but the only way I'd pay for regularly is if they had a fuck ton of exclusive content that I wanted to watch...but if they're doing it one ep at a time, id' probalby just wait a few months and binge the station 1 or 2 months/year. You can do the same with HBO Now and GoT (or whatever show(s)) you like on that channel. To me, Netflix is the only one that I really want every month, but because I justify prime because of the shipping combined with the video (and to a lesser extent their gimped prime music streaming)
     
  25. FLECOM

    FLECOM Modder(ator) & [H]ardest Folder Evar Staff Member

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    screw emby, check out jellyfin
     
  26. Jagger100

    Jagger100 [H]ardness Supreme

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    I think this is a situation where Netflix (at least in the past) didn't care but the content providers do care.
     
  27. DukenukemX

    DukenukemX [H]ardness Supreme

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    I don't pay for anything with Emby, but then again I use FreeDNS. Plus there's a Emby plugin for Kodi that avoids all the Premium pop ups.

    Now that's interesting. I'm definitely going to look into that. It's basically an open source free Emby from what I'm reading.

    https://github.com/jellyfin/jellyfin

    Crunchyroll is trying to limit people from binge watching some shows to prolong the subscription fee, cause just like you said some people cancel and resub when a show they like pops up. Remember when hackers leaked Game of Thrones before the season even started, or how Netflix's Orange is the new Black was leaked? Yea, hackers did that in protest of this practice.

    The main concern is when all streaming services have unique content they know you want really badly. So besides your Hulu and Netflix you also have Amazon, HBO Now, Crunchyroll and the soon to be released Disney service. What's to stop every new show from making a new Streaming service? Rick and Morty streaming service, the Dragon Ball Supreme streaming service. Just pay $8 a month to watch each individual show. Then when they know they have you addicted they'll limit these services to one IP per subscription fee. Then little boys and girls will basically cry and scream cause they can't watch the latest episode of their favorite show, so you need to pay $8 each per person per service. That's when you fire up your favorite VPN and say fuck it I'm torrenting.
     
  28. WBurchnall

    WBurchnall 2[H]4U

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    Brave of these guys to take on the MPIAA for most disliked online anti piracy organization They might just be able to do it.
     
  29. gulguran

    gulguran Limp Gawd

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    Could not agree more so sick and tired of people using "AI" and "ML" like they are actually something in use. Anyone with a rudimentary understanding of their system could do this in an afternoon with conventional code. It's just not anything "AI" needs.

    Sick to death of statistics for dummies being called "AI" and "ML"
     
  30. nilepez

    nilepez [H]ardForum Junkie

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    OK what is Emby/jellyfin? Client or server? Does it transcode all video or is streaming without Transcoding supported? Does it work with TVs or Xbox? I've been trying to get Kodi to work with the XBone, but not much luck with TV shows. The folders are there (and if you go to video you can play them) but when I click on them it does nothing from the TV screen. Oddly it seems to play movies (though it doesn't seem to support HDR, so I'm using LG's built in video app).

    Never heard of Crunchyroll. I don't see Netflix stopping binge watching. CBS, Hulu (and I suspect Disney) will try to limit this by rolling out shows 1 ep at a time. As for a stream/show, that sounds unworkable, but honestly, I'd pay 8 bucks to binge Star Trek Discovery. That's essentially what I'm doing anyway.

    If they become really unfriendly, then I may side with you, but unlike in the old days of Cable, where you pretty much had to subscribe all the time (because of fees for act/deact and because the show you want to watch won't be on next month), you can now just get it when you want it.

    If there's enough content that you feel you need to subscribe every month, then it's probably worth what they're charging. I could drop Amazon and probably not run out of Netflix content for a year (if not longer).

    Ultimately, Netflix will limit sharing in some way, but that day is years away.
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2019
  31. FLECOM

    FLECOM Modder(ator) & [H]ardest Folder Evar Staff Member

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    basically what emby was originally, emby decided it was time to do a money grab and started close-sourcing large parts of the application after some people called them out on possible GPL violations... so jellyfin was born to fork emby and create a viable open source alternative... you know it has potential because emby tools have already sent nasty letters
     
  32. odditory

    odditory [H]ardness Supreme

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    Til it breaks or gets blocked by Emby devs, since they're trying to steal their plugins too. Emby is fantastic. I've tried Plex many times over the years but it didn't do anything better than Emby, and some things it did worse (didn't like the way it handles transcoding) -- always went back to Emby.

    Emby = create your own private Netflix. And give easy access to your friends, accessible by Android/iPhone app or just web browser. My g/f went off to another state for a few weeks and was pouting she'd miss her favorite shows, so I said "download Emby app from Google Play and put in this username and password" -- voila, she's got access to my entire TV/Movie library from anywhere and starts watching whatever she wants.
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2019
  33. FLECOM

    FLECOM Modder(ator) & [H]ardest Folder Evar Staff Member

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    fixed that for you

    and they have already broken most of the players because they are continuing to act like children, which is fine, there were other compatible (open source) players that are now getting much needed dev time
     
  34. odditory

    odditory [H]ardness Supreme

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    It's unclear what exactly your beef is, or how its a money grab. I must be missing something. I bought a lifetime key years ago, it was dirt cheap, and I haven't paid a dime since.

    Edit: I see, they want $119 for a Lifetime key now, or recurring monthly or annual fee. Yeah I wouldn't like that if I was starting over.
     
  35. focbde

    focbde Gawd

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    I pay extra for a premium account so that my parents can use it. No, we don't live in the same place, but I think it's a legitimate use case - otherwise I'd just downgrade the account... given that there are limits anyway on simultaneous access, I really don't see what's needed here.
     
  36. Uvaman2

    Uvaman2 2[H]4U

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    At the 10 or 12 whatever level of $ netflix gives you 2 simultaneous streams, they dont care who or where gets used. I share mine with one other person. If you are offered 2 streams, they shouldn't care who and where.. which they don't... This is unlike spotify family.. they still want users to be the same household... Haven't tried to do otherwise, so I do not know how they are.
     
  37. nilepez

    nilepez [H]ardForum Junkie

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    If it's the UHD sub, I believe the limit is 4 (but I've only got 3 accounts, so not sure).
     
  38. thelead

    thelead 2[H]4U

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    I hate when companies claim 'they've lost billions' due to customers sharing things. Many people just wouldn't watch Netflix if their family member/friend didn't share their account/password with them.
     
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