NCASE M1: a crowdfunded Mini-ITX case (updates in first post)

was wondering if I could get some help from the forum about build and suggestions

this is my rough idea for a build:

CPU: Intel Core i7 4790k
CPU cooler: top down air cooler - noctua NH-C14 / or any other noctua cooler
Memory: recommendations - ? 8gb to 16;
MB: Asus impact VII
HDD/SSD: ssd 256gb; larger 3.5 hard drive 4tb? ; any suggestions yay/nay for m.2 ssd's?
GPU: recommendations - prefer gtx 980 - what seems to fit for this particular case given size?
PSU: Sliverstone SFX 450w vs 600w? recommendations;
Fans?
Filters?

suggestions?

I dont really have a ton of time on my hands, between nightshifts, being out of town/constantly driving, so Im kind of asking for a lot of input here. i have the m1 version of the case. I have a basic idea in my head. I am not trying to watercool (i know my limitations). Just want to have a nice desktop that can play games w/out any issues @ 2560x1440 whenever i have free time, rather than my crappy microsoft gen 1 surface. I realize this might be overkill but, I plan on this lasting for more than a couple years.

Any help/criticism is appreciated.

Thanks
 
Rorschach said:
There is a guy a few pages back that installed the MSI (141 mm height with no problems)
Click to expand...
Thanks. Updated that part. :)

For those looking for a short card GTX970:
U7l2RJR.png

Translation:
"With its 24 cm length, the Gainward Geforce GTX 970 Phantom is already relatively short for a card in its class. However, the high cooling system takes three slots and extends 6.5 cm from the PCB."
(Source)

Meaning this card does fit the M1 but is a bit too high with its three slots. Using a full-cover block from a GTX 670 however, this card can be shortened to 182 mm (!!!). Making it one of the shortest and fastest cards out there.
 
Ow boy that Gainward GTX 970 would be a nice card to have with a waterblock !
But I can't justify spending 450€ for a card and waterblock when my R9 290X + waterblock performs the same (in 1080p), but just uses more power.
 
BaK2BaK said:
Thx a lot JaccoW, this Phantom looks great! :)
Click to expand...
And it's probably not just the Phantom. As far as I can tell every reference PCB GTX 970 has this extra cooling element screwed on in the back, meaning you can remove it and replace it with the water block. But someone else will have to confirm that one for me.

I just yearn back to the old style of my Gainward 8800GT. :D
ez9ofk0.jpg
 
JaccoW said:
Making it one of the shortest and fastest cards out there.
Click to expand...

That I know, there are or soon will be 10 GTX970s with short PCB cards. The Gainward is indeed one of the fastest, but the big advantage of the Gainward is that it seems to be 30+ euros cheaper than the other cards with the same clocks (looking at prices in the Netherlands anyway).

Some waterblocks that were intended for 670 do work on these cards, but I will wait for the 970-specific versions to be sure of compatibility.

Also be aware that most GPU manufacturers void your warranty if you install a waterblock, or even replace stock TIM. Except for EVGA.
 
Has anyone tried a Gigabyte GTX 970/980 G1 yet?
Tempted to give it go - I believe it should fit with about 5mm to spare.
 
jdajjarapu said:
was wondering if I could get some help from the forum about build and suggestions

this is my rough idea for a build:

CPU: Intel Core i7 4790k
CPU cooler: top down air cooler - noctua NH-C14 / or any other noctua cooler
Memory: recommendations - ? 8gb to 16;
MB: Asus impact VII
HDD/SSD: ssd 256gb; larger 3.5 hard drive 4tb? ; any suggestions yay/nay for m.2 ssd's?
GPU: recommendations - prefer gtx 980 - what seems to fit for this particular case given size?
PSU: Sliverstone SFX 450w vs 600w? recommendations;
Fans?
Filters?

suggestions?
Click to expand...
I'm doing a similar build - parts arriving today!
i7-4790k. asus impact vii. gigabyte 980 windforce. silverstone sx600-g. crucial ballistix sport vlp ddr3-1600 (8gb x 2). samsung 840 evo-series (500gb) ssd. noctua nh-c14 hsf. noctua nf-f12 case fan. samsung uj-265 slim blu-ray writer.

i'll post an update on whether i can get the 980 to fit or not.

this site helped me snag a card...notifications available by email, text message, browser popup/sound: http://www.nowinstock.net/computers/videocards/nvidia/gtx980/

AFD had some suggestions:
"Noctua C12, L12 and C14 (C14 only if you're not using the side 3.5" drive rack) and Scythe Kabuto 2 *should* fit the Impact board and have acceptable cooling for the 4790k. For RAM, the Crucial Ballstix Sport VLP (very low-profile) is highly recommended. For SSD, there's lots of good choices for 2.5" drives.. for M2 SSD, your choices are limited. Think the Samsung XP941 would be a good choice."
 
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Going to fetch my silver panel kit tomorrow from the post office. Strange thing is, the customs fee is exactly the same as the fee I paid for the M1 case. Shouldn't the fee be based on the value of the product?
 
had a couple more questions.

1. how many additional fans are people generally placing on their builds? 2 x 120 on sides, a 140 in back? fans on bottom?

2. are demci filters all that much better than stock filters?

3 a link for that slim samsung blu-ray drive would be great?
 
WiSK said:
To answer your questions:
  • Radiator - pump integrated? I don't believe there is any rad+pump combo that fits in the M1
  • Radiator fans Noiseblocker eLoops B12-PS (German!)
  • Reservoir - love the M1 res, but is not available at the moment and I don't want to extend the case volume too much by bulky reservoirs
    Then either get a Swiftech rad with integrated reservoir, or buy a short PCB 970 and have a pump+res combo in the free space.
  • CPU Waterblock - pump integrated here? Swiftech Apogee Drive II is an option, but hard to get in Germany I think - can try Highflow in the Netherlands
  • Compression fittings - which angle, which diameter? EK fittings are quite small, Alphacool are cheap if you want to try things out. Size must match tubing...
  • Tubing - which diameter? I use 16mm outer diameter 10mm inner - also called 3/8"-5/8" in USA
  • Since I change my graphics card quite often, would it make sense to integrate quick disconnectors in the loop around the card? Would there be enough room to do so? QDCs tend to be huge, I wouldn't risk it.
Click to expand...

Thanks for your answer.
I don't want to use the space a short 970 graphics card would leave, because ... you know ... maybe next year a better card is released, which will be longer and then I can't use it, because something relevant is in the way blocking the space. I'm moving out of a Silverstone Fortress Mini to the Ncase, because the Fortress is quite limited in graphics card length. I know, new 970s will also fit in there, but how long will a 970 feed a 34" LG monitor with newer games and ... well, you get the point.

I can't find the Apogee Drive II in Europe. Was searching via geizhals. Does anyone has a source or a similar product or even better: a reservoir with integrated pump, that can easyly mounted at the back of the case?
 
Finally got the NH-C14 installed on my Asus PZ877-I mobo. I can't control the speeds of the fans on it for some reason. They were on full blast and it was very loud. I installed the Low Noise Adapters for the mean time, but if I start gaming they wont be able to keep up with my CPU heat.. Any solutions anyone?
 
jmor1960 said:
Finally got the NH-C14 installed on my Asus PZ877-I mobo. I can't control the speeds of the fans on it for some reason. They were on full blast and it was very loud. I installed the Low Noise Adapters for the mean time, but if I start gaming they wont be able to keep up with my CPU heat.. Any solutions anyone?
Click to expand...
Not sure if you want auto speed control but other solution is buying new fans
 
jdajjarapu said:
had a couple more questions.

1. how many additional fans are people generally placing on their builds? 2 x 120 on sides, a 140 in back? fans on bottom?

2. are demci filters all that much better than stock filters?

3 a link for that slim samsung blu-ray drive would be great?
Click to expand...
I actually wound up using none. The temperatures stay cool and the bottom has enough holes to allow the graphics card to suck up a lot of air on its own. The CPU I used (i5-4590S) stays especially cool (doesn't go over 60 C when gaming).

I had bought two 120mm Scythe Slipstream Slim fans but don't know what to do with them now. Maybe I'll put one on the side.
 
adlsrf said:
I actually wound up using none. The temperatures stay cool and the bottom has enough holes to allow the graphics card to suck up a lot of air on its own. The CPU I used (i5-4590S) stays especially cool (doesn't go over 60 C when gaming).
Click to expand...
I don't have any case fans either. Just the single 140mm on my 4790k with NH-C14 and the blower on my reference 980. I don't go above ~60C CPU when gaming. GPU gets to 80C, but I could reduce my temp target if I wanted to. GPU fan doesn't generally exceed 60%.
 
jmor1960 said:
Finally got the NH-C14 installed on my Asus PZ877-I mobo. I can't control the speeds of the fans on it for some reason. They were on full blast and it was very loud. I installed the Low Noise Adapters for the mean time, but if I start gaming they wont be able to keep up with my CPU heat.. Any solutions anyone?
Click to expand...

The P14 fan included with the C14 cooler is not PWM. For my ASUS Z87 board, I had to switch the CPU fan control from Auto (Q-Fan/PWM) to Advanced Mode (DC/3-pin) in BIOS, otherwise the fan ran at full blast. I'm not 100% sure, but it seems that on your board, a 3-pin (non-PWM) fan plugged into the CPU header will run at 100% with either of the 2 settings (Q-Fan and Q-Fan disabled). There's a discussion about that issue here..

As a workaround, you can plug the P14 fan into a chassis header (and set CPU fan warning to ignore, or plug in another fan if it's PWM), or.. just buy the Noctua NF-A15 PWM fan (or any other PWM fan.. my A15 is awesome, though ;))
 
adlsrf said:
I actually wound up using none. The temperatures stay cool and the bottom has enough holes to allow the graphics card to suck up a lot of air on its own. The CPU I used (i5-4590S) stays especially cool (doesn't go over 60 C when gaming).

I had bought two 120mm Scythe Slipstream Slim fans but don't know what to do with them now. Maybe I'll put one on the side.
Click to expand...

Bobalias_LeShay said:
I don't have any case fans either. Just the single 140mm on my 4790k with NH-C14 and the blower on my reference 980. I don't go above ~60C CPU when gaming. GPU gets to 80C, but I could reduce my temp target if I wanted to. GPU fan doesn't generally exceed 60%.
Click to expand...

Those two computers of yours will be sucking in a lot of dust over time.
 
einmannbude said:
Thanks for your answer.
I can't find the Apogee Drive II in Europe. Was searching via geizhals. Does anyone has a source or a similar product or even better: a reservoir with integrated pump, that can easyly mounted at the back of the case?
Click to expand...

The Apogee Drive II it's not a high volume product. So occasionally it will be out of stock in Europe, waiting on a shipment from the US. Highflow does normally have it in stock, you can email them when next delivery is expected. Or you can buy direct from the US on the Swiftech website.

Not sure that Geizhals is the best for searching watercooling stuff. Germany does have the problem that the biggest importer (Aquatuning/Phobya) has a strong monopoly position. They have made some enemies along the way and so certain companies like Swiftech and EK Waterblocks don't trade with them anymore. EK products you can order direct from the manufacturer.

As for res+pump combos: Printermeow used a bay reservoir with integrated pump http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1041106757&postcount=250
 
Bobalias_LeShay said:
I don't have any case fans either. Just the single 140mm on my 4790k with NH-C14 and the blower on my reference 980. I don't go above ~60C CPU when gaming. GPU gets to 80C, but I could reduce my temp target if I wanted to. GPU fan doesn't generally exceed 60%.
Click to expand...
One thing I noticed is my hard drive seems to be pretty hot to the touch. It's mounted in the hard drive cage. I can't check the temperature because it's in a RAID array.

I don't know if that's normal or what.
 
adlsrf said:
One thing I noticed is my hard drive seems to be pretty hot to the touch. It's mounted in the hard drive cage. I can't check the temperature because it's in a RAID array.

I don't know if that's normal or what.
Click to expand...

See what it says in HWMonitor (LINK). My WD Green is always under 40C mounted in the side HDD rack. It gets some air from my frontward bottom fan, but even with the fan disabled, the temp seems about the same. Anything below 50C should be okay.

EDIT: Oops, just saw the part about them being in RAID. Maybe get one of these suckers (LINK)?
 
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adlsrf said:
One thing I noticed is my hard drive seems to be pretty hot to the touch. It's mounted in the hard drive cage. I can't check the temperature because it's in a RAID array.

I don't know if that's normal or what.
Click to expand...

Touch is a bad way to measure. There's a pretty narrow range between what feels hot and cold. Moreover it gives you an emotional fear-based reaction when things are over blood temperature (38C). For example, a heatsink that is 55C can even burn skin, but the components under it might have a working temperature up to 100C.

Having said that, can I ask if your GPU is exhausting it's air directly up to the hard drive?
 
I'm also in the "no extra fans" league. Just the fans of my H220 and the ST45SF-G PSU fan.
CPU idle: ~35°C, gaming load: ~60°C
GPU idle: ~35°C, gaming load: ~60°C

IVEST said:
Those two computers of yours will be sucking in a lot of dust over time.
Click to expand...
Why would you say that ?
 
thanks all for the collective input; still mulling over multiple fans.

have the basic build in my head, now to just suck it up and make the purchase. seems the power supply and the graphics card will take the longest to get here.

was wondering about windows 7 vs 8 vs just using that windows 10 experimental build; suggestions?

i think windows 7 plays nicer w/ video games. And windows 10 seems to be 8 but slightly different. I always loved 7. Also, heard 10 will be a 20$ upgrade for windows 8 users.

Anyways, thanks again forum peoples
 
WiSK said:
Touch is a bad way to measure. There's a pretty narrow range between what feels hot and cold. Moreover it gives you an emotional fear-based reaction when things are over blood temperature (38C). For example, a heatsink that is 55C can even burn skin, but the components under it might have a working temperature up to 100C.

Having said that, can I ask if your GPU is exhausting it's air directly up to the hard drive?
Click to expand...
There's probably some hot air from the GPU being spread around as it's not a blower type (Zotac Amp GTX 680) but I can feel it blowing hot air out the vent in the back.
 
adlsrf said:
There's probably some hot air from the GPU being spread around as it's not a blower type (Zotac Amp GTX 680) but I can feel it blowing hot air out the vent in the back.
Click to expand...

One thing that touch is good for, if not absolute temperature, is relative temperature. Do the heatpipes of the GPU feel significantly hotter than the drive?
 
AFD said:
The P14 fan included with the C14 cooler is not PWM. For my ASUS Z87 board, I had to switch the CPU fan control from Auto (Q-Fan/PWM) to Advanced Mode (DC/3-pin) in BIOS, otherwise the fan ran at full blast. I'm not 100% sure, but it seems that on your board, a 3-pin (non-PWM) fan plugged into the CPU header will run at 100% with either of the 2 settings (Q-Fan and Q-Fan disabled). There's a discussion about that issue here..

As a workaround, you can plug the P14 fan into a chassis header (and set CPU fan warning to ignore, or plug in another fan if it's PWM), or.. just buy the Noctua NF-A15 PWM fan (or any other PWM fan.. my A15 is awesome, though ;))
Click to expand...

Thank you so much for the advice. It was very helpful. I went ahead and ordered the A15 fan! Thank you so much again
 
A quick update, i installed 2 more powerful fans on the bottom to see if they help the video card.

Initially i've put 2x 120 mm bitfenix Specter fans on 3 pins -very weak regarding cfm - it helped a little let's say 2-3 degrees.
And with them my MSI GTX 760 Twin Frozr IV - in Shadow of Mordor, it had 75-78 Degrees Celsius, at 75 % rpm (~ 2200 rpm) - the video card;s own fans.


Now i've put 2x Noiseblockers eLOOP B12-P fans with PWM and at 50 % total RPM i had 63-65 degrees C in the same game/conditions and of course the fan for the videe card dropped its rpm by 400 rpm. So in my case they helped quite a lot. Will monitor further.
 
IVEST said:
Those two computers of yours will be sucking in a lot of dust over time.
Click to expand...
Conveniently it's trivial to clean a computer of dust in about 30 seconds. It also doesn't hurt the computer to be moderately dusty, so I'm not worried about it. If you don't have one of these I highly recommend you get one.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001J4ZOAW
 
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Rorschach said:
A quick update, i installed 2 more powerful fans on the bottom to see if they help the video card.

Initially i've put 2x 120 mm bitfenix Specter fans on 3 pins -very weak regarding cfm - it helped a little let's say 2-3 degrees.
And with them my MSI GTX 760 Twin Frozr IV - in Shadow of Mordor, it had 75-78 Degrees Celsius, at 75 % rpm (~ 2200 rpm) - the video card;s own fans.


Now i've put 2x Noiseblockers eLOOP B12-P fans with PWM and at 50 % total RPM i had 63-65 degrees C in the same game/conditions and of course the fan for the videe card dropped its rpm by 400 rpm. So in my case they helped quite a lot. Will monitor further.
Click to expand...
Maybe it's an idea to remove the shroud and fans from the GPU alltogether and have the Noiseblockers take care of it. IT will probably be even more quiet.
Also an idea: http://www.moddiy.com/products/Mini-4%2dPin-GPU-to-2-x-4%2dPin-FWM-Fan-Adapter.html
 
Twin Frozr III gutted, noctua packaging cut into ghetto ducting and the nf-s12a+sp120l fans switched around: https://i.imgur.com/8AptNAe.jpg - had to leave the fan mounts in blocking some of the airflow, as they had the actual thread for the screws I'm using for the shitty ducting.

Temperatures! not amazing really, gpu temp has maxed at 82 degrees and I've not 100% used it (92% apparently so far) - payday 2 hammers GPU, I'm waiting for it to update at the moment and I can test the setup. If it's really poo, I'll try and fit more plastic to the back of the gpu and force more air in, but if it stays under 90 I'll be happy for now I guess.

It also didn't look quite as dusty by eye...

Rorschach, I'm powering the bottom fans with one of these http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/321122344060 (and a spare Y splitter that came with one of the brown fans)
 
whiteface said:
Twin Frozr III gutted, noctua packaging cut into ghetto ducting and the nf-s12a+sp120l fans switched around: https://i.imgur.com/8AptNAe.jpg - had to leave the fan mounts in blocking some of the airflow, as they had the actual thread for the screws I'm using for the shitty ducting.

Temperatures! not amazing really, gpu temp has maxed at 82 degrees and I've not 100% used it (92% apparently so far) - payday 2 hammers GPU, I'm waiting for it to update at the moment and I can test the setup. If it's really poo, I'll try and fit more plastic to the back of the gpu and force more air in, but if it stays under 90 I'll be happy for now I guess.

It also didn't look quite as dusty by eye...

Rorschach, I'm powering the bottom fans with one of these http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/321122344060 (and a spare Y splitter that came with one of the brown fans)
Click to expand...

Here's the mod I did: https://i.imgur.com/6E9NIqF.jpg
1. SP120L fans elevated by fan silencers.
2. Duct tape over areas where heatsink is not present
3. Mutilated the sides of the heatsink for Powercolor PCS+ r9 290 because I ripped out some extending metal that was originally used to screw in the shroud. They were in the way of my fans.
4. Fans are doing exhaust to dump the heat directly outside.
5. Looks dusty but I filtered the other three intakes (2 fans at side, 1 fan on back)
 
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