NCASE M1: a crowdfunded Mini-ITX case (updates in first post)

sYaKcvq.jpg


This is how im gonna arrange my ramsink. Hope there is enough room for ddc pump+phobya top. Else, i need to re-arange the ramsink.

My case arrived, but in the post-office. I have to pick it up on Monday. SFX-600G psu also arrived. Will start building on Friday.
 
Alright guys, lets say i wanted to use a atx power supply to gain better accoustics. Since i heard most people describe the sx-600 as somewhat noisy, i was thinking about going this route. What i was wondering is, is there a way using a full-length gpu with a modular atx-psu, if you are able to put the graphics card in the third pci slot? Like by using a two-slot micro-atx board like this one: http://www.ecs.com.tw/ECSWebSite/Pr...oryID=1&DetailName=Feature&MenuID=172&LanID=0 ?

Share your thoughts!
 
While it is possible if you get a short ATX PSU, you are losing a lot of good features on the motherboard to make up for the PSU noise which is described as being hard to hear above other fans, especially a GPU.

The motherboard though has no USB 3.0 header so you'll need a converter to USB 2.0 if you want to use the front USB ports. The board has a VIA sound chip, which almost no manufacturer today uses (mostly Realtek ALC1150 or 892). The Realtek Gbit Network controller is also a large negative in my book, I've had plenty of issues with those.
 
Yeah, especially that usb 2.0 header on the board is a huge letdown. really a shame that all elitegroup boards seem to be somewhat budget style components. They have some awesome form factors or really exotic port/layout combinations, but those components seem to lack quality.

However, are there any other boards with a similar form factor, especially the lowered PCI slot? All i can find are boards with the PCI-slot in the same position as found on mini-itx boards, but that wont lower the GPU to the third bracket/slot in the NCase.
 
Zurec said:
Since i heard most people describe the sx-600 as somewhat noisy, i was thinking about going this route
Click to expand...

You might also want to look a little deeper into this. The discussion of the supply in the dedicated thread are mostly people trying very hard to describe what are essentially some odd noises (like the clicking of the fan when it is around it's starting voltage), but almost across the board, when asked, they confirm that it is not a loud noise.

To quote the SPCR review conclusion: "This sample produced virtually no audible electronic noise under ~200W. Above that power level, any rise in electronic noise is masked by the broadband fan noise. In comparison with ATX PSUs of the same power rating, the small SX600-G runs louder at mid & higher power level, though its subjective volume is still moderate; this is the price you pay for for high power in a small package."

It may still be too noisy for your preferences/setup, but I'm not sure that "most people describe it as somewhat noisy" is all that accurate.

Depending on your patience and power requirements, you might also consider holding out for the SFX-L 500W model (certified a month after the 600W, but still no press release/ETA/forum-announcements-by-Tony to go on), with the caveat that we're still not sure exactly how well it will fit in the M1 with a full length graphics card. I'm not sure if I'm remembering Necere's estimation accurately, but I believe it was along the lines of "if it fits, it's gonna be tight".
 
Thank you for this very informative reply. I checked the sx-600 thread, and its those clicking/buzzing noises im afraid of. What i'm trying to do is building a powerful yet quiet gaming system. Thats also the reason being i scrapped the idea of using a h220 to cool both gpu and cpu, because the pump will most likely be the loudest part in the build. But then again, i've never heard the h220 in person, and neither did i with the sx-600. maybe im a bit overreacting?

At the moment im planing on going for a xeon 1231 v3 cooled with a be quiet top flow sr1, 16 gigs of 1866mhz ram, a asrock z87e-itx (going the easy itx-route) or some two-slot dtx/micro-atx board with no drawbacks. If i find one.
For the gpu im trying to get a used gtx 690, since it seems to have the best fps/$ on the high-end gpu market.
And the sx-600, maybe i need to hear it in person to decide if i can live with the sound.
 
Zurec said:
Thank you for this very informative reply. I checked the sx-600 thread, and its those clicking/buzzing noises im afraid of. What i'm trying to do is building a powerful yet quiet gaming system. Thats also the reason being i scrapped the idea of using a h220 to cool both gpu and cpu, because the pump will most likely be the loudest part in the build. But then again, i've never heard the h220 in person, and neither did i with the sx-600. maybe im a bit overreacting?

At the moment im planing on going for a xeon 1231 v3 cooled with a be quiet top flow sr1, 16 gigs of 1866mhz ram, a asrock z87e-itx (going the easy itx-route) or some two-slot dtx/micro-atx board with no drawbacks. If i find one.
For the gpu im trying to get a used gtx 690, since it seems to have the best fps/$ on the high-end gpu market.
And the sx-600, maybe i need to hear it in person to decide if i can live with the sound.
Click to expand...

If you are not watercooling the GPU, that will be the loudest component in your rig while gaming.
 
Most definitely, especially with a dual-gpu card like the gtx 690. However, many other more silent fans/ noise emitters will build up, and im trying to go with as few, large and silent fans as possible. I plan to put in be quiet fans wherever possible. Or are there even more quiet options?

On the other hand, will a copletly watercooled (h220) setup be more quiet than an aircooled one? It will definitely run cooler, but most pumps are noisier than the fans, atleast thats what i heard.
 
Zurec said:
Most definitely, especially with a dual-gpu card like the gtx 690. However, many other more silent fans/ noise emitters will build up, and im trying to go with as few, large and silent fans as possible. I plan to put in be quiet fans wherever possible. Or are there even more quiet options?

On the other hand, will a copletly watercooled (h220) setup be more quiet than an aircooled one? It will definitely run cooler, but most pumps are noisier than the fans, atleast thats what i heard.
Click to expand...

Indeed. With small cases, adding more fans is often adding noise for little cooling benefit. A single 120mm fan can, in principle, move air equal to the whole volume of the case several times a second. But with fans, silent often means lower rpm. BeQuiet can be a good choice, depending which model (e.g. http://www.hardware.fr/articles/874-35/recapitulatif-db-a-vs-cfm.html)

There's some truth in the "pumps are noisy" thing, because most AIO coolers have the pump bolted to the motherboard which is bolted to the case, so the whole case vibrates with it. However, if you keep the speed of the H220 pump slow then it's reasonable noise. For a simple CPU+GPU loop it provides enough turbulence at minimum speed. And being PWM you can get it down to 20% duty cycle at idle. I generally use the Apogee Drive II which is similar to H220 and I can't hear those at 30% even.

AIO pumps also suffer from noise from air bubbles in the coolant. With H220 you have some control over this, since you can top it up with distilled water, unlike closed-loop coolers. Swiftech has a video explaining how to do this.
 
ruffstuff said:
sYaKcvq.jpg


This is how im gonna arrange my ramsink. Hope there is enough room for ddc pump+phobya top. Else, i need to re-arange the ramsink.

My case arrived, but in the post-office. I have to pick it up on Monday. SFX-600G psu also arrived. Will start building on Friday.
Click to expand...

What kind of heatsink is that for the vram?
 
Didn't see any photos of a case with H75 and two fans in push 'n pull, so here's a couple of photos of my current build.
XYersFGl.jpg

pcQSL8zl.jpg


CPU(2600k 3.4Ghz) temps are idling just below 30C, fans are running at 1200 RPM.
During gaming temps are around 40C.

Thank you guys for an excellent case!
 
icc0rz said:
Didn't see any photos of a case with H75 and two fans in push 'n pull, so here's a couple of photos of my current build.
XYersFGl.jpg
Click to expand...
Is that a modular ATX PSU? How is that working out with the reference AMD GPU? It looks like it's pushing down on the card.
 
icc0rz said:
Didn't see any photos of a case with H75 and two fans in push 'n pull, so here's a couple of photos of my current build.
XYersFGl.jpg

pcQSL8zl.jpg


CPU(2600k 3.4Ghz) temps are idling just below 30C, fans are running at 1200 RPM.
During gaming temps are around 40C.

Thank you guys for an excellent case!
Click to expand...

What PSU and what GPU? Clearance on them?
 
Motaa said:
What PSU and what GPU? Clearance on them?
Click to expand...

It's an old PSU called MIST 650W, perhaps a rebrand of some sort. The GPU is a 6950 from XFX with the reference cooler.
Actually the cables for the MB comes out beneath the gpu and there are two modular 12V plugs that sits just above the gpu, i.e. they wrap just fine around the card.

P6026547.jpg


As you can see, the rest of the modular plugs are at the very front of the PSU, so a few mm shorter gpu or a slight tilt to the PSU would make them available too.

Planning to get one of the next gen GPUs when they become available, and perhaps a SFX PSU and Corsair HG10. We'll see, very happy with my current build.
 
Okay so I have the ASROCK B75M-ITX, which isn't a motherboard I've ever seen mentioned around here. Here is a picture of the layout.

B75M-ITX(m).jpg


What is a quiet cooler that will fit? I can't overclock, and I'm using the 3570, so it won't need to be heavy duty.
 
@ David164v8

I have a MSI B75IA-E33 which is exactly the same layout as yours.
I use a Thermarlight AXP-100R with a Noiseblocker B12-P with great results for my 2700k @ stock - 30 degrees idle / 55 degrees in gaming.
The great thing about that heatsink is that is also compatible with a center socket mobo like the Impacts etc if you will change it in the future and you can use any 120 mm or 140 mm fans you want via it's adaptable plate.

http://imgur.com/vLi3vmc

http://imgur.com/YetauPQ

http://imgur.com/ZVJEywA

The only thing to be careful is to use ram with no heatsinks or VLP.
Slot 1 will touch the heatsink. I removed mine.

http://imgur.com/JR74bTn
 
Rorschach said:
@ David164v8

I have a MSI B75IA-E33 which is exactly the same layout as yours.
I use a Thermarlight AXP-100R with a Noiseblocker B12-P with great results for my 2700k @ stock - 30 degrees idle / 55 degrees in gaming.
The great thing about that heatsink is that is also compatible with a center socket mobo like the Impacts etc if you will change it in the future and you can use any 120 mm or 140 mm fans you want via it's adaptable plate.

http://imgur.com/vLi3vmc

http://imgur.com/YetauPQ

http://imgur.com/ZVJEywA

The only thing to be careful is to use ram with no heatsinks or VLP.
Slot 1 will touch the heatsink. I removed mine.

http://imgur.com/JR74bTn
Click to expand...

Thanks for the pictures, this looks like a good choice. The layout between the two boards really is almost identical. I have a spare Corsair SP120, which should be a good choice to replace the slim fan. Here in the UK I can only find the "AXP-100", but looking at specs they seem the same.

My ram is some Corsair Vengeance LP, which should fit by default right? If not I can remove the heatsink like you did.

Has anyone else got suggestions? I'm waiting until tonight to order, but as it stands the AXP-100 seems like a good choice.
 
My pleasure.
Ah yes, R is for Red for the fan, then virtually identical with the olive/green standard.
Avoid the Muscle version it does not ship with the adjustable plate and no PWM for its fan.
So it's cheaper because of this.

Those Corsairs VLP i think they are shorter than mine - Crucial Tactical Tracers.
I will try to find some numbers for the height of mine.

Other option if you keep this mobo for a long time and want to go even bigger, then have the AXP-200 version.
Same deal but it will cool the entire motherboard with this socket orientation.
And there is no worry with the rams anymore.

http://imgur.com/SlyNq9L

http://home.coolpc.com.tw/koli/open/Thermalright_AXP-200/coolpc_Thermalright_AXP-200_10.jpg

Here i think they compare both 100 and 200.

http://www.coolpc.com.tw/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=72&t=119727

And there's this one as, the same as AXP-200

http://www.cryorig.com/c1.php

I searched a lot and the AXP-100 was my solution for my needs.
The Noctua L9i is too small.
I didn't get the AXP-200 or Cryorig because i wanted to use it in the future on an Asus Impact for example and with these big ones in the Ncase you have to use an ATX psu (not sfx)

http://imgur.com/Mcw1iU9

So yeah, it depends on what you need.
 
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Thanks very much,just bought the AXP-100 of Amazon. The Corsair RAM does seem a little shorter, hopefully I won't have any problems.
 
Rorschach said:
Those Corsairs VLP i think they are shorter than mine - Crucial Tactical Tracers.
Click to expand...
Just a heads-up for people reading: Crucial has "VLP" memory which stands for Very Low Profile, the generally associated accronym. The Corsair Vengeance Low Profile is just regular RAM with a very minimal heatsink, these days called "Low Profile" or LP like these:

Corsair-Vengeance-LP.jpg


VLP memory is usually regarded as these memory kits:

PCF276.w_rev5.memory-623-80.jpg



Overview shot:

normal_CrucitalBallistixSportVLP_007.jpg

Extremely and unnecessary high heatsink RAM
Normal height heatsink RAM
Low Profile RAM without heatsinks
Very Low Profile RAM
 
Added some 3 slots m-atx boards to the google docs page yesterday :)
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...mJWMjZYSXJvNWNOVzJkdkJPTWc&usp=sharing#gid=26

Still haven't figured out what to do with my M1 lols, with each setup I consider there's something holding me back :p
So far the ones like the asus impact and the other ones with better onboard sound got my attention, was looking at the m-atx with 3 slots as alternative but it's barely worth the trouble; I want an Intel ethernet chipset and they're somewhat rare with these motherboards.

Right now the asrock Z97E-ITX offers the best package for my wishes... pretty nice board for most of us I suppose :)
 
Phuncz said:
Overview shot:

normal_CrucitalBallistixSportVLP_007.jpg

Extremely and unnecessary high heatsink RAM
Normal height heatsink RAM
Low Profile RAM without heatsinks
Very Low Profile RAM
Click to expand...

There is also however you want to categorize the Tactical LP; categorized by Crucial as "Low Profile", even though it has the same height PCB as the VLP RAM. Since it uses a heatsink similar to what Phuncz lists as "Normal height heatsink RAM", it ends up being about the same height as the Low Profile RAM without heatsinks. And for anyone who has to have VLP due to clearance, and black PCB for aesthetics, this is pretty much the only show in town.
 
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Remember that unless you are performing some truly obscene RAM overclocking without any airflow over the motherboard, heatspreaders for RAM are superflous. Removing them may void your warranty, but it won't affect stability.
 
Alright

So I have finally pressed my checkout button on frozencpu & performance-pcs for my w/c loop

As it ships I have an idea of how it will look like, however I'm not too sure about the inlet & outlet ports on the Apogee Drive II

Attached is how I think it should be..

 
The sequence doesn't really matter that much. You'd better focus on having shorter tubing without sharp bends and ease of install.
 
sashi said:
I'm not too sure about the inlet & outlet ports on the Apogee Drive II
Click to expand...

The IN port is marked clearly on the AD2

Ideally you want the pump connected directly from the reservoir. Especially if it's your first time priming a DDC, I recommend testing with a short loop (pump+res+rad) outside the case. This way you can learn a bit how it works without needing to undo your whole installation if there's an issue.

Hold the res above the pump when you start it the first time. For the first few seconds of operation, the inlet must get an adequate amount of water, using gravity to feed. This is because, if it only gets air, then the pump impeller spins in place and can be damaged from heat of friction. Once the pump is totally filled with water, then it will operate normally.

A good tip is to squeeze tubes to push some water into the pump before you prime it.
 
WiSK said:
The IN port is marked clearly on the AD2

Ideally you want the pump connected directly from the reservoir. Especially if it's your first time priming a DDC, I recommend testing with a short loop (pump+res+rad) outside the case. This way you can learn a bit how it works without needing to undo your whole installation if there's an issue.

Hold the res above the pump when you start it the first time. For the first few seconds of operation, the inlet must get an adequate amount of water, using gravity to feed. This is because, if it only gets air, then the pump impeller spins in place and can be damaged from heat of friction. Once the pump is totally filled with water, then it will operate normally.

A good tip is to squeeze tubes to push some water into the pump before you prime it.
Click to expand...

Thanks! So does that mean I should have my AD2 IN > res? Instead of my AD2 IN > GPU?
 
sashi said:
Thanks! So does that mean I should have my AD2 IN > res? Instead of my AD2 IN > GPU?
Click to expand...

Yes

I think you have to stand back and look at the picture you drew :)

If you pour water into the reservoir - will that reach the pump? No because the pump is higher than the reservoir.

What if you have the case on its right side when you fill? The motherboard will be flat on the floor and the ports of the AD2 are pointing upward. The reservoir is higher than the ports. So if you fill the res the pump will get liquid. But! What about the other components, they are higher than the res now, so they won't be filled.

Then the best is to have the case on its face. The reservoir is then the highest point of everything and when you pour, everything should fill up. Then squeeze the tubes to dislodge any stuck bubbles before turning the pump on.

YMMV :)

Here's a good example http://i.imgur.com/2pdrZla.jpg if he puts the case face-down and has the radiator unmounted and resting on the floor, then everything pours smoothly and just a squeeze or two for air in the GPU block.
 
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WiSK said:
Yes

I think you have to stand back and look at the picture you drew :)

If you pour water into the reservoir - will that reach the pump? No because the pump is higher than the reservoir.

What if you have the case on its right side when you fill? The motherboard will be flat on the floor and the ports of the AD2 are pointing upward. The reservoir is higher than the ports. So if you fill the res the pump will get liquid. But! What about the other components, they are higher than the res now, so they won't be filled.

Then the best is to have the case on its face. The reservoir is then the highest point of everything and when you pour, everything should fill up. Then squeeze the tubes to dislodge any stuck bubbles before turning the pump on.

YMMV :)

Here's a good example http://i.imgur.com/2pdrZla.jpg if he puts the case face-down and has the radiator unmounted and resting on the floor, then everything pours smoothly and just a squeeze or two for air in the GPU block.
Click to expand...

Omg so confusing but thanks!

I was just following overrated build haha
 
The SX600-G is available for order on Amazon. I've been hoping it would be back in stock before I got my case.
 
Can the ST30 rad be mounted in both ways, with its ports either on front or on the back of the case?
I would prefer having them on the back, with fans in pull, but can not find a pic to confirm it fits.
 
Hi, I would like to know if it's possible to buy some spare parts in advance:
1. Power cable inside the case, connected to the PSU: ST30S-F is what I have in my built. With this PSU this power cable is very tight and I think it's a bit twisted due to the very short distance to the front wall case. I see there are some 90 degree power cables but the height is over the distance between the top panel and PSU:(
2. Front audio module: Sometimes it's shaking though I check the screws already. I'm a heavy headphone user so I don't want to see someday it's broken and I don't have it to replace it:)
TKS
 
I would be interested in a spare front panel connector box as well. I have plans to anodize it but would prefer to have a black one on hand as well.
 
BaK2BaK said:
Can the ST30 rad be mounted in both ways, with its ports either on front or on the back of the case?
I would prefer having them on the back, with fans in pull, but can not find a pic to confirm it fits.
Click to expand...
Most rads that fit in the case will fit either way. With some longer rads (like the H220's), having the ports at the front might prevent a 2.5" drive from being installed there, but this shouldn't be an issue with the ST30.

icq99a said:
Hi, I would like to know if it's possible to buy some spare parts in advance:
1. Power cable inside the case, connected to the PSU: ST30S-F is what I have in my built. With this PSU this power cable is very tight and I think it's a bit twisted due to the very short distance to the front wall case. I see there are some 90 degree power cables but the height is over the distance between the top panel and PSU:(
Click to expand...
We ordered extra power cables, both left and right angle versions. Email W360 if you want to order one. V2 came with the left-angle version, so you probably want the right-angle version for use with that PSU.


icq99a said:
2. Front audio module: Sometimes it's shaking though I check the screws already. I'm a heavy headphone user so I don't want to see someday it's broken and I don't have it to replace it:)
Click to expand...

JaccoW said:
I would be interested in a spare front panel connector box as well. I have plans to anodize it but would prefer to have a black one on hand as well.
Click to expand...
We don't have extra front audio/USB ports, I'm afraid.
 
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