NCASE M1: a crowdfunded Mini-ITX case (updates in first post)

Screes

Limp Gawd
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Necere: can you tell me a few measurements?

With waterblock on GPU, distance from bottom of case to waterblock.

You stated once you had to get a low profile psu plug that only came in a single orientation. Do you know the thickness added from the standard plug available in both orientations?
 

justcme

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Necere: can you tell me a few measurements?

With waterblock on GPU, distance from bottom of case to waterblock.

You stated once you had to get a low profile psu plug that only came in a single orientation. Do you know the thickness added from the standard plug available in both orientations?

This should hopefully give you an idea.
 

Phuncz

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Necere, what do you think about this card at the bottom with no extra fans ? It's a Gainward GTX 770 Phantom:
http://www.fudzilla.com/home/item/3...26-gainward-gtx-770-phantom-reviewed?start=14

gtx770phantom1.jpg


videoout.jpg


powerin.jpg


gtx770phantom3.jpg


phantomcooler2.jpg


In combination with two 120mm fans blowing outward on the sidepanel, with a Noctua NH-C14 and and 92mm fan blowing inward. I'll probably be giving the PSU it's own air through the right side. No overclocking on CPU or GPU.

I'm asking this because it seems like a decent GPU cooler with the pull-configuration on the fans and with the almost 3-slot thickness, it would be able to pull fresh air from the bottom and have it exit by the CPU exhaust.
 

Screes

Limp Gawd
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Exhaust fans are overrated. Cool air intake straight onto your hot components and hot air will figure its way out someplace.
 

Phuncz

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If I want bad advice, I know I should ask you. If you've read the last few pages and actually would have any decent experience, you'd know that just isn't how it works.
 

SithSolo1

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Necere, what do you think about this card at the bottom with no extra fans ? It's a Gainward GTX 770 Phantom:
http://www.fudzilla.com/home/item/3...26-gainward-gtx-770-phantom-reviewed?start=14

gtx770phantom1.jpg


*snip*

I'm asking this because it seems like a decent GPU cooler with the pull-configuration on the fans and with the almost 3-slot thickness, it would be able to pull fresh air from the bottom and have it exit by the CPU exhaust.

I think it should fit. The card itself is just under 10.8" and only uses about 2.5 slots. According to the front page you can fit up to 11" in the third slot however the fit may be tight.

As far as cooling I don't think it will be bad though the upper portion of the case may run warmer.
 
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geofelt

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I don't see the advantage of this cooler in the M1 case.
Looks cool?
There is no real performance or price advantage over a stock GTX770 card.
The blower type cooler would seem to me to be a better fit for the M1.
 

illli

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advantage is probably that it is quieter than stock blower. i say probably b/c i have not read any reviews about it. but i know some 3rd party coolers, like the ones asus makes, are very quiet and do a better job at cooling than stock. in this specific case... i can't really say.
 

SithSolo1

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I don't see the advantage of this cooler in the M1 case.
Looks cool?
There is no real performance or price advantage over a stock GTX770 card.
The blower type cooler would seem to me to be a better fit for the M1.

The biggest issue is that only two companies are actually making blower style 770s:

Evga has a few but they are the basic, non-Titan coolers.
Inno3D is making one which appears to be the only 770 with a reference design Titan cooler.


Outside of those few cards all other GTX 770 coolers are open-air and Gainward looks to have one of the beefier options. They also run cooler and are much quieter which is important to some users. As noted though everything else in the case runs warmer as a result.

It all comes down to personal build preference and goals.


***Edit***
Looks like PNY also has a blower style card.
 
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Phuncz

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Exactly the problem. For some reason, almost no brand seems to release the reference cooler except Inno3D. I think it's price-related.
 

rumartinez89

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I think it should fit. The card itself is just under 10.8" and only uses about 2.5 slots. According to the front page you can fit up to 11" in the third slot however the fit may be tight.

As far as cooling I don't think it will be bad though the upper portion of the case may run warmer.

Was thinking about going with nvidia for this cooler alone next round. Something about it, even my girlfriend likes it. She thinks its cute.
Might be the sleek look which i personally think goes well with the M1 design. I know Gainward doesnt sell in the US but Sparkle does have one that looks fairly similar.
 

Dephcon

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Exactly the problem. For some reason, almost no brand seems to release the reference cooler except Inno3D. I think it's price-related.

EVGA has a full range of cards with blowers, come to the green team! :D
 

Phuncz

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It will depend on the price. I'd like a reference cooler design, but the EVGA one is also very nice as it seems to be entirely encased meaning the air MUST escape out the back.
 

faugusztin

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advantage is probably that it is quieter than stock blower.

If it has similar 3x 8cm thin fans as the GTX570 Phantom, then no, it is not quieter, it is much more noisy (imagine three 8cm fans running at 2400RPM or more).
 

*Daedalus

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Versus one 40mm fan? It will be extremely quiet, far quieter than the stock card. The whole idea is that more larger fans will spin much slower than a single small fan to move the same amount of air. That's computer building 101 type stuff.
 

wreckem

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I don't see the advantage of this cooler in the M1 case.
Looks cool?
There is no real performance or price advantage over a stock GTX770 card.
The blower type cooler would seem to me to be a better fit for the M1.

The issue is, the reference 770 and its high quality blower/cooling system(the same as the Titan and 780) isn't supposed to be making an appearance in the US. Instead you have 770s with 3rd party blowers which are crappier than the reference blower or 770 with non blower cooling. I guess those in the US can have the Inno3d 770 imported but thats is just going to add to the cost.

Personally I would take an open air/non blower cooler over a PNY or EVGA third party cooler. Inno3d is cost prohibitive because of international shipping plus import fees.
 
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mesasone

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Do you think it'd be possible to fit a 120mm rad and 120mm fan on the bottom of the case if you went with a waterblock on the GPU?
 

wreckem

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If that's anything like the cooler on my PNY GTX 670, I'd recommend taking a pass on it. Noisy, and not particularly effective. Or rather, particularly UNeffective.

Anyway, I was under the impression the M1 was going to ship with decals so everybody could decide where, and if, they wanted the decal to be?

It apparently is using the reference cooler from the 680. So not terrible but certainly no titan cooler. Would still take open air over the 680 reference cooler.
 
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This thermal test? I don't seem to see the picture you're talking about... I want to know if you could mount something like an H60 below the GPU, in the bottom of the case, towards the front.
 

crazjayz

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This thermal test? I don't seem to see the picture you're talking about... I want to know if you could mount something like an H60 below the GPU, in the bottom of the case, towards the front.

It would be very tight. Fan height is 25mm, rad thickness is 27mm. You have about 40-50mm to work with, give or take. I don't know how much thinner a GPU waterblock would make it. If the GPU + waterblock was thinner than a single slot GPU, then you've got a shot. Otherwise, it's going to be pressed right up against the waterblock, possibly even bending it up.
 

Screes

Limp Gawd
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Necere: If I was only going to use a single SSD on the front inside panel location with the Asus motherboard your testing with, what would be the most ideal SATA cable length and connectors?
 
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Thanks for the info! Also thanks to Screes for that post with the screenshots. I'm still debating between doing something like this with my SG08, or getting the NCASE M1. The thermal performance with the H220 CPU+GPU loop was fairly disappointing. :/ I'd be using a universal waterblock on my GPU so I could fit that 120mm rad at the bottom, but those slim fans just don't move much air...
 

Screes

Limp Gawd
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Thanks for the info! Also thanks to Screes for that post with the screenshots. I'm still debating between doing something like this with my SG08, or getting the NCASE M1. The thermal performance with the H220 CPU+GPU loop was fairly disappointing. :/ I'd be using a universal waterblock on my GPU so I could fit that 120mm rad at the bottom, but those slim fans just don't move much air...

To be fair, his setup is using dual 140mm radiator with 4x fans in push/pull configuration.

The NCase M1 used a dual 120mm radiator with 2x fans.

Also the SG08 is a larger case.
 

Necere

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I also prefer small embossed or etched logo on bottom... Like antec makes -> http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/3121/cvbgn.jpg
That looks stamped. Don't think that would turn out well with 1.5mm aluminum. There's not really a corner for the logo to occupy anyway (the angled front makes it awkward).

Necere: can you tell me a few measurements?

With waterblock on GPU, distance from bottom of case to waterblock.
With this particular Alphacool block: ~51mm to the waterblock face, ~43 to the socket plugs. It will vary from block to block, though.

You stated once you had to get a low profile psu plug that only came in a single orientation. Do you know the thickness added from the standard plug available in both orientations?
Well, I don't have the plug itself, but I have the drawing for Lian Li's standard angled connector. AFAICT, It should project 25.5mm from the PSU inlet (which itself rises about 3mm from the face of the PSU). The angle connector we're using projects ~13mm. We have a total of ~18mm available for the plug until you hit the top panel.

Necere, what do you think about this card at the bottom with no extra fans ? It's a Gainward GTX 770 Phantom:
http://www.fudzilla.com/home/item/3...26-gainward-gtx-770-phantom-reviewed?start=14

...

In combination with two 120mm fans blowing outward on the sidepanel, with a Noctua NH-C14 and and 92mm fan blowing inward. I'll probably be giving the PSU it's own air through the right side. No overclocking on CPU or GPU.

I'm asking this because it seems like a decent GPU cooler with the pull-configuration on the fans and with the almost 3-slot thickness, it would be able to pull fresh air from the bottom and have it exit by the CPU exhaust.
It should fit. Using shrouds below the card like I talked about a few pages back may help channel airflow.

As with any non-blower cooler, all the warm air goes inside the case, and wherever it passes through to get out is going to pick up and retain heat. Obviously, it's going to be hotter the more power-hungry the card and application used, and it's only an issue if it will bother you. Under moderate loads and especially with lower power cards it's not that big a deal IMO.

Necere: If I was only going to use a single SSD on the front inside panel location with the Asus motherboard your testing with, what would be the most ideal SATA cable length and connectors?
10-12", straight at both ends. Edit: actually 8" is what I'm using. It's the shortest that will fit.
 
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hdale85

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I'm really considering a SFF build for my next desktop based on a 4670k or 4770k with a GTX 780 and I'm really loving the looks of this case! And the price is pretty dang good too if you can keep it at that point.

Personally I like the etched logo.
 

Lord_Vale3

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For those considering using the third PCI slot for a soundcard and are thinking about how to get one of those ribbon cable slot extenders to the actual slot, one of Asrocks new Haswell boards has a mini-PCI-E on the bottom of the board: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157374&IsVirtualParent=1

I just wonder how easy it would be to turn the cable around underneath the board to route it to the third slot...
 

Lord_Vale3

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Oh, indeed it does. I wonder just how much nicer ALC1150 is supposed to be compared to the usual onboard audio experience. For me its looking like either this asrock board or the socket 1150 version of the awesome Asus board

Heck maybe I'll try both :) A family member just asked me about building her a really small new PC like a day after I found this project, and after reading through the thread and doing research for her build now I want one for myself.

This is looking really awesome
 
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If the integrated audio is important to you, I think the two best choices are going to be either the EVGA Stinger board, which has Creative Core3D, or the rumored ASUS ROG mITX board that supposedly they're announcing on Tuesday, which most likely would have SupremeFX. Both of those solutions are definitely going to be better than the Realtek one.

Personally I think the EVGA board would look pretty cool in the M1, but I don't know if EVGA has gotten their BIOS act together, because the z77 boards had quite a few issues.
 

kevral

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ASUS ROG mITX board that supposedly they're announcing on Tuesday, which most likely would have SupremeFX. Both of those solutions are definitely going to be better than the Realtek one.
Did Asus change their approach?
The SupremeFX that I had last time was nothing more than a software-enhanced Realtek.
 

Diverge

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EVGA Stinger should be avoided until proven that their bios isn't complete garbage again. As a buyer of their Z77 itx, i'm just warning anyone not to be a pioneer with their boards unless you don't mind huge headaches, and very slow development. Look at their forums, they are notorious for garbage bioses.
 

Jomanscool2

Limp Gawd
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With Haswell shipping I'm even more excited for the KS/Indiegogo for production. Can't wait to rebuild!
 

Phuncz

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I'll be getting the Asrock Z87E-ITX myself, it seems to be loaded with all the goodies I want: Intel Gbit NIC, 802.11ac, mSATA-600, Realtek ALC1150 with TI NE5532 headphone Amp and optical, decent placement of headers and components.
 
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