NCASE M1: a crowdfunded Mini-ITX case (updates in first post)

Hermit2001

Weaksauce
Joined
Aug 25, 2015
Messages
116
Looks very good. I like the proportions of the window and the surrounding metal.
Thanks, for those interested it is a 250mm x 50mm window (5mm radius on corners). I positioned it in line with the ventilation holes above (so spacings of 35mm to rear of panel and 30mm to front, the bottom of the slot is 25mm from the bottom of the panel).

The perspex I've ordered is clear extruded perspex sheet (3mm thick) from Cut Plastic Sheeting - Order Cut To Size Plastic In Seconds . Final dimensions will be: 270mm x 70mm x 3mm as they don't cut dimensions less than 100mm. There should then be 10mm overlap on all sides for an adhesive like silicone sealant.
 

No Hands 55

Limp Gawd
Joined
Nov 4, 2014
Messages
179
Thanks, for those interested it is a 250mm x 50mm window (5mm radius on corners). I positioned it in line with the ventilation holes above (so spacings of 35mm to rear of panel and 30mm to front, the bottom of the slot is 25mm from the bottom of the panel).

The perspex I've ordered is clear extruded perspex sheet (3mm thick) from Cut Plastic Sheeting - Order Cut To Size Plastic In Seconds . Final dimensions will be: 270mm x 70mm x 3mm as they don't cut dimensions less than 100mm. There should then be 10mm overlap on all sides for an adhesive like silicone sealant.

You should look into making it flush, I did it on an xbox a while ago and it was really difficult, but it was by hand. But man it looked great. I think it would really compliment the cleanliness of the cutout, and can usually be applied by just having the window be slightly larger than the window so it will be held in by pressure.



And is $50 for a NH-C14 a good deal? I might buy one used and see if i can make some spacers to fit the hdd cage with the c14, and if not ill sell it. but I am wondering if I should get the price down lower?
 
Last edited:

MarkRWatts

n00b
Joined
Jan 11, 2016
Messages
17
Hi all,

I thought I'd share with you my new build based on the M1:

IMG_0917-001.JPG


This picture was taken while I was bleeding the loop after first filling (as you can see by the paper towels).
Obviously I don't run it sat on a towel normally ;)

Main components are a i5-6600K and a GTX970 along with a Samsung 950 Pro M.2 SSD and 16GB of Corsair LPX.
I'm running EK waterblocks throughout along with an EK CoolStream SE 240 slim radiator in the bottom with a pair of Silverstone 15mm fans pushing air down through the radiator.
The pump/res is the EK XRES Revo 100, mounted on a piece of aluminium cut to size.
The fan at the rear is a 92mm Noiseblocker NB-BlackSilent Pro PE-P acting as intake.

Loop order is Res/pump -> Rad -> GPU -> CPU although I understand that it doesn't make that much difference.

After around 30-45 minutes of gaming (Rise of the Tomb Raider @ 1440p, High quality) I see the following temperatures:

CPU = 55C
GPU = 71C
Coolant = 57C (measured with a cheap digital sugar thermometer stuck in the fill port on the top of the reservoir)
Ambient = 22C (measured with the same thermometer stuck in the coolant before the system was first powered on today)

While I understand that the CPU/GPU temperatures are well within tolerance for those devices, the temperature of the water seems to be rather high.
There's certainly a lot of heat coming out of the bottom of the case so the loop is working.

I'm using the Asus FanXpert software to control everything, based on CPU temperature although I pretty much ramp up the radiator fans to 100% by the time the CPU is at 55C.
I'm also not convinced that the rear intake fan is actually serving any useful function even at full speed; none of the temperatures seem to change regardless of whether it's on or off.

I have couple of questions;

1. Are these temperatures, particularly the coolant temperature, anything to worry about?
2. Am I likely to damage (or melt) anything running things as they are for hours at a time?
3. I believe I can fit a 92mm BlackIce radiator with either the current fan or a slim Noctua NF-A9x14. Would this make a drastic difference to any of the temperatures?
4. Is there anything else I can do to improve things?


Any advice of suggestions are welcome :)
 

Hanakuso

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Mar 3, 2011
Messages
1,463
And is $50 for a NH-C14 a good deal? I might buy one used and see if i can make some spacers to fit the hdd cage with the c14, and if not ill sell it. but I am wondering if I should get the price down lower?
I'd say $40 is a good price, but $50 if you can't wait is decent.

Got links, item numbers or something? I can never find anything on those sites. Definitely interested in an alternative source in case I don't hear back from the ncase folks.
Best way to find it is go to mcmaster carr, then screws & bolts, then machine screws, then under features, click the "sealing". After that just filter out the sizes you want. Only bad thing is these specific screws don't come in black like the Lian Li ones.


There's also Pro-bolt, which specializes in race car nuts and bolts. They have titanium, aluminum, and stainless steel bolts in many colors. Only problem is that the compatible sizes are very limited when it comes to the Ncase.
Titanium, Stainless Steel, Aluminium Fasteners & Motorcycle Bolts | ProBolt
 

yoyo0221

Limp Gawd
Joined
Feb 6, 2015
Messages
458
....
EK CoolStream SE 240 slim radiator in the bottom with a pair of Silverstone 15mm fans pushing air down through the radiator.

After around 30-45 minutes of gaming (Rise of the Tomb Raider @ 1440p, High quality) I see the following temperatures:

CPU = 55C
GPU = 71C
Coolant = 57C (measured with a cheap digital sugar thermometer stuck in the fill port on the top of the reservoir)
Ambient = 22C (measured with the same thermometer stuck in the coolant before the system was first powered on today)

While I understand that the CPU/GPU temperatures are well within tolerance for those devices, the temperature of the water seems to be rather high.
There's certainly a lot of heat coming out of the bottom of the case so the loop is working.

I'm using the Asus FanXpert software to control everything, based on CPU temperature although I pretty much ramp up the radiator fans to 100% by the time the CPU is at 55C.
I'm also not convinced that the rear intake fan is actually serving any useful function even at full speed; none of the temperatures seem to change regardless of whether it's on or off.

I have couple of questions;

1. Are these temperatures, particularly the coolant temperature, anything to worry about?
2. Am I likely to damage (or melt) anything running things as they are for hours at a time?
3. I believe I can fit a 92mm BlackIce radiator with either the current fan or a slim Noctua NF-A9x14. Would this make a drastic difference to any of the temperatures?
4. Is there anything else I can do to improve things?


Any advice of suggestions are welcome :)

Hey MarkRWatts,

The build looks absolutely amazing. I have a question for you as well but first I'll try to shed some light on the temps if I can.

1.) As far as your current temps I wouldn't worry to much. Those numbers are definitely below anything that could cause long term damage.
2.) I highly doubt it. Again with those temps I don't really see an issue
3.) It may help, but slightly. 120mm or larger is always the way to go. But due to the placement of that particular size radiator you may see a slight drop in temps
4.) Since you're not using soft tubing you wouldn't really be able to throw a 120mm radiator on the side bracket in front of the CPU, so you're best bet may be the 92mm radiator

Now if i could share a bit of my build. I have a 240mm EK Coolstream PE on the side bracket mount. It has two 120mm Noctua Industrial PPC Fans running between 1000-1600rpm.
The Coolstream SE was not out at the time I purchased the PE. Using soft tubing and the Apogee Drive II on the CPU.

CPU Load Temps =49C max
GPU Load Temps =47C max

I don't know if the thicker radiator 37mm vs 26mm makes a big difference, but I'm guessing the fans play a huge factor. That static pressure on 15mm fans are no where near the Noctua's PPC pressure.
Do you have the fans set as pull or push?
Can you post a closeup pic of the radiator and fans on the bottom? I'm looking to see how much clearance there is between graphics card and fans. I'm thinking of adding an additional radiator to the bottom as well.

EdAKoDc.jpg
 

MarkRWatts

n00b
Joined
Jan 11, 2016
Messages
17
Hey MarkRWatts,

The build looks absolutely amazing. I have a question for you as well but first I'll try to shed some light on the temps if I can.

1.) As far as your current temps I wouldn't worry to much. Those numbers are definitely below anything that could cause long term damage.
2.) I highly doubt it. Again with those temps I don't really see an issue
3.) It may help, but slightly. 120mm or larger is always the way to go. But due to the placement of that particular size radiator you may see a slight drop in temps
4.) Since you're not using soft tubing you wouldn't really be able to throw a 120mm radiator on the side bracket in front of the CPU, so you're best bet may be the 92mm radiator

Now if i could share a bit of my build. I have a 240mm EK Coolstream PE on the side bracket mount. It has two 120mm Noctua Industrial PPC Fans running between 1000-1600rpm.
The Coolstream SE was not out at the time I purchased the PE. Using soft tubing and the Apogee Drive II on the CPU.

CPU Load Temps =49C max
GPU Load Temps =47C max

I don't know if the thicker radiator 37mm vs 26mm makes a big difference, but I'm guessing the fans play a huge factor. That static pressure on 15mm fans are no where near the Noctua's PPC pressure.
Do you have the fans set as pull or push?
Can you post a closeup pic of the radiator and fans on the bottom? I'm looking to see how much clearance there is between graphics card and fans. I'm thinking of adding an additional radiator to the bottom as well.

yoyo55, glad you like it :)

My inspiration was this build: NCASE M1 v1 Mini-ITX Build
It seems to use the same EK 240SE radiator although with the PWM version of the 15mm fans (the blue just wouldn't go here) but it also has the 92mm in the back, I assume with the fan on exhaust.

I'm pretty confident that if there was the extra space then using 'proper' static-pressure fans would probably sort things out; the CooleStreamSE is a 22 fpi radiator so the 15mm fans do struggle to get the air moving, particularly in the limited space.
The 92mm would only be 16fpi.
I'm not 100% wedded to using hard tubing but it does make some of the tighter bends have more stability - I didn't use any other fittings but there's no reason I can't switch to soft tubing with the addition of some 90 degree bends, other than the additional cost.

I /could/ redo things to get a conventional 120mm radiator and static-pressure fan in there although I'd have to get rid of that lovely bendy tube from the GPU to the radiator ;)
It's not obvious at first glance whether there would be any difference between the SE and PE variants of the 120mm radiator?
I'd definitely need some 90 degree fittings to give me clearance around the GPU at least - I wonder if there's any issue with mixing soft tubing and hard PETG pipes in the same loop?

The 92mm radiator would certainly look better - I'd always considered adding a window although I wonder whether that would cut off too many air intakes for the lower area.

To answer your question, the rear fan is intake while the 15mm's are exhaust through the floor.

Also, some more pictures!

IMG_0923.JPG

IMG_0924.JPG


As you can see, not a whole lot of space for those poor 15mm's, maybe 8mm at most :(
 

MarkRWatts

n00b
Joined
Jan 11, 2016
Messages
17
So, some back-of-an-envelope calculations suggest that an i5-6600K (96W) with the EVGA GTX970 (170W) draw 266W of power at full load. I have a an inline power meter to plug into the wall so I'll test that out tonight.

I came across this review of the longer EK SE 360 radiator: EK CoolStream SE 360mm Radiator Review - Page 5 of 6 - ExtremeRigs.net
I'm making the assumption that the SE 240 I have is 2/3rds the performance which means I'm looking at a theoretical maximum of around 190W of cooling capacity with fans at 1850rpm, which is barely enough to cool the GPU properly.
Clearly an additional radiator is needed which is probably why other builds using the SE 240 have an additional radiator mounted on the rear.

There are other thin radiators which are more efficient based on that review, which I assume scales down to the 240mm radiators, but the approach I'm going to take is either to add a 92mm BlackIce Micro radiator in the rear or switch to flexible tubing and install another 120mm radiator in front of the CPU on the side bracket. The pump/res blocks using another 240mm radiator.
Even sticking with an EK SE 120 radiator, assuming it's 1/3rd of the performance of the 360, will give me an additional 96W of cooling which happens to match the CPU exactly). I'd also be able to run a more appropriate static-pressure optimised 120mm fan as well.
I'm making the general assumption that even if I'm not getting full efficiency from the 240mm radiator due to sub-optimal performing fans and radiator placement, I'm also probably not actually drawing that much power from both devices.
Either way it's clear that the SE 240 isn't enough on its own regardless as to how you look at it.

I'll be placing an order next week so I'll report back when I've finished the upgrade!
 

FnordMan

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Apr 22, 2011
Messages
1,727
So, some back-of-an-envelope calculations suggest that an i5-6600K (96W) with the EVGA GTX970 (170W) draw 266W of power at full load. I have a an inline power meter to plug into the wall so I'll test that out tonight.

I've got that exact setup running right now. The max I ever saw (as reported by the UPS's power meter) was like ~280W during prime95 and furmark. Note that also includes a second (atom) PC, a monitor and a network switch. Using a Silverstone 450W SFX unit in there. (one of the v2.0 guys)
 

MarkRWatts

n00b
Joined
Jan 11, 2016
Messages
17
I've got that exact setup running right now. The max I ever saw (as reported by the UPS's power meter) was like ~280W during prime95 and furmark. Note that also includes a second (atom) PC, a monitor and a network switch. Using a Silverstone 450W SFX unit in there. (one of the v2.0 guys)

I wonder what that actually means in practice; would the coolant temperature essentially not change over ambient if I can match the cooling capacity to the power draw of the system?
 

Necere

2[H]4U
Joined
Jan 3, 2003
Messages
2,766
I wonder what that actually means in practice; would the coolant temperature essentially not change over ambient if I can match the cooling capacity to the power draw of the system?
No, that's not what that means. "Cooling capacity" doesn't really mean anything out of context, and is only really useful as a way of comparing different products from the same manufacturer. The way heat dissipation capability of anything that transfers thermal energy - copper or aluminum heatsinks, heatpipes, radiators, waterblocks, water itself - is measured is by thermal resistance, which is expressed in °C/W, or the temperature rise, in degrees Celsius (or Kelvin), per Watt of thermal energy.

For heat transfer systems which involve a fluid medium (i.e., air or water), thermal resistance is variable with flow rate, and therefore expressed as a graph. Where you have more than one medium (e.g., both air and water in a watercooling setup), the flow rates of both will affect the overall thermal resistance (generally, more flow = lower thermal resistance = lower temps). Here's an example of the thermal resistance of a HardwareLabs GTX 360 radiator with Gentle Typhoon fans:

hstgzqb.png

from Skinneelabs

If you want to know how a particular setup will perform, you need to find out the C/W of the system, then plug in the expected heat load. For example, with the watercooling setup in the above graph (HWLabs GTX 360, Gentle Typhoons), if the fans are running at 1800RPM and the pump at 1.6GPM, the thermal resistance is about 0.016 C/W. You then multiply that by the total thermal load of whatever is in the loop. Say it adds up to 300W, so you have 300 * 0.016, or a 4.8C rise in temperature (AKA delta T). Rise over what? Over the ambient air temperature (or technically, the temperature of the air prior to entering the radiator). Note that this will be the approximate temperature of the water, and not of any of the components (CPU, GPU) in the loop. Waterblocks have their own thermal resistance that must be calculated separately. Typically the CPU and GPU will be running somewhat warmer (10C+) than the water temp.

Also worth noting is that thermal resistance is difficult to determine without directly testing a specific setup, since even with a graph like the above, differences in the parts used has a direct effect on performance. For example, the Gentle Typhoons are known to have a relatively high static pressure rating, so different fans may not perform nearly as well at the same RPM if they have a lower static pressure.

It should be obvious at this point that a nominal "cooling capacity" rating offered by a manufacturer is not useful by itself as anything other than a very general ballpark figure; we need to ask at what (actual) CFM and flow rate, and at what target temperature? A radiator will continue to dissipate heat until the coolant boils, which might be thousands of watts of heat, but that's not particularly useful for us. Similarly, you can get quite substantial cooling with fans running at 6000RPM - but you wouldn't want to live with it.
 

Necere

2[H]4U
Joined
Jan 3, 2003
Messages
2,766
I came across this review of the longer EK SE 360 radiator: EK CoolStream SE 360mm Radiator Review - Page 5 of 6 - ExtremeRigs.net
I'm making the assumption that the SE 240 I have is 2/3rds the performance which means I'm looking at a theoretical maximum of around 190W of cooling capacity with fans at 1850rpm, which is barely enough to cool the GPU properly.
I should probably have followed this link before posting the above long-winded explanation, because it does go into detail about fans and temps etc.

Basically, the way to look at it is not "190W is the maximum cooling capacity," but instead what delta T (and fan speed) are you comfortable with. They're basing their ratings on a delta T of 10C, which is fairly typical of what people who water cool aim for. It is not, however, any kind of hard limit, or even close to it really, for what a water cooling loop can operate at. According to your own measurements, your coolant temp is 57C under load with an ambient of 22c - that's a 35C delta T! Which, BTW, is rather high, and you probably do want to look at adding another rad in there. You might actually get better performance with a lower FPI slim rad on the bottom, since those slim fans are probably really struggling to push air through the one you have.
 
Last edited:

spammy

n00b
Joined
Feb 21, 2016
Messages
5
For those of you who have the Noctua NH-U9S, have you tested the difference between facing the exhaust upwards and facing the exhaust to the rear?
 

WiSK

2[H]4U
Joined
Oct 28, 2011
Messages
2,207
I'm making the general assumption that even if I'm not getting full efficiency from the 240mm radiator due to sub-optimal performing fans and radiator placement,

Totally agree with Necere's comments: you should forget "cooling capacity" because it's not a helpful tool and cannot directly be related to the power consumption of your components without including many other variables in the equation.

But your comment above shows you understand the issues. Heat dissipation is primarily proportional to radiator frontal area and volume of air per second moving through the radiator. Pump speed only needs to be enough to provide turbulent flow. You won't get (much) more cooling from a "better" rad of the same size, or even from a thicker rad. Similarly "better" fans will also disappoint, unless they have a bigger "scoop" ie 25 mm. So you are indeed left with: increase the frontal rad surface area (ie another 92mm or 120mm rad on the side), or get proper 25mm fans, or don't have the graphics card in the way of the fans.

I wouldn't be surprised if a 120mm rad with a 25mm thick fan over the CPU would make all the difference, mostly due to increased airflow.

Lastly, 57C coolant temperature is no problem with hard tubing, but may exhibit plasticiser issues with soft tubing. I've done a CPU+GPU build in the past with a single 120mm rad where the coolant was hot. The effect was stiffened tubing, plasticiser deposits in the CPU heatplate, and copper ions trapped in the tubing (turns the tubes greenish).
 

MarkRWatts

n00b
Joined
Jan 11, 2016
Messages
17
Thanks for all of the replies, especially to Necere and WiSK.

Pump speed only needs to be enough to provide turbulent flow.

Regarding this, I'm not quite sure how to determine what speed to set my pump to.
I have this: EK-XTOP Revo D5 PWM - (incl. pump) – EK Webshop
Currently I have it set to about 40% which, assuming flow rates are linear with speed is 600L/hr which is just audible if I stick my ear next to the case.
I have no idea if that is good or not...


My current radiator plan is to abandon the side window and to install a >25mm 120mm radiator with a 'normal' 25mm SP fan.

Radiator choices are looking like either the EK CoolStream PE (38mm/19fpi) or XE (60mm/16fpi).
Assuming the same fan is used on both (probably be the EK-Vardar F3-120 or a Noctua NF-F12 industrialPPC-2000 PWM) what difference will there be between the two radiators?

I'll have to switch to soft tubing for the two connections to this radiator as I'll probably struggle to fit it otherwise, but I assume since temperatures will naturally be lower (how much remains to be seen) that this will be ok.


If anyone has any opinions on radiator/ran suggestions, I'm all ears. I'd prefer EK if only because all other parts of the watercooling loop are EK already :)
 
Last edited:

No Hands 55

Limp Gawd
Joined
Nov 4, 2014
Messages
179
So I think I have finally decided. I will be going with the NH-C14 and modding to fit the hdd cage. I will get 3 NF-F12s for it and use the 140mm NF-P14s for the GPU (most likely have to drill holes) which I will be getting an Accelero Xtreme 3 for (because it has heatsinks unlike the 4).

This will be bought in several small upgrade stages. I will get the C14 and use it with my corsair sp120s that i currently have on my H105. Once / if the H105 and Sp120s sell I will get the NF-F12s. After the entire CPU and side panel situation is finished I will buy the Accelero 3 and mount the NF-P14s on the bottom, then its just a matter of tweaking and configuring the fans just right.

Thoughts or concerns? Any feedback is much appreciated!

EDIT:
was contemplating getting the new gentle typhoons or sticking with SP120s for better CFM but the noctuas will be a quieter option while still performing nearly the same, correct?

and from my observations it seems like the c14 should barely fit with the cage
lMBqPOyl.jpg
 
Last edited:

jpm804

Gawd
Joined
Oct 19, 2004
Messages
828
Finally finished my build in the Ncase ... I was worried this was going to be a tough build due to the size, but it was a breeze to build in.

My Specs:
MB: Asus Z170i Pro Gaming
CPU: Intel 6600K
Memory: Corsair Dominator Ram 2 x 8GB 2666MHz
Video Card: Nvdia GeForce 970 GTX
Storage: Samsung 950 Pro - 256GB (OS) / Samsung 850 Evo 500GB ( Storage)
PSU: Silverstone 600W SFX
Cooling: Corsair H105

Here was my first go at it:

Man that SFX PSU really is small....

d39ef91d-56fc-46bc-a970-1133748b494b_zpsfahto8cv.jpg


I first wanted to put slim fans on the H105 since it was a thiocker radiator, that way I would be gaining a little space between the radiator and the motherboard side and thought it would be quieter.

91FE2F6D-CF8B-4BB0-8C76-3AB5A61628D5_zpsvqhxofhx.jpg


E792320D-C742-4EC3-83D3-5EEBF21014E2_zpsutzfpxf6.jpg


Then the backside with the m.2 drive. love the cutout..makes installing the drive and CPU bracket possible even after mounting the MB.

CD6AFBCC-98FA-44FD-8AB9-D75391CE730F_zps63axogmi.jpg


This is my first build in awhile so i was worried I would run into some issues, but luckily nothing major. It booted right up on the first try which is always nice, but when I was trying to install the OS it would not see the m.2 SSD. Turns out I just didnt push it in all the way. After that the drive was recognized and I installed the OS with no issue.

After the first night I didnt like the amount of air that the silverstone slim fans were pushing and also for some odd reason the fan blades would hit the side radiator mount when you powered down so it would make this awful noise ( blades hitting the bracket) when I shut it down.

I decided to just install the corsair fans that came with the H105 and see how I liked that better. I also installed one of the slim silverstone fans on the bottom for some additional ariflow for the bottom of the case.

It did cramp up the case a bit, but it wasn't as bad as I thought it would be. Also I like the additional airflow the static pressure fans created, definitely louder at full blast but easily controlled by the Asus MB software which was nice. Now I have it turned down on idle / causal use and it will throttle with more load.

I haven't stress tested it yet but will probably do some testing this weekend.. Right now its at 29c at idle. with the fans cranked down to 1200rpms

174c4662-4cd3-4d09-8ddd-25b1789f1744_zpsdydejz9s.jpg

283B535E-7409-4F83-A1C3-9F057C184857_zpsai8xrct4.jpg
 

WiSK

2[H]4U
Joined
Oct 28, 2011
Messages
2,207
I'm not quite sure how to determine what speed to set my pump to.
...
EK CoolStream PE (38mm/19fpi) or XE (60mm/16fpi) ... what difference will there be between the two radiators?

Pump speed, simple. Set fans to max, set pump to max. Run Prime95 or similar. Now reduce speed of the pump gradually, noting down each CPU temperature v pump rpm. Note also the points where pump noise becomes acceptable and when it sounds quiet. Then do it again from low to high speed. This gives you two curves to help you visualise the tradeoff between noise and improved cooling performance.

Radiators. I have PE240s but no XE rads, so can't tell you from own experience. But I know that Coolstream rads are all pretty restrictive and so I guess that, compared to PE series, XE rads would need quite a high fan speed (maybe > 1400rpm) before you see the advantage of extra fin depth. I would go with thinner rad anyway, easier to assemble your loop.
 

ghostwich

2[H]4U
Joined
Sep 10, 2014
Messages
2,118
A 60mm rad will also be... quite thick? Too thick? Factor in 25mm fans and will that even fit between the side and the PSU?

(Not to mention fittings.)

Agree with WiSK on the pump, but it's really applicable to nearly everything: limit your variables, and test. You have no hope to determine anything useful when changing multiple things at the same time. Lock down all factors, change 1 variable, and take notes.
 

Hermit2001

Weaksauce
Joined
Aug 25, 2015
Messages
116
A few people on this forum suggested they were going to try to install the Asetek 545LC cooler in the M1. Has anyone actually tried this? Any pics? And temp data??

Some brave souls even thought to try it with the Asrock X99-ITX. If you succeeded, what are your temps like? What level of overclocking did you manage?
 

-H1N1-

n00b
Joined
Feb 26, 2016
Messages
60
Hi there, i´m also proud owner of the M1 V5

IMG_20160207_124731.jpg

Going for a full watercooling setup, but have to wait for the Alphacool Eisberg 2 :)

cheers
 

Attachments

  • IMG_20160207_124731.jpg
    IMG_20160207_124731.jpg
    254.5 KB · Views: 249

No Hands 55

Limp Gawd
Joined
Nov 4, 2014
Messages
179
Why use a 140mm fan over a 120mm fan when the increased size is blocked and you have to cut up a 120mm like that ? 120mm fans will do just fine.

This isn't mine. And the post was referencing the cooler with the hdd cage next to it not the fans.

Those are both the NH-C12P, I believe.

Ah after looking at some more I believe you are correct.. :/ I will have to cut out some spacers like originally planned then if it doesn't fit. The idea is to just make two small metal strips that will allow the cage to be shifted towards the front while still being attached to the fan.
 

COOJ

n00b
Joined
Jan 20, 2016
Messages
11
yoyo55, glad you like it :)

My inspiration was this build: NCASE M1 v1 Mini-ITX Build
It seems to use the same EK 240SE radiator although with the PWM version of the 15mm fans (the blue just wouldn't go here) but it also has the 92mm in the back, I assume with the fan on exhaust.

I'm pretty confident that if there was the extra space then using 'proper' static-pressure fans would probably sort things out; the CooleStreamSE is a 22 fpi radiator so the 15mm fans do struggle to get the air moving, particularly in the limited space.
The 92mm would only be 16fpi.
I'm not 100% wedded to using hard tubing but it does make some of the tighter bends have more stability - I didn't use any other fittings but there's no reason I can't switch to soft tubing with the addition of some 90 degree bends, other than the additional cost.

I /could/ redo things to get a conventional 120mm radiator and static-pressure fan in there although I'd have to get rid of that lovely bendy tube from the GPU to the radiator ;)
It's not obvious at first glance whether there would be any difference between the SE and PE variants of the 120mm radiator?
I'd definitely need some 90 degree fittings to give me clearance around the GPU at least - I wonder if there's any issue with mixing soft tubing and hard PETG pipes in the same loop?

The 92mm radiator would certainly look better - I'd always considered adding a window although I wonder whether that would cut off too many air intakes for the lower area.

To answer your question, the rear fan is intake while the 15mm's are exhaust through the floor.

Also, some more pictures!

View attachment 446
View attachment 447

As you can see, not a whole lot of space for those poor 15mm's, maybe 8mm at most :(
Your water cooling setup is very similar to what I am planning to do, but I would add one more 120mm radiator at the side panel and the fans at the bottom 240mm radiator would be sucking air in, instead of blowing air out.
 
Joined
Jan 24, 2016
Messages
33
Anybody feel like helping me out on a build I'm planning? I've got a M1 v5 sitting in my closet for the past few weeks and I'm having trouble making decisions on this build.

Intel Core i7-6700, EVGA GeForce GTX 970 - System Build - PCPartPicker

Intel Core i7-6700 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor - vt-d, etc. This box will double as a lab and gaming PC
Noctua NH-C14 CPU Cooler - I have seen conflicting results on this cooler, I won't need to mod my case to use it right? Will it cause issues spilling over to where the ram sits?
Asus Z170I PRO GAMING Mini ITX LGA1151 Motherboard - I'm a little up in the air on the MB, I've seen some conflicting reviews on 5ghz wireless just outright not working, and of course the number of PWM headers available.
Corsair Vengeance LPX 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR4-2666 Memory - nothing special here
Samsung 950 PRO 512GB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive - 4x PCIe, NVMe etc etc
EVGA GeForce GTX 970 4GB Superclocked ACX 2.0 Video Card - I don't have strong feelings on the GPU, except that it's nvidia. I'm trying to go quiet here so I dunno if I'll end up with a AIO water cooling unit or not. (but I'll decide on that after I build it)
Silverstone 500W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular SFX Power Supply - I don't have strong feelings one way or another on the 600W vs 500W silverstones, but I'll listen to you if you want to argue one way or another.
Noctua NF-F12 PWM 55.0 CFM 120mm Fan x 2 - I figure I'll need a few case fans as well. Not strong feelings one way or another about this either.

Again, if anybody has any thoughts on this, I'd love to hear you out.
 

pixelstuff

n00b
Joined
Nov 25, 2013
Messages
5
Anybody feel like helping me out on a build I'm planning? I've got a M1 v5 sitting in my closet for the past few weeks and I'm having trouble making decisions on this build.

Intel Core i7-6700, EVGA GeForce GTX 970 - System Build - PCPartPicker

Intel Core i7-6700 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor - vt-d, etc. This box will double as a lab and gaming PC
Noctua NH-C14 CPU Cooler - I have seen conflicting results on this cooler, I won't need to mod my case to use it right? Will it cause issues spilling over to where the ram sits?
Asus Z170I PRO GAMING Mini ITX LGA1151 Motherboard - I'm a little up in the air on the MB, I've seen some conflicting reviews on 5ghz wireless just outright not working, and of course the number of PWM headers available.
Corsair Vengeance LPX 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR4-2666 Memory - nothing special here
Samsung 950 PRO 512GB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive - 4x PCIe, NVMe etc etc
EVGA GeForce GTX 970 4GB Superclocked ACX 2.0 Video Card - I don't have strong feelings on the GPU, except that it's nvidia. I'm trying to go quiet here so I dunno if I'll end up with a AIO water cooling unit or not. (but I'll decide on that after I build it)
Silverstone 500W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular SFX Power Supply - I don't have strong feelings one way or another on the 600W vs 500W silverstones, but I'll listen to you if you want to argue one way or another.
Noctua NF-F12 PWM 55.0 CFM 120mm Fan x 2 - I figure I'll need a few case fans as well. Not strong feelings one way or another about this either.

Again, if anybody has any thoughts on this, I'd love to hear you out.


I'm not seeing that motherboard on the Asus website so I wonder if they pulled it. Maybe you could go with the ROG series (Maximus VIII Impact) if that PRO GAMING motherboard has fatal flaws. Another brand that I have had decent results with is ASRock. The ASRock Fatal1ty Z170 Gaming-ITX/ac looks pretty interesting to me, although I haven't used it.

I'm curious though, why did you pick the DDR 2666 ram instead or something like 2800 (a nice round number). The G.Skill Ripjaws or maybe even the TridentZ series at 2800 seem to be a little cheaper and a little faster.

The only other thing I might consider is the Noctua NH-D9L cpu cooler and aim it out the back of the case, however you would only be able to put a single 120mm fan in there (not over top of the CPU) with the NH-D9L sticking up.
 

Necere

2[H]4U
Joined
Jan 3, 2003
Messages
2,766
^Great pic. I like how it shows a variety of possible configurations right next to each other. Looks like an ATX PSU + Noctua NH-U9S on the left, SFX + Corsair (?) AIO in the middle, SFX-L + Noctua NH-C14 on the right. That about right?
 

Hanakuso

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Mar 3, 2011
Messages
1,463
^Great pic. I like how it shows a variety of possible configurations right next to each other. Looks like an ATX PSU + Noctua NH-U9S on the left, SFX + Corsair (?) AIO in the middle, SFX-L + Noctua NH-C14 on the right. That about right?
Haha correct! It's like you designed this case or something:p Btw it's a H100i in the middle
 
Joined
Jan 24, 2016
Messages
33
I'm not seeing that motherboard on the Asus website so I wonder if they pulled it. Maybe you could go with the ROG series (Maximus VIII Impact) if that PRO GAMING motherboard has fatal flaws. Another brand that I have had decent results with is ASRock. The ASRock Fatal1ty Z170 Gaming-ITX/ac looks pretty interesting to me, although I haven't used it.

I'm curious though, why did you pick the DDR 2666 ram instead or something like 2800 (a nice round number). The G.Skill Ripjaws or maybe even the TridentZ series at 2800 seem to be a little cheaper and a little faster.

The only other thing I might consider is the Noctua NH-D9L cpu cooler and aim it out the back of the case, however you would only be able to put a single 120mm fan in there (not over top of the CPU) with the NH-D9L sticking up.

You know, I poked around and that ASRock board is great (I've been running on an asrock board for a while in my current build) the ROG board not so much, as it was missing a rear M.2 slot and SATAe ports as well. Going back and comparing the ASRock Fatal1ty Z170 vs the Z170I Pro Gaming, is a bit more difficult. While I can be sure there are limitations to how the ASRock does it's M.2 + SATAe (That limitation being no SATA if both ports are in use), I'm not so sure the same limitation applies to the Asus Z170I. Both seem to support 3 fans 1 CPU & 2 Chassis, and as best I can tell they both support PWM on those three fans.

As far as the ram, I think you're spot on - I'm updating my build to reflect a faster clock (at around the same price point)

I'll look into the fans in a little bit.
 

Phuncz

2[H]4U
Joined
Apr 12, 2009
Messages
2,630
Btw here's a pic finally of all 3 of my NCases beside each other

And I thought I was a fan of the Ncase M1 :eek:

And now the expected questions: which performs the quietest, which one you like to work on the most, which one is the most versatile ?
 
Joined
Feb 16, 2016
Messages
14
I'm wondering, is it possible to put two 120mm radiators at the base of the m1?? So one can cool the liquid from the CPU before going into the GPU and then cooled again before the reservoir.

Waiting on mine from Taiwan, should arrive hopefully next week
 

Necere

2[H]4U
Joined
Jan 3, 2003
Messages
2,766
I'm wondering, is it possible to put two 120mm radiators at the base of the m1?? So one can cool the liquid from the CPU before going into the GPU and then cooled again before the reservoir.

Waiting on mine from Taiwan, should arrive hopefully next week
No, they won't fit side-by-side on the bottom, and it would serve no purpose anyway. The idea that the water in the loop is appreciably warmer after passing a component in the loop is a somewhat common misconception. In actuality, in a typical loop there's less than a degree of difference between the warmest and coolest points. The water flowing through each component only heats up (and is subsequently cooled by the radiator) only a fraction of a degree every cycle, so the loop is basically a near-constant temperature throughout.
 

jpm804

Gawd
Joined
Oct 19, 2004
Messages
828
Anybody feel like helping me out on a build I'm planning? I've got a M1 v5 sitting in my closet for the past few weeks and I'm having trouble making decisions on this build.

Intel Core i7-6700, EVGA GeForce GTX 970 - System Build - PCPartPicker

Intel Core i7-6700 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor - vt-d, etc. This box will double as a lab and gaming PC
Noctua NH-C14 CPU Cooler - I have seen conflicting results on this cooler, I won't need to mod my case to use it right? Will it cause issues spilling over to where the ram sits?
Asus Z170I PRO GAMING Mini ITX LGA1151 Motherboard - I'm a little up in the air on the MB, I've seen some conflicting reviews on 5ghz wireless just outright not working, and of course the number of PWM headers available.
Corsair Vengeance LPX 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR4-2666 Memory - nothing special here
Samsung 950 PRO 512GB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive - 4x PCIe, NVMe etc etc
EVGA GeForce GTX 970 4GB Superclocked ACX 2.0 Video Card - I don't have strong feelings on the GPU, except that it's nvidia. I'm trying to go quiet here so I dunno if I'll end up with a AIO water cooling unit or not. (but I'll decide on that after I build it)
Silverstone 500W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular SFX Power Supply - I don't have strong feelings one way or another on the 600W vs 500W silverstones, but I'll listen to you if you want to argue one way or another.
Noctua NF-F12 PWM 55.0 CFM 120mm Fan x 2 - I figure I'll need a few case fans as well. Not strong feelings one way or another about this either.

Again, if anybody has any thoughts on this, I'd love to hear you out.

I just finished building my ncase and it is very similar to your proposed build. I posted some pics on this page.

Here is my opinion on the parts as Ive been using then for less than a week, so not long but my initial impressions.

MB - asus Z170i pro - had no problems with my build with this board. At this point just running it stock. No issues with the 5GHz wireless on it and works wells for me. I was going to run hardwired, but happy to use wireless for now. Also had no issues installing my samsung pro 950 on it and installed windows on it with no issues, ran disk tests and it ran at it advertised speeds ( I was worried i was going to have issues with the drive on this board). Have fans on all fan headers ... 2 fans on one header for my H105, one fan for the pump and one for a fan I mounted on the bottom of the case. Ive been controlling the fan speeds via the Asus software and been happy with that ( can set fan speed % as tempts rise). Overall pretty happy with the board performance. I was thinking of getting the ROG impact Viii but this board does everything I want at a lower price.

PSU 600W - I went with this versus the 500w since I liked the shorter length of the PSU which I think helps with cabling on a longer video card and I believe comes with the shorter PSU cables which was nice. Also I havent run into any chirping or noise issues with the unit and has been quite for me. I am also happy with this purchase for this build.

GTX970 - went with a refernece cooler version since i wanted one that vented the air out of the case instead of circulating it in the case ( since I just have fans on my CPU cooler blowing air in. I did ad a fan on the bottom to blow fresh air in for the card. Not sure it helps but want to try it out, figure it could hurt it.
 
Joined
Feb 16, 2016
Messages
14
No, they won't fit side-by-side on the bottom, and it would serve no purpose anyway. The idea that the water in the loop is appreciably warmer after passing a component in the loop is a somewhat common misconception. In actuality, in a typical loop there's less than a degree of difference between the warmest and coolest points. The water flowing through each component only heats up (and is subsequently cooled by the radiator) only a fraction of a degree every cycle, so the loop is basically a near-constant temperature throughout.
Awesome, thanks for clearing that up. Guess I'll stick with the 240mm EK Slim one then
 

Malangyar

n00b
Joined
Aug 11, 2008
Messages
55
My CPU cooler is currently a Scythe Kabuto II, would replacing it with a Noctua NH-C14S be an upgrade? I'm thinking the larger 140mm fan would mean less noise and lower temps?
 

Necere

2[H]4U
Joined
Jan 3, 2003
Messages
2,766
My CPU cooler is currently a Scythe Kabuto II, would replacing it with a Noctua NH-C14S be an upgrade? I'm thinking the larger 140mm fan would mean less noise and lower temps?
The NH-C14S is too tall and its fans won't fit. The only way to use it would be with slim fans, but then you're giving up some airflow. The older, discontinued version, the NH-C14 fits perfectly, so long as you don't need to use the 3.5" HDD cage. Neither can be used with their second (bottom) 140mm fan, though with the NH-C14 you can at least use a 120mm fan in its place.

Is the NH-C14 better than the Kabuto II? I haven't looked up reviews comparing them, but probably.
 

Skott

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Aug 12, 2006
Messages
4,198
The NH-C14 is currently the best air hsf for the M1 from all reports we been hearing from users. No real in depth comparison has been done however between all the air hsf on the market used in a M1 case. Eventually something will cool better than the NH-C14 but we haven't found it yet. To do better you would need to go with a AIO or full water cooling. If you want the original NH-C14 model I suggest getting one now before all available stock is dried up.
 
Top