NCASE M1: a crowdfunded Mini-ITX case (updates in first post)

alphataru said:
3. In terms of bottom fan, you can not fit another 120mm. In fact, you're not gonna be able to fit much else in the room. I chose single fan because the whole point is to direct more air to the intake, more cool air rather than case air. Having an additional fan blow at the shroud is pretty pointless, as the heatsink is covered. Having a slim fan that has a good curve is important, as it won't blow so much air that it will move gpu fan while idle thus possibly sending a charge back to the board. If you need storage, you can choose a 120mm fan at the intake, then it should allow room for a drive down there (double check with someone else).
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Ok, so I would take one of the 140mm fans off the C14 and that will run on the second fan header with voltage control. I am using a short GPU (170mm) so I will place the fan at the back to blow air into the case rather than at the GPU.

alphataru said:
4. Haha, sorry about cabling. I'm very bad at it and it's still a work in progress. A few things I observed is that it's important to go for short and flat cable. It allows easier bending, better ability to go between low clearance situations and less cable to work with. Sx500-l comes with flat cables, but if you choose something else, I'd grab a silver stone short cable kit to make your life easier.
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Does the short cabling come standard with the SX500-l?

alphataru said:
5. In terms of psu, sx500-l is one of the only choices if you want a quiet system. While it still has the clicking, it's supposedly much better than sx600 and not very audible unless you really are sensitive to noise. It's important to note that if your gpu has a shroud like mine, it's SUPER tight and you basically have to bend the cables 90 degrees for them to fit. It'd be much easier without a shroud. You can also choose to turn the psu inward and the cables will completely avoid the gpu. However, I didn't want it to intake hot case air.
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Did you do any fan replacements as others do? I am in fact very noise sensitive and my girlfriend will use the system for work and needs to be able to concentrate on documents a lot. Clicking if audible is a big issue I'm affraid.
Any improvements can be expected from fan replacements?

alphataru said:
Hope it helps. Post your build once you're done!
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I am expecting the V5 in January :) Pics will follow

Nobu said:
Noctua's 4-pin adapter splits the PWM signal to both fans, as well as the +12V signal. If the PWM signal is strong enough, it'll control both fans as if they were connected to two headers with the same PWM curve. If it's not strong enough, strange things can happen (like the fan running full speed or not at all). With just two fans it shouldn't be a problem, though.
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Ok, thx. But running a 4-pin and 3-pin fan on one header is nonsense?

XelNika said:
While I don't understand what's going on in the manual and don't know anything about the board itself, you can easily power all your fans off a single header. You have a couple of options depending on your fans.

If you use the NF-P14 fan, which is 3-pin AFAIK, for the CPU, you should hook that (and the secondary CPU fan if you want one) up to the second header. Then, assuming you don't already own the 120 mm fans, use a 4-pin splitter on the first header (possibly after an extender to reach the bottom) and buy two 120 mm PWM fans for the bottom.

If you only have or want 3-pin fans, your choices are
  1. Put all of them on one header, which means you lose control of their individual speeds. They will all be controlled as one which sucks if they are rated for very different speeds. It will, however work well with 3-4 identical 120 mm fans.
  2. Get a fan that is either already at a comfortable noise level or can be made comfortable with the Noctua low-noise adapters and put it on the first fan header. This means you have to choose one for idle noise levels and will mean higher temps at load than if you had automatic software control.

If I'm not mistaken, you can also get a 4-pin splitter and use a 4-pin fan on the side with speed control and a 3-pin fan on the side without and control them both, but I don't know what this will do to a 3-pin fans motor. If I remember correctly, I had a fan set up like this for years in my previous case.
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Is running the CPU fan on a system header not a bad idea? Because I want the fan to speed up when the CPU is hot / not when the system is hot.

So at the moment the only idea I can see in order not to waste too many fans (the ones standard with the C14) is to use one of the fans in the case floor hooked to the system header and buy a second PWM fan for the CPU header. That way I am wasting one fan but don't see an alternative.

Hooking a CPU voltage fan & a case voltage fan to the same header doesn't seem like a good idea to me...
 
anak85 said:
Since I am planning a Hackintosh, I have to stick with this board. The others cause a lot of issues it seems.

I read the entire manual and all I noticed is the following:

23550062tf.jpg


Odd, that the headers have different layouts.

So, what is the consequence regarding the NF-C14 and the 1-2 fans in the case floor? Buy a new 140mm fan for the CPU and stick one of the 3-pin fans in the case floor leaving one as spare for when the Noctua breaks in 20 years ;-)?
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Different pinout represents the fact that one is voltage control and the other is PWM, therefore the speed control is either done via Power (pin 2) or via the PWM signal pin (pin 4)
The logic behind the pinouts are the same, its just how it has been named to reflect the type of speed control.

I am on an older generation motherboard, a Z87E ITX, but currently running hackintosh. Just couldn't bring myself to buy a gigabyte due to the terrible fan control at the bios level. Asrock was the only supplier who had a decent bios fan control for the 87 series chipsets.

In the current Z170 board offerings, practically most brands offer a useful degree of control in the bios, with gigabyte now the only one with the same terrible percentage per degree fan control methodology. Asrock boards also have a graphical fan control system for the bios now, Brilliant! Hackintosh compatibility needs to be demonstrated though, but having not yet played with the asrock Z170 boards, don't know how well they hackintosh.
 
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okwchin said:
Different pinout represents the fact that one is voltage control and the other is PWM, therefore the speed control is either done via Power (pin 2) or via the PWM signal pin (pin 4)
The logic behind the pinouts are the same, its just how it has been named to reflect the type of speed control.
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So you are saying the CPU header is voltage controlled and the System header is PWM controlled?

Here what the manual lists and it gives you the option to adjust both headers with a factor x PWM...

23552812rp.jpg


23552813sk.jpg


23552814fw.jpg


okwchin said:
In the current Z170 board offerings, practically most brands offer a useful degree of control in the bios, with gigabyte now the only one with the same terrible percentage per degree fan control methodology. Asrock boards also have a graphical fan control system for the bios now, Brilliant! Hackintosh compatibility needs to be demonstrated though, but having not yet played with the asrock Z170 boards, don't know how well they hackintosh.
Click to expand...

Z170 not hacked successfully yet... at least not fully working.
 
anak85 said:
So you are saying the CPU header is voltage controlled and the System header is PWM controlled?
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No, the CPU Fan header has PWM (pin 4 labelled "Speed Control"), and the Sys Fan header is voltage control (pin 4 is just hooked up to constant +5V, though could just as well be left disconnected entirely).
 
EdZ said:
No, the CPU Fan header has PWM (pin 4 labelled "Speed Control"), and the Sys Fan header is voltage control (pin 4 is just hooked up to constant +5V, though could just as well be left disconnected entirely).
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Ahh, ok.

So, if I hook a 3-pin fan to the CPU header it will run at 100% since the header isn't using pin nr. 4 to control the fan? So I must use a PWM fan for the CPU if I want controll?

Equally for the system fan I must use a 3-pin fan if I want voltage control? Or can PWM fans also be controlled via the voltage?
 
PWM fans can be voltage-controlled. The CPU header SHOULD also implement voltage control. Gigabyte's motherboard fan control is notoriously half-arsed though, so who knows.
 
EdZ said:
PWM fans can be voltage-controlled. The CPU header SHOULD also implement voltage control. Gigabyte's motherboard fan control is notoriously half-arsed though, so who knows.
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Ok, I'll get the C14 and see how it goes. If not, order a PWM fan to go on the cooler.

Btw, I just found an official Noctua shop on Ebay that also sells refurbished and bulk products quite cheap for anyone living in Europe.

http://www.ebay.de/usr/official_noctuashop?_trksid=p2047675.l2559
 
anak85 said:
Did you do any fan replacements as others do? I am in fact very noise sensitive and my girlfriend will use the system for work and needs to be able to concentrate on documents a lot. Clicking if audible is a big issue I'm affraid.
Any improvements can be expected from fan replacements?
Click to expand...

The stock fan starts at a very low voltage and I haven't come across a suitable replacement: http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1041441547&postcount=463

Some people have mounted 25mm thick fan to the outside of the unit and powered it externally. Would void the warranty though.
 
Aibohphobia said:
The stock fan starts at a very low voltage and I haven't come across a suitable replacement: http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1041441547&postcount=463

Some people have mounted 25mm thick fan to the outside of the unit and powered it externally. Would void the warranty though.
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makar1 has replaced the fan with a FW 121. He said he doesn't notice the fan since swapping.

makar1 said:
It's the SX 500 LG. I haven't really noticed the fan at all since swapping in the FW121.
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Here are his pictures: http://imgur.com/a/xeDo9
 
anak85 said:
makar1 has replaced the fan with a FW 121. He said he doesn't notice the fan since swapping.
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Cool, I hadn't seen his build before. I tested a FN123 but mine makes a rasping noise that's just as annoying as the clacking of the stock fan.
 
Qrash said:
The FW 121 is a PWM fan. I wonder if he is is running it at full speed?
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Koizer said:
I'm wondering this myself. I'm considering replacing the stock fan in mine if it is a reliable improvement.
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So how would you run it at full speed? Hook it up differently?

Maybe a different fan with less RPM would make sense for that then? The Prolimatech Ultra Sleek Vortex 12 runs up to 1.300 rpm with 17 dbA

http://www.prolimatech.com/en/products/detail.asp?id=2722&subid=2723#showtab
 
anak85 said:
So how would you run it at full speed? Hook it up differently?
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Yes. I believe the fan connector inside the power supply only goes up to 5 V. He might have plugged his replacement fan into a power supply cable using an adapter or he could have plugged it into a fan connector on his motherboard.

I would be afraid of varying the fan speed based on the temperature of a component outside of the power supply, so I would run it at a constant speed, be it at 12 or 7 Volts, whichever provides good airflow with an acceptable level of noise. The fan choice would be key in this modification.
 
Qrash said:
The FW 121 is a PWM fan. I wonder if he is is running it at full speed?
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The PSU uses very simple voltage control that works on any fan. The FW121 doesn't spin at idle or the lowest voltage level above idle, but once you have a moderate load it starts spinning. At the lowest voltage level there can be a whine noise where the voltage isn't quite enough to start the fan.

As Tony Ou mentioned some time ago this fan won't stop spinning when the load goes back down, but it does mean you won't get the annoying start-stop transition noise. It's an improvement over the stock fan, but it's not perfect.
 
makar1 said:
The PSU uses very simple voltage control that works on any fan. The FW121 doesn't spin at idle or the lowest voltage level above idle, but once you have a moderate load it starts spinning. At the lowest voltage level there can be a whine noise where the voltage isn't quite enough to start the fan.

As Tony Ou mentioned some time ago this fan won't stop spinning when the load goes back down, but it does mean you won't get the annoying start-stop transition noise. It's an improvement over the stock fan, but it's not perfect.
Click to expand...

So what about connecting a Prolimatech Ultra Sleek Vortex 12 (1.300 rpm with 17 dbA) straight to a 12V connection? That would remove any whining / clicking...

http://www.prolimatech.com/en/produc...d=2723#showtab
 
anak85 said:
So what about connecting a Prolimatech Ultra Sleek Vortex 12 (1.300 rpm with 17 dbA) straight to a 12V connection? That would remove any whining / clicking...
Click to expand...

I find that Prolimatech slim fan pretty loud at full speed.
 
anak85 said:
So what about connecting a Prolimatech Ultra Sleek Vortex 12 (1.300 rpm with 17 dbA) straight to a 12V connection? That would remove any whining / clicking...]
Click to expand...

If you're running at a fixed voltage, it doesn't really matter what fan you use. Pick one that has good airflow at a low noise level.

You can also use full thickness fans if you have space next to the PSU.
 
TridentZ has large heatsinks making it bigger than a regular sized module. Even a regular sized module without a heatsink wouldn't work. You need real VLP (very low profile) ram to clear the bottom heatsink pipes in the orientation you will need to use the cooler. Other orientations will hit daughterboard, or audio solution/pci-e slot. I am not certain that LP sufficiently clears, it very likely must be VLP. Note that what Corsair brands as "LP" is not the true standard of LP - that is a regular sized module.

Something like the Crucial Sport Ballistix VLP ram is. Problem is, that is DDR3. You need DDR4.

Technically, the only real DDR4 VLP ram right now is ECC Registered (Buffered) ram. You can't use that on Z170.

Note - I'm running TridentZ in my current build, but on mATX in a different case, so I am familiar with the modules in person. I have a Dark Rock TF but never ended up fitting it into my M1, since I never ended up with another consumer itx board. I have a server itx board inside of the M1, but the cpu socket/dimm placement is not similar to consumer boards like the Impact, so testing it is pointless.
 
Okay :(
May be Asus Z170I PRO GAMING fit Dark Rock TF with Trident Z? Its havnt large heatsink and big "sound card"
 
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Has anyone put the Dark Rock TF into the ncase M1 yet?

I'd like to know if you can fit it with the heatpipes pointing towards the GPU and still fit the hard drive cage.

I plan to use the 3m riser card to move an EVGA 980 Ti down a slot - giving room for the Dark Rock and also room for an SFX-L PSU.

BUT I'd love for any reports of getting this cooler in with the hdd cage....

Anyone with pics on fitment?
 
The OP says the M1 V4 is up for pre-order on the website. Where is the link? Can't find it.
 
Just got my 950 pro 512, and now my build is complete. I've been using a 1tb 850 evo as boot, which I'll switch to storage/games now.

Rest of my build can be found in a previous build, for now, here's a quick bench, and some shots of it in my case.


jZU98W7.png




http://imgur.com/a/MQIqP
 
XelNika said:
The OP is outdated.

You are aware that the V5 is up for pre-order, right?
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No actually. It's been a long time since I've check in. I figured the OP would be the most current instead of hunting down a post with the latest info..

Where can I get the website link? Thanks in advance.
 
alphataru said:
Just got my 950 pro 512, and now my build is complete. I've been using a 1tb 850 evo as boot, which I'll switch to storage/games now.

Rest of my build can be found in a previous build, for now, here's a quick bench, and some shots of it in my case.


jZU98W7.png




http://imgur.com/a/MQIqP
Click to expand...

I just finished my build, and I ended up going with a 512 GB 850 evo (m.2). Can you let us know if you can notice a difference in the upgrade to the 950 pro? I was originally planning to get the 950, but after reading reviews it seemed like the tangible benefit for more basic use cases (not heavy video / photo editing, gaming, browsing, etc.) wouldn't be that significant for a decent price change. Would love to see your impressions making the move from one to the other.
 
Hi all!

Looking to getting a CPU cooler ASAP. Silence will be my top priority, as the stock cooler + a stock GPU is driving me insane. Is there any Air cooler / AIO(120mm) (Tho i would prefer Air cooled) That you guys would recommend?

Thank you!
 
bencho said:
Has anyone put the Dark Rock TF into the ncase M1 yet?

I'd like to know if you can fit it with the heatpipes pointing towards the GPU and still fit the hard drive cage.

I plan to use the 3m riser card to move an EVGA 980 Ti down a slot - giving room for the Dark Rock and also room for an SFX-L PSU.

BUT I'd love for any reports of getting this cooler in with the hdd cage....

Anyone with pics on fitment?
Click to expand...

bump >_<
 
bencho said:
Has anyone put the Dark Rock TF into the ncase M1 yet?

I'd like to know if you can fit it with the heatpipes pointing towards the GPU and still fit the hard drive cage.

I plan to use the 3m riser card to move an EVGA 980 Ti down a slot - giving room for the Dark Rock and also room for an SFX-L PSU.

BUT I'd love for any reports of getting this cooler in with the hdd cage....

Anyone with pics on fitment?
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This is the only build I can recall seeing with the Dark Rock TF. If you read down that thread, the poster addresses fitment with the HDD cage. Of course, how and if it fits depends on the CPU socket location on the motherboard.
 
Hey Necere!

Yea that's the only one I saw as well. It doesn't make reference to pointing the heatpipes downwards towards the GPU and fitting though :(

Just curious - has there been any plans to make the ncase M1 larger to accommodate SFX-L more comfortably?
 
bencho said:
Yea that's the only one I saw as well. It doesn't make reference to pointing the heatpipes downwards towards the GPU and fitting though :(
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Inside the link that Necere provided is a link to photos of the build: http://imgur.com/a/dyriR

The Dark Rock TF is installed with the ends of the heatpipes pointed downwards towards the PCI-E slot.
 
Wow that looks really sharp. I had no idea things like this existed. I was in the market for something like this over the summer.
 
This is the current MOBO that i am using. the CPU socket is so close to the PCI-E slot. Will Will there even be any coolers that I can fit onto it?

Thank you
 
I'm sure my problem has nothing to do with the Ncase specifically besides the fact that I'm using it but I don't really know where else to go for help. Just finished my build in the m1, was really excited to turn it on, as soon as I got it half way plugged in the psu exploded, sounded like a gunshot, small amount of smoke floated up. The power bar the cord was connected to is done, none of the other outlets on it work. A quick Google search lead me to another forum saying it's probably a faulty psu. I'm hoping that's true as I don't think I did anything wrong in the build. I'm using the sx600-g v1.1, the room I'm building is a bit humid, but I highly doubt that's and issue as other computers are running in the same room.
 
rptw said:
I'm sure my problem has nothing to do with the Ncase specifically besides the fact that I'm using it but I don't really know where else to go for help. Just finished my build in the m1, was really excited to turn it on, as soon as I got it half way plugged in the psu exploded, sounded like a gunshot, small amount of smoke floated up. The power bar the cord was connected to is done, none of the other outlets on it work. A quick Google search lead me to another forum saying it's probably a faulty psu. I'm hoping that's true as I don't think I did anything wrong in the build. I'm using the sx600-g v1.1, the room I'm building is a bit humid, but I highly doubt that's and issue as other computers are running in the same room.
Click to expand...

Ouch... sounds like yet another case of the Silverstone 600w blowing up on people...
 
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