NCASE M1: a crowdfunded Mini-ITX case (updates in first post)

Discussion in 'Small Form Factor Systems' started by wahaha360, Sep 15, 2012.

  1. Phuncz

    Phuncz 2[H]4U

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    Yep that's my build. Heat and noise are excellent in my regard, I've done a more elaborate post in the past but I need to look it up after work.

    If you are referring to my picture, it's a Scythe Kabuto II, as there were only a few beefy CPU coolers that don't extend past the left fan on the fan bracket.
     
  2. icc0rz

    icc0rz n00b

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    Depends on the MB doesn't it? I had no issues fitting it in my first build, I could even keep the original heatsinks on the RAM: http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?p=1041076061#post1041076061
     
  3. Phuncz

    Phuncz 2[H]4U

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    EDIT: added markup and words for obviousness.

    Today I exchanged the original fan bracket in my Ncase M1 v1 for the new steel v4 one with the magnetic mesh filter. One problem is that you can't use all four screws apparently when using the v4 bracket with the v1 case. You'll see this in one of the pictures. It's attached well enough with just the screws in the back but you have to mind to not put much force on the bracket or you might strip the threads on the case.

    I also took some pictures of angles some people have questions about from time to time. The pictures were done in a lightly cloudy day and with a Sony A6000 using the kitlens at 16mm and F/3.5, resized to 900x600.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    Here you can see it doesn't line up. I've tried putting the bracket on the inside so the tabs at the back are inside the case, but then the holes in the front of the case misallign to the front.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2015
  4. XelNika

    XelNika Limp Gawd

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    Wow, nice Lian-Li QC.
     
  5. Nobu

    Nobu 2[H]4U

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    The case may have just been bent during shipment--that's what it looks like to me, at least.
     
  6. XelNika

    XelNika Limp Gawd

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    Not if the original side bracket fits.
     
  7. Phuncz

    Phuncz 2[H]4U

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    This is one of the original batch v1 cases, if it was bent during transport, I would have noticed by now :)

    I doubt this is a manufacturing error, I expect that something has changed with the dimensions in between those 4 versions.
    BTW: for me this doesn't need to be "fixed" or exchanged, it does it's job and I did it mainly for the mesh.
     
  8. Berzerker7

    Berzerker7 n00b

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    I'm running a Gigabyte G1. Probably the best you can get for performance/binning behind the HoF.

    It fits *perfectly*, but does take a little bit of finagling to get it to fit in (nothing too ridiculous). See pic below.

    [​IMG]

    P.S. For anyone else wondering, the H100i GTX (as seen in the image above) is a pretty poor choice. The tubing is extremely long and rigid, and will pretty much not let you attach it down without an extreme amount of force. And even then, it'll bow the mounting bracket and prevent the door from staying attached. I'm currently in the process of swapping it out for an H100i, which should be a lot better for a build configuration that I have.

    I'm currently running one. My Z97i PLUS has the M.2 on the back of the board, and it's aligned perfectly over the cutout. The aluminum from the side-panel acts as a, kind of, contactless heatsink and I've noticed 0 thermal throttling.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2015
  9. Qrash

    Qrash Gawd

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    I too have a V1 and a V4, so I just did a quick check. My V4 fan bracket fits my V1 case frame a bit better than in your photos. If I use the lower set of holes on the V1 frame, the front holes on the V4 fan bracket almost line up with those on the case. A slight inward press on the front edge of the frame completes the alignment. However, if I slide the V4 bracket up to the top set of holes on the case, the misalignment is too great and small amount of pressure is insufficient. Perhaps this is because the upper holes are closer to the corner of the frame so it will not bend as easily. Anyway, I'm surprised the bracket doesn't fit both sets of holes without any pressure.
     
  10. Hanakuso

    Hanakuso [H]ard|Gawd

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    Really strange issue with the steel bracket. I have mine sitting in the box and i'll try to install it on my V1, V2, V3
     
  11. Necere

    Necere 2[H]4U

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    I'm not happy about this, at all. I had the same problem with the first sample steel bracket they sent me, so I had them move the holes forward. Second sample ended up being too far forward and I asked them to move them back again, but only a little. There shouldn't be differences between how the bracket fits on different chassis versions, but it might be that individual chassis or brackets end up out of tolerance and they match them up during assembly. I don't know at this point.

    Anyway, I apologize to you, Phuncz, and anyone else that has this issue with the new bracket not lining up. Please contact us through the website and we'll see about getting replacements.
     
  12. callumbolch

    callumbolch Limp Gawd

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    phuncz - it might be worth utilizing the case flex technique provided to those of us with the v2 wobble feet issue - it may assist in lining up your holes a little better if your case is somewhat flexed.
     
  13. The_Oasis

    The_Oasis Limp Gawd

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    Hey guys, dropping in again now that Skylake has dropped. Has anyone hopped on that new EVGA mITX board that's being sold? I'm thinking of heading down to Microcentre and picking it up along with the new processor, but I just wanted to know if anyone's been spectacularly early by jumping on it.
     
  14. monochromatik

    monochromatik n00b

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    hey all, i'm gonna be making a build with the m1 probably at the end of next month. so far this is my planned build:

    cpu: i5-6600k
    gpu: unsure as of now (question to follow)
    mobo: unsure but waiting to see the asrock and gigabyte mini-itx z170 boards come out
    ram: 8gb x 2 corsair vengeance lpx ddr4 2400
    ssd: 500gb samsung 850 evo m.2 drive (will most likely buy a new laptop within the next couple and pop this in there then replace with a 2tb samsung 850)
    cooling: also not 100% (question to follow)
    psu: corsair sf600 when it comes out possibly but also toying with the idea of an atx supply for silence reasons

    so my few questions are:

    1. so i'm unsure about my cooling setup. i'd like to aim for maximum quietness but not sacrificing too much in terms of temps. the setup i think i'm leaning towards is an nh-c14 with a 120mm fan on the bottom (fractal venturi possibly? i would use a noctua redux but their 120s aren't high pressure optimized) and then 2 120mm fans as intakes on the side. as much as watercooling seems cool, i'm not sure i wanna mess with it. which brings me to the gpu...

    2. if i were to go with a setup like this, would using a non-reference gtx 970 be okay? either something full sized like a gigabyte 970 g1 or a mini card like the asus 970 direct cu? i was thinking about the mini sized one in order to be able to fit either a fanless psu like a seasonic or a corsair ax760i or something. i know there's a lot of complaints about the silverstone sx-600g being noisy. but maybe the corsair sfx power supply will remedy all that. also have thought about possibly getting something like the evga 980 hybrid but that might be more money than i wanna spend, as i'm not a hardcore gamer per se and the price to value proposition is a whole lot better on the 970. also, assuming i did get a non-reference design, is it worth it to pop a couple fans on the bottom? i've seen posts here stating it's not a huge difference but if it doesn't hurt.

    anyway, hope you guys can help out and hope to be joining the ranks in the not too distant future. thanks.
     
  15. Pyotr_Parker

    Pyotr_Parker n00b

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  16. yoyo55

    yoyo55 Limp Gawd

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    Are the magnetic mesh filters restrictive or you does it provide sufficient airflow?
     
  17. Phuncz

    Phuncz 2[H]4U

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    Don't sweat it, my problem is not really an issue. If anything, I'd fix it myself with a small file to lengthen the holes. I am however amazed that this seems to be a Lian-Li QC issue.

    But if you need ammo to fire at Lian-Li:

    [​IMG]

    Not worth it for me, my case is stable, not wobbly. So I'd like to keep it that way.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2015
  18. Skhmt

    Skhmt n00b

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    I really doubt it. An h100i seems to barely fit and it has a 27mm thick rad + 25mm thick fan. The Predator AIO has a 68mm thick rad + 25mm thick fan.

    Then of course, as you noted, the pump/res on the side.
     
  19. bznotins

    bznotins n00b

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    I'm holding-out for the ASRock board. More SATA ports!
     
  20. Qrash

    Qrash Gawd

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    The 68 mm thickness includes the 25 mm fans I believe, based on the photos. The CoolStream PE radiator is 280 mm long and has been used in builds posted here earlier. However, the addition of the pump and resevoir to the end increases the length to 295 mm and this would make this very hard to fit in an M1. You might be drilling your own mounting holes into the side bracket, if even that would make it fit.Yin
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2015
  21. Skhmt

    Skhmt n00b

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    You might be right. It looks like the rad is twice the thicknesses of the fan, but the rad might have a shroud or something over part of the fan.

    Also a ddc pump is roughly 2.44" which is 62mm and it seems like the rad+fan is about the width of a ddc.
     
  22. Haagen_dazs

    Haagen_dazs n00b

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    Am I the only one in this place waiting for Skylake and a decent selection of Z170 m-ITZ motherboards to hit the market? My beautiful NCase M1 is just collecting dust in the corner :/
     
  23. Skhmt

    Skhmt n00b

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    Thanks, got it to fit with one fan. It's tight with the long tubes and isn't really giving better temps than the air cooler that came with the x99e-itx/ac, but it's quieter. While it looks possible to get another fan in there, I don't think it's a good idea.
     
  24. flatlander

    flatlander n00b

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    You are not the only one. The EVGA is just no good. We should be seeing more over the next couple of weeks as the launch of the remaining Skylake line gets closer.
     
  25. Marmotta

    Marmotta n00b

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    I was looking to get some dust filters for my NCASE and was looking at some DEMCiflex ones, but wanted to know if they are the best out there and which filters I would need to buy for my case. I have one 120mm intake fan at the bottom of my case and a Noctua NH-C14. Would I also benefit in any way in having outtake fans or is the positive pressure enough already?
     
  26. Nobu

    Nobu 2[H]4U

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    Without the filter, assuming my calculations aren't way off, it looks like the area available for air to flow through is about double (2434mm^2 vs 1140.6mm^2), but taking into account fluid/aerodynamics, it's probably not that simple.

    The numbers I used, for the curious (results could be way different if my assumed values are off):
    Code:
    Stock:
    (42 * 18) + (41 * 17) = 1453 holes.
    3.14 * .5mm^2 * 1453 = 1140.605mm^2
    Mod:
    1 * ((100 * 19) + (110 * 2)) = 2120mm^2
    10 * (3.14 * 10) = 314mm^2
    314mm^2 + 2120mm^2 = 2434mm^2
    (1mm wide, with a 10mm diameter curve at each end and 100mm straights [110 on the first and last])
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2015
  27. BaK2BaK

    BaK2BaK [H]Lite

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    Must have been asked several times already... but where did you buy these plastic end caps (instead of the cables pass-through ones)?
     
  28. Phuncz

    Phuncz 2[H]4U

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  29. BaK2BaK

    BaK2BaK [H]Lite

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    Great! Thx to both of you guys! :)
     
  30. Qrash

    Qrash Gawd

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    Thanks for the link. I just bought a few, though I may experiment with removing the grommets completely to see how that affects temperatures. Same for the third expansion slot cover and the rectangular plate above it. So many tests .... hopefully I can REALLY get to them this weekend.
     
  31. Phuncz

    Phuncz 2[H]4U

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    Someone has already done that in the past, I believe it made thermal performance worse. Having an entirely open case changes the characteristics of the cooling. When you have a case with a decent intake and exhaust, it will perform like a wind-tunnel. But when you "open" the case too much, it becomes "caseless" and removes the wind-tunnel effect.

    Look at most enterprise server and workstation hardware. Or Apple's Mac Pro, old and new. All have a shape that has a distinct intake and distinct exhaust area so airflow is used not to move air in a cone, but to force it through a certain path.
     
  32. The_Oasis

    The_Oasis Limp Gawd

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    Okay, I just got my NCase (bought a v2 from someone here in [H]).

    I realize now that there is no way that I'm not going to get it working ASAP. I need it. I want it.

    Anyone else here with a v2 that's willing to share their specs and recommendations for building? At this point I'm just going to go to Microcenter and buy everything I need and get this thing up and running.
     
  33. klatox

    klatox [H]Lite

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    I recently put a Noctua NF-A9 redux (92mm) fan as an intake on my M1. Is it normal for this fan to sort of rev up and run at 100% on boot/wake from sleep? My heatsink (NH-L9x65) fan doesn't do this so I'm curious.
     
  34. vpr

    vpr n00b

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    @Necere

    I picked up my dual fan bracket that I ordered today, but it came w/ a pretty serious bend (packaging was pretty abused too) in it. I sent an email w/ pictures to the support email - just posting here for visibility. It wasn't packaged very well by whoever packaged it, just the bracket in a plastic baggie inside a rectangular box - no foam or anything to help protect it.
     
  35. QinX

    QinX Limp Gawd

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    The hole size you used is too small.
    Here is my calculation.

    Assuming the M1 uses the standard Lian Li hole pattern which are 2.95mm in diameter (I measured a Lian Li PC-Q08 Side panel I have)
    a 2.95mm hole has a surface area of 3.14*1.475^2=6.835mm²
    1453 holes
    1453*6.835= 9931.255mm² or around 100cm^2

    The modded panel has a practicaly continuous Serpent shaped pattern.
    I've crudely mocked up the M1 side panel and roughly copied the pattern in the picture, making sure I slight oversize mine.
    I've got 125mm high straights and 7.5mm radii
    the total length of the pattern is taken from my CAD software at 3000mm. Lets take a couple of different width for the cut itself.
    3000x1.0=30cm²
    3000x1.5=45cm²
    3000x2.0=60cm²
    3000x2.5=75cm²
    3000x3.0=90cm²

    Looking at the photo 3.0 seems about right, maybe 2.5mm as well

    So my earlier comment saying that radiator is getting no air is wrong, it's almost getting the same amount, go figure.
    Surface areas:
    Original M1: ~100cm²
    Modded M1: ~90cm²
     
  36. ghostwich

    ghostwich [H]ard|Gawd

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    Have you checked out the Google spreadsheet?
     
  37. The_Oasis

    The_Oasis Limp Gawd

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    I have, and I'm trying to put together something right now. It seems that the H97i is a good bet, along with the Noctua L9i. I'm not too sure about the PSU yet, though, so I might actually just run with my ATX PSU until the Corsair one comes out (though, I'd have to make sure I'd have clearance with my graphics card as well. I'll work with that...

    Either way, I'm excited to join you guys! This is looking to be like a fun day!
     
  38. raymondo

    raymondo Limp Gawd

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    @ The_Oasis: mind you that ATX PSUs will only fit with a short GPU e.g. Gigabyte GeForce GTX 970 OC and ASUS Geforce GTX 970 DC Mini.
    Noctua L9i will only be good enough for an i3 or i5/i7 CPUs with low TDPs from my personal experience. It's more like a high quality and better boxed cooler. Better get Noctua NH-U9s, Noctua C12 or Noctua C14 if you want air cooling I would say.
     
  39. The_Oasis

    The_Oasis Limp Gawd

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    Good to know! But I've heard that there are some problems with fan placement and such with the C14 (not so for the C12 on the spreadsheet, but I can't actually find it on any retailer).

    Think I'll go for the U9s, then. Cheers!
     
  40. Topsu

    Topsu n00b

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    Installed accelero on my gtx 980, I have two nf-f12 as intakes blowing air to it. I connected both fans to my gpu using y-cable and gelid's adapter.

    The fans are pretty loud even on lowest setting in evga precision. =/ Is there any way to make the fans run slower?

    E: Made a fan curve using evga precision and managed to set the fan profile to much quieter