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NCASE M1: a crowdfunded Mini-ITX case (updates in first post)
- Thread starter wahaha360
- Start date
That's not to say I'm done or we're done, just that the M1 may or may not be produced in the future. It's always been a very niche product, and the high price limits the appeal for a lot of people. Thing is, we can't lower the price without increasing volume, and we can't increase volume without lowering the price. So we have to look at products that are more accessible if we want something sustainable in the long term.Sounds so final
Very nice. The D5 is pretty big, I wasn't sure it could actually be made to fit. Did you have to remove the front audio jacks?
I think the Morpheus could fit using slim fans. Definitely not with normal thickness fans, though.
Telecaster
n00b
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- Feb 6, 2015
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Hey guys,
first post here after following you for over a year
Necere, Wahaha360 you did an outstanding job! - thanks for making this happen - I love my case!
Build spec:
http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1041456770&postcount=367
Pics:
http://imgur.com/gallery/va3xU/new
Anyway my news here is:
It is possible to squeeze in
Apogee Drive II (pump on CPU) next to thick Radiator 38mm (EK-CoolStream), standard 25mm 12cm FAN ...and filters!
It leaves less than 1mm clearance between pump fitting and fan bracket but it works!
Added to compatibility spreadsheet.
Cheers!
Nice job!
But is watercooling the 750ti necessary? Mine is the passively cooled version and even overclocked to 1385mhz it barely breaks 52c degrees, and of course completely silent.
D
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Curiositie
Limp Gawd
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It's same thickness as the alpenfohn Peter II, and I can fit maybe, maaaaybe 20mm thick fans under it, definitely 15mm.
I know for a fact 25mm won't fit though, I've tried.
It is model NH-C12P SE14 (now discontinued). It uses 140mm fan.
EpicFruit, later I´m going to upload some other photos.
Thanks for clearing that up! Was hoping that by some miracle I might be able to use an NH-C14 and a 120mm AIO for the GPU at the same time. Ah well, I think the NH-U9S will still be more than adequate for my usage.
Nice album and build! Congratz
Aibohphobia
[H]ard|Gawd
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I've gotten quotes for my SFX-L bracket, so now it's time to see if there's enough interest to move forward.
Custom SFX-L Bracket Interest Survey
Please only fill out if you're serious about buying one. We need to see if we could hit the minimum order quantity otherwise it'd be too expensive to produce.
For those not familiar, I've developed a custom bracket that would mount a SFX-L PSU up against the front of the case like the ATX bracket so the connectors will clear the end of 10.5" length cards like the reference GTX 970/980.
Pic of prototype installed: http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?p=1041440375&highlight=#post1041440375
Note: Production version would be shifted forward slightly to better clear the card.
Also note: The bracket will block use of anything mounted to the forward part of the side bracket (radiator, fan, HDD, etc.). It will also block any 2.5" drives from being mounted to the inside of the front frame with the PSU in the forward position.
There is an additional set of mounting holes for those with shorter video cards that will let the PSU clear 2 x 2.5" drives. Either way, you can still mount drives behind the front panel.
Custom SFX-L Bracket Interest Survey
Please only fill out if you're serious about buying one. We need to see if we could hit the minimum order quantity otherwise it'd be too expensive to produce.
For those not familiar, I've developed a custom bracket that would mount a SFX-L PSU up against the front of the case like the ATX bracket so the connectors will clear the end of 10.5" length cards like the reference GTX 970/980.
Pic of prototype installed: http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?p=1041440375&highlight=#post1041440375
Note: Production version would be shifted forward slightly to better clear the card.
Also note: The bracket will block use of anything mounted to the forward part of the side bracket (radiator, fan, HDD, etc.). It will also block any 2.5" drives from being mounted to the inside of the front frame with the PSU in the forward position.
There is an additional set of mounting holes for those with shorter video cards that will let the PSU clear 2 x 2.5" drives. Either way, you can still mount drives behind the front panel.
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AFD
2[H]4U
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Then how am I supposed to select "no" and fill out the "why not" section?
Also, you might want to add a note to your post/s that your SFX-L bracket blocks use of the side 3.5" HDD bracket (and/or fans, rads, etc mounted in that spot).. and also, if it blocks use of the 2.5" mount in that location, whether for single or stacked drives (I'm not sure if it does, but it looks like it might).
Aibohphobia
[H]ard|Gawd
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Then how am I supposed to select "no" and fill out the "why not" section?
What if you're starting to fill out the form and your M1 bursts into flames suddenly and unexpectedly negating your need for the bracket
Actually, it seemed silly to have a checkbox that just had "yes" so I added the "no" option.
Good point, I'll edit the post.
It does block any 2.5" mounted to the inside of the front. But there's an additional set of mounting holes for those with shorter cards that would clear those drive mounts.
Do you think the fan would run louder in this configuration since it is pulling in hot air from inside the case? Also would the production version of the bracket allow for 2.5" drives or an ODD mounted in the front?
Aibohphobia
[H]ard|Gawd
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It's really designed for reference cards so you'd only have to worry about heat from the CPU, most of which will exhaust out the top.
At that point I guess it's debatable whether the SX500-LG intaking slightly warmer air is quieter than the SX600-G intaking fresh air but owning both I'd much rather take the SFX-L's subtle clacking over the variety of strange noise the SX600-G makes.
I've edited my post, 2.5" drives behind the front panel or an ODD will still fit.
The screws and rubber grommets stick inside the frame a bit though so I've elongated the mounting holes so someone with a M.2 drive could shift the PSU right up against the frame for that much extra GPU clearance.
AFD
2[H]4U
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What if you're starting to fill out the form and your M1 bursts into flames suddenly and unexpectedly negating your need for the bracket
You know damn well that I certainly won't fill out the form now!
(and thanks for the clarification on possible limitations).
Well just used my friends M1 and a cardboard mockup of the H220x and it is possible, but not in a configuration I'm really comfortable with as far as trying to do that short a run, but being able to actually drain the system if needed. Also had to buy some baby stuff so budget won't quite allow for a full loop right now.
Question for you guys about CPU cooler direction as I feel like I have switched a million times in my head. I have been running an H60 in my FT02 for over two years now with zero issues with noise or performance. Would you recommend going the direction of something along the lines of an H60 or go with something more akin to a Noctua cooler? The main goal is as quiet as possible. I have s reference 970 so I am drawn toward the idea of a NH-U9S because I would like to have both fans on the side as intake.
Question for you guys about CPU cooler direction as I feel like I have switched a million times in my head. I have been running an H60 in my FT02 for over two years now with zero issues with noise or performance. Would you recommend going the direction of something along the lines of an H60 or go with something more akin to a Noctua cooler? The main goal is as quiet as possible. I have s reference 970 so I am drawn toward the idea of a NH-U9S because I would like to have both fans on the side as intake.
The NH-U9S is too high to mount a intake fan on the side bracket. Im running the previous version (SE2) with a reference design 970 (Manli) and a single noctua 120mm intake fan for my use its fine. Recently switched to the 500W SFX-L PSU so now its intake fan and dual 92mm cpu fans together with the 970 fan that i hear.
Im guessing a silent cpu fan solution would use that larger noctua cooler that could double as a 120mm intake and cpu fan? Im happy with my setup but its not truly silent but atleast the SFX-L PSU stays quiet in during normal and moderate use since the fan stays off.
Checked "Yes". Thanks for doing this.
Gimme. That is all.
For anyone interested I've recently completed my Ncase with a internal D5 pump and res together with some decent hardware (2500k, 970, SFX-L).
It was pretty tricky and I wasn't sure everything would fit at first since I was only going on the online specifications.
With some minor modifications I was able to squeeze everything together.
Small album can be found here:
http://imgur.com/a/cf2r7
Well done! Thx for the pics!
Routing that tube behind the front cover is a clever idea!
I am working on a similar D5 project, same GPU block, silver fittings also and oh, your mobo is the one I have in my previous build
I want two of your brackets. One for my v2 and one for my v3 and my brother wants one for his v3 as well. We've both voted in your poll already.
Aibohphobia
[H]ard|Gawd
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Thanks, I guess I should have considered that some people would want more than one bracket.
Glad I put the extra notes field.
smiesznabakteria
n00b
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Probably not and I even suspect that it's actually heating up the CPU. Anyway that was my first WC build and it was hard for me to asses everything on paper before shopping.
The stock cooler was not cooling gpu ram whereas these one sticks to both gpu and all ram - may not have any performance impact but I like that approach
Would you say the noisiest part is just the SFX-L PSU? I had planned on getting the SG600 and just modifying it with a different fan to quiet it down. I had more or less sworn off the SFX-L since I had a reference length card and didn't want to be putting extra pressure on the card.
I really liked the NH-UH9S so I can just have all the heat exhausting instead of potentially re-circulating air with a top/down cooler. When I look at what the cooling would be like to attempt to have 2x120 blowing in and trying to have 2x 92 trying to force it in a different direction would probably cause more harm than good. I could be just overthinking this.
If you're willing to rotate the SFX-L PSU around with the fan facing inside, you should get a little more clearance with the cables, as they're slightly offset and the 24-pin might even clear the GPU in that orientation.
Depending on the position of the CPU socket on your motherboard, you could try orienting the NH-U9S to exhaust upwards, and add another 92mm fan as intake on the rear fan slot. This will bring fresh air directly to the cooler and also expel the heat straight out the top. I don't really think those Noctua NF-A9 PWM fans are that loud at all, you definitely wouldn't hear them over your PSU unless they're running close to full speed. They're also easy on the power draw, so it shouldn't be a problem to connect all 3 of them(push-pull on cooler and one intake) to your CPU header.
I have the Asrock z97e-itx/AC so my socket is pretty high up. If I went with the U9S my current plan was to intake from the case mounted 92 ducted to the cooler and then exhausting up, or doing a push/pull exhausting out the back so both CPU and GPU exhausted in the same direction. Although looking at it now, I'm not sure there would even be space for it to fit a top exhaust very well which is why part of me wonders if I should just throw a single fan radiator AIO cooler on it.
Board shot for reference: http://images.anandtech.com/doci/8276/ASRock Z97E-ITX Top.jpg
I don't think you would have to use a duct if the rear intake is within an inch of the heat sink, you should just let it blow directly into the fins from the side, which might actually help more than a duct would. You could decide whether or not to order a third fan for push-pull after you try positioning it with the included fan, it looks close, but you'll still need to try it first. Even with 1 fan, the U9S is still a very formidable little cooler. A second fan would only lower the load temps by 4-5°C tops, not a huge difference from a performance perspective.
Thanks for the tips. I ebayed some thermal strips. It was "7W/MK". Not sure how trust worthy that was but it was from Phobya.
I put some strips on the chips and it went from 67C at idle down to 51. A good drop but still kinda toasty. I need like a fan on it...
Im not sure if they are conductive. I put strips on the front side facing the sidepanel of the mSATA. The other side of the msata has chips on it but its directly on the motherboard PCB. If I were to put thermal strips on it, would it explode/short out?
Comparing the Z87eITX to the Z97eITX, the cpu is probably a mm or two lower down in the 97 than it was in the 87. I never actually fitted my U9B heatsink in the M1, but in my mockups, the U9B fitted nicely. By fitting nicely, I mean that the heatsink was right up agasint the top panel, within a few mm. I would not say that you have any room at all to add a fan to the top as an exhaust.
Lankius Maximus
n00b
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- May 26, 2014
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I wonder if anyone can offer some advice concerning my next step.
Im looking to upgrade the GPU in my system. My old KFA2 560Ti is dumping alot (and I do mean ALOT) of heat into my build to the point it will shut down the system on graphic intensive tasks (ie gaming).
My idle CPU temps are between 30-35, and then up to 65 ish when gaming from the gpu heat dump.
Im looking at installing a 960 or 970 into my build and would ideally want a mini itx variant. However Im now worried the cooler/ venting will not be nearly substantial enough so would a stock 'blower' card be the way to go?
Ive already removed the bottom 120mm fan as this was simply forcing GPU heat back up into the system.
Also has any one considered compartmentalising between the gpu and cpu? Ideally a thin section of perspex between the two sections with routing for cables?
Thanks for any help.
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I wonder if anyone can offer some advice concerning my next step.
Im looking to upgrade the GPU in my system. My old KFA2 560Ti is dumping alot (and I do mean ALOT) of heat into my build to the point it will shut down the system on graphic intensive tasks (ie gaming).
My idle CPU temps are between 30-35, and then up to 65 ish when gaming from the gpu heat dump.
Im looking at installing a 960 or 970 into my build and would ideally want a mini itx variant. However Im now worried the cooler/ venting will not be nearly substantial enough so would a stock 'blower' card be the way to go?
Ive already removed the bottom 120mm fan as this was simply forcing GPU heat back up into the system.
Also has any one considered compartmentalising between the gpu and cpu? Ideally a thin section of perspex between the two sections with routing for cables?
Thanks for any help.
Proglin made a duct here: http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1041457405&postcount=15773
Blower card is probably the easiest way out without modifications.
Or if you dare to go further, there are some who removed the shroud/fans of the GPU and run two 120mm fans below the GPU, and made ducts from the fans to the heatsink.
This way you'll be able to run the 120mm fans as exhaust to pipe the heat directly out the bottom.
With the Arctic Accelero Xtreme aftermarket cooler, there's no need for ducting.
Here's a picture of my setup with bottom exhaust.
Proglin made a duct here: http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1041457405&postcount=15773
Blower card is probably the easiest way out without modifications.
Or if you dare to go further, there are some who removed the shroud/fans of the GPU and run two 120mm fans below the GPU, and made ducts from the fans to the heatsink.
This way you'll be able to run the 120mm fans as exhaust to pipe the heat directly out the bottom.
With the Arctic Accelero Xtreme aftermarket cooler, there's no need for ducting.
Here's a picture of my setup with bottom exhaust.
What card is that and what kind of temps are you getting?
Qrash
Gawd
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I keep meaning to try this, but work/life keeps getting in the way. I have the short Zotac 970 and I've removed the shroud from its fairly small heatsink so that my bottom mounted 120 fans can blow directly onto it. My plan is to remove the third PCI slot cover and the small rectangular plate above the covers as well. My hope is that adding a cardboard (or perspex) divider just above the graphics card will force all of the GPU airflow out the rear (and maybe the front too, above the I/O connectors) of the case.
It's the (Powercolor PCS+) R9 290, the most power hungry single GPU on the market together with the R9 290x.
When I play CivBE, the GPU peaks at 59C.
I ran Uniengine Valley for 10 minutes and it peaks at 68C.
I checked the motherboard temp at the end of the run and it was at 40C.
Bottom 120mm fans are connected to the GPU.
So I just ordered one of these cases a week ago. Hoping to receive in the next week or 2. Basically looking to create a gaming machine for the living room, by it's nature it may extend to some multimedia, but gaming is the goal here. I want to get it as powerful as possible without disrupting the living room with excessive fan/water noise. I'm willing to pay a premium to accomplish both of these goals.
I don't really want to experiment to much and am looking for proven builds. Closest I have found to what I was looking for was the build Silent PC Review did. I've skimmed parts of this thread, but certainly not the entire thing.
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article1431-page1.html
I'd like to copy that build except maybe with a 980, unless that's going to run too hot and/or raise fan noise a significant amount.
Note: I haven't built a system in years, I've backed off this hobby as I've gotten older, but every system I've ever owned I built. I've never done water cooling, not even one of these AIOs, which is a new concept to me. Until recently I thought all water cooling solutions were pretty custom, requiring external reservoirs and pumps.
So researching the AIO they are using, Arctic Hybrid II, the consensus seems to be excellent on the core and not so much on the VRAM, this is even with a heat sink. SPR left the heat sinks off the VRAM altogether, Beyond that, while they tested the temp for the core, from what I can see did not test VRAM temp. So alarms are sounding around that part of their build.
So in short, is that a concern, is there a better route I can go with a build similar to that? Also 980/970, is there reason to go with one over the other besides price?
Thanks guys.
I don't really want to experiment to much and am looking for proven builds. Closest I have found to what I was looking for was the build Silent PC Review did. I've skimmed parts of this thread, but certainly not the entire thing.
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article1431-page1.html
I'd like to copy that build except maybe with a 980, unless that's going to run too hot and/or raise fan noise a significant amount.
Note: I haven't built a system in years, I've backed off this hobby as I've gotten older, but every system I've ever owned I built. I've never done water cooling, not even one of these AIOs, which is a new concept to me. Until recently I thought all water cooling solutions were pretty custom, requiring external reservoirs and pumps.
So researching the AIO they are using, Arctic Hybrid II, the consensus seems to be excellent on the core and not so much on the VRAM, this is even with a heat sink. SPR left the heat sinks off the VRAM altogether, Beyond that, while they tested the temp for the core, from what I can see did not test VRAM temp. So alarms are sounding around that part of their build.
So in short, is that a concern, is there a better route I can go with a build similar to that? Also 980/970, is there reason to go with one over the other besides price?
Thanks guys.
Can I use both 140mm fans on C14 if I have low profile ram on Asus Maximus Impact and mount the SFX psu to Ncase ATX bracket with silverstone SFX to ATX bracket ?
Asus Maximus Impact VI [Soon to be replaced with VII]
Crucial Ballistix Tactical LP [25.5mm]
Silverstone SFX-L 500W on Ncase ATX bracket with silverstone SFX to ATX bracket
Noctua NH-C14 with both 140mm fans [38mm ram clearance]
EVGA GTX970 SC
I am afraid that lower fan might interfere with Asus sound card, M.2 slot or with dautherboard.
Asus Maximus Impact VI [Soon to be replaced with VII]
Crucial Ballistix Tactical LP [25.5mm]
Silverstone SFX-L 500W on Ncase ATX bracket with silverstone SFX to ATX bracket
Noctua NH-C14 with both 140mm fans [38mm ram clearance]
EVGA GTX970 SC
I am afraid that lower fan might interfere with Asus sound card, M.2 slot or with dautherboard.
Lankius Maximus
n00b
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Thanks for the advice Cows. Definitely will look at some form of basic partition, perspex of otherwise for the long term and I think it would be a good little inexpensive project.
As you mentioned it are your fans exhausting out the bottom of the case or blowing towards the card/ top. If the are blowing upwards it would defeat the purpose of what I want to achieve however I really like the idea of using the space I have and filling it with a cooler. Love how quiet my system is and wand to try and keep it that way.
Used AC solutions before. Reminds me of my old 8800GT 'sniff'
Got rid of the two fans and strapped a 120mm fan on with the frame cut off. Worked like an absolute dream.
Love to do it again if it works in this case.
As you mentioned it are your fans exhausting out the bottom of the case or blowing towards the card/ top. If the are blowing upwards it would defeat the purpose of what I want to achieve however I really like the idea of using the space I have and filling it with a cooler. Love how quiet my system is and wand to try and keep it that way.
Used AC solutions before. Reminds me of my old 8800GT 'sniff'
Got rid of the two fans and strapped a 120mm fan on with the frame cut off. Worked like an absolute dream.
Love to do it again if it works in this case.
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Hey, it's blowing downwards, out the bottom. I think it's the most logical choice to not dump 300W of heat into the case. My two side 120mm fans and back 90mm fan serve as filtered intake.
Lankius Maximus
n00b
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Cow, thanks again. Think I will go for a stock 960 and then do the same.
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goodbyegalaxy
Weaksauce
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The 980 has a slightly higher TDP (165W vs 145W) but it should still be fine, especially if you get that afermarket water cooler. I would even just start with the reference 980 and see what you think from there.
For compatibility and common builds, there is a spreadsheet on the first page where many users have put down their info so that could be another place to start.
Looking over your goals, do you need gaming performance greater than 1080p? If not, a GTX 970 is your sweet spot. A 980 is an amazing card, but if you're gaming on a 1080p TV in the living room, you're gaining very little at the expense of cost, heat, power, and noise. Check the NCASE M1 compatibility sheet (link on the first post) to see which cards will fit. There are also a bunch of assembled builds listed there for you to peruse.
Also, if low noise is your concern, be aware that the Silverstone 450 and 600 power supply used in the SPCR article are a gamble. There's a 50/50 chance you'll get one whose fan will be too loud for your quiet living room needs. You should look into the 500-L version which may limit some of your mounting options.