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NCASE M1: a crowdfunded Mini-ITX case (updates in first post)
- Thread starter wahaha360
- Start date
Hey guys
I'm having a bit of problem
So I finally got back my pump from swiftech, finally happy to back to building
If I fill my res (Ncase M1 res) to about over half of distilled water, the pump is pretty silent.
If I fill the res all the way to the top, the pump is so loud like a jet engine.
Did I get yet another bad pump? Pump is MCP35x
I'm having a bit of problem
So I finally got back my pump from swiftech, finally happy to back to building
If I fill my res (Ncase M1 res) to about over half of distilled water, the pump is pretty silent.
If I fill the res all the way to the top, the pump is so loud like a jet engine.
Did I get yet another bad pump? Pump is MCP35x
It's an interesting board. Probably mostly directed at Asia though. I spy a single HDMI, VGA and two PS/2 connectors for mouse and keyboard.A while back, some people were discussing mATX boards that fit the Ncase M1, basically because there are FlexATX boards (mITX but with 3 PCIe slots) and wrongly named mATX.
Gigabyte was so nice to grace us with a G1 Gaming series H81 chipset board:
An Intel NIC and a Realtek ALC892 sound chip with decent sound-caps apparently. Although the ALC1150 would have been prefered, this board might offer options for people seeking to add a TV tuner or a dedicated sound card.
Link: http://www.gigabyte.com/products/product-page.aspx?pid=5177#ov
It's still very basic with just two rear USB 3.0 ports (no 3.0 front header) and the bare minimum of ports.
How did you prime it? Are you running the pump at 100% (PWM fan header disconnected)? Is the loop full, as well as the reservoir? Are there lots of air bubbles in the water?
Always good to test pump first outside the case, with just the res and a rad.
If you are running the pump at 100% then yes, it will be loud. Mine is running at 1350rpm at the moment and that's just enough for 2 blocks and a rad.
Prime it just means to make sure the pump is entirely filled with water - no air bubbles - before switching it on. Even if the loop seems full the pump impeller itself could be sitting in an air bubble. If you switch it on then, you can damage the ceramic ball that the impeller sits on. That can make it louder. It needs water as lubrication.
The other thing about air bubbles, if you haven't fully bled out the air, there could be pockets of air in the radiator or even in waterblocks. If the water is infused with air bubbles, the pump can be noisy from the air bubbles, even tiny ones.
In the latter situation, you can try tipping the case on either side, and squeezing the tubes. Then put the case face down (so reservoir is highest point). Squeeze the tubes again and check if any air bubbles come into the reservoir. Start the pump again and see if there's any change in the sound.
Why would the pump be louder when the res is full and not when it's half full?
Edit: Thanks Wisk for the awesome help, I have filled the res to the top and it no longer makes the huge jet engine sound once I took out all the air bubbles
I'm still running it overnight to let any bubbles run out
Going to get my liquid metal tomorrow and see how well my temps are
Edit: Thanks Wisk for the awesome help, I have filled the res to the top and it no longer makes the huge jet engine sound once I took out all the air bubbles
I'm still running it overnight to let any bubbles run out
Going to get my liquid metal tomorrow and see how well my temps are
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Ok, so I've swapped out the Corsair H75 for a SilverStone NT06-Pro.. I still have two fans on the side bracket, blowing towards the NT06-Pro. / motherboard and one fan on the bottom blowing up into the case. I also have a video card w/ blower style fan (GTX770), sucking air out of the case and exhausting out the back.
If I have the PSU fan facing inwards (sucking hot air out of the case and blowing it out), will I still have positive pressure in the case? I've removed the Demciflex filters because I found them too restrictive. Couldn't feel the fans blowing any air when I had the filters in.
If I have the PSU fan facing inwards (sucking hot air out of the case and blowing it out), will I still have positive pressure in the case? I've removed the Demciflex filters because I found them too restrictive. Couldn't feel the fans blowing any air when I had the filters in.
Going to get my liquid metal tomorrow and see how well my temps are
Glad to help. A warning about liquid metal: I would only recommend it when the two metal surfaces are nickel. I've seen plenty of examples (e.g. delid thread on OCN) where copper plates absorb the gallium and becomes hard over time.
Of course it depends on the sum of the airflow, but surely 3 x 120mm fans will produce more airflow than the 80mm PSU fan.
thefivetheory
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I'm 100% certain the answer to this is in the thread somewhere, but I am having no luck whatsoever finding it... is it possible to mount 4 HDDs on the side panel (assuming one had an extra mounting bracket)?
thefivetheory
Weaksauce
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Aha. Thank you! I don't suppose you guys have extra HDD cages avaialble to order... I submitted an email via ncases.com in case.
Not sure offhand. W360 will be able to tell you though, so you did the correct thing in sending an email.
Hehe, meant to post that in the v2 build thread, but yeah I'll post pics. up later with all the fans on.
Glad there's a switch on the fans to keep them on. I don't really care for the flashing and spinning modes of the LEDs. I just want them constantly on.
How do you spread it? I'm getting worse thems with the metal than with grease
Pea size in the middle or a thin line across the die?
AFD
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Check out 5:30 in this video..
http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1041013340&postcount=181
Pretty cool delid video, so probably worth watching the whole thing
EDIT: Was assuming you were using Liquid Metal for a delid.. or were you using between IHS and cooler? If the latter, then maybe check out this video instead (LINK). Application seems similar (spreading thinly across the entire surface).
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Um... Wasn't there a roadmap a few months ago detailing the future events of Ncase by Necere? I'm pretty sure it said that there was going to be extra Ncases leftover from production that were going on sale on Oct. 26.
Edit: To my disappointment, it turns out it's only silver, non-ODD V1 editions that are being sold.
Edit: To my disappointment, it turns out it's only silver, non-ODD V1 editions that are being sold.
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AFD
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Anyone tried fanless Seasonic PSU in this case? I'm very close to buying one for my M1, but hesitating on whether it can overheat or not. It would be mounted vertically, and not with the meshed side facing upward that Seasonic recommends (for best heat dissipation I guess).
I'm going for as silent build as possible. But maybe I should consider a semi-fanless instead?
I'm going for as silent build as possible. But maybe I should consider a semi-fanless instead?
Phuncz
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I wouldn't recommend a passive PSU in this case unless there is a fan somehow moving air in there. Heat can build up in this case without any airflow. But you could just look at the quietest 120mm fan PSU's, as long as you keep in regard what limitations this involves when using an ATX PSU inside the Ncase M1.
Aibohphobia
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A semi-fanless PSU will work, I have a Kingwin Lazer Platinum 550W in mine.
With a i7 4771 (cooled by a Noctua C12P) and deshrouded 260X all dumping heat inside the case, the fan on the PSU stayed off almost all the time.
With a i7 4771 (cooled by a Noctua C12P) and deshrouded 260X all dumping heat inside the case, the fan on the PSU stayed off almost all the time.
Thanks. I am aware of the limitations with an ATX PSU. Modular 140mm in order to use full length GPU. But I plan to have a short pcb GTX 970 in there (the new Gigabyte one looks perfect for the task). So a 150-160mm long one is fine for me.
With a bottom mounted fan, or rear case fan, to assist some airflow, I think a passive one might be ok. But as you say, it feels a bit unsafe. Would feel better if someone else had tried it.
I will spend some time on finding an alternative very quiet 120mm ATX PSU.
I too would agree with potential heat concerns due to potentially reduced airflow opportunity. I have had experience with a Seasonic M620 PSU and that silent enough for me to be happy to call practically silent. Its an old one, but seasonics are known for their smooth quiet low rpm fan. A passive PSU is one that relies on airflow from the rest of the case to help it stay cool. The NCase may not be one of the most ideal, but if you have sufficient supportive airflow from the rest of the case then it could be an option. If your adding a low RPM fan onto a passive PSU, you might as well go for one that has a fan within it (As Phuncz suggested). A high efficiency PSU with a semi-fanless design, or more importably, a quiet fan will be quiet enough in my opinion. Realistically the rest of your system would be a bigger concern. For example, your CPU fan must be just as quiet, and you are running a purely SSD only setup for a (properly quiet PSU fan) to be an annoyance.
I know there are PSUs out there with noisier fans, but historically seasonics have been good in my limited experience. More important is choosing a CPU fan with a low enough idle RPM, quiet bearings, and quiet motor. I have dozens of fans I've bought in search of a quiet fan, and after all this money, still haven't found the perfect fan. Some are better suited for specific applications.
e.g. My CPU uses a Scythe Glidestream because it has a very low starting RPM, perfect for CPU fan usage (about 300 rpm), but it ticks very mildly. This was acceptable as it spends half its time off, and the low starting RPM was the most important factor. The slipstream was a quieter option, but its power consumption was higher).
For the PSU, I went with a Scythe Kama 2, because its a quieter motor, but the higher starting voltage/rpm (about 550) was not as much a concern as this fan would not be required to start/stop regularly.
Case bottoms use the Scythe Gentle Typhoons as the give maximum static pressure, a strongly beneficial factor in that location with filters. Bearing noise is its weakness, however its location on the case bottom masks the noise concern.
What is the rest of your build like? (I now see) a 970 is in the works, A decently large, low airflow CPU cooler? And SSDs all round? A motherboard that turns off the CPU fans when not needed? Your loudest component at this stage might be your GPU at anything above idle. Idle fan speeds might be ok, and fortunately modern GPUs have fan profiles that are much kinder on the ear at idle speeds.
Look forward to seeing your build come together.
I know there are PSUs out there with noisier fans, but historically seasonics have been good in my limited experience. More important is choosing a CPU fan with a low enough idle RPM, quiet bearings, and quiet motor. I have dozens of fans I've bought in search of a quiet fan, and after all this money, still haven't found the perfect fan. Some are better suited for specific applications.
e.g. My CPU uses a Scythe Glidestream because it has a very low starting RPM, perfect for CPU fan usage (about 300 rpm), but it ticks very mildly. This was acceptable as it spends half its time off, and the low starting RPM was the most important factor. The slipstream was a quieter option, but its power consumption was higher).
For the PSU, I went with a Scythe Kama 2, because its a quieter motor, but the higher starting voltage/rpm (about 550) was not as much a concern as this fan would not be required to start/stop regularly.
Case bottoms use the Scythe Gentle Typhoons as the give maximum static pressure, a strongly beneficial factor in that location with filters. Bearing noise is its weakness, however its location on the case bottom masks the noise concern.
What is the rest of your build like? (I now see) a 970 is in the works, A decently large, low airflow CPU cooler? And SSDs all round? A motherboard that turns off the CPU fans when not needed? Your loudest component at this stage might be your GPU at anything above idle. Idle fan speeds might be ok, and fortunately modern GPUs have fan profiles that are much kinder on the ear at idle speeds.
Look forward to seeing your build come together.
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Thanks for input. My goal is to make a very tidy, clean and quiet build, by choosing components carefully. Basically, dead silent for normal tasks, and a very light and pleasant whooshing when gaming or doing video encoding.
Having followed the SFX thread, the SX-600G doesn't seem to cut it even if it has improved compared to the 450W one. So made the choice to go full ATX PSU instead. Will likely shorten the PSU cables myself, and sleeve them as well to optimise space and airflow.
Also, I plan to try a i7 4790K and a GTX 970 of some kind (new Gigabyte short pcb one seems nice). I think the above components are what gives best value for the money (I don't plan to upgrade every year, and don't need highest FPS when gaming). Will only use SSDs as well.
I don't plan to overclock initially, but maybe later when I have experience from how my build is performing and sounding. The raw 4 GHz from the i7 4790K is very appealing to me.
For CPU cooler, I will start with a Noctua L9i, PWM controlled. I've read from reviews that it has nice acoustics even at high rpms. I know this little cooler might not be up to the task for i7 4790K (and probably not overclocking), but I might disable turbo boost or even lower the multiplier a little, to study how it behaves. If it really doesn't cut it, I will pick a bigger cooler.
Also, probably going with the ASRock Z97e-itx motherboard. I've heard it has good pwm control in the bios, 1-100%, and not starting at 60% like the Asus Impact. Although I have read conflicting reports about this. The EVGA Stinger has the best looks, but you get very little for the money, otherwise.
16 GB of Crucial Ballistix VLP RAM, to ensure best compatibility with coolers.
All in all, I am doing my first PC build in many years, so I need to learn a bit from the experience. But I am a perfectionist, so I will get this right. That's why I bought the M1 as well, syncs perfectly with what I seek in terms of case aesthetics and effort put into the design process.
If you think anything of the above sounds like a big no-no to start with, please tell me.
FTFY. Modular plugs make the PSU too long, whereas non-modular has a single cable bundle that bypasses long GPUs.
Hello,
is the base frame not a bit wobbly? It has this slim stripes of aluminium and no braces? When I watch the following I have no trust in the base
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GPbBm1YC7Ts&feature=youtu.be
I do not want to talk the M1 down. I love the considered concept, the extreme nice and clean design and the cooling possibilities for this small case. I do want to order next time one.
But I wish the base frame would be made of sturdy steel. I think the weight ascept is pretty uninteresting.
is the base frame not a bit wobbly? It has this slim stripes of aluminium and no braces? When I watch the following I have no trust in the base
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GPbBm1YC7Ts&feature=youtu.be
I do not want to talk the M1 down. I love the considered concept, the extreme nice and clean design and the cooling possibilities for this small case. I do want to order next time one.
But I wish the base frame would be made of sturdy steel. I think the weight ascept is pretty uninteresting.
Half Life
Weaksauce
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Plans a for another batch soon?
It's actually pretty solid - particularly with the panels on. You have to apply some significant force to make it flex like in the video. However, it won't do particularly well if dropped when fully loaded on to hard surfaces or being crushed by errant forklifts. So try to avoid those kind of things and you'll be okay.
I'm going to say... signs point to yes.
Yey! Are there any revisions/changes you think you'll make over V2?
Half Life
Weaksauce
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When? But this time help me to pay, the last time i can't pay on the page with paypal i don't know why, remember?
Yes, though there are only a couple of things that need addressing over the V2 cases:
1. Addition of braces at the bottom corners to mitigate wobbling.
2. Minor changes to the side panels (discussed a bit already).
3. Extra QC for both the above.
Were you the guy in... Mexico? I think we're considering some alternate payment options (maybe even including Bitcoin), so we'll see what we can do.
Half Life
Weaksauce
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Haha yes am i, i think i can pay with paypal on a ad on ebay or amazon. Well i'll waiting for the preoreder
Thanks for the fast response. I do never drop my hardware ^^
How thick are the base frame aluminium? The panels are 1.5 mm thick, right?
It's 1.5mm throughout - the panels, chassis, and all included brackets.
Hi , guys. I want to show my friend worklog forum PcLab.pl
http://forum.pclab.pl/topic/994392-NCASE-M1-HEXXEH-FastMod2/
http://forum.pclab.pl/topic/994392-NCASE-M1-HEXXEH-FastMod2/
Hot damn that's a fine looking build! Love the custom-painted GPU!