NCASE M1: a crowdfunded Mini-ITX case (updates in first post)

[Locrin]

Off topic /

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Cooltek/W1/

Blasphemy

Yeah, it is pretty similar. Lacks the premium look and is also considerably bigger tho.


Dimensions:
NCASE M1: 240 x 160 x 328mm
Cooltek W1: 356 x 242 x 362mm

 

[Skott]

Hey guys, you guys have been very helpful! Tahnk you! I basically summarized what you guys said and replied to Bryan at swiftech. I also stated that everything was still running, besides the pump. If it was a PSU complications, I never got a BSOD.

I doubt he will change his mind nor is there any other representative that handles RMA at swiftech. Need to think of other solutions soon. I am very disappointed though because this would be my first computer component from a manufacture that would not accept an RMA.

Next time you talk to him, or anyone at the company, tell them that quite a few people here are watching your thread and not happy how their policy is. We can as a group tell current and any future builders to avoid their product like the plague. Swiftech may not care but if they are smart they will change their minds. We can keep them from getting a fair amount of future buyers by just spreading the word they are not a fair company to do business with.

 

[Evangelion]

Warm yes, but not too bad compared to the 4770k on that cooler. Pretty sure the AIDA64 FPU-only test or Prime95 small-FFT test will stick you into throttling real quick (probably/hopefully not relevant to real-world usage, though).

So, in that screenshot, your AIDA64 test is running 4-core turbo at 4.4GHz instead of the normal 4.2? And do you know, is yours an L3 or L4 batch of 4790k? Anyway, thanks for the info, really appreciate it!



Cause the Swiftech H220 has abnormally high failure rates?

Its running at stock settings, no changes in the bios, etc. And I can confirm that my i7 4790k is an L4 batch.

 

[AFD]

Its running at stock settings, no changes in the bios, etc. And I can confirm that my i7 4790k is an L4 batch.

Thanks again!

I reseated my C12 cooler and RAM last night (still odd temps and crashes with XMP profiles, and Crucial is being extremely difficult to contact about the issue). Removed my F12 from the side rack and replaced it with the stock P14 directly to the heatsink.. temps improved slightly, though the fan is slightly "ticky" using DC control.

Also just had a weird issue where my 840 Evo dropped 50% in the Samsung Magician benchmarks (ie, 550MB/s read down to 250MB/s).. reseated the Silverstone SATA cables and the readings went back to normal.

Now I just gotta figure out my RAM issue, and also why my wi-fi doesn't work coming out of sleep (sometimes it does, depending on RAM settings.. bluetooth always works). Sometimes the only way to correct the issue is to clear CMOS or unplug the PSU.

Take 1 step forward and 2 steps back

 

[Evangelion]

You're welcome! And right?! Right when you're about to fix a problem suddenly another one appears lol.

I might sell my two drives and get a single 3 tb drive and partition it. That way I can put my H100i in my system and not worry about temps. Then when the 600 watt SFX psu comes out I can oc the shit out of the 4790k!

Still don't know if I'm going to do it or not. Decisions, decisions.

 

[rideyourbike]

Hey guys, I've been following this thread for over a year now, and I have bought a v1 case.

I have only just been able to put my parts into today, I have a ASUS Maximus VI Impact, i7-4790k, Samsung Evo 250GB, 4GB of some memory I had leftover at work, and some generic power supply.

I will be upgrading the memory to 16GB in a week.
I will be adding a graphics card later, but I am waiting on the 600W sfx power supply.

I have a startup problem with the Impact, when I boot the cpu led is lit up.

I read on ASUS website, you need to do a BIOS update to get this working, does that mean I need to install a compatible cpu and update it? Or can I just use the USB Bios function?

Thanks heaps.

 

[Phuncz]

Maybe best to ask that question in the Impact VI topic: http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1777355

Not everyone with that motherboard checks this topic But I'd be very amazed if it allowed to update the BIOS without a working CPU. You'd probably best find someone that happens to have a Socket 1150 CPU laying around or get one cheap like the Intel Celeron G1820 or G1840 ($40-$50).

 

[AFD]

I have only just been able to put my parts into today, I have a ASUS Maximus VI Impact, i7-4790k, Samsung Evo 250GB, 4GB of some memory I had leftover at work, and some generic power supply.

I have a startup problem with the Impact, when I boot the cpu led is lit up.

I read on ASUS website, you need to do a BIOS update to get this working, does that mean I need to install a compatible cpu and update it? Or can I just use the USB Bios function?

I thought a regular Haswell (non-refresh) was needed to update the BIOS to a Haswell-refresh version, but it looks like there's a way to do so without a CPU installed at all, using USB BIOS Flashback..

http://rog.asus.com/339292014/labels/guides/guide-update-your-maximus-vi-or-asus-z87-motherboard-with-usb-bios-flashback-for-devils-canyon-4790k-4690k-cpus/

So, unless you have a spare Haswell (non-refresh) chip lying around, I would just follow the guide above without CPU or RAM installed.

Not too sure about the onboard LED lights.. I have one that's always lit up green. During my first boot, it was red and I couldn't even enter BIOS, but I reseated my RAM and it's been green ever since. I'm guessing if you're booting up without a CPU or RAM (or with an unsupported Haswell-refresh CPU installed), it may also light up red until you update the BIOS.

 

[Phuncz]

Neat feature that you can flash the BIOS without CPU and RAM, didn't know it was possible without something processing it. Apparently they included a dedicated chip for that.

 

[Hanakuso]

we still dont really know for certain if this badboy is gunna fit yet do we? im really hoping it does, because that would be fantastic!

I don't think there's a 100% answer, but we should by now. I'm kinda surprised no one overseas have bought the silverstone SFX-L equivalent yet. Then again i'm guessing most people on hard is from North America.

I'm kinda regretting not buying the SFX-L psu when I had the chance. It could of been in my M1 by now

 

[adudeinblue]

So I am not getting a H220 RMA consideration at all. Wont even get the chance for them to get it and check on it physically. If you are using a Silverstone SFX PSU under 600w PSU with a 780ti or any high end GPU, don't even mention it in your RMA for Swiftech.

I've been playing with the pump lately and just power it externally, and it would run for a few seconds and die out each time. I guess I have a radiator and some fans from this ordeal haha

This was Bryan at Swiftech's last response. A little sad, but it can't be helped and I don't blame him because like everyone is mentioning, it looks like they're being tight on H220 RMAs.

The issue is that you weren’t using a power supply with the recommended wattage from the video card manufacturer, I can’t authorize an RMA for the kit due to this. The reason for this is that it’s likely that due to the power fluctuations through the board due to the lower wattage power supply the pump eventually failed. The way these motherboard power delivery systems work is that they prioritize power. I’m not sure if you’re aware of this, but essentially the board will prioritize power in order to keep critical systems like the GPU functioning properly and this will thus create power fluctuations in other systems. The fact that the pump behaved differently when under stress is a very clear indication of this. If it was just a PWM fan or even a hard drive you likely wouldn’t have had an issue. This isn’t a fan or a hard drive though. It’s a much higher wattage pump that requires quite a bit more current. Also, due to the fact that it’s a PWM device the current needs to stay fairly consistent or you’ll damage the pump. This is very likely what’s happened.

I still do not understand how a CPU Fan Header would not be "prioritized" first. I would imagine the CPU is the absolute necessity component to keep alive in any system.

 

[backfeed]

This was Bryan at Swiftech's last response. A little sad, but it can't be helped and I don't blame him because like everyone is mentioning, it looks like they're being tight on H220 RMAs.

Somebody should explain to this Bryan person what the "recommended wattage" actually means in practice. Your system was in no way straining the psu. He's spewing uneducated bullshit.

 

[backfeed]

double post

 

[AFD]

A little sad, but it can't be helped and I don't blame him because like everyone is mentioning, it looks like they're being tight on H220 RMAs.

Guess they have to be if everyone that buys an H220 eventually needs to RMA

You did send him a typo, and meant to say that you had a 750Ti powered by an AX1500, right?

 

[WiSK]

I've asked in the H220 owner's club thread on OCN, post #11151. Probably will get deleted, but who knows...

Can you explain exactly how a motherboard can regulate current?

I kind of misspoke. This is actually more of a power supply issue. The power supply isn't rated for the hardware that he's using. A 450 watt power supply just won't cut it for that hardware and we're not responsible for third party damage to our products.

It was from the NCase M1 owners club thread on [H]. It's a custom SFF case with production run of 1500, that only fits an SFX PSU. Luckily the ST45SF-G is an exceptional piece of engineering. Until yesterday, the main recommended watercooling unit when people ask was the H220, because of its low profile and easy expandibility for GPU block. Many M1 owners sporting Titans, 780Ti's and 290X's using H220s and AD2s with no issues whatsoever powering them, albeit likely not direct from the motherboard. Some reports of H220 with noisy pumps and whatnot, but generally people speak well of the RMA experience. However, now there's some consternation about recommending the H220 if the RMAs will be denied on a technicality ("780TI draws 600W!" - you know an 8+6 pin GPU may only draw max 22 amps).

Even if the pump is directly connected to the motherboard it's rated for 6W / 0.5 amps, and the board in question is rated for 1 amp on the CPU header.

If there's some corroborative statements from motherboard manufacturers about this "reduced power" effect on fan headers, I would be happy to read it.

Just to be clear: if it's user error, then it's user error. I don't want to meddle in your RMA policy. I'm happy with my own RMA experience from a broken AD2 last year. It's just that the explanation seems to be a bit of a fudge compared to the collective experience in the M1 owners thread.

As I stated previously, the issue in this case is related to the power supply. If this was the first one then I'd have no problem with it. To have this same exact issue multiple times now indicates to me that there's something wrong with his power supply. I'm not going to send him another unit to just have the same exact thing happen again because he's unwilling to address the real issue. I understand that there are other similar systems that aren't having an issue, and if they did start having issues though we'd have to look further into this.

 

[Evangelion]

I have another couple questions for everyone. Well, this one is mainly for those who are currently using/or planning on using a 240mm all in one cooler or custom water loop. How did you guys mount the radiator in the case? I mean, I know how to do it, but I'm talking about the fans in particular. Did any of you notice any increase/decrease of temps/performance with the fans on the outside (pushing air through the radiator) or inside (pulling air through the rad)? Or is the temperature very similar either way?

Also, for those who have a 3.5" drive under their gpus, hows the temp for your hard drive? Does it run pretty warm while the gpu is under load? I'm thinking about adding my H100i back in my system and I just wanted some feedback. Thanks in advance!

 

[WiSK]

Performance of push v pull on radiator fans is indeed similar. (Push is technically better - see here). Many people with issues of dust mount the radiator on the outside, fans inside pulling. This way you can just pop off the side panel and vacuum your rad, rather than having to unscrew all the fans first.

 

[Evangelion]

Awesome. Thanks for the link! Dust really isn't a problem for me. I purchased a set of Demciflex filters and they seem to be doing their job pretty well. I might mount the H100i with the fans on the inside because it does look like it would be easier to clean.

 

[adudeinblue]

Hey WiSK, thanks for sticking your neck out for me. There's really nothing else I can do but change the ST45SF-G to the 600w SFX when it does come out.

I was already content of moving on but for him to say user error is kinda bending the truth. The manual on page 9 even says that you may use your motherboard's PWM capable headers. If the Asus Impact 6 CPU Fan header is not a PWM capable, then it's definitely an user error on my end. I will accept that, but he's saying it's PSU and user error? And multiple time? I went through the original H220 pump, and then the RMA modified pump with the molex connected to it. This is exaggerating now and I sound like some jerk on the net, but my NCase build is nothing special, heck its similiar to many 4770k/Impact 6/H220/ST45SF-G/780Ti builds because its proven to work.

 

[88records]

Originally Posted by Swiftech
As I stated previously, the issue in this case is related to the power supply. If this was the first one then I'd have no problem with it. To have this same exact issue multiple times now indicates to me that there's something wrong with his power supply. I'm not going to send him another unit to just have the same exact thing happen again because he's unwilling to address the real issue. I understand that there are other similar systems that aren't having an issue, and if they did start having issues though we'd have to look further into this.

Hey WiSK, thanks for sticking your neck out for me. There's really nothing else I can do but change the ST45SF-G to the 600w SFX when it does come out.

I was already content of moving on but for him to say user error is kinda bending the truth. The manual on page 9 even says that you may use your motherboard's PWM capable headers. If the Asus Impact 6 CPU Fan header is not a PWM capable, then it's definitely an user error on my end. I will accept that, but he's saying it's PSU and user error? And multiple time? I went through the original H220 pump, and then the RMA modified pump with the molex connected to it. This is exaggerating now and I sound like some jerk on the net, but my NCase build is nothing special, heck its similiar to many 4770k/Impact 6/H220/ST45SF-G/780Ti builds because its proven to work.

Wait he states here (I'm assuming Bryan) that hes already replaced your h220 or something along those lines, so this isn't the first time you've had this issue..?

 

[adudeinblue]

Wait he states here (I'm assuming Bryan) that hes already replaced your h220 or something along those lines, so this isn't the first time you've had this issue..?

The first H220 Pump + a Replacement RMA H220 Pump. So total of 2. The second I just e-mailed Bryan on.

 

[icq99a]

Dear all, my colleague told me there is a package to me this morning. Yes I got M1 V2 already. Pity that I don't have time n chance to show u all the pix Hope u guys get urs soon~

 

[Curiositie]

Dear all, my colleague told me there is a package to me this morning. Yes I got M1 V2 already. Pity that I don't have time n chance to show u all the pix Hope u guys get urs soon~

Whaaaat?

Where do you live? o:

 

[AFD]

Whaaaat?

Where do you live? o:

I'm guessing just across the Keelung River from the Liu-Ti industrial park

And unless they skipped the post office, that's overnight/next-day delivery!


ETA: (Unless OP's package was something other than his M1, or his colleague was just screwing with him )

ETAA: (or.. perhaps W360 was wise and only posted that M1s started shipping out this Tuesday, when they actually started shipping out a week ago? Less "transit" waiting, and deliveries appear to arrive a week earlier! Magic!)

 

[icq99a]

I'm guessing just across the Keelung River from the Liu-Ti industrial park

And unless they skipped the post office, that's overnight/next-day delivery!


ETA: (Unless OP's package was something other than his M1, or his colleague was just screwing with him )

ETAA: (or.. perhaps W360 was wise and only posted that M1s started shipping out this Tuesday, when they actually started shipping out a week ago? Less "transit" waiting, and deliveries appear to arrive a week earlier! Magic!)

Helo guys... don't forget that there is an option of shipping: Taiwan - TW Surface

 

[Frazhna]

I have pretty much decided to get water cooling for my GPU because I just can't keep the temps below the throttle range. I really need to thank adudeinblue for posting about his RMA experience with Swiftech. Now I know that I need to steer clear of that company. You saved me from probable future headaches!

GA-Z87N-Wifi
core i7 4770K
crucial ballistix sport vlp
Silverstone 450W modular SFX
MSI GTX 770 reference design
cooler master Seidon 120V

 

[WiSK]

I have pretty much decided to get water cooling for my GPU because I just can't keep the temps below the throttle range. I really need to thank adudeinblue for posting about his RMA experience with Swiftech. Now I know that I need to steer clear of that company. You saved me from probable future headaches!

GA-Z87N-Wifi
core i7 4770K
crucial ballistix sport vlp
Silverstone 450W modular SFX
MSI GTX 770 reference design
cooler master Seidon 120V

I must say I don't think Swiftech is generally a bad company, but the H220 seems to have more issues than any of their other products. I would still recommend the Apogee Drive II, as a compact solution for the NCase M1. But if you only want CPU cooling, then the Seidon 120V is a good choice.

 

[Phuncz]

Wait he states here (I'm assuming Bryan) that hes already replaced your h220 or something along those lines, so this isn't the first time you've had this issue..?

My H220 came defective out of the box, also the pump. I connected it to a SATA power supply (with the H220-included SATA to Fan splitter) I use to connect hard drives through eSATA. Probably also not Swiftech approved

The pump is the general issue with the H220 and it seems Swiftech is blaming it on the good nature of proper tech support instead of bad engineering.

Oh well, let me list the alternatives, if you know of one that fits, let me know and I'll add it to the post !

Confirmed fitment:
(confirmed by M1 owners to fit and work properly)​

- Corsair Hydro H100i (Amazon.com, Amazon.co.uk)
- Corsair Hydro H105 (Amazon.com, Amazon.co.uk)
- Cooler Master Seidon 240M (Amazon.com, Amazon.co.uk)
- Cooler Master Glacier 240L (Amazon.com, only available in the US) (based on H220 but suspected with more reliable pump)

Within specifications:
(so should fit but not confirmed yet)​

- Enermax LiqTech 240 (Amazon.com, Amazon.co.uk)
- Fractal Design Kelvin S24 (available soon, marketed as expandable)
- Cooler Master Nepton 240M (Amazon.com, Amazon.co.uk)

Might fit or tight fit:
(not sure or dependant on size of other hardware)​

Silverstone Tundra TD02 - (Amazon.com, Amazon.co.uk, confirmation)

 

[Urelure]

Has anyone heard anything regarding the Fractal Design Kelvin release dates? Just returned from a google hunt but couldn't find anything. The minimalist sleek look should go really well withthe overall aestethics of the M1. We'll have to see about quality, but fractal needs to get this right if they want a piece of this market, and it seems like the general opinion is that alphacool rads are great.
If they don't make it to market in time for my build i'll probably just go stock intel while waiting. Should work just fine right?

 

[Tschus]

Share some photos about the V2 I just received.


NCASE M1 V2 by imnogard, on Flickr


NCASE M1 V2 by imnogard, on Flickr

 

[Chosin137]

IT BEGINS!

 

[AFD]

Share some photos about the V2 I just received.

Wow, that is definitely some fast shipping, even locally.. very nice!


Interesting to see the power outlet is back to ground downward again.

Any pictures from an upper-front angle? Iirc, there was a revision with the top panel to help with panel gap.. just wondering if it looks any different.

 

[WiSK]

We'll have to see about quality, but fractal needs to get this right if they want a piece of this market, and it seems like the general opinion is that alphacool rads are great.

The design and price and performance of Alphacool radiators is indeed good, but one issue is important to know. Alphacool do not make an effort to clean the soldering flux and other debris from the inside. Make sure to flush well if you buy those rads.

 

[Rorschach]

No more serial numbers on the plate in the back? Just "v2" ?

 

[AFD]

No more serial numbers on the plate in the back? Just "v2" ?

The serial numbers are exclusive to the first edition cases.

You get minor improvements, we get limited edition serial numbers.. sorry

 

[Rorschach]

Got it. thanks

 

[Sunnni]

Has anyone heard anything regarding the Fractal Design Kelvin release dates? Just returned from a google hunt but couldn't find anything. The minimalist sleek look should go really well withthe overall aestethics of the M1. We'll have to see about quality, but fractal needs to get this right if they want a piece of this market, and it seems like the general opinion is that alphacool rads are great.
If they don't make it to market in time for my build i'll probably just go stock intel while waiting. Should work just fine right?

At the end of this video [3:28] he says August

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQNsMPzChUw

 

[JamboAU]

Share some photos about the V2 I just received.

Nice! can't wait for them to land Down Under

 

[Urelure]

The design and price and performance of Alphacool radiators is indeed good, but one issue is important to know. Alphacool do not make an effort to clean the soldering flux and other debris from the inside. Make sure to flush well if you buy those rads.

I actuallty just read that during my hunt for info. This better not be an issue with the Kelvin though, as they ar sold as expandable closed loop system. We shouldn't be expected to pull the closed loop apart unless we actually expand it. -Just to make sure we're on the same page, i was referring to the fact that the kelvin has alphacool rad.

At the end of this video [3:28] he says August

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQNsMPzChUw.

Thanks! That was really helpful
That means it will be avalable well before I'll manage to put together a build.

 

[WiSK]

I actuallty just read that during my hunt for info. This better not be an issue with the Kelvin though, as they ar sold as expandable closed loop system. We shouldn't be expected to pull the closed loop apart unless we actually expand it. -Just to make sure we're on the same page, i was referring to the fact that the kelvin has alphacool rad.

Ah I see. Yes not to worry, with closed systems there is QC with flushing, filtering, testing pump pressure, etc. before it's vacuum filled with the final coolant mix.