NCASE M1: a crowdfunded Mini-ITX case (updates in first post)

clericc said:
It looks like you reached your goal: Lian Li is collecting feedback for one of their cases before they go into production:

http://www.lian-li.com/lianliblog/prototype-give-us-your-feedback-pc-a51/

Where have i seen that front panel before... :D
But honestly, they reconfigured their tools the the M1, why wouldn't they continue to use that?
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Looks cool, but... I'm not a fan of the PSU mounting in the front of the case rather than the usual back.

Makes cable management for me much harder...
 
well we already bought the perfect case but the point is, a manufacturer is listening to their customers
 
okwchin said:
C14Trimmed10_zps13a20089.jpg
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What is this GPU? How you checked size. I was looking for asus r9 280x but it won´t fit
 
RideTheNun said:
Just a quick question, I need a decent amount of storage in my M1 but would like to not use a 3.5 HDD. 1TB SSD are too expsensive for me so, can someone tell me their opinion about WD Velociraptor 2.5" HDD. http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822236366

I do plan to use a 256GB SSD for the OS too and could maybe, if I have no other option, get a 512GB SSD as a second HDD.
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I have purchased 5 velociraptor drives in the past. They have been great drives, however I no longer buy them. There are better performing solutions out there now and the performance increase doesn't justify the cost. The WD Black, SE, and RE drives out perform all but the latest versions of the velociraptors, and the SE versions are higher capacity and nearly the same price. You can't just take the desktop velociraptor out of its ice pack. They get too hot.

If you want storage less than or equal to 1TB you should just consider the 2.5in 7200RPM WD Black. You can get a 750GB WD7500BPKX for $90 at newegg. WD also just released this week a hybrid version of the same at 1TB with 128GB SSD and 340MB/s reads. That is more than twice the performance of a velociraptor, and will run cool and quiet. Another great sounding option is the just release 2TB 2.5in 9.5mm thick Seagate Spinpoint M9T (made by Samsung).

Your best bet is to just to buy a 2.5in HDD and cache it on a 64GB partition of your SSD using Intel's caching technology. That will give you the best performance at the lowest cost, you can choose which brands you buy, and you already have the SSD.
 
They sell those raptors as 2.5" drives as well, with no "ice pack" so I am sure you can use them like that. I have thought about using Raptors too, for storage, but in the end I think I am going to go with an SSHD Hybrid drive. I am planning to go full watercooling, video included, so I think I will go with the new 3.5" Hybrid 2TB drive, its way cheap, only like $109 right now. I should be able to fit it on the bottom, on the floor. If I can fit 2 of them in there, I will, and stripe them. That should provide pretty decent perf, IMHO. I will use an SSD for my main os drive, though.
 
adamantium said:
I have purchased 5 velociraptor drives in the past. They have been great drives, however I no longer buy them. There are better performing solutions out there now and the performance increase doesn't justify the cost. The WD Black, SE, and RE drives out perform all but the latest versions of the velociraptors, and the SE versions are higher capacity and nearly the same price. You can't just take the desktop velociraptor out of its ice pack. They get too hot.

If you want storage less than or equal to 1TB you should just consider the 2.5in 7200RPM WD Black. You can get a 750GB WD7500BPKX for $90 at newegg. WD also just released this week a hybrid version of the same at 1TB with 128GB SSD and 340MB/s reads. That is more than twice the performance of a velociraptor, and will run cool and quiet. Another great sounding option is the just release 2TB 2.5in 9.5mm thick Seagate Spinpoint M9T (made by Samsung).

Your best bet is to just to buy a 2.5in HDD and cache it on a 64GB partition of your SSD using Intel's caching technology. That will give you the best performance at the lowest cost, you can choose which brands you buy, and you already have the SSD.
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Thanks! This would be a great drive then for my need ? Speaking of it... 90$ at newegg.ca right now. http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Produc...=10592396&PID=1646355&SID=7240515.35-14056631
 
The Velociraptors without Icepack heatsinks only work in stuff like SAS backplanes and rackservers. These have a lot of air moving over the disks so it's viable. But I wouldn't place them in most desktop cases unless it has a fan pulling air over it plentifully. It won't survive some casual whiffs of air gently touching it's brimstone surface, it needs the forceful hand of aerodynamic fury pass it as a whirlwind to keep it in play.
 
Phuncz said:
The Velociraptors without Icepack heatsinks only work in stuff like SAS backplanes and rackservers. These have a lot of air moving over the disks so it's viable. But I wouldn't place them in most desktop cases unless it has a fan pulling air over it plentifully. It won't survive some casual whiffs of air gently touching it's brimstone surface, it needs the forceful hand of aerodynamic fury pass it as a whirlwind to keep it in play.
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Great description. :)

If you want to use your one expansion slot you could put a SAS controller in the M1 and then fill it with WD XEs at $500+ per drive, and four high CFM Delta fans. :eek:
 
Ordered my cooling parts! :)

EK Radeon R9-290X VGA Liquid Cooling Block - Acetal + Nickel (EK-FC R9-290X - Acetal+Nickel)
Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra 100% Metal Thermal Interface Material
Swiftech MCR220 "Quiet Power" 2 x 120mm Radiator w/ Reservoir (MCR220-QP Res. R2)
Swiftech Apogee Drive II Pump & CPU Waterblock Combo - Sockets 115x/1366 (APD2-1155-1366)
(2) Alphacool G1/4 Thread 90° Rotary 3/8" ID Barbs - Copper
(4) Alphacool G1/4 Thread 3/8" (10mm) ID FatBoy Barb - Copper
(5feet) Tygon E-1000 3/8" ID (1/2" OD) - Plasticizer Free Flexible Tubing (ADK00027)
4-Pin Molex / SATA Power Distribution PCB 8x PWM + 2x 4-pin Block (MMT-PCB-4-8P2M1S)
(4) Cooler Master Blade Master 120mm x 25mm PWM Fan (R4-BMBS-20PK-R0)
(1) Noiseblocker NB-BlackSilentFan XE2 92mmx25mm Ultra Quiet Fan - 1800 RPM - 21 dBA

For hardware:
CPU 4770K
GPU 290X
MB Asus mITX pro or impact
PS Corsair CX750
RAM Samsung magic ram

Distilled water and biocide

If I screwed up, please let me know!!!
 
Nightbird said:
....
Swiftech MCR220 "Quiet Power" 2 x 120mm Radiator w/ Reservoir (MCR220-QP Res. R2)
...
PS Corsair CX750
...

If I screwed up, please let me know!!!
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You screwed up :p Can't use an ATX PSU and 240mm rad at the same time.
 
Yeah it will probably fit on the bottom but it won't perform.

Tr8Y45Nl.jpg


Considering the fan is 25mm high and the radiator is 34mm thick, you can't even fit the fan filters most likely.
 
This is a 27mm thick H60 rad + 25mm thick fan:

uVfegkD.jpg


Same rad w/Scythe 12mm thick fan:

YTKPBhz.jpg


It's clear that a 35mm thick rad + 25mm thick fan won't fit at all underneath a waterblocked GPU. With slim fans - probably. But airflow will be poor.

The other issue is the length. Even a 275mm long rad will have problems fitting; I can guarantee that a 300mm long rad will require removal of the front I/O, at the very least.
 
Necere said:
You screwed up :p Can't use an ATX PSU and 240mm rad at the same time.
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I'm glad to have found this out now rather than later. I haven't ordered that PSU yet thank goodness.



I see a lot of people "planning" to use the ST45SF-G PSU with a 290x and 4770K. Is this SFX power supply sufficient for this much hardware? You definitely don't want to do Prime and Furmark at the same time but for regular gaming without much overclocking.

I see that the HardOCP review of the 290X shows 440 watts, but this is with the i7 3770K OCed to 4.8ghz. I don't plan to OC that much but it'll still be close since I have more fans and 1 pump to power...
 
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Singapore here and I got one of my two silver cases yesterday. Truly the most beautiful case in both form and function, only to be exceeded by any future versions of M1. I also quite like the silver feet because they're shiny.
 
hydroforge said:
Woo! My M1 has finally arrived in the country. Just a couple more weeks at the most :D
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Note: Country = Australia.

Us Yanks are still impatiently waiting for a couple boats to arrive on the east coast any day now. Saw your post and got excited, until I looked up your handle in the spreadsheets.

Congrats, though! ;)
 
Just had a thought, has anyone suggested using a PCI-E riser to lower the GPU to the bottom two mounting brackets, would that provide enough room for modular/longer/ATX PSU and a GPU?

AFD said:
Note: Country = Australia.

Us Yanks are still impatiently waiting for a couple boats to arrive on the east coast any day now. Saw your post and got excited, until I looked up your handle in the spreadsheets.

Congrats, though! ;)
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Haha thanks, I've been checking that iPost tracker at least twice a day. Today I decided to visit and ask my local post office and they told me my M1 arrived in Sydney 10am this morning. Sure enough, I checked the iPost tracker immediately and it too was updated.

I just went shopping for parts and picked up a ASRock Z77E-ITX mobo and the ever popular Silverstone ST45SF-G for dirt cheap, brand new. All I need now are those custom Cubitek PSU black ribbon cables, MDPC crimping tool/kit and of course a Swiftetch H220/CoolerMaster Seidon 240 and I'll be ready for my M1.
 
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Where did you buy your parts? PCCG was my source for my PSU. I'm in West Australia though.
 
I should've figured people would try this, despite my attempts to discourage it:

cbjG0ij.jpg


Alphacool ST30 rads on the bottom and side (EDIT: bottom rad is actually a 24mm thick Chinese tube fin rad, not an ST30) , Scythe Slipstream Slim fans on the bottom. GTX780 Hydro Copper. You can see how tight everything is.

UumbzkZ.jpg


t9rTasO.jpg


Not sure where he's planning on having the pump/res... outside rear seems like the only option. Those angle fittings on the GPU are too tall as well.

More pics in the buildlog thread.
 
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Nightbird said:
I see a lot of people "planning" to use the ST45SF-G PSU with a 290x and 4770K. Is this SFX power supply sufficient for this much hardware? You definitely don't want to do Prime and Furmark at the same time but for regular gaming without much overclocking.
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Phuncz has been running more or less the same hardware in his build in the M1 for a few weeks now without issue.
 
Necere said:
Phuncz has been running more or less the same hardware in his build in the M1 for a few weeks now without issue.
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Thanks Necere, you saved me time !

I've indeed been running a Core i5-4670K (comparison) with an R9 290X reference model for a few weeks, playing Battlefield 4 but also torturing it with FurMark. I have yet to see any instability, except the ones BF4 produces but that's because it's so buggy at the moment.
 
Managed to fit this beast inside

29lisci.jpg


Had to disassemble its front bracket but the tightest fit were the power cables It was basically within a millimeter if it would fit or not. Had to apply alot of pressure to fit the side panel which by looking now at the picture to my amazement held firmly closed

jl33ep.jpg


First attempt to boot went ok although I didnt get a picture to my screen so I tried to restart but nothing happened. I tried again and the case fans and gpu fans span for a second and then quickly shut down. They did this for three times as if trying to boot but didnt have anough juice.

Im wondering is my 450w sfx bronze not powerful enough to run this card? This seems strange because it started nicely the first time.

2600k
7970 lightning
ssd
silverstone 450w bronze

EDIT:
So Im using one 6pin->8pin adapter. Would a molex be better?
 
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With pressure on the front end of the card (power plugs) did the back end stay well seated in the PCIe slot?
 
FinnishNerdmare said:
Had to apply alot of pressure to fit the side panel which by looking now at the picture to my amazement held firmly closed
...
Im wondering is my 450w sfx bronze not powerful enough to run this card?
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100W PSU is enough to boot most anything, 450W limit is only going to be a concern after you get past the windows log in screen.

Take the side panel off, remove the card and inspect for damage. Then try mounting again and leaving the case open instead of forcing anything :)
 
DOhZ said:
With pressure on the front end of the card (power plugs) did the back end stay well seated in the PCIe slot?
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Just checked, no. Thats a great point that I hadnt thought about though. I wish it was that easy,

Im looking at the specs of ST45SF-G but I really doubt it would change anything as it delivers only one amp more than bronze version, 37amp total.

Could it be my bronze is malfunctioning? I am almost certain that I saw someone run 680 TOP version with same bronze not to mention 290x.

WiSK said:
100W PSU is enough to boot most anything, 450W limit is only going to be a concern after you get past the windows log in screen.

Take the side panel off, remove the card and inspect for damage. Then try mounting again and leaving the case open instead of forcing anything :)
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Will do but not looking forward to taking it back out :/
 
FinnishNerdmare said:
Just checked, no. Thats a great point that I hadnt thought about though. I wish it was that easy,

Im looking at the specs of ST45SF-G but I really doubt it would change anything as it delivers only one amp more than bronze version, 37amp total.

Could it be my bronze is malfunctioning? I am almost certain that I saw someone run 680 TOP version with same bronze not to mention 290x.

Will do but not looking forward to taking it back out :/
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Actually, if voltage ain't stable enough you could trip the OCP on the psu whereas you wouldn't on other psus.

Example:

A card requires 240W. If you deliver it @ 12 stable volts, its 20A. Now, if the ocp is set at 20.5A, you won't have a problem. On the other hand, if you can only deliver @ 11.5V, you will require MORE than 20A to reach those 240W and, thus, the OCP will trip.

Also, on higher end componentes (and the Gold unit is, by all means, a hig end unit) you have higher tolerances. For instance, its kinda possible that the OCP (provided it has one... I'm not worried because I'm not overloading it, but people with 290 or 290X should look into it) is rated for higher than 450W. So, by all means, if you keep the unit cool enough the difference between the Bronze and the Gold might be of around 60-100W. Maybe more if you factor other things.

In the end, the more efficient, the less heat produced. The less heat produced, the more efficient. Its like a dog trying to bite his tail. A loop.

---

Which so happens its exactly what happens. When the psu is loaded with 400W, the 12V goes down far, far below spec. Id stop using that psu right away. Its not good, not a high loads that we use it for. (note: hight loads meaning 60% or above, which is what we load our 450W units).

http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story3&reid=196
 
Just took the card out and with good inspection no damage was found. I changed to a fresh 6pin->8pin adapter, the previous was already bent by the pressure of the side panel, still no go - it did the same, fans spun 4 times and leds light on. It is the psu no doubt.

prava said:
Which so happens its exactly what happens. When the psu is loaded with 400W, the 12V goes down far, far below spec. Id stop using that psu right away. Its not good, not a high loads that we use it for. (note: hight loads meaning 60% or above, which is what we load our 450W units).http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story3&reid=196
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Am I reading this correctly, you are saying that with such big loads the irregularities in voltages become too great and this could potentially damage components? And the Gold version could possibly work?

Either way Im ordering ST45SF-G although I was planning on waiting for the rumored new 550w sfx byt Silverstone.
 
FinnishNerdmare said:
It is the psu no doubt.

Am I reading this correctly, you are saying that with such big loads the irregularities in voltages become too great and this could potentially damage components? And the Gold version could possibly work?
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As I understand it, you haven't actually loaded the GPU yet. You switched on once and got no picture, then restarted and got nothing at all. So there hasn't been any significant load on the system to corroborate what Prava is suggesting.
 
FinnishNerdmare said:
Just took the card out and with good inspection no damage was found. I changed to a fresh 6pin->8pin adapter, the previous was already bent by the pressure of the side panel, still no go - it did the same, fans spun 4 times and leds light on. It is the psu no doubt.



Am I reading this correctly, you are saying that with such big loads the irregularities in voltages become too great and this could potentially damage components? And the Gold version could possibly work?
...
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That is basically what he is saying. The irregularities in voltage - primarily the drop in voltage on the 12v rail causes a need for higher current(Amps) to be drawn to maintain the required Power (P=VA), this can potentially damage components.
 
Thank you all for help, it is getting very offtopic so I think it is better that I take this to support forums.

Ive been battling with this now for about 5 hours and it is really starting to get on my nerves so I think thats it for today. A little progress has still been made: Lightining has this stupid 'reactor' chip on its back plate to give gpu more stability and power. I removed it and after that have been able to start the pc but still no picture output...:mad: as far as I know the card itself might be doa,

Well, at least we learned that a 12.1" 7970 Lightining can be fitted in M1 :rolleyes: powering it might be the problem..
 
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