My friend spends 9 hours a day gaming. Do you know any addicts? How can we help them?

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Spare-Flair

Supreme [H]ardness
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I have a friend who's been married for 10 months. He 28 years old, living in his mother's basement with his wife, and he's addicted to an MMO. He has an education degree from university but doesn't want to be a teacher and now has a dead-end $16/hour job at a call center and it's affecting his life, his friends, and his family.

According to my calculations and his online World of Tanks profile, he's spent 1736.25 hours or 72 entire days of the past 195 days of his life playing or 8.9 hours/17 waking hours (assuming 7 hours of sleep) a day in that game.

Basically he's spent over 50% of his entire waking life for almost the past year playing this game. Do you guys have any friends who are addicted to gaming? We all want to help him but he won't help himself. I've confronted him with the fact that over half of his life has been spent in this game but he says he finds little pleasure in anything else in life.

We wanted to have some kind of intervention because this is concerning to all his friends and family. Almost 9 hours a day is spent playing this game and we are all very concerned but nothing seems to budge or change him. His wife would be the logical one to apply pressure but she is a traditional wife (the kind you almost don't find anymore) and permits this activity because she supports what makes her husband happy (yeah, I know deep down we all want to marry a girl like this, but I think she needs to be a little more proactive).

Do you guys have any other stories about people you know who are addicted to games and have had their lives fall apart or have escaped and changed? What can be done? I'm reminded of the Kotaku Everquest addiction article but none of the factors that motivated that guy will seem to work here. http://kotaku.com/5384643/i-kept-playing--the-costs-of-my-gaming-addiction

Many of us are gamers here so we can all relate to how something like this can be addictive but I need some advice on how to get someone to stop and look around at some healthier options and moderation, if not for himself, then for his family.
 
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You can't do anything other than make it clear you view his gaming as aberrant behavior. People only change when they want to change.
 
Valshistixol said:
At least his wife isn't a judgemental douche.
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This. Who gives a shit? Personally, I can't stand people who "meddle" and that's exactly what you're doing. Go on with your life, and stop worrying about what other people are doing with theirs...shit drives me up a wall.

If it's as bad as what you say, it will catch up to him in some way or another. Say your piece to his face and carry on.
 
Well, it seems to me he goes to work, doesn't he? If he is able to do mandatory stuff such as work then he is not as deep as you think it is.

If you want to have him out of the gaming world you will have to find him something he likes...which won't be easy. I'm telling you because for years I've played even more than that because I had no better thing to do (and I kid you not, 10h+ a day, for months). Sure, I could go to work no problem but, as soon as I had a minute left, I'd go back to my game again.

It may be hard for people to understand, but its not that you are addicted or something...its just that you find everything else plain boring. So, when you have to choose mentally between staff you don't like or staff you do like then...its an easy choice.

So, you have a pretty hard challenge over you, and you will have to try PLENTY of stuff

PS: about me? I had no addiction. As it was, the best thing I had to do was gaming...and that I did, but when other stuff I liked appeared I had no problem not to play for days...and even weeks. Right now, for example, I don't play a lot because I don't find it as exciting as I used to. I've got an mtb which occupies plenty of time every week (around 10 hours) and I try to do other social stuff.

But still, don't force him. As far as he knows, he likes what he does, and has no reason not to. So, you should try to find out stuff he likes...
 
I wish I had 9 hours everyday I could devote to gaming. :( Lately I'm lucky if I get 9 hours of gaming in a month...
 
erf said:
This. Who gives a shit? Personally, I can't stand people who "meddle" and that's exactly what you're doing. Go on with your life, and stop worrying about what other people are doing with theirs...shit drives me up a wall.

If it's as bad as what you say, it will catch up to him in some way or another. Say your piece to his face and carry on.
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I'm glad that you are not my friend who would just let me spiral into addictions until I hit rock bottom. Some people care about their friends and this guy is almost family. Even if I've left out the negative consequences to his life and to his family, they are there. Everything isn't about you or about people as individuals. Their actions affect those around them and people need to take responsibility to help others.
 
Spare-Flair said:
I'm glad that you are not my friend who would just let me spiral into addictions until I hit rock bottom.
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And I'm glad you aren't my "friend" who choses to meddle in my personal affairs. Fair trade I would say. Like I said, the healthiest thing you can do is say how you feel TO HIS FACE...then carry on homie.

Edit: I'm not sure how old you are, or what you've seen in your lifetime but, I'm speaking from experience...having been on both sides of the fence, albeit in different circumstances.

Edit #2: If more people in this world tended to their own business instead of worrying about others this world would be proper...I speak purely on principle.
 
Spare-Flair said:
I've confronted him with the fact that over half of his life has been spent in this game but he says he finds little pleasure in anything else in life.
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Then there are probably other issues beyond 'I LIKE GAMES'. Things most people aren't likely qualified to handle. He sounds depressed. If you're close enough, suggest he seeks help, and then leave it. Hounding him won't help him at all.
 
erf said:
And I'm glad you aren't my "friend" who choses to meddle in my personal affairs. Fair trade I would say. Like I said, the healthiest thing you can do is say how you feel TO HIS FACE...then carry on homie.

Edit: I'm not sure how old you are, or what you've seen in your lifetime but, I'm speaking from experience...having been on both sides of the fence, albeit in different circumstances.

Edit #2: If more people in this world tended to their own business instead of worrying about others this world would be proper...I speak purely on principle.
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In general or principle, you are correct. However, sometimes the needs of the few outweigh the needs of the many. Friends know which is which.
 
Screw the video game... i'm more concerned about him being married for 10 months, 28 years old, and living in his mother's basement. ... Wait a second? He's married? How does that happen?
 
I'm all for friends "meddling" for the better. How would I help him? I'm not sure on everything, but I'd probably try to get him to see how too much gaming makes the game feel like a job, chore, responsibility, etc. I know that when I played MMOs, the game becomes a huge chore just to 'keep up'. After getting fed up with too much it felt like sweet release to just toss the game aside and declare myself done with it. Only afterwards did I realize how captivated (i.e. bondage) I was.
 
Yeah, sounds like depression more than anything else. I think the term "gaming addiction" is a bit misleading, I don't really see games as addictive in and of themselves and I don't think something like an intervention would be benficial in most cases.
 
its kinda sad(?) but hey
its better(?) than alcoholism

what else should he be doing? most americans do jackshit when not working their pencil pushing jobs

maybe yall should go outside and smoke some dope

anyway....i gotta get this game!
 
He's not going to change unless he wants to. I've gone through this stuff too.

And I wouldn't consider it an addiction in the sense that he can't stop. He probably just doesn't want to. prava hit it spot on when he said everything else just seems boring. Help him realize real life is more exciting than the video game and he'll come out of it.

But honestly, if he's having more fun in the game than he is going out and drinking or BBQing or watching football, it'll be hard to get him to convince him to do those type of things.

I think you're doing a good job of looking out for him, but you shouldn't force your ideals on him either.

[Edit:] And living with the parents is abnormal for us but probably not so much for his wife. But yeah, even he should see the problem with your couple sentences (married for 10 months, 28 years old, living in mom's basement)
 
Magnus said:
In general or principle, you are correct. However, sometimes the needs of the few outweigh the needs of the many. Friends know which is which.
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My problem with the OP's thread in the first place IS the fact that he's bringing it to a public forum...also that it comes across as though he thinks his "friend" should be reaching for some socially accepted "norm" based on some set of standards that he feels are generally more healthy or rewarding.

To me, a principle, is a principle, is a principle. You either live by them or you don't. I'll state it again...the best thing a "friend" can do in a situation like this is to speak their mind, frankly, and carry on.
 
To be honest, I don't know there's anything you can do to help them. In my experience, this sort of thing runs its course on its own. When the satisfaction / sense of accomplishment he gets from the game is no longer worth the amount of time / effort put into it (there are various things that can lead to this point), he'll "snap out of it".
 
$20 says he alt-tabs out of the game, letting it run all the time, even when he's not there. He probably doesn't play nearly as much as his profile says.
 
J W said:
$20 says he alt-tabs out of the game, letting it run all the time, even when he's not there. He probably doesn't play nearly as much as his profile says.
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It's not tracking hours spent with the game loaded up but rounds played. You have to be actively involved in rounds played like in any other deathmatch/CTF type game which this is. The average round is about 15 minutes.
 
Spare-Flair said:
It's not tracking hours spent with the game loaded up but rounds played. You have to be actively involved in rounds played like in any other deathmatch/CTF type game which this is. The average round is about 15 minutes.
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But he could be so freaking pro that *his* average round is only 5 minutes. Right?
 
erf said:
My problem with the OP's thread in the first place IS the fact that he's bringing it to a public forum...also that it comes across as though he thinks his "friend" should be reaching for some socially accepted "norm" based on some set of standards that he feels are generally more healthy or rewarding.

To me, a principle, is a principle, is a principle. You either live by them or you don't. I'll state it again...the best thing a "friend" can do in a situation like this is to speak their mind, frankly, and carry on.
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I'm assuming he brought it to the forums here because as a collection of geeks and gamers, we might have some insight to the matter. Like you, he is comparing his friends behavior to what he considers normal or acceptable.

As far as principles, they are guides not, a road map to success. Blindly following ANY principle without question or periodic revue is even more foolish than following none.
 
if he has kids that is totally and unarguablyunacceptable. any man who works, sleeps, and plays 9 hours of games a day is being a terrible father no matter how you cut it. if his wife is upset with him then she can do something to make him change or leave him or whatever, she has options. kids do not have those options. if he and his wife are happy (which i doubt) then theres no problem that i see. simply spending all your time doing something you love is not unhealthy in and of itself. it is only when it affects the people who love and depend on us that outside intervention is necessary. i really hope this guy doesnt have kids.
 
Honestly, I think a lot of the overreaction about people gaming too much is just because it's new technology.

I've known people who work, come home, and then spend all their time in their personal woodworking shop - nobody called them crazy or depressed, it was just a hobby they were into.

Granted, after thirty years of hobbyist woodworking, you've got some impressive tangible shit to show for it... but it's still just a hobby.
 
erf said:
My problem with the OP's thread in the first place IS the fact that he's bringing it to a public forum...also that it comes across as though he thinks his "friend" should be reaching for some socially accepted "norm" based on some set of standards that he feels are generally more healthy or rewarding.

To me, a principle, is a principle, is a principle. You either live by them or you don't. I'll state it again...the best thing a "friend" can do in a situation like this is to speak their mind, frankly, and carry on.
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And my principle is that principles like yours - that encourage a haphazard lack of responsibility to have concern for and to help others is not something you should expect to apply to everyone else.

If my own kid was suffering from alcoholism and it was having a negative effect on his life and the lives of others around him, I would have a responsibility to do more than to "speak my mind" and let him continue on to ruin his own life and the lives of others.

I am not imposing a set of standards that I feel is generally more healthy or rewarding. I am imposing a set of standards that IS more healthy and rewarding because his economic situation, debt levels, etc. (and other factors) is dire beyond what I have explained here.

erf said:
Edit #2: If more people in this world tended to their own business instead of worrying about others this world would be proper...I speak purely on principle.
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A black&white, unmoving, unfeeling, compassionate, inflexible principle that cannot bend or change with realities or subtle changes in context and is followed blindly is just stubbornness and potentially harmful in many situations. Your lack of feeling of responsibility to your fellow man is appalling. I hate meddlers too but everybody needs a friend and everybody needs help sometimes, even if they don't know how to ask for it.

If more people in this world helped their fellow man instead of only tending to their own business this world would be proper...I speak purely on principle.
 
ekuest said:
if he has kids that is totally and unarguablyunacceptable. any man who works, sleeps, and plays 9 hours of games a day is being a terrible father no matter how you cut it. if his wife is upset with him then she can do something to make him change or leave him or whatever, she has options. kids do not have those options. if he and his wife are happy (which i doubt) then theres no problem that i see. simply spending all your time doing something you love is not unhealthy in and of itself. it is only when it affects the people who love and depend on us that outside intervention is necessary. i really hope this guy doesnt have kids.
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Yes, children are part of the issue. I don't want to get any deeper into that or the personal details. I was just looking for insight on how to approach this from people who are healthy gamers but can also relate to the problem at hand. We've all had our bouts of being addicted to a game at one time or another but not to excess and the detriment of your family I hope.
 
Spare-Flair said:
Yes, children are part of the issue. I don't want to get any deeper into that or the personal details. I was just looking for advice on how to approach this.
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Oh, I missed that he has kids. That's not great then. Shit, since I've gotten a dog, my gaming time has been cut *easily* in half - I get an hour a day, max.
 
AmberClad said:
To be honest, I don't know there's anything you can do to help them. In my experience, this sort of thing runs its course on its own. When the satisfaction / sense of accomplishment he gets from the game is no longer worth the amount of time / effort put into it (there are various things that can lead to this point), he'll "snap out of it".
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This x2. I was like this with wow for a few years. Now I play games like 4 hours a week if that. It's something he has to just get over himself. Of course I wasn't married and didn't have kids. My parents eventually got sick of it and told me to get a different hobby. I bought a motorcycle, but I like that 4 billion times more then I did WoW.
 
Magnus said:
I'm assuming he brought it to the forums here because as a collection of geeks and gamers, we might have some insight to the matter. Like you, he is comparing his friends behavior to what he considers normal or acceptable.

As far as principles, they are guides not, a road map to success. Blindly following ANY principle without question or periodic revue is even more foolish than following none.
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True enough, but the fact that someone is posting another man's business on a public internet forum tells me enough about the person in question...especially in in the context in which it was stated.

If you ever catch me on a public internet forum asking for help on how to bail a friend out of a gaming addiction...well you wouldn't...because quite frankly, the principle in question (minding your own damn business), is one that generally leads to a "healthy" outcome. Meddling is the last thing this dude needs to be doing.

The best thing this dude can do is to speak to his "friend", frankly, and move along.
 
erf said:
True enough, but the fact that someone is posting another man's business on a public internet forum tells me enough about the person in question...especially in in the context in which it was stated.

If you ever catch me on a public internet forum asking for help on how to bail a friend out of a gaming addiction...well you wouldn't...because quite frankly, the principle in question (minding your own damn business), is one that generally leads to a "healthy" outcome. Meddling is the last thing this dude needs to be doing.

The best thing this dude can do is to speak to his "friend", frankly, and move along.
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erf, you must be a grumpy old bastard :)

Everybody needs to ask for help and advice from time to time. That's part of being human. I suppose you don't believe in things like AA either? I've tried minding my own damn business with other people that I know with their own addictions (albeit worse ones) and you know what? They've ended up dead. So I don't know how old you are (as you stated to me previously) but isn't there a small chance you've missed something with this almighty principle of yours?
 
So Is World of Tanks like an MMO? Maybe he has internet friends with whom he enjoys socializing? Mabybe his wife also plays? Maybe he listens to music while he plays? Maybe he watches television while he plays?

You're his friend so you likely share a common interest someplace. Exploit whatever that common interest is. Don't have one? Get drunk together; you can offer to pay for it. There's a line from the Simpsons which is great:

Homer Simpson said:
Here’s to alcohol, the cause of — and solution to — all life’s problems.
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J W said:
So Is World of Tanks like an MMO? Maybe he has internet friends with whom he enjoys socializing? Mabybe his wife also plays? Maybe he listens to music while he plays? Maybe he watches television while he plays?

You're his friend so you likely share a common interest someplace. Exploit whatever that common interest is. Don't have one? Get drunk together; you can offer to pay for it. There's a line from the Simpsons which is great:
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Yeah, I've tried my best to exploit other avenues of interest or to get him to leave his house and do things with his friends or even as a bridging step, to get into games that are less addictive to play with his friends but he won't do it. Keeps saying that it's the only thing he enjoys in life and he'll ignore all his other friends to play alone if he has to.
 
Spare-Flair said:
And my principle is that principles like yours - that encourage a haphazard lack of responsibility to have concern for and to help others is not something you should expect to apply to everyone else.

If my own kid was suffering from alcoholism and it was having a negative effect on his life and the lives of others around him, I would have a responsibility to do more than to "speak my mind" and let him continue on to ruin his own life and the lives of others.

I am not imposing a set of standards that I feel is generally more healthy or rewarding. I am imposing a set of standards that IS more healthy and rewarding because his economic situation, debt levels, etc. (and other factors) is dire beyond what I have explained here.



A black&white, unmoving, unfeeling, compassionate, inflexible principle that cannot bend or change with realities or subtle changes in context and is followed blindly is just stubbornness and potentially harmful in many situations. Your lack of feeling of responsibility to your fellow man is appalling. I hate meddlers too but everybody needs a friend and everybody needs help sometimes, even if they don't know how to ask for it.

If more people in this world helped their fellow man instead of only tending to their own business this world would be proper...I speak purely on principle.
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Says the guy who has the time to post another man's business on a public internet forum. Well...go on with your bad self then. I've stated my piece, take it or leave it. It is what it is. If I've come across as being unmoving, unfeeling, or lacking compassion, it's because this world has spoiled itself on living with LACK of principle. If you think posting this man's business on an internet forum is going to help you solve anything...I feel bad for him alone, even more than I already did.

I'll just say I'm glad I don't have people like you in my life, and it is a great contributing factor to where I've ended up in life.

Cheers buddy.
 
erf said:
True enough, but the fact that someone is posting another man's business on a public internet forum tells me enough about the person in question...especially in in the context in which it was stated.

If you ever catch me on a public internet forum asking for help on how to bail a friend out of a gaming addiction...well you wouldn't...because quite frankly, the principle in question (minding your own damn business), is one that generally leads to a "healthy" outcome. Meddling is the last thing this dude needs to be doing.

The best thing this dude can do is to speak to his "friend", frankly, and move along.
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I would remind you that what is 'right' and acceptable to you isn't law of the universe and many people have different views on what is 'healthy.' The way we live and how we think varies from community to community. That is one of the strengths of the internet. What you think is natural or common behavior is almost certainly to have an exact opposite somewhere in the world. And you know what? It works for them.
 
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