My first TN panel after using PVA for 3 years

J

johnnysd

Limp Gawd
Joined
Oct 6, 2007
Messages
255
It was an ASUS VW266H. It went back to Fry's same day. It looked OK in Windows and even the slight tint shift because of viewing angle was not a big deal. But colors were horrible. Not amount of fiddling could get it to look good in games. I will never get a TN panel again.

Of course now my only real choices are the U2410 and the ZR24W, with a slight wish for the U2711. I dont like 1920x1080 displays and dont want to be smaller after using a 24" for 3 years so U2311 is out too.
 
If you knew the differences in mva/ips/tn panels, I'm sorry you tried a TN at all.

When you have IPS, you don't want to touch anything else.
 
I used a S-PVA for 2 years and I bought an U2410 same days ago.

I considered the U2711 as well but the reseller told me that nobody really likes them (and it was difficult to sell the three specimen he had) and I shouldn't buy that for gaming because it has markedly bigger input lag than his small brother.

It is obvious that you won't be happy with a TN display, even if it offers 120Hz support. (I ran into a TN right after CRTs and I don't want to hear about them anymore...)

I suggest you to examine those displays deeply before you choose, and still be prepared for a long run because I wasn't really pleased when I took an U2410 next to my old display (a Lenovo l220x ; S-PVA version).

My experiences with a S-PVA and a H-IPS displays:
- U2410 has much lower response time (and it is really applies to g2g, b2w, w2b as well, I really like it and I don't want to go back to a S-PVA, at least for gaming)
- but it has markedly lower contrast ratio (black doesn't feel dark enough until you used to it ; or even after that...)
- on the other hand, it is free from the black crush effect which compensates the lower contrast ratio
- but (and this could be my fault with my calibration instrument or a defective U2410 specimen) there is a smaller but existing "digital black crush" instead of the physical S-PVA effect. (The first few bars are equally black on the 8 bit grascale.)
- U2410 has an sRGB gamut emulation mode which is really good for PC games where you can't use color management systems, and even for HD videos when you don't use CMS capable video renderer. (It applies for wide-gamut displays only. We don't need it for a display with proper sRGB gamut but manufacturers used to apply wide-gamut CCFLs for PVA and IPS displays. -> U2311H has a very nice sRGB gamut!)


But I can't find any solution for my demands with U2410 yet. You can read about the story here: http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1035877146&postcount=2524

I am waiting to examine a HP LP2475w (last revision - there was nearly a hundred of them :cool:) which could be a better display for me.

HP ZR24w has a nice sRGB gamut but it has low contrast ratio after calibration (lower than U2410). ZR22w is better in this case but that one has lower resolution. But I didn't see them personally.

One thing looks clear for me: Dell uses unusual and strange gamma curve (and white point) for factory calibration while HP sticks closer to the gamma 2.2 curve which is a good thing. (Even if you won't calibrate your display with an instrument.)
So, I hope I can get a HP LP2475w and you will find your own display as well. :rolleyes:
 
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Weenis said:
If you knew the differences in mva/ips/tn panels, I'm sorry you tried a TN at all.

When you have IPS, you don't want to touch anything else.
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I know, I know. So many seem to be happy with TN, I thought it would be OK, but I was shocked how bad it was.

Problem is from what I have read not super excited about the ZR24W or U2410 and that seems to be the only choice I have.
 
If you have a calibration device other than the obviously medicore viewing angles many TN's are much better than most IPS panels for gaming/movies due to having much better contrast and black depth. Many TN's now come with equal if not better default settings than IPS do as well.

However with the release of the Dell U2311 (if it weren't for tinting) IPS panels are now worth the extra $ for your average person (they probably won't notice the tinting)

I myself won't touch an IPS panel untill they resolve the horrible quality control.
 
I use to own that Asus TN panel and it was fine for console gaming but not nearly good enough for PC usage. While IPS panels of late (atleast the cheaper ones) have quality control issues I would still much rather have a IPS panel with quality control issues than a TN panel I can't get colors right on.

I prefer my U2410 calibrated to just about anything I've seen under a 1,000 , while I understand if everyone doesn't feel the same way I still think its a decent panel if you get one without the tinting defect. I'm pretty much done with TN panels , I've used them for years , the only one I own now is the Acer 120hz panel and thats probably gonna be the only one I will own for a long time to come.
 
I'm sitting here on a VA monitor and can hardly justify buying a new one =\
 
NCX said:
If you have a calibration device other than the obviously medicore viewing angles many TN's are much better than most IPS panels for gaming/movies due to having much better contrast and black depth. Many TN's now come with equal if not better default settings than IPS do as well.

However with the release of the Dell U2311 (if it weren't for tinting) IPS panels are now worth the extra $ for your average person (they probably won't notice the tinting)

I myself won't touch an IPS panel untill they resolve the horrible quality control.
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I don't know, maybe the monitor I had was just inferior but colors in games were washed out, not vibrant and seemed to be missing colors like you took a really nice picture and reduced the color depth on it.
 
johnnysd said:
I don't know, maybe the monitor I had was just inferior but colors in games were washed out, not vibrant and seemed to be missing colors like you took a really nice picture and reduced the color depth on it.
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That is correct. TN is 6 bit color rather than 8 in both IPS and PVA. The worst thing about TN panels is the gamma shift followed closely by viewing angles and white glow from several angles.

IPS has the best color and viewing angles, PVA has the best contrast/black levels.

There is really no point in talking about VA panels, because they have disappeared anyway.

I just want LG to get their quality under control; dang it!

Dave
 
daveswantek said:
There is really no point in talking about VA panels, because they have disappeared anyway.
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Actually they are quite popular in TVs. Near as I can tell all Samsung's TVs are VA. Given that, it is feasible to get a VA display for a computer if you want one. They are very much on the large size for a given resolution, but some people are ok with that.
 
All 28" 1920x1200 panels are TN, I believe. There are 27" PVAs with that resolution, though.
 
The problem with 27"VA panels is that they have price tags way too close to 26"and 32" S-IPS TVs from LG and Philips.
 
johnnysd said:
Are there still good 24" 1920x1200 PVA panels available?
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Not really. The last good one for gaming with really low input lag was the NEC 24WMGX3. Good luck finding one.

geok1ng said:
The problem with 27"VA panels is that they have price tags way too close to 26"and 32" S-IPS TVs from LG and Philips.
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The cheapest 27" *VA monitor I've found is the Dell 2709W, and at almost $800, that's not cheap, especially when I can find a decent 32" 1080p TV for almost $200 less.

The input lag on the 2709W is a real drag too (no pun intended, or was it?).
 
Hey, I bought my 1st TN panel monitor back in Dec 2008; an Asus VK246H for around $240. I needed something cheap to connect to my HTPC as an auxiliary display. Turns out it was pretty good for gaming with 2ms input lag. If only my IPS panels had that little input lag. Anywaste, as an auxiliary monitor it only gets used between 4 and 6 hours per month at most.

If I had a choice between a 27" *VA and a 26" IPS monitor, I would go with the IPS. In fact, I bought the Planar PX2611w as secondary monitor to my NEC 2690WUXi.
 
I have an HP LP2475w. 24 Inch 1900 x 1200 resolution. I really can't complain. It is my first IPS panel monitor and it is great. I do a lot of photo editing and gaming on it. Maybe hardcore gamers will notice some input lag but I play CS and BC2 and I don't think it has hindered my gaming ability.

Any reason why some people might dismiss this as a not-so-good monitor. I'm just curious since I am happy with it but I'm a monitor noob :p
 
Sycraft said:
Actually they are quite popular in TVs. Near as I can tell all Samsung's TVs are VA. Given that, it is feasible to get a VA display for a computer if you want one. They are very much on the large size for a given resolution, but some people are ok with that.
Click to expand...

i think he literally meant VA and not PVA or S-PVA
 
Well, when people say VA they mean multidomain VA which includes S-PVA. True VA has TN-style inversion and hasn't been around for a decade or more.
 
The Ezio EV2333 and Samsung F2380MX use C-PVA which pretty much smoke anything on the market except for the average resposne time if people are looking for high quality PVA tech.....

Unfortunately the Ezio is only avaliable in Europe while the Samsung MX is only avaliable in Canada.
 
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