Mitsubishi 2070sb CRT: How to calibrate & is it normal?

Michael_

n00b
Joined
Jan 14, 2023
Messages
19
I just bought a Mitsubishi Diamond Pro 2070sb for 400 bucks.
Two questions:

1.
I have 2 very thin horizontal lines 1 about 3,15" below the top, the other about 3,15" above the bottom.
Is that normal? They're very thin, i did not even notice them at first. If not normal can this be fixed? How?
I can't see them when the monitor is turned off.
Its also not as sharp (noticed reading text) as my current EIZO Flexscan EV2450. I guess that's probably normal aswell?

2.
As far as i know these crts are still superior to most flatscreens at displaying colors and differentiate shades of grey.
So i would like to use this monitor to look at some CT and MRI pictures. For that it needs to precisely display and differentiate many different shades of grey.
I already compared it to my lcd and displayed a grey scale and it does not look off but i think i should probably do a calibration on the monitor?

I never calibrated any monitor and it is the first CRT i ever bought. Back in 2003 when it was built i was about 8 years old.
So how do i go about calibrating it or checking if its even necessary? I want to do it the right way.

Apart from that everything works fine.
I currently run it @ 1600x1200 and 109hz.
 
Last edited:

AwesomeOwl

Weaksauce
Joined
Feb 15, 2011
Messages
88
For the first question, this is what you're seeing (taken from the manual):

"Thin horizontal lines are normal for an aperture grille CRT and are not a malfunction. These are shadows from the
damper wires used to stabilize the aperture grille and are most noticeable when the screen’s background is light
(usually white)."
 

Michael_

n00b
Joined
Jan 14, 2023
Messages
19
Its also not as sharp (noticed reading text) as my current EIZO Flexscan EV2450. I guess that's probably normal aswell?

I just connected it to an older laptop with vga output running mx linux and trinity desktop and the text appears way sharper there.
So i guess its either windows 10 related/needs configured or because of the gpu/converter used which is: https://www.delock.de/produkt/87685/merkmale.html
GPU is a Nvidia Geforce GT 1030. :)

For the first question, this is what you're seeing (taken from the manual):

"Thin horizontal lines are normal for an aperture grille CRT and are not a malfunction. These are shadows from the
damper wires used to stabilize the aperture grille and are most noticeable when the screen’s background is light
(usually white)."

Thanks i'm happy to see thats normal. :)
 

Michael_

n00b
Joined
Jan 14, 2023
Messages
19
Its also not as sharp (noticed reading text) as my current EIZO Flexscan EV2450. I guess that's probably normal aswell?

I just connected it to an older laptop with vga output running mx linux and trinity desktop and the text appears way sharper there.
So i guess its either windows 10 related/needs configured or because of the gpu/converter used which is: https://www.delock.de/produkt/87685/merkmale.html
GPU is a Nvidia Geforce GT 1030. :)

Changing scaling in windows settings from 100% to 125% fixes the "sharpness" issue but obviously also costs screen space.
 

Michael_

n00b
Joined
Jan 14, 2023
Messages
19
I spent some time comparing the Mitsubishi Diamond Pro 2070sb (CRT) with my EIZO Flexscan EV2450 (LCD).
I compared images, grey scales and even gta vice city.

To me they are relatively close, unfortunately i think the eizo is even somewhat better in regards of sharpness and contrast.

I'm not a gamer and i did not buy the monitor because i wanted a superior image so thats not a problem for me.
I actually think for the monitor being 20 years old its pretty impressiv how it stacks up.
You can see the difference pretty clearly comparing it to my 2008 laptop lcd display and i think it's probably still better than more affordable modern lcds.
I also did not calibrate the Mitsubishi yet.

That said will a Sony GDM-FW900 deliver an even better picture or just more screen space?
Because if its not delivering a better picture i think it's overhyped since we already have high refresh rate lcds. :)
 

SH1

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jun 30, 2006
Messages
1,554
CRTs can present text in a softer, glowy, way that some such as myself find very pleasing. However, LCD should always prevail in raw sharpness. You're basically comparing a fixed array of pixels to something that in the former case is more like a projector inside.

Dynamic range/blacks, true multi-scan, and above all these days retention of resolution during motion combined with the other positive attributes, are more why CRT is still sought by some for enthusiast purposes. Not for text...

Comparison of CRTs gets somewhat subjective. The FW900 might have some advantages, e.g., tighter pitch in the center than all but the F520 (but looser on the sides versus other CRTs), some other stuff, but the main reason I think the FW900 is popular is because its wide screen, which is vary rare. And it's bigger. And in a striking way, even more than the actual dimensions would suggest...
 

jbltecnicspro

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Aug 18, 2006
Messages
8,386
That said will a Sony GDM-FW900 deliver an even better picture or just more screen space?
Because if its not delivering a better picture i think it's overhyped since we already have high refresh rate lcds. :)
More screen space to be honest. FW900's widescreen and largeness are what makes it desireable. It's not the best CRT ever made though unless widescreen support is a must. I have owned an F520, Artisan, FW900, and a couple of highend Diamondtron monitors. I would easily rank the Diamondtron among the top Trinitrons and even say they're better in build quality. :)
 

Xar

n00b
Joined
Dec 15, 2022
Messages
45
Anyone knows aside from eBay where to buy a good 2nd handed FW900? Wanting to collect the best CRT that ever been released to consumers.
 

Starfalcon

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jan 7, 2020
Messages
1,100
Anyone knows aside from eBay where to buy a good 2nd handed FW900? Wanting to collect the best CRT that ever been released to consumers.

The problem isnt buying it, it is shipping it.
 

Michael_

n00b
Joined
Jan 14, 2023
Messages
19
I'm currently using the monitor on a daily basis at home.

Does someone know the specs for max. brightness and contrast?

I can't find them in the user manual.

I just found ballpark information here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_CRT,_LCD,_plasma,_and_OLED_displays

and someone saying lcds are superior regarding contrast on quora:
https://www.quora.com/Are-CRT-monit...CD-in-terms-of-resolution-and-contrast-ratios
No, LCDs are far superior to the best that CRTs ever were, in both regards. Contrary to a popular misconception, a properly adjusted CRT could not provide better contrast than current LCDs. The black level of the video had to be set somewhat into the “on” state of the CRT (i.e., there would be a little bit of beam current even at the “black” level). If you set up the CRT so that the beam was solidly off at the black level, the bottom end of the gray scale would be extremely non-linear. Even with that, though, the actual delivered contrast for both technologies would generally be limited by reflected ambient light, not what light the display would actually produce when set to “black.”

But contrast ratio of Typical 200–300:1 and peak brightness of 176 cd/m2 seems too low? Especially in Super Bright Mode.
 

SH1

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jun 30, 2006
Messages
1,554
"200–300:1"...yeah that sounds ballpark for a CRT. "200-350 maybe". Presumably a reference to contrast within a single image, where LCD is superior. As exposed by an ANSI test pattern.

CRT goes up to 15000 :1 though or more in terms of contrast between images. So called on/off contrast. And LCDs just can't follow them into the dark scenes that benefit from that. That and that real content can be far removed from an ANSI test pattern is why CRT pictures can look so much deeper than LCD. LCDs have a work around that works pretty well though, if not perfectly, in Full Array Local Dimming. Long limited to TVs, but in many monitors now too. (Avoid the edge lit ones I guess.)

Would certainly not look to a CRT for peak brightness. Cranking the brightness distorts their pictures. Best off minimizing it and limiting CRT enthusiast use to rooms where you can dim ambient light.

I don't know anything about medical imaging or the history of displays associated therewith. However, wouldn't the images be brighter and wouldn't 4K resolution on an LCD or OLED be much better?

I love CRTs, but I'm really thinking more gaming where their beautiful pictures in a dimly lit room + preserved motion resolution still shine. Not for medical use. (Although again, I don't know much about that...)
 

jbltecnicspro

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Aug 18, 2006
Messages
8,386
I'm currently using the monitor on a daily basis at home.

Does someone know the specs for max. brightness and contrast?

I can't find them in the user manual.

I just found ballpark information here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_CRT,_LCD,_plasma,_and_OLED_displays

and someone saying lcds are superior regarding contrast on quora:
https://www.quora.com/Are-CRT-monit...CD-in-terms-of-resolution-and-contrast-ratios


But contrast ratio of Typical 200–300:1 and peak brightness of 176 cd/m2 seems too low? Especially in Super Bright Mode.
That contrast is ANSI checkerboard contrast. Typical CRT monitors do about 3,000-5,000:1 contrast depending on what gamma you calibrate to, though SH1 is correct. The top end ones can go beyond 10,000:1. My old Viewsonic, which is NOT the best example of the tech, does about 3,400:1. Better than any LCD I have, and motion resolution is superior.

As for the FW-900… :(. You’re about 15 years too late. Back then they were selling for a few hundred bucks. Not anymore. I wouldn’t lose sleep over it.
 

Michael_

n00b
Joined
Jan 14, 2023
Messages
19
SH1 jbltecnicspro Thanks for the clarification. :)

Would certainly not look to a CRT for peak brightness. Cranking the brightness distorts their pictures.

I currently run mine in SB (Super Bright) Mode all the time.
I'm happy with the picture.

Can this harm the monitor long term or will it just "distort" the picture?
I'm actually pretty happy with the picture in super bright mode 1 (picture).
 

jbltecnicspro

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Aug 18, 2006
Messages
8,386
SH1 jbltecnicspro Thanks for the clarification. :)



I currently run mine in SB (Super Bright) Mode all the time.
I'm happy with the picture.

Can this harm the monitor long term or will it just "distort" the picture?
I'm actually pretty happy with the picture in super bright mode 1 (picture).
You’ll run the guns a little harder so it won’t last as long but fuck it. Yolo!
 

SH1

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jun 30, 2006
Messages
1,554
As jbltecnicspro said.

As to rate of decay or such, well, it's more I've assumed the effect of driving a CRT hard would not be subtle.

I have ones that have a feature like that. 3 different bands of brightness, which I run at 100 percent contrast and maybe 35 brightness or less. However, I feel ok running at full contrast, because it's running in the dimmest of the 3 bands. Oldest in usage has gotten to 18K and still looks great. I might just be lucky with that one though.

I guess maybe you're running in a bright room? I keep things kind of dim around here...
 

Michael_

n00b
Joined
Jan 14, 2023
Messages
19
I guess maybe you're running in a bright room? I keep things kind of dim around here...

There is no daylight but four 100w incandescent light bulbs.
So its not as bright as daylight but also not dim.

But i'm currently running without super bright mode and the lights somewhat dimmed.
There are some cases where i put the super bright mode back on but most of the time i can leave it off.

That being said, i'm still experimenting with different settings. :)
But overall i'm happy with the monitor so far.
 
Top