mini-ITX WHS w/ IPMI or Intel vPro/AMT KVM-over-IP?

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altano

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Hello everyone.

I would love and appreciate some help finding a CPU and motherboard for my WHS. Here's my questionnaire:

1. What will you be doing with this PC? Gaming, Photoshop (or other intensive programs), Overclocking, Web browsing, strictly HTPC/Playback, etc. (If you have multiple things you want to do with the system, make sure you rank them from most important to least important).

- Running Windows Home Server for backup and storing and serving of multiple TB media library.
- Ripping, encoding, and storing DVDs and Blu-Rays.
- VPN Server.
- I may run WHS in a VM in Windows Server 2008 R2, which would mean purchasing more memory, but I'm only toying with that idea at this point.

2. What's your budget? Are tax and shipping included in this budget? Is your budget flexible? Is cost a driving factor in component selection?

- $2000 and flexible. Yes, that is absurdly way too much, but I'm more than okay with that.

3. Where do you live? Do you have any big B&M (brick and mortar) computer chains nearby (e.g. Microcenter, Fry's, etc)?

- I live in Boston. MicroCenter and Best Buy are accessible.

4. What exact parts do you need for that budget? CPU, RAM, case, etc. The word "Everything" is not a valid answer. Please list out all the parts you'll need.

- I need help with my motherboard and CPU selection only.

5. If reusing any parts, what parts will you be reusing? Please be especially specific about the power supply. For reused parts, list brands, model #s, and, if applicable, firmware revisions.

I've already picked out:
- Case: Lian-Li PC-Q08
- PSU: SilverStone Strider Plus ST50F-P 500W + shorter cables
- Blu-Ray player: LITE-ON iHOS104-08
- Either 3x3TB or 4x2TB HDs (I haven't chosen a make or model)

6. What specific features do you need in a motherboard? RAID? Firewire? Crossfire or SLI support? USB 3.0? SATA 6Gb/s? etc. Which is more important, size of the system or having the particular feature? Make sure you indicate *required* vs. *wanted* for each feature you list.

I require:
- mini-ITX form factor. micro-ATX cases are too large.
- AT LEAST 4 SATA ports so I can run my Blu-Ray player and 3x3TB HDs in RAID-5. I would prefer 5+ SATA ports, in any configuration that allows 4 of the ports to be used for 4x2TB HDs in RAID-5.
- Support for a CPU that can handle video encoding well.
- 1 x Intel gigabit NIC. (I'm done with Realtek)

I strongly desire:
- Either IPMI or Intel AMT/vPro support for KVM over IP, since this machine will be running headless and plugging in a monitor, keyboard, and mouse will be a *huge* chore in my setup.
- A CPU that balances the ability to do video encoding well but is also low power. Something like the Core i5 2500T, Core i5 2500s, Core i5 2600s, or the Xeon E3-1260L?

I've already done some research and here's what I've come up with:
- I *think* I've ruled out SuperMicro motherboards which come with IPMI and sound great, because their only mini-ITX board, the X9SCV-Q, only supports mobile processors. From what little info I can gather, these are pretty bad at video encoding?
- There appear to be NO mini-ITX motherboards that support the Sandy Bridge Xeons, Intel vPro/AMT KVM support, and have 4+ SATA ports. In order to support KVM over IP, I need to get a mobo that supports c206 North Bridge. But I also need 4+ SATA ports. The Portwell WADE-8011 looks like it fulfills all my requirements but I can't find it for sale. I also can't find any video-transcoding benchmarks of the Xeon E3-1260L, so I'm only assuming this CPU would perform well.

7. What resolution output do you need? 1080p, 720p, DVD quality, etc for HTPC or list Vertical/horizontal resolution for non-HTPC SFF rigs. Do you need multiple monitor output?

- n/a, running headless.

8. Does this system need to fit into a particular space? Think entertainment center shelves, closet space, rackmount, etc.

- The Lian-Li PC-Q08 is 8.94" x 10.71" x 13.58" (W x H x D) and I'm not willing to go any larger.

9. How comfortable are you with custom case design/modification and electrical wiring? What tools do you have (Screwdrivers/Leatherman, Drill, Dremel, Metal snips, Soldering Iron, Bending Brake, CNC/Welding machines/Plasma cutter, etc...)?

- I'm clueless but have lots of nerdy friends. If it comes to this, just ask and I'll investigate.

10. How important is the noise/silence of this sytem? HTPCs typically want to be quiet while all-out SFF gaming rigs don't care

- I desire very quiet but I won't be crazy about it. I will be purchasing Noctua fans where it makes sense and using low-power parts to reduce heat.

11. How mobile does this system need to be? Need a carrying handle or carrying straps? Is weight important (carry-on bag, etc)? Water cooling quick disconnects, etc?

- n/a

12. Do you already have a legit and reusable/transferable OS key/license? If yes, what OS? Is it 32bit or 64bit? Remember that OEM copies of Win7 have issues with new motherboards

- 64-bit WHS.

13. When do you plan on building/buying the PC? Immediately, in a couple weeks, 3-5 years?

- Immediately. I'm replacing a failed HP MediaSmart ex490 with a CPU upgraded to a Pentium E6300 Wolfdale CPU.

Thanks in advance for any help.
 
Ironically not only am I from the Boston area myself too, but I've been looking into building a new Mini-ITX based WHS system as well.

One board I've been looking at is this one:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813500064

It's got four 3Gb SATA ports (and supports up to RAID5 on those ports), plus it has two 6Gb SATA ports. It's also got a 3Gb eSATA port on the rear I/O panel too.

For expansion it's got a 16x PCI-E slot, so you could add an Intel PCI-e card to the board if you wanted too, bypassing the integrated NIC.
 
Fifth Horseman said:
Ironically not only am I from the Boston area myself too, but I've been looking into building a new Mini-ITX based WHS system as well.
Click to expand...

I don't believe that's ironic or even coincidental... that's part for the course for Boston :)

Fifth Horseman said:
One board I've been looking at is this one:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813500064
Click to expand...

That board has an H67 chipset. Only the Q57, Q67, and c206 chipsets support Intel's KVM-over-IP (AMT 6.0+) functionality built into the chips. So unfortunately that board doesn't work for me :(

Thanks for looking, though!
 
altano said:
Hello everyone.
Click to expand...

Hello!

altano said:
I would love and appreciate some help finding a CPU and motherboard for my WHS. Here's my questionnaire:
Click to expand...

Okay, that's a big post; had to write my response in Notepad. Good you did your homework.

altano said:
6. What specific features do you need in a motherboard? RAID? Firewire? Crossfire or SLI support? USB 3.0? SATA 6Gb/s? etc. Which is more important, size of the system or having the particular feature? Make sure you indicate *required* vs. *wanted* for each feature you list.

I require:
- mini-ITX form factor. micro-ATX cases are too large.
- AT LEAST 4 SATA ports so I can run my Blu-Ray player and 3x3TB HDs in RAID-5. I would prefer 5+ SATA ports, in any configuration that allows 4 of the ports to be used for 4x2TB HDs in RAID-5.
- Support for a CPU that can handle video encoding well.
- 1 x Intel gigabit NIC. (I'm done with Realtek)

I strongly desire:
- Either IPMI or Intel AMT/vPro support for KVM over IP, since this machine will be running headless and plugging in a monitor, keyboard, and mouse will be a *huge* chore in my setup.
- A CPU that balances the ability to do video encoding well but is also low power. Something like the Core i5 2500T, Core i5 2500s, Core i5 2600s, or the Xeon E3-1260L?
Click to expand...

Two suggestions:
  • Intel DQ67EP: Has Intel NIC, has remote management countesy of AMT, but only four SATA ports. Use a cheap add-on SATA card, but make sure it has a Sillicon Image or Marvell controller.
  • ASUS P8H67-I: Has all of the 6 ports off the southbridge internally, but has a Realtek NIC. Simple solution is to add a $20 PCIe Intel NIC. Forget about remote management though.

CPUs I recommend are Pentium G620T, i3 2100T, i5 2500T if you want absolutely lowest power consumption. Otherwise, grab an i7 2600S; it's 65W, which is as much as the stock i3`s, has a good stock clock (2.8) and has pretty serious turbo bins, so it won't be much slower than i7 2600 in practice.
altano said:
- I *think* I've ruled out SuperMicro motherboards which come with IPMI and sound great, because their only mini-ITX board, the X9SCV-Q, only supports mobile processors. From what little info I can gather, these are pretty bad at video encoding?
Click to expand...

Mobile CPUs are the same chip as desktop and server parts, except for being optimized for low power usage. They're FASTER at video encoding that most desktop chips if you use the Quick Sync feature with supported software, like Media COnverter 7. If you want to x264, lower clocks will decrease performance, but turbo is pretty aggresive, even when fully loaded. Alternatively, do several videos concurrently.

You might have a probem finding a decent heatsink if the mounting holes do not match LGA 1155. If they don't, either modify an existing one or get a custom one built, I'm sure you don't want to use laptop coolers xD

altano said:
- There appear to be NO mini-ITX motherboards that support the Sandy Bridge Xeons, Intel vPro/AMT KVM support, and have 4+ SATA ports. In order to support KVM over IP, I need to get a mobo that supports c206 North Bridge. But I also need 4+ SATA ports. The Portwell WADE-8011 looks like it fulfills all my requirements but I can't find it for sale. I also can't find any video-transcoding benchmarks of the Xeon E3-1260L, so I'm only assuming this CPU would perform well.
Click to expand...

I just found one from Intel with Q67 chipset. You don't get the ECC support you would have gotten from a C206 board though, and no KVMoIP either, but you have some remote management features; just keep an old monitor nearby in case the OS refuses to boot and you can't fix it from the AMT console.

altano said:
Thanks in advance for any help.
Click to expand...

You're welcome.
 
These are great pointers, thanks to both of you.

After some more investigation, the mobile processors don't look half bad. I can't make use of the Intel Quick Sync tech because I am doing x264 encoding, but general benchmarks seem to be damn fast for the Core i7 2720QM CPU. I lose the ECC, but I can get a SuperMicro board that supports both IPMI and Intel's KVMoIP, so I can see which one works best and take advantage of it. Plus it has the Intel NIC and 6 SATA ports. This sounds like a good compromise.

iconiK said:
You might have a probem finding a decent heatsink if the mounting holes do not match LGA 1155. If they don't, either modify an existing one or get a custom one built, I'm sure you don't want to use laptop coolers xD
Click to expand...

Both the mobo (SuperMicro X9SCV-Q) and the CPU (Core i7 2720QM) are rPGA988B / Socket G2, which is Intel's Sandy Bridge Mobile CPU line. This isn't LGA 1155. So I need to find a good CPU heatsink/fan that supports Socket G2 Mobile CPUs and does a better job of cooling than the stock heatsink, right? I've looked around the net and found absolutely nothing. Perhaps I'll have to rely on the stock heatsink plus good case cooling? That scares me...

Any have any ideas?
 
There is no stock heatsink. Mobile CPUs use barely any power, so the last thing you have to worry about is cooling...if cramped laptops can do it, why not a desktop? I believe CoolJag makes a few heatsinks that will work for you.
 
altano said:
Both the mobo (SuperMicro X9SCV-Q) and the CPU (Core i7 2720QM) are rPGA988B / Socket G2, which is Intel's Sandy Bridge Mobile CPU line. This isn't LGA 1155. So I need to find a good CPU heatsink/fan that supports Socket G2 Mobile CPUs and does a better job of cooling than the stock heatsink, right? I've looked around the net and found absolutely nothing. Perhaps I'll have to rely on the stock heatsink plus good case cooling? That scares me...

Any have any ideas?
Click to expand...

It's likely that Socket G2 has different mounting holes than LGA 1155, so you can't find any average heatsink on there. Also, there probably is no stock heatsink shipped with CPUs. Give Supermicro a call or e-mail, ask them what cooling solutions they have for that board.
 
Blue Fox said:
There is no stock heatsink. Mobile CPUs use barely any power, so the last thing you have to worry about is cooling...if cramped laptops can do it, why not a desktop? I believe CoolJag makes a few heatsinks that will work for you.
Click to expand...

Not true, mobile CPU also need cooler
 
lvyelion said:
Not true, mobile CPU also need cooler
Click to expand...

But they're meant for notebooks, it's the OEM's job to design a cooler that fits in their case, not Intel's. That's a Supermicro ITX board that takes mobile chips... but Supermicro is on its own if they do that, Intel has no reference cooler
 
The CoolJag coolers appear to be a match. Thanks for the pointer. These are all compatible:
http://www.cooljagusa.com/products.asp?tid=83

They are advertised as Socket G1 but the manufacturer verified over email that they are Socket G2 (rPGA988B) compatible. BUT: holy crap they are REALLY loud! Presumably b/c they are so small. They range from 30-40dBA running at ~5000RPM.

And I probably do want a good cooler because I'll occasionally be pushing this CPU hard for extended periods of video encoding.

I think I'm a bit turned off from going the mobile CPU route because of the following new information:
  • The cooler volume.
  • The price of a Crucial 8GB 204 pin SODIMM is $400 (vs. $25 for 4GB). I thought I was going to be able to get more memory more cheaply going this route but that isn't true.
  • I finally heard back from Portwell's sales dept, the makers of the WADE-8011 Xeon board, and they are ready and willing to sell me the board.

Soooo I think I'm just going to go the Xeon route. I'll post that final list of parts in another thread for a sanity check.

Thanks so much for all your help, everyone. This was immensely helpful.

Oh, and here's the final build parts list that I'm abandoning if anyone is curious:
Code: 
Case:         Lian-Li PC-Q08 ([URL="http://lian-li.com/v2/tw/product/upload/image/pc-q08/flyer.html"]info[/URL], [URL="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811112265"]newegg[/URL])
PSU:          SilverStone 500W, 80 PLUS BRONZE, 140mm, 100% modular ([URL="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817256065&Tpk=SilverStone%20Strider%20Plus%20ST50F-P%20500W"]newegg[/URL])
                + SilverStone 500W, 80 PLUS BRONZE, 140mm, 100% modular ([URL="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812162010"]newegg[/URL])
Motherboard:  SuperMicro X9SCV-Q ([URL="http://www.supermicro.com/products/motherboard/Xeon/QM67/X9SCV-Q.cfm"]info[/URL], [URL="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813182261&Tpk=X9SCV-Q"]newegg[/URL])
CPU:          Intel Core i7-2720QM Mobile 2.2GHz ([URL="http://ark.intel.com/products/50067/Intel-Core-i7-2720QM-Processor-(6M-Cache-2_20-GHz)"]info[/URL], [URL="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819111023"]newegg[/URL])
CPU Cooler:   CoolJag  BUF-A ([URL="http://www.cooljagusa.com/productshow.asp?id=242"]cooljagusa.com[/URL])
Memory:       Any 4GB 204-pin DDR3 SODIMM ([URL="http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=100007609%20600006178%20600000399&IsNodeId=1&name=4GB"]newegg[/URL])
Hard Drives:  4 x 2TB WD20EARS in RAID-5 (5.58TB usable space) ([URL="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136514"]newegg[/URL])
Blu-Ray:      LITE-ON iHOS104-08 ([URL="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827106326"]newegg[/URL])
Case Fan:     Noctua NF-P14 FLX 140mm Case Fan ([URL="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835608017"]newegg[/URL])
 
Just out of curiosity, what did Portwell quote you price wise? I've been thinking about purchasing one of the boards myself.
 
iconiK said:
It's likely that Socket G2 has different mounting holes than LGA 1155, so you can't find any average heatsink on there. Also, there probably is no stock heatsink shipped with CPUs. Give Supermicro a call or e-mail, ask them what cooling solutions they have for that board.
Click to expand...

SuperMicro has a HSF assembly for that board listed as an optional part - SNK-C0054A4L

newegg has them for about $25

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816101658&Tpk=16-101-658
 
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