Microsoft Trademarks 'Windows 365'

CharonPDX

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And it will likely be the end of windows as people switch to a non subscription based OS

Doubt it. Most large businesses already treat Microsoft products as subscription-based. If they make it cheap enough ($99 a year for "Windows 365+Office 365", or $25/year or less for Windows 365 alone,) I could see it working. And new PCs would come with a permanent license, as always. But people who want to stay "up to date" will fork over the fee.

Hell, Apple basically did that for a few years with their yearly $30 updates to OS X, people paid.

Will I do it? No. I'll upgrade to my Windows 10, and be done with it if that's the last non-subscription Windows. I kept a PC on Windows XP to the bitter end. I keep a PC on Windows 7, and will until its bitter end. I have a Windows 8.1 tablet - which will get upgraded to Windows 10. Other than that, I have a Mac and a Linux box.
 

Exavior

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Doubt it. Most large businesses already treat Microsoft products as subscription-based. If they make it cheap enough ($99 a year for "Windows 365+Office 365", or $25/year or less for Windows 365 alone,) I could see it working. And new PCs would come with a permanent license, as always. But people who want to stay "up to date" will fork over the fee.

Hell, Apple basically did that for a few years with their yearly $30 updates to OS X, people paid.

Will I do it? No. I'll upgrade to my Windows 10, and be done with it if that's the last non-subscription Windows. I kept a PC on Windows XP to the bitter end. I keep a PC on Windows 7, and will until its bitter end. I have a Windows 8.1 tablet - which will get upgraded to Windows 10. Other than that, I have a Mac and a Linux box.

As I pointed out above, Microsoft already said that Windows 10 will have free upgrades and will not be updated like previous versions. so you won't wait for windows 11 to get new features. Instead FREE OF CHARGE you will get smaller updates every so often like with Xbox One's OS. So you will upgrade to windows 10 for free from your windows 7 or 8 machines and then be done with it. no more paying for copies of windows. They don't plan on there being a Windows 11, instead you will have Windows 10 with constant updates.
 

LBJM

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You are connecting disconnected things. We can list about 10 things millions of Americans pays a subscription for, phone, internet, TV, HOA fees, gas, car registration, license, Netflix, amazon prime and MS office. I don't get why some people seem to not understand that that the mere fact someone has to pay a subscription has nothing to do with the success. It has to do with does the product subscription cost a reasonable amount for the service and as compared to the competition

If you don't drive a car you don't need, gasoline, car registration, or a license to drive a car, they are all opt out. The phone and internet, netflix, and amazon prime have intrinsic values to them which make people more willing to continue the services. You complain about me connecting disconnected things LOL. As for Windows the OS regular consumer have come accustomed to it coming with their PCs as part of the overall cost of the machine. Now if the price of the computer remains unchanged and now they see they have to pay an extra fee for it, they will just switch to Linux/chrome OS/MAC OS X. The point I was making that connected everything I was saying is if people didn't need it chances are they will not pay extra for it.
 

evilsofa

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Zarathustra[H];1041414772 said:
So, it's going to become a web based OS? :p

Load it up in my browser? :p

Swallowing the OS entirely doesn't seem to be the plan for the Spartan browser, but I could be wrong.

I'm only not dismissing it out of hand entirely because I've used a computer whose OS was BASIC.
 

dandirk

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I think just the OS as a sub would be difficult. The temptation to use a "free" version of an OS would be there (eventually). OS is a product that doesn't really have to be updated that much (besides security).

Though I am sure it won't just be the OS... with the right price and other value adds like access to Office365 and Cloud storage space more people might be tempted to just go the subscription route.

The unlimited cloud space offer with Office365 is/was very tempting. I still ponder if I should switch from google...
 

Cyraxx

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I think just the OS as a sub would be difficult. The temptation to use a "free" version of an OS would be there (eventually). OS is a product that doesn't really have to be updated that much (besides security).

Though I am sure it won't just be the OS... with the right price and other value adds like access to Office365 and Cloud storage space more people might be tempted to just go the subscription route.

The unlimited cloud space offer with Office365 is/was very tempting. I still ponder if I should switch from google...

ERROR: Unable to verify Windows subscription status. Please connect to the internet and try again.
 

WaltC

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Microsoft said that it had no intention of changing the business model for Windows...payment up front, is the rule. But unlike previous versions of Windows, ending with Windows 7, Microsoft has set upon a course of drastically reducing the up-front costs relating to Windows: Windows 8.x was available direct from Microsoft for $39.99 for at least four months; upgraders from Win7 with a coupon got it for $15. Windows 10 upgrade from Win7/8.1 will be free for a year...during which time millions of people, if not tens of millions, will install Windows 10. So, it's pretty hard to ask a subscription price of $9.99 a year (the lowest I can imagine) in perpetuity, when you can buy it upfront for ~$40 (or less.) I think that this has to be a defense-of-trademark issue as they don't want somebody else to start using "365" in association with "Windows." By buying the trademark they can ensure that no one will.
 

Phoenix333

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Microsoft said that it had no intention of changing the business model for Windows...payment up front, is the rule. But unlike previous versions of Windows, ending with Windows 7, Microsoft has set upon a course of drastically reducing the up-front costs relating to Windows: Windows 8.x was available direct from Microsoft for $39.99 for at least four months; upgraders from Win7 with a coupon got it for $15. Windows 10 upgrade from Win7/8.1 will be free for a year...during which time millions of people, if not tens of millions, will install Windows 10. So, it's pretty hard to ask a subscription price of $9.99 a year (the lowest I can imagine) in perpetuity, when you can buy it upfront for ~$40 (or less.) I think that this has to be a defense-of-trademark issue as they don't want somebody else to start using "365" in association with "Windows." By buying the trademark they can ensure that no one will.

Interesting... considering that as back in 1993 or so they had said that subscription-based OS was their ultimate goal. They surely wouldn't lie, no? :rolleyes:
 

andrewaggb

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What I don't want to see are a bunch of different subscriptions. Office 365 + windows 365 + live Gold, etc. I'm sure they'll all have to exist at some level, but for home users they will hopefully just add windows (and gold) all into one inexpensive subscription for 5 users like they do for office 365. I already pay for office 365 just for the onedrive space.
 
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If Microsoft offers Windows 10 as a subscription, I would suspect that it wouldn't just be the OS. I would guess that a Windows 365 subscription would include full access to their latest releases of Windows and Office, along with your unlimited OneDrive storage all under one roof with an easy subscription. Hell, it could even include things like Xbox Music, Skype Minutes, etc.

Similar to Adobe Creative Cloud in a way - I think this would be awesome, personally. An easy way to own everything you use, under one ecosystem across all of your devices, for a single subscription fee you can cancel at any time? Cool beans.
 

CreepyUncleGoogle

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Recurring billing for an OS would take some getting used to as lots of people currently using computers are so old that they still think that when they pay for a current OS that they're buying it instead of just paying for permission to use it. This would be even more scary for them.

I that if they went down the subscription route completely for Windows and Office without offering a pay once model (or worse, they asked for subscriptions for full functionality on a computer shipping from the OEM with the OS installed), they'd only open the door for lots of niche competition and non-standard alternatives or whatever. There's already LibreOffice, Kingsoft Office and a bunch of other office suites that work well enough to for non-enterprise MS Office replacement. Linux might gain a little momentum. I dunno though, I love using it, but it's been around for ages at no cost and hasn't really gone anywhere except as a framework for Google to broadly deploy its spyware phones all over the place. Apple is probably in the best overall position to see benefits since they have a less fragmented community, existing support infrastructure, and means of selling standardized, complete systems that consumers seem to want over DIY junk like what happens with *nix for home users right now.
 

Lames.

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If they did something like $5/month for full access to Windows and the upgrades are included (going from Windows 8 to 10 for example), I would do it. Better then shelling out $200+ for an OS in one sitting. If they go the way of EA and start doing DLC type shady crap, then no, I am not OK with it.

Also beats trying to dick around with OEM licenses when you switch motherboards or something of that nature.
 

rudy

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If you don't drive a car you don't need, gasoline, car registration, or a license to drive a car, they are all opt out. The phone and internet, netflix, and amazon prime have intrinsic values to them which make people more willing to continue the services. You complain about me connecting disconnected things LOL. As for Windows the OS regular consumer have come accustomed to it coming with their PCs as part of the overall cost of the machine. Now if the price of the computer remains unchanged and now they see they have to pay an extra fee for it, they will just switch to Linux/chrome OS/MAC OS X. The point I was making that connected everything I was saying is if people didn't need it chances are they will not pay extra for it.

If you don't use a computer you don't need windows??? What's your point? Consumers being accustomed to something can change. It still comes down to value and competitors. If I take the current landscape right now and MS says $10 / year for windows I would buy into the subscription because what are my options? An over priced under performing mac, Linux or chrome both have shit for games and applications available and chrome just blows in every way its a glorified thin client. On top of that I expect that the base computer will come with X years for free, no different than many other subscriptions have a promotion period. You can make any claim you want but at the end of the day millions and millions of SONY and Xbox customers pay a subscription to use the internet they already pay for and there doesn't seem to be any hint that people are rushing out to buy something different to get rid of that subscription.
 

rudy

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Recurring billing for an OS would take some getting used to as lots of people currently using computers are so old that they still think that when they pay for a current OS that they're buying it instead of just paying for permission to use it. This would be even more scary for them.

I that if they went down the subscription route completely for Windows and Office without offering a pay once model (or worse, they asked for subscriptions for full functionality on a computer shipping from the OEM with the OS installed), they'd only open the door for lots of niche competition and non-standard alternatives or whatever. There's already LibreOffice, Kingsoft Office and a bunch of other office suites that work well enough to for non-enterprise MS Office replacement. Linux might gain a little momentum. I dunno though, I love using it, but it's been around for ages at no cost and hasn't really gone anywhere except as a framework for Google to broadly deploy its spyware phones all over the place. Apple is probably in the best overall position to see benefits since they have a less fragmented community, existing support infrastructure, and means of selling standardized, complete systems that consumers seem to want over DIY junk like what happens with *nix for home users right now.


Lets say windows was $10-20 / years, MS just flips the standard OEM license so now its a 3-5 year subscription. After that time your windows stops updating to new features and you can simply start paying $10-20 / year to keep receiving updates. At that time some people will just say I will buy a new PC, probably a good thing, others will stay cheap and pay and a few will switch to Linux, then probably switch back. This is a very legitimate model. Also in the past MS has always been pretty damn relaxed about things. For instance if you windows subscription expired most likely they would not kick you to the curve just like if WGA failed they don't shut down your PC, they just hassle you with annoying messages, oh noes I cant see my back ground any more.
 

Ur_Mom

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I don't think they would be foolish enough to switch to an all subscription based model.

It would work for some places. Small businesses, etc.. Home users? Very doubtful. I think it may go similar to Office 365/2013. A subscription model is available, but not required. You can go with Office 2013 just the same.

If it does happen, I expect to see a lot of incentives - OneDrive storage space (huge amounts), Office 365 as part of it, multiple PC's on the same account, etc.. Just a subscription model for the updates and all that? No way would that be a hit.
 

Ur_Mom

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If they did something like $5/month for full access to Windows and the upgrades are included (going from Windows 8 to 10 for example), I would do it. Better then shelling out $200+ for an OS in one sitting. If they go the way of EA and start doing DLC type shady crap, then no, I am not OK with it.

Would your Grandma pay for it, though? The majority of computer users aren't us enthusiasts. The Grandma's of the world want to be able to get to their Yahoos and emails to see pictures of the grandkids. Maybe a little YouTubes. Even those that are a bit more knowledgeable see their computer as a tool or a toy, not a real productive machine. People aren't going to pay $5 a month for something if they don't feel they are getting a value from it.

Look at how many enthusiasts are against it, and we need and want the OS.

I don't see Linux as a huge threat for a while if this happens. I think the biggest threat will be similar to Windows 8 - itself. People won't upgrade from Windows 7 (or even XP) or 8 until they get a new computer and then they'll still hold off until the last minute.

I'd pay it if it had other features other than Windows (Office, more OneDrive space, etc.).
 

CreepyUncleGoogle

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Lets say windows was $10-20 / years, MS just flips the standard OEM license so now its a 3-5 year subscription. After that time your windows stops updating to new features and you can simply start paying $10-20 / year to keep receiving updates. At that time some people will just say I will buy a new PC, probably a good thing, others will stay cheap and pay and a few will switch to Linux, then probably switch back. This is a very legitimate model. Also in the past MS has always been pretty damn relaxed about things. For instance if you windows subscription expired most likely they would not kick you to the curve just like if WGA failed they don't shut down your PC, they just hassle you with annoying messages, oh noes I cant see my back ground any more.

I don't think that MS will be unreasonable about it and I think there won't be an all subscription model yet. Its way too early to tell what'll happen or how they'll handle it. I think we're only far enough along to see that a subscription model for the OS is very likely coming. Most people won't care or just complain a little about it and then move on; they have more important stuff to do than debate about pricing model changes for computer operating systems because there's lots of cats to hug, hot cocoa to drink, and real life to live.

I think that there will be a niche that forms as a result of ideological objections, angry torch waving sorts, people who needed an excuse to complain, and whatever else that decides to make changes. It might gain momentum, but it probably won't and the only effect I think is gonna happen is that the greater attention non-MS software gets will just mean more a little more day-to-day pain for people who didn't need to care before. It'll be just like the browser thing with there being several widely deployed browsers and the need for web devs to make sites that work with all of them (supported versions of IE, Firefox, Safari, Spyware...errr Chrome) and average people install more than one browser just to view pages properly. The same thing might happen in a subscription world where the various fractures are big enough that there'll be just more pointless pain for average people who otherwise don't at all care and just wanna use their computers to do stuff -- something that's hard for people here to understand since they get pretty emo about computer hardware and software.
 

Autopia

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Microsoft said that it had no intention of changing the business model for Windows...payment up front, is the rule. But unlike previous versions of Windows, ending with Windows 7, Microsoft has set upon a course of drastically reducing the up-front costs relating to Windows: Windows 8.x was available direct from Microsoft for $39.99 for at least four months; upgraders from Win7 with a coupon got it for $15. Windows 10 upgrade from Win7/8.1 will be free for a year...during which time millions of people, if not tens of millions, will install Windows 10. So, it's pretty hard to ask a subscription price of $9.99 a year (the lowest I can imagine) in perpetuity, when you can buy it upfront for ~$40 (or less.) I think that this has to be a defense-of-trademark issue as they don't want somebody else to start using "365" in association with "Windows." By buying the trademark they can ensure that no one will.

you forget that they want to make windows as a service, what do you think that service is going to be?
 

kbrickley

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you forget that they want to make windows as a service, what do you think that service is going to be?

They could borrow a page from the MMO world and charge a fixed fee for basic access levels but offer the recurring subscription for additional features (remote storage, optional integrated features, improved service responsiveness, etc) ... there are many possible approaches they could take (some horrible and some very competitive) and we would need to see which direction they choose to go to fully judge the effectiveness and risk ;)
 

Stoly

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Swallowing the OS entirely doesn't seem to be the plan for the Spartan browser, but I could be wrong.

I'm only not dismissing it out of hand entirely because I've used a computer whose OS was BASIC.

Basic has never been an OS.
 

Megalith

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How is Microsoft even going to sell the idea of a subscription-based Windows when the OS has traditionally been so affordable. People bought into Office 365 and Adobe Creative Poop because they seem like a good deal compared to their full versions (paying $10 or so a month compared to hundreds of dollars at once), but I don't see Microsoft being able to trick people the same way.
 

TwistedAegis

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grtitan

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Haha I love the anti ms trolls. I guess their predictions that office 365 would fail was accurate as well? Haha.

haha I love the ms fanbois. I guess their dreams of eternal monopoly will never die? Haha
 

Unknown-One

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Indeed. Linux has a bright future (on the desktop) if Windows goes subscription.
Why the assumption that the subscription version will be the only version?

Hasn't been the case with Office. The stand-alone retail version is still available for those who consider it the best fit.
 

Exavior

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Why the assumption that the subscription version will be the only version?

Hasn't been the case with Office. The stand-alone retail version is still available for those who consider it the best fit.

A better question is why assume that there will be a subscription since we have already been told that windows 10 and all future versions are free once you get it. Only cost will be for those going from windows Vista or below up to 10. But once you get 10 there is no more cost for windows going forward. So if windows is free you are paying for????? Nothing, that is what you are paying for. Unless of course you are an enterprise. then you don't get the free versions forever like home users will. Again this is what they have been saying. Don't see them going back on something like that.
 

evilsofa

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we have already been told that windows 10 and all future versions are free once you get it.

Your optimism makes a nice balance to the pessimists who read the announcements in a much more sinister way than you have. I'm not with them, but neither do I think it will work quite the way you hope it will.
 

Exavior

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Your optimism makes a nice balance to the pessimists who read the announcements in a much more sinister way than you have. I'm not with them, but neither do I think it will work quite the way you hope it will.

I might be slightly overlooking something. However they had stated this.

This is more than a one-time upgrade: once a Windows device is upgraded to Windows 10, we will continue to keep it current for the supported lifetime of the device – at no cost. With Windows 10, the experience will evolve and get even better over time. We’ll deliver new features when they’re ready, not waiting for the next major release.

So they aren't going to be expecting to go from windows 10 to 11 to add in new features. Instead they will be adding stuff right into Windows 10. And if you read that it states at no cost for you to keep said device current with all the updates. So where exactly am I confused or misunderstanding that for the average person (none enterprise) that they are going to be paying for upgrades?
 

evilsofa

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I've had long experience with tech companies splitting hairs over the difference between "update" and "upgrade". Let's look, for example, at the phrase, "we will continue to keep it current for the supported lifetime of the device": define "it". Are they talking about the device or Windows 10?

Also, "next major release" implies that there will be a next major release, which could quite possibly be defined as "the version that can't be upgraded to from a free Windows 10 upgrade".

And as for your last sentence, of course average people will be paying for WIndows 10 upgrades - all of those people that don't do the free upgrade in the first year will have to pay.
 

heatlesssun

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And as for your last sentence, of course average people will be paying for WIndows 10 upgrades - all of those people that don't do the free upgrade in the first year will have to pay.

I'm thinking that those who don't upgrade within the year will never upgrade.
 

Flogger23m

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If they did something like $5/month for full access to Windows and the upgrades are included (going from Windows 8 to 10 for example), I would do it. Better then shelling out $200+ for an OS in one sitting. If they go the way of EA and start doing DLC type shady crap, then no, I am not OK with it.

Also beats trying to dick around with OEM licenses when you switch motherboards or something of that nature.

$5 a month? That is $60 a year. $120 for two years. A new Windows comes out every ~2+ years, so you'd really not be saving much, if any. And if you wanted to keep some spare PCs around (which are used only a little) that will will go up even more.

I don't mind a subscription option, but I would always want a non-subscription license.
 

DPI

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A better question is why assume that there will be a subscription since we have already been told that windows 10 and all future versions are free once you get it. Only cost will be for those going from windows Vista or below up to 10. But once you get 10 there is no more cost for windows going forward. So if windows is free you are paying for????? Nothing, that is what you are paying for. Unless of course you are an enterprise. then you don't get the free versions forever like home users will. Again this is what they have been saying. Don't see them going back on something like that.

Let's wait to see what's hiding in the EULA before we make any assumptioms about there never being a cost again if you update to Windows 10. Thanks.
 

Trimlock

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Your optimism makes a nice balance to the pessimists who read the announcements in a much more sinister way than you have. I'm not with them, but neither do I think it will work quite the way you hope it will.

There are a lot of misconceptions, for one everyone hoping/counting/praying this fails doesn't understand what the current 365 is, which is only a service, not the actual software.

Could it end up that this becomes our only option? Sure, but it has yet to do that and is a very awesome service.

Then there are the ones who have no idea what any of this is, doesn't care and just want anything Microsoft to fail.
 

Jagger100

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Windows 365 where you can pay several times over for the same OS. You pretty much have been anyway.

Windows 365, you've been paying for our bugs for a long time now, why not think of it as paying for bug fixes and feel better about it.

Windows 365, why would you want to give us incentive to ever make another significant OS update? Really why?
 
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