Microsoft Releases More Diversity Stats, And They Aren’t Pretty

[heatlesssun]

Here's where you're wrong. It wasn't a "bad shoot", it was perfectly justified. Don't know if the kid was shell-shocked or plain slow, but he made the wrong move when he didn't put his hands up. Maybe his parents should've taught him better about being careful 'round da po-leece, or something.

Justified to me means that this cop would do exactly the same thing in the same position. As Bill1024 said, hindsight is 20/20. And with that 20/20 hindsight how would doing the same thing again in the same position be justified?

 

[jtm55]

Hi All

I was told by my parents to always obey the police & follow their instructions. To be polite to them & never make any sudden moves. That if I was pulled over by them keep my hands on the steering wheel until asked to show drivers license/ registration & to move slowly when doing so. If arrested keep my mouth shut & respectfully ask to call my parents. My dad told me that a lot of police have never had interaction with blacks or Latinos so only new what they saw on TV or told by other police. A lot of what the media portrays of blacks & Latinos is less than positive,so conduct yourself in a way where they won't see you as a threat.
I took what my dad told me to heart & have been fortunate in never having a bad encounter with the police. Unfortunately all people of color can't say that. Case in point http://www.nytimes.com/1999/02/05/n...re-41-shots-and-an-unarmed-man-is-killed.html

 

[dmonkey]

Justified to me means that this cop would do exactly the same thing in the same position. As Bill1024 said, hindsight is 20/20. And with that 20/20 hindsight how would doing the same thing again in the same position be justified?

You could run this scenario a hundred times with a hundred cops and the results would be the same. Dumb kid weeded himself out of the gene pool.

 

[Bill1024]

The kid was 5 ft 7 and 200 pounds with a gun that looked real.
How can the police know he was 12 and the gun was a BB gun?

There are no do overs even with 20/20 hindsight. This is not "call of duty" or "quake2"
You do not get to respawn when you make a mistake.
That young man made a deadly mistake. People have to take responsibility for their actions.
You can't go around pointing a weapon at people and think it is a good thing to do.
You can not resist arrest and batter a police officer go for his gun, then expect a good outcome.
Anyone who thinks people do not bring fate upon them selves by doing stupid shit like that will have a rude awakening one day.
Teach your kids manners and respect for other peoples life and property. Teach them to stay away from drugs and alcohol and people who do criminal activities.
Teach then the proper way to handle a weapon and to never point a gun at anything you do not intend to shoot.
Did you not see that young man point that gun at people? Stupid, stupid, stupid.
Now his parents, family, and the officer have to live with this young mans mistake.


No common sense, common sense is not so common anymore is it.

 

[heatlesssun]

The kid was 5 ft 7 and 200 pounds with a gun that looked real.
How can the police know he was 12 and the gun was a BB gun?

I always find it interesting how some in these cases will talk about the size of these "criminals" but then swear up and down that race plays never plays a part. Clearly if you can judge the weight and height of the "perp" you didn't miss race.

 

[Bill1024]

I always find it interesting how some in these cases will talk about the size of these "criminals" but then swear up and down that race plays never plays a part. Clearly if you can judge the weight and height of the "perp" you didn't miss race.

You keep saying he was 12, just a boy. He was the size of an adult.
What does being 12 have to do with it?
What does race have to do with it?
Either you are saying the kid was black and shot him for that reason.
He is black, therefor don't shoot he will not hurt anyone.
He was 12, and 12 year olds never kill any one.

You're saying police have to ID the suspect find out his age, race where he goes to church.
Then inspect the weapon, make sure it is real and loaded with one in the chamber.
Then if all conditions are met, step back 20 paces count to 10 and fire.
I am done with this nonsense.
May he rest in peace and the Lord comfort his family in their time of sorrow.
Also the police officer that has to live with the fact he shot and killed that child.

 

[heatlesssun]

You keep saying he was 12, just a boy. He was the size of an adult.
What does being 12 have to do with it?
What does race have to do with it?
Either you are saying the kid was black and shot him for that reason.
He is black, therefor don't shoot he will not hurt anyone.
He was 12, and 12 year olds never kill any one.

You're saying police have to ID the suspect find out his age, race where he goes to church.
Then inspect the weapon, make sure it is real and loaded with one in the chamber.
Then if all conditions are met, step back 20 paces count to 10 and fire.
I am done with this nonsense.
May he rest in peace and the Lord comfort his family in their time of sorrow.
Also the police officer that has to live with the fact he shot and killed that child.

I was 5' 10" when I was 12 though much slighter at 130 pounds. I did all of my vertical growing by 14 ending up at 6' 1". So I was man sized at an early age and as mentioned earlier my parents warned me about by size and skin color being threatening. But at the age of 12 do you really think I understood that? Even if you don't agree about race, do you really think a 12 year old the size of a man really understands that some people will think he's a full grown man and what all of the implications of that are?

Obviously children, especially where anything gun related is involved, can be dangerous. The story of the Idaho woman shot with her own gun by her two year old. That really broke my heart. Look, I think that the Cleveland incident was honest mistake. The kid apparently made mistakes as well, though nothing he would have done that day would have put someone in the ground. I don't think the cop needs to go to jail or anything like. But it was a pretty bad mistake and he doesn't need to be a cop anymore. I would kind of think he doesn't want to be a cop anymore either.

 

[Bill1024]

"But it was a pretty bad mistake and he doesn't need to be a cop anymore"

What do can not or will not comprehend it was the kids mistake, not the cops.
The cop did his job, his duty to protect the community and his self.

The police officer did not know or could not of known the kid was 12 and the gun was fake.

I got my first gun when I was 13, a Ruger 10/22 semiautomatic 22cal.
My 2nd gun when I was 14, a Savage 222cal bolt action with a 9x40 scope and bipods.
My 3rd was a 12ga Ithica pump action shotgun when I was 16.
I never shot anyone, I never, ever pointed my gun at anyone never.
I was 10 or 11 the first time I shot a gun. At 12 I knew guns could kill, I knew what it felt like to be in a fight and get hit. 12 year olds know right from wrong,
You need to get over this and rethink your position. Walk a mile in that police officers shoes.

You your self would not of shot that kid? You honestly would of , after getting a cal of "a male pointing a gun at people walking by and scaring them " you would not shoot after telling his to put his hands up and then he reached for his waistband. You would not shoot?

And IF that weapon was real, and the kid shot and killed your father, or brother or sister the policeman, You would not be angry they did not shoot because they thought the gun was fake?
Really?

Don't let your kids play with BB guns that look real!!!!!!

Over and out.

 

[Blown 89]

But one was a trained police officer and grown man. The other was not and 12. It was a bad shoot and excuses don't make it a good one.

"He was 12" is the biggest excuse in that case.

 

[kac77]

"He was 12" is the biggest excuse in that case.

Not really from every sense possible legally or otherwise. The age of the individual matters unless you don't see them as human.

 

[kac77]

Don't let your kids play with BB guns that look real!!!!!!

Over and out.

This is the biggest load of crap I've seen in a while. What metal toy gun doesn't look real? Little kids have been playing with toy guns that look quite real from far away for years. I played with plenty from BB guns to Co2 guns when I was little. We pointed the gun at all sorts of things. Killed some animals too. Yet no one called the cops (probably because one lived on our block) and at no time when we played outside did a cop car pull up next to us and within 2 seconds (which really isn't enough time to comply with any one) shoot us dead.

The fact of the matter is that some here would rather come up with any excuse possible instead of recognizing the obvious.

 

[heatlesssun]

"He was 12" is the biggest excuse in that case.

This is just creepy.

 

[Blown 89]

Not really from every sense possible legally or otherwise. The age of the individual matters unless you don't see them as human.

Being 12 doesn't excuse his actions nor does it remove consequences.

 

[punisher]

This is the biggest load of crap I've seen in a while. What metal toy gun doesn't look real? Little kids have been playing with toy guns that look quite real from far away for years. I played with plenty from BB guns to Co2 guns when I was little. We pointed the gun at all sorts of things. Killed some animals too. Yet no one called the cops (probably because one lived on our block) and at no time when we played outside did a cop car pull up next to us and within 2 seconds (which really isn't enough time to comply with any one) shoot us dead.

The fact of the matter is that some here would rather come up with any excuse possible instead of recognizing the obvious.

Sadly we live in a different time. My dad carried a shotgun to school, which he used to hunt with, and it stayed in the back of the classroom all day until it was time to head home. He open carried it all the time during dove season. I had my toy cap guns when I was a kid (6-7 years old), and later on my BB/pellet guns with which I terrorized the local wildlife.

I never carried any toy gun, or that pellet gun with me ever when I left my parents/grandparent's property. If I had even thought of pointing that pellet gun at anyone, my dad would have psychically bitchslapped me for being stupid. (he was that good).

Kids do stupid shit as kids are inclined to do. Sometimes events merge, and murphy's law takes over, and a kid that does something stupid pays for his actions with his life. It sucks, but I understand it. I don't know if I would have/could have pulled the trigger as quickly as that cop did, but I understand why he did.

As far as the "obvious", well duh. The cops thought an African American male was waving around a gun, and pointing it at people in a park. If it would have been a little white kid, dressed like a cowboy, with a nickel plated 6 shooter cap gun running around terrorizing people, the outcome likely would have been different. If a Caucasian adult was running around pointing a blacked out airsoft AR-15 at people, cops would have dropped him to.

 

[Bill1024]

The man then the woman that were attacked with hammers because they were white by black youths deserved to be attacked why?

Old white people should be punched and knocked out by black youth in some game because?

Black youth riot, loot, and burn down their neighborhood in honor of a criminal who after strong robbing a store, then attacked an officer, going for the officers gun. That's ok why?

The New black panther party goes on Tv and says kill all the crackers and their cracker babies. Every last iota cracker.

Blacks march and say what do we want. Dead cops, when do we want it, now. OK too?

And they chant this is what democracy look like.
Ummm this is not a democracy, we live in a REPUBLIC. that goes back to lack of education.

Who are the racist ones n this country......

 

[heatlesssun]

And they chant this is what democracy look like.
Ummm this is not a democracy, we live in a REPUBLIC. that goes back to lack of education.

Yes, the gift of education. That always freely given freely to the souls you condemn.

 

[dmonkey]

This is the biggest load of crap I've seen in a while. What metal toy gun doesn't look real? Little kids have been playing with toy guns that look quite real from far away for years. I played with plenty from BB guns to Co2 guns when I was little. We pointed the gun at all sorts of things. Killed some animals too. Yet no one called the cops (probably because one lived on our block) and at no time when we played outside did a cop car pull up next to us and within 2 seconds (which really isn't enough time to comply with any one) shoot us dead.

The fact of the matter is that some here would rather come up with any excuse possible instead of recognizing the obvious.

What is "the obvious"? They shot him because he was a 12 year old black boy? Is that all you got?

You know it's funny when some people talk about a "blood feud" like there's a race war going on, when the fact is that's the last thing you'd ever want.

 

[Bill1024]

Yes not only is it free to the little souls, they must attend until the age of 16 by law.
Now if only they would take advantage of it.

But then if it is so free, what are my land and school taxes so damn high?

 

[maverikv]

The man then the woman that were attacked with hammers because they were white by black youths deserved to be attacked why?

Old white people should be punched and knocked out by black youth in some game because?

Black youth riot, loot, and burn down their neighborhood in honor of a criminal who after strong robbing a store, then attacked an officer, going for the officers gun. That's ok why?

The New black panther party goes on Tv and says kill all the crackers and their cracker babies. Every last iota cracker.

Blacks march and say what do we want. Dead cops, when do we want it, now. OK too?

And they chant this is what democracy look like.
Ummm this is not a democracy, we live in a REPUBLIC. that goes back to lack of education.

Who are the racist ones n this country......

Well, you, for one.

 

[Dekoth-E-]

This is the biggest load of crap I've seen in a while. What metal toy gun doesn't look real? Little kids have been playing with toy guns that look quite real from far away for years. I played with plenty from BB guns to Co2 guns when I was little. We pointed the gun at all sorts of things. Killed some animals too. Yet no one called the cops (probably because one lived on our block) and at no time when we played outside did a cop car pull up next to us and within 2 seconds (which really isn't enough time to comply with any one) shoot us dead.

The fact of the matter is that some here would rather come up with any excuse possible instead of recognizing the obvious.

It was a 5'7" Male waving a gun around that looked real. So other than that, please indulge us in what you think is the obvious? It seems to me the one making up excuses is you. The obvious is at that size he was indistinguishable from an Adult. So unless the cop knew him personally and knew he was 12, age is irrelevant.

Skin color had little to do with it, anyone of any color of that size waving a gun around in public is likely going to get shot.

Age had nothing to do with it as mentioned above. The "kid" by age was a full grown man physically. Any cop that sees a full grown man pointing what reasonably appears to be a real gun at people is going to take them down. The only ones missing the obvious seems to be those with a chip on their shoulder against police. There are plenty of things cops do wrong they need to be held accountable for. This isn't one of them.

 

[Blown 89]

Well, you, for one.

This is why minorities aren't getting anywhere with racism. When a something, anything at all regardless whether it's racist or not, happens to a black man everyone in the world is racist. When a white man points out racism toward him the white man is racist. Racism isn't race specific.

 

[maverikv]

This is why minorities aren't getting anywhere with racism. When a something, anything at all regardless whether it's racist or not, happens to a black man everyone in the world is racist. When a white man points out racism toward him the white man is racist. Racism isn't race specific.

Give me a break. White people have it so rough. Constantly oppressed by the powerful black oligarchy.

 

[kac77]

It was a 5'7" Male waving a gun around that looked real. So other than that, please indulge us in what you think is the obvious? It seems to me the one making up excuses is you. The obvious is at that size he was indistinguishable from an Adult. So unless the cop knew him personally and knew he was 12, age is irrelevant.Skin color had little to do with it, anyone of any color of that size waving a gun around in public is likely going to get shot..

Oh so its not race because u say so...oh OK

The age matters because the fact that is was a kid was communicated earlier...as was the possibility of the gun being a toy.

This isn't one of them.

Feel free to provide an example. I personally don't think that you think race is ever a factor...and in this country that kind of belief just highlights the point being made here.

 

[heatlesssun]

This is why minorities aren't getting anywhere with racism.

We didn't anywhere with slavery and legal racism for how long? There has always been major conflict in this country between blacks and whites over the matter of race. Always. Hell, there's always even been major conflict between whites over these issues. The conflict over these issues today are nothing new, just another chapter in a centuries long story.

 

[punisher]

I personally don't think that you think race is ever a factor...and in this country that kind of belief just highlights the point being made here.

Of course race is a factor, not an overriding factor, but a factor. The question is "Why is race a factor,"

Can we assume all rookie cops start their police careers as racists just looking to kill black people, or is it more likely they learned from experience on the job that blacks are inherently more dangerous to deal with? Do black cops harbor similar biases? Is it a never ending cycle of blacks behaving badly causing cops to treat them differently causing blacks to behave badly when interacting with cops?

 

[heatlesssun]

Is it a never ending cycle of blacks behaving badly causing cops to treat them differently causing blacks to behave badly when interacting with cops?

However there are plenty of incidences where blacks aren't behaving badly and stereotypical thinking trumps good judgment. Cops take out plenty of black folks, and when the facts of the situation are clear and the black person had it coming, NO ONE complains about it, black, white, etc. Hell it hardly makes any news.

It's those circumstances where the facts aren't really clear or cops are tightlipped about it or where its a he said she said situation with no witnesses or solid evidence that are problematic. And in the grand scheme of things, while those incidences get tons of coverage, they are also pretty rare.

 

[Blown 89]

Give me a break. White people have it so rough. Constantly oppressed by the powerful black oligarchy.

Case in point. Before calling other people racist you may want to take a look in the mirror. It's pathetic how people like you preach tolerance for others yet are so intolerant yourself.

 

[dmonkey]

Case in point. Before calling other people racist you may want to take a look in the mirror. It's pathetic how people like you preach tolerance for others yet are so intolerant yourself.

You're forgetting the fact that black people are systematically incapable of being racist, sir. They couldn't even be racist if they tried.

 

[Blown 89]

However there are plenty of incidences where blacks aren't behaving badly and stereotypical thinking trumps good judgment. Cops take out plenty of black folks, and when the facts of the situation are clear and the black person had it coming, NO ONE complains about it, black, white, etc. Hell it hardly makes any news.

If that were the case the Ferguson riots would have never happened.

 

[maverikv]

Case in point. Before calling other people racist you may want to take a look in the mirror. It's pathetic how people like you preach tolerance for others yet are so intolerant yourself.

Other peoples racism is not a worldview that deserves or requires tolerance.

 

[heatlesssun]

If that were the case the Ferguson riots would have never happened.

The point though is very rarely do cops take out a black and something like Ferguson happens. Most black folks have zero issue with cops taking out a black thug. And even when cops have screwed up you don't see riots or see a lot of national attention. .

 

[Blown 89]

The point though is very rarely do cops take out a black and something like Ferguson happens. Most black folks have zero issue with cops taking out a black thug. And even when cops have screwed up you don't see riots or see a lot of national attention. .

I disagree. While there may not be riots every day the black community tends to vilify much of what the police and society does towards them and that attitude is prevalent in that culture's music, comedy, entertainment, and attitudes toward the police. Those undertones are what fuel riots like in Ferguson.

 

[heatlesssun]

You're forgetting the fact that black people are systematically incapable of being racist, sir. They couldn't even be racist if they tried.

I know plenty of black racists. My parents, while not what I would call full blown racists, they have a LOT of racial baggage. But growing up under their circumstances into middle age is bound to lead to feelings of resentment. So I cut them some slack. Likewise, I cut slack for white folks that have has bad experiences with blacks and other minorities. No one's hands are really clean in all of this. That is the nature of blood feuds.

 

[heatlesssun]

I disagree. While there may not be riots every day the black community tends to vilify much of what the police and society does towards them and that attitude is prevalent in that culture's music, comedy, entertainment, and attitudes toward the police. Those undertones are what fuel riots like in Ferguson.

And I disagree because I've seen plenty of instances where cops took out or took down a black person and there simply was no controversy. Indeed just look at the prisons. How many black folks rioted or even complained about one-tenth of a percent of the blacks in jail?

 

[Jagger100]

I blame senility.

To hear much of the talk you'd think it was still 1964 out there or even 1954. Just would be just about the right age for young adults from that era to start going senile and falling back to the world they knew. Also their kids probably raised viewing the world through the same glasses.

Won't matter in 20 years, Hispanics will displace Blacks as the key minority group that media and politics orbit around. Blacks are about to be on their own no matter what went before.

 

[heatlesssun]

I blame senility.

To hear much of the talk you'd think it was still 1964 out there or even 1954. Just would be just about the right age for young adults from that era to start going senile and falling back to the world they knew. Also their kids probably raised viewing the world through the same glasses.

Won't matter in 20 years, Hispanics will displace Blacks as the key minority group that media and politics orbit around. Blacks are about to be on their own no matter what went before.

Hispanics have already displaced blacks as the largest ethic minority in the US. And indeed this thread is out of 1964, even 1864. And if you think that many older black people have some sort "good old days" nostalgia about the Jim Crow era, I'd say you are mistaken. Some of you just don't seem to get how that system worked. I see people going apeshit all the time over NSA spying and how it stomps all over the Constitution. But somehow a system that dictated where you could live, work, go to school or sit in a restaurant is something people are pining for in their old age?

 

[Deleted whining member 223597]

What the fuck does this conversation have to do with tech anymore? I guess this is the race war section now.

 

[rudy]

Hispanics have already displaced blacks as the largest ethic minority in the US. And indeed this thread is out of 1964, even 1864. And if you think that many older black people have some sort "good old days" nostalgia about the Jim Crow era, I'd say you are mistaken. Some of you just don't seem to get how that system worked. I see people going apeshit all the time over NSA spying and how it stomps all over the Constitution. But somehow a system that dictated where you could live, work, go to school or sit in a restaurant is something people are pining for in their old age?

Whether you accept it or not some people have a vested interest in things you might not think anyone would. Jesse Jackson has had negative things to say about Obama, likely a reaction to his own Jealousy that a old guy like himself that represents the old equality fight wasn't the one who got to be president. Think about it from a perspective of power and wealth many black leaders pin their entire performance and support on the concept that racism is a problem that must be fought, and if that arguments becomes less important then the true nature of some of these leaders may come to light. As I said before diversionary war. Believe it or not some people will long not so much for those old days but for their success and notoriety they gained, for the purpose it gave their life, and the simplicity for which they fought. The scariest thing that can happen to an old person is seeing their power and focus become meaningless. This manifests itself in everything from as complex as a national equality fight, to a mechanic working in a garage that is pissed off because fuel injected engines are making his old expertise obsolete.

 

[heatlesssun]

Whether you accept it or not some people have a vested interest in things you might not think anyone would. Jesse Jackson has had negative things to say about Obama, likely a reaction to his own Jealousy that a old guy like himself that represents the old equality fight wasn't the one who got to be president. Think about it from a perspective of power and wealth many black leaders pin their entire performance and support on the concept that racism is a problem that must be fought, and if that arguments becomes less important then the true nature of some of these leaders may come to light. As I said before diversionary war. Believe it or not some people will long not so much for those old days but for their success and notoriety they gained, for the purpose it gave their life, and the simplicity for which they fought. The scariest thing that can happen to an old person is seeing their power and focus become meaningless. This manifests itself in everything from as complex as a national equality fight, to a mechanic working in a garage that is pissed off because fuel injected engines are making his old expertise obsolete.

And everything you say here could be 100%. However, black leaders and blacks of accomplishment have always faced significant opposition from some whites, no matter what. They've always been labeled troublemakers. And in all honesty that's kind of what they did. Not too many white folks in the South wanted to see MLK in their town, because yep, he was certainly going to cause some trouble.

So it's not always any easy thing to discern. Clearly some black leaders, like any other leaders, are not who they say they are and do what they do for selfish reasons. But causing trouble and being discomforting to some whites historically has proven effective.

 

[NickS]

I wish all this PC crap about diversity in the work place would just die.

The way a business should be run is that you hire the most qualified and appropriate people for the jobs you need to fill.

Hiring black, hispanics, asians, whites, etc. just to meet some stupid diversity expectation is completely and utterly retarded.

This.