100% agreed. In some cases, as in older titles that no one cares to support anymore, it can actually be more optimized than native Windows and far from slow.
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Microsoft Quietly Cuts Off Windows 7 Support for Older Intel Computers
- Thread starter Megalith
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100% agreed. In some cases, as in older titles that no one cares to support anymore, it can actually be more optimized than native Windows and far from slow.
BS, right click the start button in Window 10 and everything you typically want as a tech or power user is right there, your problem is your a Luddite and still using the Control Panel.
dreamwriter
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Obviously Wine doesn't provide 100% Windows compatibility, but is it possible that it will, eventually?
dreamwriter
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I have Windows 10 on my HP 8740W, and do not object to its interface. What bother me is that it is more intrusive, with lots of telemetry enabled by default.
Too bad this isn't accurate. That's just two examples that I provide and your right click doesn't fix Safe Mode. Keep the name calling to yourself.
dreamwriter
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It should be noted that as of the end of last year Windows 7 is at 49% usage (from memory), whereas Windows 10 is at 29%. Pretty startling afyer years of aggressive marketing that people vote for Windows 7. It would make sense for MS to see the writing on the wall, but they don;t listen to people outside of their inner circle.
dreamwriter
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If that was the only reason for telemetry I would be for it 100%. But if you read consent and Eula you will see that MS gives itself the right to scan all personal files on your PC. In the aftermath of the disastrous Facebook policy, I don't think this is justifiable.
It's amazing how we managed without it (or at least nowhere near the current extent) during the biggest and best software advancements in history.
I can agree that the way they handled safe mode is poor. Unless something has changed, there's no hotkey command anymore to get into a "safe mode" version of the OS. You have to fail a bootup a few times, toggle it in settings, jump through the advanced boot menu, or use recovery partitions/media. All of which are inconvenient steps that used to just take a press of a button at the right time.
That's just poor design. Their justification (iirc) was that boot times were so quick now, users wouldn't be able to hit the hotkey in time. The solution to that is to do what most devices do, on power on when the firmware first starts to load they look for a key combination being held, if it's held they execute safe mode. Users don't have to hit a command window, because they're simply holding a button (or combination of buttons).
dreamwriter
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It's because all logic points to telemetry as primarily a marketing strategy. Technological progress does not require on it. There are other ways of troubleshooting and problem solving.
I highly doubt that's really happening, if it was people would be blowing through their data usage caps in no time at all.
The problem with that kind of thinking is that software of yesteryear was... less complicated than software of today. If you look at the size of the Windows codebase it's ballooned in size. Why? Because people are expecting their systems to do damn near everything for them including figuratively make them breakfast in the morning. Well, when your codebase becomes bigger that means more bugs.
auntjemima
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It should be noted that computers advanced pretty slowly since Windows 7 was released (people are still running socket 1156 i5's, even on this forum). I feel that Windows 7 was only as quickly adopted because 10 years ago people were more apt to buy a new PC. We were just entering the Core2 era and laptops were coming down in price considerably. A few years forward and you are getting laptops with a core processor which rarely needs to be upgraded. Then you have the cell phone and tablet market that took off, aggressively by Apple and Google.
If Windows 10 was released 10 years ago it would have huge adoption. Rarely do people upgrade devices if they are already serving their purpose. So I feel the slow PC market and people still running old systems vs a new system already coming with 10 is the reason because the slow adoption.
dreamwriter
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Don't you think that the primary reasons for Windows 10 were an attempt to consolidate all Windows users, and "manage them", as well as create one dumbed down UI modelled after ubiquitous tile based smartphones and tablets?
Remember the uproar when 8 eliminated the Start Menu? People like some of the traditional features because they work well. I;m on other forums where many prefer 7.
I also put the blame on Intel in this situation. How long have we had ONLY four core processors? I'd say close to ten years. Combine that with what amounts to table scraps as far as performance increases from generation to generation and you have a recipe for a slowing PC market. With AMD and the new AMD Ryzen line of processors coming to the market, then and only then has Intel had to actually get off their asses and actually do something as versus just sleeping at the wheel like they have been for close to ten years.
auntjemima
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Even so, you could still run an old processor on Windows 7 for the foreseeable future. People just aren't buying laptops like their were a decade ago.
Doubt it. Google Chrome with more than six tabs open would bring an older system to its knees. It would make a Core 2 Duo system positively beg for mercy. And we're not even talking about the fact that most modern web sites are so loaded down with Javascript and images that RAM usage sours into the Stratosphere.
Works for me (not the crap, just Win 10). It used to had occasional pop up ads but they stopped some time ago (like last year?). Now it shows links on the PW screen and they change the PW screen background time to time and I like the images - I save one now and then to my USB stick. I've had zero issues with my free copy of Win 10 so I bought a few more for my other PC's. I've said some harsh things about Microsoft in the past but since Win 10 I have to give them a thumbs up.
Maybe if I was in the business I'd see it differently but, I'm not (just a used to be repair tech for HP, amongst others) and for gaming, iTunes etc Win 10 home works great
Dead Parrot
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Wonder how long before some company sues Microsoft over this due to having some type of now dropped CPU in an embedded machine that will cost many thousands of dollars to upgrade IF it can be upgraded. Seems like Microsoft is defaulting on their long published support policies and may be stepping into a legal mess if some deep pockets company gets burned.
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You do realize I have degrees in astrospace engineering and computer science and am the chief engineer of a fortune 100 company? I also designed satellites for NASA. I also worked for a Nobel prize winner in Chemistry.
I use my home computer maybe < 1 hour a week, mostly for amazon and reading tech sites. I do my development on windows 7 like most corporations do. The only real tinkering I do is with Arduino on windows 10 and that ide is anchient but effective. As I'm creating an it device for a lunch and learn I wanted to start up iis and run a webAPI service on it to talk to Arduino. Then I found out what a pain in the ass it is to find and set up under 10. Completely different then what it used to be for no freaking useful reason what so ever, just like the cpl change.
Don't make assumptions.
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Old windows 7 control panel. There's a difference. RIF
I can find anything by typig the cpl name in the windows search. Buy try to find the old control panel layout from mouse clicks. It's just a disaster of too many clicks. The average user is not so skilled. Usability stats say the average user gives up if there are more than 3 clicks involved.
I make software usable not flashy. As I told someone "I make functional not flashy. If you want someone to spend one week producing a cornflower blue icon hire that guy and stop worrying about your customers usability stats."
Bonus points if you get the corn flower blue icon reference.
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You seem to forget the auto upgrade from 7 that Microsoft rammed down people's throats on their old machines. The fact so many rejected ia "free upgrade" should tell you something.
My wife didn't have that choice. They upgraded her when I told it not to. And that was an issue for a log log till people started bitching to Microsoft about that little "feature"
Windows 10 is a failure because is rejected by the majority of people happy with 7 like interfaces.
auntjemima
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By old I was thinking the iCore series, but even so, Chrome is highly memory dependant. 8gb and you would be fine.
ManofGod
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Am I supposed to believe you just because you say so on the internet? LOL!
Doing development and doing IT are not the same thing, even by a long short. No biggie though, I used to think that developers would know all about computers as well, until I found that they didn't.As far as the tools, you use what you have available to get the job done.
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You're rightAm I supposed to believe you just because you say so on the internet? LOL!
As far as the tools, you use what you have available to get the job done.
It and doing development is not the same thing. Each has their purpose . But in development we create. IT uses what we create. And then we in development institute hacks to the registry to get around the problems it creates on our personal machines.
just poking a little fun at ya. I couldn't do my job without IT. But when it comes to system internals we will happily match with with any IT person.As engineer and architect I work with engineerig, software teams, and it when the network gets involved. It's always a team effort.
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auntjemima
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I find the search function in the start menu to be one of the best things to come to Windows. Previous version had that search box, but it wasn't effective at all.
oh noes, we believe you
Had something similiar back in the day ..I called it the Borg Cube as it was in a APEVIA X-QPACK . Very good experience for me using the BIOSTAR board for that .
I ran Win 7 on a Pentium-M which was based on PIII architecture , early Centrino .It just topped out with 1GB RAM which was not optimal , but didn't crash like XP
Kenny
ZLoth
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I've played around with Windows 8, and it had multiple performance and functionality improvements. Guess what everyone remembers about Windows 8? The TETRIS menu interface (laughably called "Modern").
Lets see here.... you are still willing to use nVidia 2xx cards (released 2008-2009) and the AMD/ATi Radeon 5xxx HD caards (released 2009)? You do realize that nVidia discontinued driver support in April, 2016, right? Are you still rocking that 1600×1200 CRT monitor?
And, when you talk about "old world craftsmanship", are you including the fact that it took longer to build and assemble, and was intended to last decades? In comparison, I place the usable life of a computer of around 5-7 years now, and a car that I use everyday to run errands and commute to work at 10-15 years. Sure, you can restore a classic old automobile, but do you want to deal with the reduced safety.
I can see your argument about desktop computers being "tools", and I can see that aspect. Too often, I see form over function in both cars and computers. Guess what? You can modify it to fit your needs! I hate-hate-hate the Windows 10 Calculator, so guess what? There is a Windows 7 Calculator replacement. Hate the standard Notepad? I use Notepad++. Anyone recall when web development stalled because Internet Exploder had 98% of the browser market? Firefox broke the logjam, and nowadays, at least 60% of the Internet population uses Chrome.
I still cannot believe this whole Win7 vs Win10 religious war started because Microsoft elected not to fix an issue on a processor family that was discontinued in the early 2000s. What does all of this petty bickering really get you? Not much, and quite frankly....
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I'll happily mail you my linked in and resume as well as contactsoh noes, we believe you
auntjemima
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You're trying too hard to prove yourself to nobodies.
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You're right
For everyone saying Windows 10 is just like any other upgrade, everyone is just whining, you're either ignorant of how different 10 is from any other version of Windows, you've drank the kool aid, or are so simple you can't envision a scenario where their design change is a really, really bad idea.
I'm dreading Windows 10 for one reason: mandatory automatic updates. This means I'm not in control of my system. If MS decides to push an update that breaks software I use in the middle of a project, that's it, I'm fucked. I've already seen updates on Windows 7 break things, this isn't some hypothetical scenario. At least on 7 I can skip anything problematic. That control is gone. Unless you're using Enterprise, LTSB, or something else hacked together, you're no longer control your system. Now granted, 99% of the time that's probably not going to cause a problem. If you're unlucky enough to get hit when it does though, again, you're fucked. I rely on my computer for my job. The thought of any of my software working one day then not working the next for any reason that's not hardware failure is completely unacceptable to me, even if it's less than a 1% chance. To remove that control from the user completely is beyond asinine in my eyes. If all you do is browse the web, send emails, and use software that's actively supported, I'm sure Windows 10 is great for you. If you do anything where you lose money if your computer isn't running your software exactly the same as it was the day before, it's a nightmare to even think about.
But sure, try to falsely equivocate this with just "being afraid of change." It's obscene how willing people who should know better are to give up control of their own systems.
I'm dreading Windows 10 for one reason: mandatory automatic updates. This means I'm not in control of my system. If MS decides to push an update that breaks software I use in the middle of a project, that's it, I'm fucked. I've already seen updates on Windows 7 break things, this isn't some hypothetical scenario. At least on 7 I can skip anything problematic. That control is gone. Unless you're using Enterprise, LTSB, or something else hacked together, you're no longer control your system. Now granted, 99% of the time that's probably not going to cause a problem. If you're unlucky enough to get hit when it does though, again, you're fucked. I rely on my computer for my job. The thought of any of my software working one day then not working the next for any reason that's not hardware failure is completely unacceptable to me, even if it's less than a 1% chance. To remove that control from the user completely is beyond asinine in my eyes. If all you do is browse the web, send emails, and use software that's actively supported, I'm sure Windows 10 is great for you. If you do anything where you lose money if your computer isn't running your software exactly the same as it was the day before, it's a nightmare to even think about.
But sure, try to falsely equivocate this with just "being afraid of change." It's obscene how willing people who should know better are to give up control of their own systems.
Linux for your normal computing needs, Windows 10 for games. Solved the issue(s) for me. Linux runs almost all the applications I was using under Windows, the only place it was lagging was with games. Only about a third of my Steam games are available for Linux.
^ This. So much this. I recall when it was normal to build and tweak a 'personal computer' - it was about personal choice and control.
I depend on my Win7 boxes for work - tweaked to suit particular specialty tasks. When I dived into the Win10 Early Idiot Adopter program, an update borked a machine - I lost time and money. Did M$ recoup my lost income? No, they did not. Will I give M$ another chance? No I will not.
All but one Win7 box are offline. When 2020 rolls in, the only only internet connected box in the office will be running Linux.
Nanogrip
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P3 only runs USB 1.0 if I am not mistaken, total ram also is an issue. Goodluck running W7 on that ancient CPU hehe.
Red Falcon
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One can get USB 2.0 PCI expansion cards for it, so I don't see what the issue would be with that, and many of those Pentium III systems can have upwards of 768MB to 1.5GB of RAM - would be painful but it could be done.
Not to mention the Spectre and Meltdown issues that would be left unpatched, so it would also be much more unsecure.
There are quite a few lighter operating systems that could be run on such a system, though.
Nanogrip
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I remember installing a USB 2.0 PCI expansion card to one old P3 computer. BSODed everytime, including booting in safe mode. Took out the card (probably cost more than the P3 system itself), then smashed the computer with a sledge hammer in my back yard. Had some porn in the computer but screw it, 700MB of 240p videos is painful to watch. The slotted CPU cooling fan made perfect RAM coolers though.
Hey, don't knock the Pentium 3's!
My P3 Tualatin @ 1.7Ghz is a fine retro gamer, although it is running Windows 98SE and not Windows 7.