Microsoft Is Removing Xbox One DRM

okashira

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jul 7, 2005
Messages
1,802
OMG there needs to be an edit button

FIX now

What they are doing is process offloading to a server farm. Latency has nothing to do with it. The amount of information being sent and received is small. The console will have all the required large information and all the offloading is send a plot job to figure out where things go and it sends the answer back. This elevates the console having to do a bunch of number crunching for processing or graphics. Same functionality has existed with supercomputers and graphic designers. It is nothing new, just new in the console world.

If Microsoft implements this function correctly it will allow the X1 to become main times more powerfully than the PS4 no matter what hardware is in the physical console.

100% BS. Thanks for posting though.
 

Zomoa

Limp Gawd
Joined
Nov 28, 2011
Messages
242
OMG there needs to be an edit button

FIX now

What they are doing is process offloading to a server farm. Latency has nothing to do with it. The amount of information being sent and received is small. The console will have all the required large information and all the offloading is send a plot job to figure out where things go and it sends the answer back. This elevates the console having to do a bunch of number crunching for processing or graphics. Same functionality has existed with supercomputers and graphic designers. It is nothing new, just new in the console world.

If Microsoft implements this function correctly it will allow the X1 to become main times more powerfully than the PS4 no matter what hardware is in the physical console.

It's all BS until it's proven that they can actually do the server offloading shit without ruining games. So far, server offloading has really done nothing to improve games, and has only made them worse (d3, sim city, etc). Latency is not some minor problem. It's a huge issue with the concept in general for real time gameplay.

It won't be better than having more powerful hardware locally.

Since I live in reality and not fantasy cloud land, I'll go with the significantly more powerful actual hardware of the PS4.
 

Anaerin

n00b
Joined
Mar 13, 2007
Messages
62
So it seems I'm the only one that's massively disappointed in this.

  • No more sharing your library with friends
  • No more playing your games on a friend's console
  • No more playing games without having the disc in the drive
  • Want to sell/lend/trade? Better give them the physical disc. What's that? They're in another city/country? Too bad, so sad.
Instead of Digital Rights Management, they've gone back to Physical Rights Management. And you can't go half-way, 'cause how would online console A know you've sold your game to a friend to play offline on console B?
 

Dreaz

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Aug 30, 2004
Messages
1,656
So it seems I'm the only one that's massively disappointed in this.

  • No more sharing your library with friends
  • No more playing your games on a friend's console
  • No more playing games without having the disc in the drive
  • Want to sell/lend/trade? Better give them the physical disc. What's that? They're in another city/country? Too bad, so sad.
Instead of Digital Rights Management, they've gone back to Physical Rights Management. And you can't go half-way, 'cause how would online console A know you've sold your game to a friend to play offline on console B?

All of that was probably BS. Why would you believe anything MS has said after both of their release disasters and now this 180 on all their most "important" features?
 

BladeVenom

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jun 29, 2005
Messages
7,707
So it seems I'm the only one that's massively disappointed in this.

They probably should have had one policy for those who bought a digital download, and the traditional policy for those who bought a disc. That way they could satisfy both groups.
 

kbrickley

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
May 13, 2012
Messages
7,514
It's all BS until it's proven that they can actually do the server offloading shit without ruining games. So far, server offloading has really done nothing to improve games, and has only made them worse (d3, sim city, etc). Latency is not some minor problem. It's a huge issue with the concept in general for real time gameplay.

It won't be better than having more powerful hardware locally.

Since I live in reality and not fantasy cloud land, I'll go with the significantly more powerful actual hardware of the PS4.

Right now both systems are only theoretical since neither have submitted their systems for independent benchmarking ... also, as far as I know, neither has demonstrated their systems at 4K resolutions (the only one that matters since 1080P is so last decade ;) )
 

yourgrandma

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Apr 15, 2011
Messages
1,370
This doesn't make the console all that more attractive tbh. Mediocre first party devs, weaker console and higher price makes it still a huge stinker.

But it's good to see that bitching can create change even from a company as stubborn as Microsoft. Maybe there is still hope for windows 8 and the chance that they will remove the horrible full screen menus
 

Rizen

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jul 16, 2000
Messages
9,394
They are going to leverage their cloud compute function in which, done right will allow the X1 to be many times more powerful than the PS4 no matter what the hardware is in the physical console.

This is why Microsoft did not dump as much hardware in the console as Sony did and no Sony will not have this ability for quite sometime. Sony's offering is streaming games from the cloud.
This will never happen. Developers would have to build their games with the assumption that the end user has a high speed, low latency connection. Which would severely limit their audience. Latency is still a huge issue in the US. I have a 24mbps connection and I still regularly have a 60-70ms ping which is unacceptable for core gaming functions.
 

DeathPrincess

Fully [H]
Joined
May 15, 2010
Messages
18,205
Untrustworthy company? And you trust Sony more? Root-kits in CD's? Networks that anyone just waltz through?

I'm not saying the Xbox One is better hardware then the PS4. But Sony is a more trustworthy company then Microsoft? You must be out of your head.

You seriously think the Xbox's network is...secure? :confused: That network is actually worse for security. I know bunches of people who have lost real money, and it's pretty common (and Microsoft will do nothing about it or even admit there's a problem, and barely tries to help the people who are affected).

It's like flying in planes and driving in cars. People are scared of fuck of flying because one plane crashed once, so would rather drive. Yet more people are killed in car crashes daily.

"Root kits" by a completely different company (SCE isn't SME or SDADC) vs. SOPA backing and selling you out to the government. Vs. crushing indie developers vs. Windows rootkits and "activations"? Microsoft isn't exactly known as an outstanding company, but that's not the issue here. Present actions, and the fact that Microsoft haven't apologized (which means they still think it's a good idea, which means they'll pursue it later). :D
 

Zomoa

Limp Gawd
Joined
Nov 28, 2011
Messages
242
Right now both systems are only theoretical since neither have submitted their systems for independent benchmarking ... also, as far as I know, neither has demonstrated their systems at 4K resolutions (the only one that matters since 1080P is so last decade ;) )

They have released specs. They are both based on existing AMD chips.

We know how these chips already perform. And we know how much of a difference an extra 50% more GPU power can make.

That will come into even greater effect at 4k resolutions, where extra GPU power matters even more.
 

kac77

2[H]4U
Joined
Dec 13, 2008
Messages
2,671
id like to get a big FUCK YOU to every one that bitched about the DRM
i LIKED the idea of sharing downloadable games and not have use physical disk

FUCK ALL YOU PEOPLE THAT BITCHED

So what you want us to believe is that it is hard to share downloadable games in 2013.....over the iNTERNET? In addition you seem to be under the impression that DRM removes the restrictions of content.....over the INTERNET.

Something tells me you haven't thought this through at all. Are you sure you are in the right thread? This is the thread is about not being tethered to Microsoft 24 hours a day in order to play the $60 game you've bought.

The thread entitled "Being Microsoft's bitch is all I have to hold on to" is about eight links down.
 

Rizen

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jul 16, 2000
Messages
9,394
Just look at the way MS is marketing the hardware. They are advertising the transistor count of the processor, which is a completely meaningless number.
 

Zomoa

Limp Gawd
Joined
Nov 28, 2011
Messages
242
This will never happen. Developers would have to build their games with the assumption that the end user has a high speed, low latency connection. Which would severely limit their audience. Latency is still a huge issue in the US. I have a 24mbps connection and I still regularly have a 60-70ms ping which is unacceptable for core gaming functions.

Bingo. Multi-platform developers arn't going to go out of their way to support cloud offloading, assuming they can even get it to work correctly. It's a lot of extra work that won't be of use to anyone using a PS4/PC; it's a lot of extra work that the majority of your players will not realize any benefit from.
 

Makaveli@BETA

2[H]4U
Joined
Mar 24, 2004
Messages
2,372
haha I like when they came in to pressure.

It seems they did like that amazon poll from a few days ago showing 30k votes for the ps4 and like 1700 for the Xbox one.

It sad that this is the only way MS will listen to their customers.

I wish that same thing could have been done for Win8 instead of the gimped start button they are adding in 8.1 which is obviously what people don't want.
 

Alyosha

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
May 1, 2003
Messages
1,870
Good for MS. It's nice when a big company doesn't let their hubris make them too stupid to kinda-sorta admit when they're wrong.
 

Jagger100

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Oct 31, 2004
Messages
7,631
So it seems I'm the only one that's massively disappointed in this.

  • No more sharing your library with friends
  • No more playing your games on a friend's console
  • No more playing games without having the disc in the drive
  • Want to sell/lend/trade? Better give them the physical disc. What's that? They're in another city/country? Too bad, so sad.
Instead of Digital Rights Management, they've gone back to Physical Rights Management. And you can't go half-way, 'cause how would online console A know you've sold your game to a friend to play offline on console B?
A lot of that came out late which makes me think it was pulled out at the last second to salvage their DRM scheme.
 

Tudz

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jun 15, 2008
Messages
7,434
you can kiss steam like sales good by fuck you all btw for that
id rather games for 10 bucks then this

You really thought they'd have Steam like sales? LOL, poor naive fool.

Steam doesn't have sales simply because it's an online distributor, it has sales because it's an online distributor in a market place of many online distributors AND brick and mortar stores which also have sales. PC games depreciate faster, that's been the case for a while now, Steam or no Steam.
 

Jagger100

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Oct 31, 2004
Messages
7,631
I guarantee you no top exec or board of director is accepting responsibility for this. Behind their closed doors they're blaming consumers for being ignorant, stubborn and clinging to guns & religion.
 

fdiaz78

2[H]4U
Joined
Oct 6, 2007
Messages
2,123
I have never quite understood this reasoning of firing someone for a single mistake unless it is something that they realistically should have known better (many safety violations for instance) ... it is hard for someone to learn from a mistake when their first mistake is their last one ;)

People who make decisions like this should be fired. Microsoft I think had a meeting with their PR and marketing and they told the execs that focus groups and polling all hate it and they would lose tons of money. MS can't afford to take a chance on losing to Sony.
 

Stiler

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jun 4, 2002
Messages
10,538
Now if they'd drop the stupid Kinect from the system and make it optional.
 

ol1bit

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jan 15, 2007
Messages
1,232
Microsoft has their heads buried in the sand. How and the F*ck did they think it would be ok to screw their users?

They had months to gather it was a bad idea that was going to suck, but they stood with their flaming ball of poo all the way though E3!

I think that now they see everyone pre-ordering PS4s changed their minds. I have owned all the flavors of Xbox, and I have a PS4 pre-ordered. Better/faster hardware, no crappy CEL technology, developers should be able to write code better/faster than ps3.

Sony blew it last time, this time they seem to be on the ball for what gamer's want. MS seems to be all about the money, so when the money started drying up, they reversed course. Not out of making a better system, but out of fear of losing money.

I will not forgive MS for their bone head plan, and their refusal to even see pre-E3 what people were saying for months. I don't trust they won't change their minds in the future.

Idiots!
 

SGTGimpy

Limp Gawd
Joined
Oct 7, 2009
Messages
233
Bingo. Multi-platform developers arn't going to go out of their way to support cloud offloading, assuming they can even get it to work correctly. It's a lot of extra work that won't be of use to anyone using a PS4/PC; it's a lot of extra work that the majority of your players will not realize any benefit from.

Yes you are correct on cross platform titles but exclusive content titles like Halo will.
 

nissanztt90

2[H]4U
Joined
Apr 13, 2007
Messages
3,858
People who make decisions like this should be fired. Microsoft I think had a meeting with their PR and marketing and they told the execs that focus groups and polling all hate it and they would lose tons of money. MS can't afford to take a chance on losing to Sony.

They lost when they pulled this shit to begin with and are only back pedaling because sony literally handed them their ass. I have a feeling they were banking on sony doing something similar and it backfired.
 

Elios

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Aug 12, 2004
Messages
7,249
So it seems I'm the only one that's massively disappointed in this.

  • No more sharing your library with friends
  • No more playing your games on a friend's console
  • No more playing games without having the disc in the drive
  • Want to sell/lend/trade? Better give them the physical disc. What's that? They're in another city/country? Too bad, so sad.
Instead of Digital Rights Management, they've gone back to Physical Rights Management. And you can't go half-way, 'cause how would online console A know you've sold your game to a friend to play offline on console B?

not just you i am to people cant see past the OMG DRM BAD to see what this would bring them
now where back the same old paying full price for console games for 3 year be for getting a whole 10 bucks off >.>
 
Joined
Aug 6, 2006
Messages
972
I wonder what Sony is thinking now. It still sucks paying M$ 60 bucks a year for Live on top of the 499 your gonna burn for the One.
 

kbrickley

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
May 13, 2012
Messages
7,514
People who make decisions like this should be fired. Microsoft I think had a meeting with their PR and marketing and they told the execs that focus groups and polling all hate it and they would lose tons of money. MS can't afford to take a chance on losing to Sony.

I agree they did it prematurely but make no mistake, this model is coming eventually from both companies ... right now people are holding onto the antiquated notion of ownership because of physical media ... but we have multiple digital platforms that are weaning us off of that model into a subscription model (Netflix, Steam, iTunes, Google Play, Amazon App store, Pandora, etc) ... even Sony now charges for online multi-player features of their next gen (and don't expect them to back away from that because MS has that already) ... the courts and congress have so far been in agreement that digital goods do not carry the same protections and restrictions that physical goods do ... postpone the inevitable as long as you like but the future will get here sooner or later ;)
 

Goose

Limp Gawd
Joined
Mar 21, 2006
Messages
306
Make the Kinect an option
Drop the price to $399
Match the PS4 for overall power
Shit they should have done from the start.
Then, maybe I'll consider a XB1.
 

kbrickley

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
May 13, 2012
Messages
7,514
PSN is now required to on the PS4 though I don' know how much it is.

The paid PSN is only required if you want to play online ... if you don't want to use online multiplayer or cloud functions you don't need the paid service (if you only want Netflix for instance and you play single player or local multiplayer only) ;)
 

pxc

Extremely [H]
Joined
Oct 22, 2000
Messages
33,064
peers into crystal ball:

...Don Mattrick departs MS to spend more time with his family...
 

Rauelius

2[H]4U
Joined
Jan 2, 2008
Messages
2,242
Even if they remove the Kinect needing to be always connected, I still won't consider an Xbone. So we've gone from Xbone to Xbox 180.

But it will always be "shame on anyone who'd support these practices in any form".

Seriously, Microsoft's already shown their hand. Just because they're backing down now doesn't mean they aren't going to try this again in the future...possibly before the eighth generation is even over. I still can't fathom why anyone would suddenly be okay with forking over $500 to a company that just attempted this unprecedented display of anti-consimerism.

I for one won't be getting an Xbone...ever...we can't let the threat of this disregard for the end user ever be even considered again. I want Microsoft out of the console market, as they are more of a detriment to us the gamer community than an asset. Microsoft must be made an example of, we can't let this happen again. I will tell anyone and everyone who comes to me for advise this holiday(and people always go to gamers for game-gift advice) to avoid the Xbone like the plague. Remember all the RRoD 360's? I'm on my fourth Xbox 360...I've had one since launch....I've had a PS3 since it's launch...however it's the same PS3 I purchased at launch. Running fine and enjoying "Last of Us" on my 7 year old console...Also let's not forget the complete and total disregard Microsoft has for Indie-Developers....And again, I DON'T WANT THE DAMN KINECT CAMERA TO BE REQUIRED...as I will not be getting an Xbone you think I wouldn't care. But at least 1 person I interact with might think about considering purchasing an Xbone, and I personally don't want to be in a house with an always listening camera knowing that Microsoft was the first company to sign on to PRISM. Not to mention in XboxLive's ToS it states that if you sign up for it not to expect any level of privacy. And lets not forget the PS4 is substantially more powerful and the Xbone(7GB available DDR5+Radeon 7850 class GPU vs 5GB available DDR3+Radeon 7790), compounded by the fact that the Xbone costs more than the More Powerful PS4.
 

Rauelius

2[H]4U
Joined
Jan 2, 2008
Messages
2,242
Major Nelson said that the Xbones policies were irreversable and the system was built from the ground up with always online needed. So either Microsoft was LYING to everyone, or the system is going to be much less capable then what Microsoft displayed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RtSGFryKwo&feature=player_detailpage#t=694s

It's so obvious today that he lied....Microsoft has to fire him if they want to save any face...Same with anyone else at Microsoft stupid enough to put their faces to the public backing this moronic idea.
 

MrSteel74

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Nov 17, 2000
Messages
1,599
I wonder what Sony is thinking now. It still sucks paying M$ 60 bucks a year for Live on top of the 499 your gonna burn for the One.

I'm going to sound like a total dick here but if you're smart enough to go online, register on a forum and complain that live costs $60 a year you should be smart enough to find a year of live for half that price. Just two weeks ago Best Buy had 4 months of live with 400 points for $15 in store.
 

Spidey329

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Dec 15, 2003
Messages
8,683
So much for the small and vocal few. Looks like their affected fanbase was a lot larger than anticipated.
 

Dark Shade

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
May 2, 2006
Messages
1,872
Even if they remove the Kinect needing to be always connected, I still won't consider an Xbone. So we've gone from Xbone to Xbox 180.

But it will always be "shame on anyone who'd support these practices in any form".

Seriously, Microsoft's already shown their hand. Just because they're backing down now doesn't mean they aren't going to try this again in the future...possibly before the eighth generation is even over. I still can't fathom why anyone would suddenly be okay with forking over $500 to a company that just attempted this unprecedented display of anti-consimerism.

I for one won't be getting an Xbone...ever...we can't let the threat of this disregard for the end user ever be even considered again. I want Microsoft out of the console market, as they are more of a detriment to us the gamer community than an asset. Microsoft must be made an example of, we can't let this happen again. I will tell anyone and everyone who comes to me for advise this holiday(and people always go to gamers for game-gift advice) to avoid the Xbone like the plague. Remember all the RRoD 360's? I'm on my fourth Xbox 360...I've had one since launch....I've had a PS3 since it's launch...however it's the same PS3 I purchased at launch. Running fine and enjoying "Last of Us" on my 7 year old console...Also let's not forget the complete and total disregard Microsoft has for Indie-Developers....And again, I DON'T WANT THE DAMN KINECT CAMERA TO BE REQUIRED...as I will not be getting an Xbone you think I wouldn't care. But at least 1 person I interact with might think about considering purchasing an Xbone, and I personally don't want to be in a house with an always listening camera knowing that Microsoft was the first company to sign on to PRISM. Not to mention in XboxLive's ToS it states that if you sign up for it not to expect any level of privacy. And lets not forget the PS4 is substantially more powerful and the Xbone(7GB available DDR5+Radeon 7850 class GPU vs 5GB available DDR3+Radeon 7790), compounded by the fact that the Xbone costs more than the More Powerful PS4.

but d00000d fukin HALO, man! gotta have us a bro LAN on Butt Gulch! :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:
 
Top