Making a server....Questions

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wankrtron

Gawd
Joined
Sep 27, 2004
Messages
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ive got an older 800mhz athlon box that is just sitting around right now. i want to make maybe an ftp or web server, but not really sure where to start.

im on cable internet and have a wireless router that hosts out to my pc (wired), a laptop (wireless) and my roomates pc (wireless). what im thinking is that it would be nice to have a place to ftp files to and from, and a place to host a small web page that i am making.

my question is where should i start? should it be windows based or should it be linux based? should it run an ftp ap or a web server ap and which ftp or web server ap should it run? is it gonna be difficult? ive messed with networking computers together and such, but never with an ftp / web server ap. thats why i came to you guys for suggestions.

so can any of you help me out?
 
wankrtron said:
ok, so it should run linux. what ftp ap or web hosting ap should it run? anyone?
Click to expand...

vsftp for the ftp server and apache for the web server. There are many how-to on the setup and configuration of these two services. Apache is the standard for web server software and vsftp is a very good and secure ftp server.

Running the server is a good idea. It will teach you a lot and plus it's fun.

Have fun.
 
FreeBSD is another good choice. Personally, I would seriously say if you can, try both and see how you like each of them.
 
I'm not sure how Linux friendly you are, but if you aren't it's not absolutely necessary to learn a ton of new stuff just to get a couple small jobs done. A very very basic install of Windows XP or better yet some form of 2000 can do quite well being a small time server, and then you can use normal programs you know. Apache still works under windows and there are many capable ftp servers (my favorite it BulletProof FTP).

Now, I don't want to bad mouth any Linux or Unix or whatever, but it's still not as easy and familiar to many people. If you have plenty of spare time and a hunger for knowledge, then go the Linux route. It will probably be more efficient, more stable...but if it were me, if I was going to have a few friends FTP from me and then a few more visit a small web site, I'd stick with what I know better, which is Windows.
 
i personally like freebsd the best out of all. I have been running my webserver with freebsd 5.1 for about a year and have had no problems at all. Really stable and fairly easy to setup.
 
dont use redhat 9 unless you plan to have at least 1,024mb of ram. I had 384mb of ram in my 500mhz athlon, and it sucked it dry with a basic "workstation" install.


If you have a big hard drive and a lot of ram, redhat 9.0 is probably the most user-friendly linux ive seen.
 
hmhmm, you have a 500mhz athlon might have something to do with your problem of RH being slow. I will say however that its desktop is pretty slow, with Suse 9.1 being the slowest.
 
well, i have been doing A LOT of reading from www.aboutdebian.com. from what i have picked up, you can use the standard linux installs as an ftp and web server right? i also downloaded the latest debian release and put the iso's on 9 cds. WHEW!

im fairly new to linux. about all i have messed with is a linux live knoppix disk. i have been wanting to learn linux for a long time now. despite the people that tell me that it is pointless. so i think first off i wanna give it a try and see if i can get it to work for me. if not, ill drop my 2k back on it and find some aps for it.

a few questions:
- i have yet to attempt an install. what are the chances im gonna screw it up? :p no really, its not THAT hard is it?
and
- should i just use what comes in the linux install as the ftp / webserver or find other add on programs?

- do i need to run both an ftp AND a webserver program to accomplish both tasks? is it more benefical / secure to do so? is it just more complicated and pointless?

- i know there are a lot of different distros out there. which ones should i look at? i know some say debian some say freebsd (ill probably try both). any others?

btw the official freebsd page is http://www.freebsd.org/ right?

this is really gonna be a learning adventure (if i dont get discouraged). i hope it turns out to be fun, and i hope i learn some stuff. most of all i hope i can get it up and running...sort of as a personal goal.

been wanting to run a linux box for years now, and here is my chance. any advice (ftp or otherwise) is definately welcome by this linux noob.

wish me luck and keep the advice coming. i really do apreciate it and thank you all.
 
With RH9, it had an FTP server and apache built-in. Just run the FTP and web server at the same time. For remote webpage editing, you can upload files much easier.

For me, as a windows and macintosh user, it wasnt too hard to figure out RH9. I was just astonished at how 480mb of ram (about 100mb swap used) can be used to run GNOME and the other various networking services. It was plenty fast on the 500mhz athlon, considering what it can do with gaming in windows.

Turbo linux 6.0 on my 225mhz O/C'ed K6 was a challenge. Voltage regulators over-heating, video card freaking-out... It only took about 20 minutes for an install, using 800mb of space. I had only "dos" experiance, so i figured out how to change directories and list pretty quickly.

Just, when i typed "DIR" it would dump about 200 pages all at once, and i couldnt figure out how to make it pause at each page (like DIR/P in dos). Anyway, within an hour of keyboard pounding, I was reconfiguring X windows using turboxpkg.


And whoever told you that linux was pointless, if I didnt have any common sense in me, i would drive down there myself with my 486DX linux server/internet gateway/print server/ftp server/router/proxy server.


And screwing it up? I screwed mine up. I didnt want to wait for the services to shut down, so I hit the power button a few times (like 20). I was getting CRC errors and many other things, which linux figured out how to fix them by itself during startup.

You will never learn a thing if you dont get to work. You have to get a linux server going, FUBAR it about ten times, then you will know how to un-FUBAR a computer with your eyes closed.

 
bob said:
And whoever told you that linux was pointless, if I didnt have any common sense in me, i would drive down there myself with my 486DX linux server/internet gateway/print server/ftp server/router/proxy server
Click to expand...

Just to confirm what I thought I said, I am not against using Linux at all for this, and by what it sounds like from wanktron, I think it's an excellent idea for him to use some form of it. My point was that many people might want to put up a web/ftp server and then be discouraged because they think Linux or Unix are the only good OS's for running servers.
 
deadlier...im not referring to you. dont feel bad, you are actually probably right. for me, it probably would be easier to run the windows server, but i really wanna learn linux, so im gonna give it a go.

anyway...um this is where im getting the freebsd from: ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/ISO-IMAGES-i386/5.3/ this is the place i needed to get it from right? 5.3 is the latest STABLE release isnt it? i think that has been one of my problems in this whole thing....im to retarded to figure out which download im supposed to get. :rolleyes: eh, if im wrong, im sure one of you will straighten my ass out. ;)
 
ClarkConnect has built in firewall, NAT, apache server, FTP server, SAMBA server and many more options. All you need is an old PC with 2 NICs in it.

Easy to set up and maintain, you can get it up an running in less than a 1/2hr, it's linux based and stable, oh yeah, and it's free. I've run mine for years, sometimes for over 250 days without a reboot. Actually I've never had to reboot it because of problems, only when I move the physical box and have to power it down or migrate it to a new box. I've run it on a pentium 200, currently running it on an old P3 500.
 
Personally, I use Gentoo for all my serving needs, but really for the tasks you are looking to do, any Linux/Unix box will do nicely. The most important thing you probably want to do is look into building a secure setup. You will want to disable any apache modules which you do not plan on using, as they can open up a machine to possible attack. I would recommend avoiding using FTP. Many Windows FTP clients support SFTP, which is a secure FTP-like system that works like FTP for the clinet, but uses the SSH protocol and port to send data, which is encrypted. This means you don't have passwords flying across the Internet as plain text. FTP is very insecure and isn't really designed with security in mind, so I would definitely recommend that you avoid it, if possible. One solution could be to use the webdav module for Apache to allow your clients to upload files using webdav, which you can secure by only allowing over SSL. Which brings me to my next point, be sure to create yourself a self-signed SSL certificate for your site and put anything you don't want the entire work seeing on a SSL-only portion of your site. A little bit of forethought and planning before building your server can save hours and days of headaches later, so read up and make a plan before jumping into anything.
 
You have two options as far as your new server goes. First off, you can either use two NICs in your server and disable DHCP in the wireless router you have now. This will allow you to route your traffic with the linux server, and generate statistics. The other option is to simply assign a IP to your server and route the traffic from your router to the server so you can use SSH (remote control), apache (httpd), ftpd ect. The benifit of this is that your network isn't reliant on the "smarter", and thus more vulnerable, box. Those little linksys/d-link routers get the job done, and replacing yours doesn't make a lot of sense.

Either way you need to run linux. You will get frustrated, and you will hate it, until you get past the learning curve. One thing you HAVE to remember when you're working on older hardware and linux: If it doesn't work, you're doing something wrong. Almost all of the old mainstream hardware has support in some form, and there is a HOWTO written on how to do it. If you want to simply get the box up and running, install FedoraCore, or Clarkconnect, or any of another number of distributions that installs/configures all the software you need. If you'd like to get more technical, i'd strongly reccomend Gentoo or Arch. Gentoo can be a bit overwhelming to set up, but once its going it works well. I've just started using Arch on my laptop and its just like gentoo but everything is pre-compiled (which after working with gentoo is awesome).

I don't know if anyone mentioned it before, but the services you will probably want to run are:
Apache for HTTP
sshd for remote ssh connection
Samba for your internal file sharing between the fileserver and windows machines
proftpd for your external connections via ftp

One thing i'd also reccomend is NOT installing a form of a GUI. You will learn soo much more having to struggle with the CLI (command line interface), and in the end will be a much much more educated user. RedHat (fedora core), mandrake, and similar distirbutions thrive because they take the complexity out of linux by automaticly using a GUI. Just about every benifit i enjoy by running linux on an older machine comes from not being forced to use a GUI, and only the software i need.

Give it a shot and ask smart questions when you get stuck.
 
You dont know the meaning of frustration, untill you install GNOME with RH7.2 on a 200mhz K6, overclocked by 19mhz FSB and 25mhz core, and with the Vcore cranked up for that extra snap, with a fried videocard (too much FSB?), and two old hard drives in RAID 0, with 96mb of ram that you got at goodwill.

GNOME on antique hardware is slow, and uses up the ram in a hurry, which is a 4x multiplier of frustration. I couldnt belive Nautalis file brower used up 30mb of my precious ram. Hours later, i figured out how to configure apache manually to use my /RAID folder as the wwwroot.

If you are honestly looking for a no-BS, quick easy and cheap linux for FTP/HTML or internet routing, FREESCO is the way to go. Its not a good choice for any real applications, like running a big website. Its far from performace, but its on a floppy disk.

www.freesco.org , 1.44mb floppy is all thats needed, and has wizards for the options.
 
wow. thought i had several questions before i checked in here, now i have a myriad of questions.... :(

i guess ill get started:
i was reading and thinking over the weekend....got me wondering if i should install a gui? i believe that i could probably learn more without it, but would it still be possible to do things from the command line if i had a gui installed for that "safe feeling"? i ask cause i kinda wanna get the feel for linux as a desktop as well. i really liked playing with knoppix, but i can only do so much with that. is it possible to have the desktop running with a gui, but still manage the server from the command line for practice, and the gui for backup?

i was also wondering if i should use it as a firewall as well. i do have the dlink router, but it wont really generate bandwidth usage stats etc. id like to be able to do that, but its not absolutely necessary. i do have an extra nic i can install in it if i want to run something like clarkconnect...which i have read a little about, but still dont understand if it is a linux ap or a linux distro. anyone fill me in here?

i was planning on doing my install tonight...now, im not so sure.. i mean YIKES!

if clarkconnect will do ftp, http, routing and stats, maybe that is the way i should go.

i am totally unfamiliar with webdav. if i shouldnt use ftp, i can use webdav and connect and upload/download using a ftp client that allows ssh connection, correct?

the webpage i am gonna host wont be anything fancy. just some simple stuff to get information out to a few specific people, and maybe host my resume, demo tape, and demo dvd, and i just wanted a place to ftp stuff to so that i can access it from home or work, or have a couple friends ftp me some stuff. nothing fancy there either.

my plan went like this (slowly and one step at a time):
get linux (in some form) up and running
get the linux box on my network
get the ftp up and running
get the webserver up and running
secure everything
mess with it and see what i can learn (command line and gui)

is this a good way to go about it? should i worry about security first? im not all that conerned about hackers getting on my box. i dont really have anything they'd want, but i dont want it to be easier to enter than a 10 dollar truckstop whore.

you guys are throwing out a lot of good information, and i thank you. im gonna have to start processing it faster or im gonna be overwhelmed. :p

i have already burned the debian and freebsd iso's to disks. i have so many linux install disks lying around it isnt even funny. im feeling ancy to try SOMETHING out, but far from feeling confident.
 
Clarkconnect has a firewall in it. It also has a web interface to it that you use to control it. Once you are set up you don't need a monitor on the box.
 
Clark is a distro sort of. It's based on a redhat core, but it doesn't have a GUI on it, you aren't going to slap GNOME on it and use it as a desktop. It's a dedicated use distro.

One other good selling point is that they will do a DNS entry for you when you register your free account with the Clark folks and turn your server on. So, when you connect it up you get a DNS entry that looks like USERNAME.clarkconnect.org (insert your own username there) So, when you want to get to your box and the webserver or FTP on it you dont need to use a numerical IP address. If your IP changes because of DHCP from your ISP then the box notifies the clark DNS server and it updates itself.
 
ok so basically i dl the iso, slap it on my compy and up comes a dedicated server that i can us ftp and web services on. it is the "distro" and ap all in one. hmmm sounds good. i dont guess that ill have to have a gui to play with...i can do that elsewhere at another time.

it is all CLI stuff and a multifunction tool huh? from what i have been able to look at, "intrusion detection" sounds cool! :D

i take it that i can lock it down fittingly after i learn how, and i dont have to worry about hackers and script kiddies so much. plus they give you a dns addy that points directly to my box...sounds neat.

i think im gonna give this a try first and see how it works for me. im sure ill be posting later asking for MUCH help.

TONIGHT I LEARN!
 
One tip for you, get two different brands of NICs to use in the machine, it makes it much easier to tell one NIC from the other. Most brands will have the drivers in the install and will autosense them automagically. The install is really easy, honestly it only takes about 1/2 hr or less from start to finish. There's not a whole lot of locking down to do, it comes pretty well locked down to begin with. The vulnerabilities come into play if you want to do things like use the email server on it for webmail (Squirrelmail) or if you set up annonymous FTP on the FTP server. You can do all the management tasks you need from the Clarkconnect administration web tool, set up firewall port forwarding, logging, updating (like Windows update using the linux apt/get tool) SAMBA makes it easy to use the machine as shared network space from your LAN, I even used mine as a print server for my printer until I got a printer that had a print server built in.

Good luck.
 
ive got another nic i can shove in there. when i do the install, should i have the network cables plugged in or should i do that later? does it matter? i think i will have the linux box behind my router for now, im sure i can change it later, but i dont wanna take my whole network down in one fell swoop should something happen.
 
wankrtron said:
ive got another nic i can shove in there. when i do the install, should i have the network cables plugged in or should i do that later? does it matter? i think i will have the linux box behind my router for now, im sure i can change it later, but i dont wanna take my whole network down in one fell swoop should something happen.
Click to expand...


I dont bother having the cables plugged in for the install. It will ask you as part of the install if you have cable, PPPoE or what have you for the WAN connection. I'd recommend making it your router/gateway since it does NAT and the firewall. It can be your DHCP and DNS server for your LAN as well.

It can also be installed just as a server instead of a gateway. Then you'd have to port forward all your relevant ports to the clark box from your existing router.

Your call chief.
 
in a situation like that, which is easier for the most extreme noobie? i like the thought of using it as a firewall, but im concerned about using the nat. if i do this, is it easy to get open ports for such services as msn and stuff? as fun as it may sound, i dont totally wanna cut off my roomates network services just yet.

on the otherhand, it may be easier to port forward from the router? ?? or not. i have a feeling doing this may cause problems in connecting to the server from outside my network, like if im at work and wanna ftp something to my house, or edit / upload a html page. and would being behind the router cause problems with the *.clarkconnect.org url?

also, which iso do i need, the home or the firewall/vpn?
 
I'd just make it your firewall/gateway/NAT thingymajiggy. It's really what it's meant for and is ludicrously easy to set up.

The firewall is simple to configure and has many built in port forwarding rules in addition to the ability for you to set and name your own rules. This is the configuration page...If this confuses you then stop now and go buy a Mac or something. ;) ;) ;)

clark.gif
 
heh, that looks a lot like my router's filtering options....

Ravenrex said:
...If this confuses you then stop now and go buy a Mac or something. ;) ;) ;)
Click to expand...
i LOVE mac's. i just WISH i could afford one. i think its wicked cool i getta carry a powerbook home from work. ...which reminds me, i did setup osX server for use here in the office for dhcp, nat and firewall. that was insanely easy, after i figured out (by hand, i might add) how to create my own firewall filters. the only thing is, it was all gui based. from what you are telling me, clarkconnect has a sort of "web gui" like my router. this makes me feel better. WHEW! maybe i CAN do this AFTERALL!! /thelittleenginethatcould

ok, well, ill set up clarkconnect without any cables plugged in and see how that goes. if i get it up, ill plug some stuff in i guess.

so should i download the home iso, or the firewall/vpn iso?
 
To test things out I'd set up the clark box with the same LAN IP address as your current router (i.e. 192.168.1.1 or whatever yours is) then once it's built and installed just swap them out and see how it goes. Just dont plug both in at the same time with the same IP, duh. If the configuration is not right you can always put the router back in place, no harm no foul.

Just FYI, to get to the configuration utility on the clark box the IP is https://192.168.1.1:81 or whatever IP you choose to pick, HTTPS, not HTTP. This one is the biggest causes of frustration to people who aren't paying attention and then wonder why they can't connect to it.
 
i assume that when i get this set up, to test it out, clarkconnect will tell me which nic goes to the router and which i should put toward my other box right?
 
wankrtron said:
i assume that when i get this set up, to test it out, clarkconnect will tell me which nic goes to the router and which i should put toward my other box right?
Click to expand...
Best way is to try one configuration and if it works you're right. 50/50 chance of success. If it doesnt work reverse it.
 
well, lets look on the bright side....im halfway there. i did an install, got clarkconnect up and running, and managed to connect to it from my tibook. i didnt manage to get the tibook to pass through the linux box to the internet though. i have the ip set as the same as my router, and the only error i can find says either the network is down or the dns ip is incorrect. i called cox and they said they use dynamic dns ips and that they wouldnt tell me anyway. i know this has to work cause im sure a lot of people run it off cox.

as for the install, i pretty much just did the standard straight froward default install. the only part i changed i think, was the service modules i wanted to install. i took out what i didnt think id use and left what i thought i would. i left a few entries about ip addresses and stuff blank, but i figure those are what i have been tinkering with all night. ive looked through the whole web interface, which i like, but cant seem to find out why it isnt working. i know the cables are in right cause the mac can see the linux box, and i was getting some failing error when the cables were in the other way. now, the only weird thing i can see when it boots is it says it cannot determine the ip. i have no idea why, i have reset the cable modem, i had my router taken out of the loop. for the testing, my networked looked like this:

cable modem> clarkconnect> tibook

eth0 is set up as external to host to the modem and eth1 is set up as lan to host to my network.

i hope you can help me out here, cause im stuck. im actually suprised i managed to get the tibook to see the clark. maybe tomorrow night i will get it all up and running with a little help from the [H] crew.

oh yeah, and so far, it hasnt been near as scary as i thought. i really like the web interface. it is a lot like my dlink routers.
 
Is your tibook getting its address via DHCP from the clark box?

When you set it up did you choose the cablemodem connection type for your connection?

Does your cablemodem require any type of username/password to be entered in it for the connection type?

Try powering off the modem for a bit, like 10 mins, then reconnecting it and letting the two devices see each other. Sometimes it takes a bit to get the cablemodem to recognize a new routing device when the PAC address changes when you switch routing devices.
 
yeah, the powerbook was getting a dhcp lease from clark, the different times i rebooted it recieved a different ip iirc.

when i set up, i think i left the connection type blank b/c i didnt know which it was. should i reinstall to change this or can you change it elsewhere?

in the web interface, i entered my user name and password in case it needed that, it didnt seem to do a lot of good. maybe i did it wrong.

i did power off the modem for about a minute or so and then turned it back on and re booted the linux box. ill try again though, maybe i needed to leave it longer.

i do remeber looking around and seeing two places that listed what each ethernet card did. one of them had eth0 disabled. i may have this configured wrong. but again i dont know exactly how it needs to be. im gonna take a look at their documentation today, and hopefully something will jump out at me. it sucks to be so close and stuck.

the default "listening ip" is 127.0.0.1. does this need to be different? like does this need to be the ip given by the cable modem? 127.0.0.1 is also the default DNS ip. that sound about right?

one other thing i noticed, the first few times i booted the box, it seemed to run for about 7 minutes and then freeze. i couldnt use the keyboard, i couldnt use the web interface. it seems that after i got the cables and stuff straightened out, it would stay booted longer say 30 or 45 minutes, but it seemed to freeze up rather frequently. is that something im causing by tinkering with the web interface?
 
Ravenrex said:
ClarkConnect has built in firewall, NAT, apache server, FTP server, SAMBA server and many more options. All you need is an old PC with 2 NICs in it.

Easy to set up and maintain, you can get it up an running in less than a 1/2hr, it's linux based and stable, oh yeah, and it's free. I've run mine for years, sometimes for over 250 days without a reboot. Actually I've never had to reboot it because of problems, only when I move the physical box and have to power it down or migrate it to a new box. I've run it on a pentium 200, currently running it on an old P3 500.
Click to expand...

Yes, I also agree that you should go with Clark Connect. It is easy to use and you can learn a good deal about Linux and server tools as well. I've been using it for 2 years now. First on a PII 500 and now on a Thunderbird 1.3GHz.

I use mine for Samba file serving, backup, print serving, NAT, firewall, and to run a SlimServer music server.


Do you have a switch in the mix or just like you said Internet -> CC box -> Ti Book?

Do you have a keyboard and mouse on the CC box still? Are you sure you are on the internet with it? Can you do an apt-get update and apt-get upgrade from the terminal?
 
i took my router out of the system for the test. it looks like this:

Cable Modem> ClarcConnect Box> PowerBook

my pc and the router were out of the system completely. i just couldnt get the CC box to resolve the IP from the ISP.

i do have a kb and mouse connected to the CC box, but it is turned off right now. i havnet ever used a mouse with it either, is this normal? i put my router back so i could have service this morning and my roomates could use the internet through the day. i will work on the CC box again tonight.

im new to linux, so if you could gimme a little more detail that would help. i believe if i hit "C" before clark "boots" i can get to the command line..right? then just type "apt-get update" ? if it requires a connecton to the internet, it probably wont work...when the booting happens it says it was unable to resolve IP. i feel like kicking my modem really hard, but that wouldnt be good.

i KNOW it cant be too hard. lots of people do it. ive just gotta get that "something" right. im all open for options. thanks for the help so far.
 
I think you might have something borked in the install.

Try reinstalling and yes, you do want to make a choice for the connection type. Go with the cablemodem connection option.

Eth0 and Eth1 both have to come up, one is your LAN one is your WAN. From the sounds of it Eth0 is the WAN which was not right and Eth1 was the LAN which seemed fine,

When you are aked to put in an administrator password this is the 'root' account password. So, when you log onto the web interface use 'root' and 'PASSWORD' (insert what your password was there) and log into it.

Try the reinstall again, it doesnt take long, and see how it goes. I know there's a way to fix things from within, but as easy as the install is it's simpler to just reinstall and pick the right options.

The 127.0.0.1 for the listen IP is correct, that's just a feedback loop to itself. You can ignore that, don't try and change it.

If you left everything default then the DHCP should hand out 192.168.1.1 for the gateway and the primary DNS as this is the LAN IP of the clark box. The wan IP will be whatever Eth0 gets from your cablemodem for your Intarweb address.

If you want to get to a command line interface hit alt-F2 or Alt-F3 and log on with root and your root password.
 
i think you may be right....
i cant remember if i left the service provider type blank or not. i either choose cable or left it blank. heh, i cant even remember last night.

yep, eth0=wan eth1=lan. i logged into https:// like you said my ip was 192.168.0.1, cause thats what it was in the router. i had to log in to the web admin tool with "root" and my password cause i didnt make any other accounts...not sure how to yet.

ill run the installer again tonight, and leave the cables plugged in like they are, maybe that will help. as long as im running the installer again do i need to manually partition the drive or just take the "automagic" option? :p

ill keep you posted. thanks.
 
wankrtron said:
ill run the installer again tonight, and leave the cables plugged in like they are, maybe that will help. as long as im running the installer again do i need to manually partition the drive or just take the "automagic" option? :p

ill keep you posted. thanks.
Click to expand...

Leave it on the automagic setting, it's best unless you have something really specific that you need to configure on it. In any event if you had a need to make it different from the default setting for partitioning you'd know how to modify the install to meet that need.

Good luck, I look forward to hearing that you had a success. When you do the install try unplugging the cablemodem for the duration of the install process just to zero it out and force it to recognize the new MAC address for your clarkbox vs. the router. You'd be suprised sometimes how long it takes certain systems to let the new routing device start functioning. Leaving the cablemodem off for over 10 mins usually overcomes this barrier.
 
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