Low glow 28-32" IPS monitor?

Discussion in 'Displays' started by silverwolf0, Sep 28, 2017.

  1. silverwolf0

    silverwolf0 Gawd

    Messages:
    613
    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2004
    [rant]
    I just got an asus mx34vq which is a VA curved ultrawide and was thoroughly disappointed. Viewing angles were terrible. The contrast shift made everything look hazy and desaturated. I had to move back at least 3.5 feet just for everything to look somewhat normal, and even further if I wanted the deep blacks. I don't know how people are suppose to sit in front of it at a desk and have the curve wrap around their vision. At a moderately close enough distance for "immersion" it just looks plain awful. The deep blacks are dirty white uneven glows. Even the image right in the center head-on has poor contrast. You HAVE to sit like 4 feet away. The monitor looks beautiful when the screen is off and you can admire the sleek design and frameless look.
    [/rant]

    So now I am officially done with all manner of VA. I am tempted to get one of the 28" samsung TN monitors as IPS also suffers from terrible viewing angles, at least for people who abhor IPS glow. I am still hoping that there is a low glow and tolerable relatively large IPS monitor that won't drive me batshit. 32UD99? Something else??
     
  2. Necere

    Necere 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    2,712
    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2003
    I wish they'd implement A-TW polarizers on gaming/general use displays. As is they can only be found on handful of very expensive Eizo displays intended for color critical work.

    The local dimming LCDs coming next year might alleviate some of the IPS glow, but that comes with its own issues (haloing).

    Best compromise right now IMO is to get an OLED for gaming/media viewing, and stick with whatever LCD for general PC use. That only works if you don't mind having to sit a long way back from the OLED though, due to the lack of desktop-size displays.
     
    John721 likes this.
  3. MistaSparkul

    MistaSparkul Gawd

    Messages:
    940
    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2012
    If you could not tolerate VA viewing angles then I'm not sure what you makes you think you'd be able to tolerate a TN panel o_O
     
    d50man likes this.
  4. Absalom

    Absalom Gawd

    Messages:
    645
    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2007
    The Asus PG348Q isn't too bad, assuming you don't get one with really bad bleed at the corners. Since it uses an IPS panel, the viewing angles end up being a selling point. The curve is so subtle I can't notice it. However, If I sit too close, the display image is out of my vision cone. I had to teach myself to sit back about ~3.5 feet so I could take everything in without moving my head or eyes too much. That's just the nature of the beast. If you prefer to sit close maybe you should consider a non-ultrawide?

    But then there's the question of IPS backlight bleed. The one I currently have has very minimal bleed at the corners, but it's uniform and only ever noticable in a dimly lit room. Honestly, I got over it within the first 48 hours, and I'm pretty picky when it comes to quality. And for what Asus charges for this thing I'd expect nothing less than near perfection.

    My only complaint with the PG348Q is I wish Asus made a glossy version.
     
  5. Phlorge

    Phlorge Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    504
    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2014
    low glow / IPS


    pick one.
     
    d50man and Meeho like this.
  6. Phlorge

    Phlorge Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    504
    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2014
    Seriously though the bleed/glow issue is totally overblown. If you are looking at an all black screen than sure it will be super noticeable. Maybe some dark movies, so if you watch a ton of movies it will show. But I have played a shit ton of games and I have owned IPS monitors for a long time. I have had a U2412HM / U2713HM / XB270HU / Just got a PGP348Q and they all had the same issue in the corners. Never did it make gameplay bad or was it even noticeable. It also improves over time, I am not even sure its still there on my XB270HU I should turn it on to check.

    People that know about the issue and check for it right when they get their monitor are part of the problem. I was guilty of it too, taking a shitty in the dark picture that shows the glow being way over saturated.

    Also I dont really play in the dark, I don't know many people that do its terrible for your eyes. Sometimes with this UW I do though but it still isn't a problem.
     
    GoldenTiger likes this.
  7. HiCZoK

    HiCZoK Gawd

    Messages:
    820
    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2006
    It's not overblown. I had Dell U2312hm and it was barely usable when not displaying rich colorful photos.
    In gaming, movies or and not super bright fullscreen content it was terrible and washed out. Even my old TN was better.

    IPS angles are worst of all 3 imo because of silvering. VA have best angles
     
    Meeho likes this.
  8. Absalom

    Absalom Gawd

    Messages:
    645
    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2007
    I've owned nothing but IPS panels for the past 12 years. I've experienced nothing but the best when it comes to viewing angles with them. It may have to do with preference for very low brightness when calibrating them. That might mitigate a lot of the "glow".

    The few VA panels I've messed with have always been inferior in that regard. VA tend to have a noticable gamma shift especially when viewing off center in the vertical direction. VA also tends to have noticable black crush, but it's no where near as bad as TN. Regardless, I'm more sensitive to these artifacts than IPS glow. VA might very well be for those who spend their time looking at a screen in a very bright room. I'm not in that category, however.

    I don't think it's universal which (IPS vs VA) have better viewing angles. There are a plethora of bad IPS implementations out there and there are some really good VA implementations. Ten years ago I'd have told you to get IPS without question. Today it's more like, "well, it depends."
     
    kalston and GoldenTiger like this.
  9. Phlorge

    Phlorge Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    504
    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2014
    This is not subjective.

    Objectively IPS is the better technology for angles no matter what, that is just the reality of the technology. VAs are getting better for sure, but they still can't compete with the viewing angles of IPS. They are purchased for people who are overly sensitive to bleed/glow and people who want high contrast.

    It is absolutely overblown or you are overly sensitive.
     
    John721 likes this.
  10. jbltecnicspro

    jbltecnicspro [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    5,323
    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2006
    Never fear! Panasonic has come out with an IPS tech that should compete with OLED of all things. :)
     
  11. Necere

    Necere 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    2,712
    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2003
    Unfortunately it doesn't seem like it will be remotely affordable anytime soon. There are two monitors announced so far that use the Panasonic panel: the Flanders Scientific XM310K and the Eizo Prominence CG3145. The prices are $45k and ‎¥2,850,000 (~$25k), respectively.
     
  12. HiCZoK

    HiCZoK Gawd

    Messages:
    820
    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2006
    No. I just returnet u2417h. The viewing angles were so terrible.
    it was crushing corners with silvering when looking up front. And from an angle whole screen looks washed out. With VA there is no silvering. Only screen is washing out when looking of angle.
    With TN, at least the screen looks good in right position.
    Ips is total shit. What is overblown is love for it. It only have better colors. but everything else is worse than other panels (aside from ghosting which is worse on va).

    This comes from an experience week ago. iiyama xb2483hsu-b2 and dell u2417h connected next to each other with correctly set rgb levels running in cloned desktop mode. Some part of ips always looked like if there was a window behind me, while va had incorrect overall set gamma and a bit washed colors compared to it. I do not own calibration unit so I can't set it correctly. I liked the Dell colors. They really popped out nicely. But my test with movie and game failed. Even my fiancee said my old monitor (iiyama amva+) have better viewing angles than the new one when she was passing by. She agreed on better colors and worse dark performance. (she doesn't know anything about monitor technology)

    Monitors are terrible nowadays. I hate monitors... So I have good amva screen. had "good" ips screen. Next stop is gsync tn..and I have a feeling it might not be that bad as some make it out to be.
    sorry for being triggered :p I also had U2312hm years ago and it was just as bad. the only TN panel I had was samsung 226bw which also had it's share of problems but it was 10 years ago.
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2017
    MistaSparkul and Meeho like this.
  13. Meeho

    Meeho [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    4,371
    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2010
    It truly isn't. I have a hard time deciding which is worse, TN or IPS. At least the TN is fast. Yes, the glow really is that bad. I would say unusable at 27" and larger.
     
  14. KG-Prime90

    KG-Prime90 Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    251
    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2013
    Been playing games in the dark exclusively for like 20 years and i'm near 50 and still don't need reading glasses. In fact i'm reading 24"1440p unscaled no problem.

    Ips glow is very real and annoying. So much so that i chose TN over IPS, any day, and i hate TN too..

    My desktop is black, i hate bright image wallpapers on my desktop, and i do watch movies and netflix nightly on my monitor as well as play dark games and all that in a darkened room.

    Tried Bias lighting. It does nothing. It doesn't change the subjective image or blacks or hide the slight glow, even on a TN panel.

    I bought an NEC TN and an NEC IPS model back in like 2006? Sitting next to my Fw900 the Ips looked like shit as far as the contrast and blacks. I could not turn it down or make it go away. Playing Witcher 1 at night absolutely sucked on it. Yet the TN looked pretty good.

    I got rid of both of them and immediately bought a second grade A Fw900 for 700 dollars, put one in the closet and settled in the for the long haul to wait out the hopefully short lived life of crappy lcd monitor.

    My brother bought the TN off me over the IPS. The blacks were obviously much better , the color was plenty good enough and overall it had far less input lag which was just terrible on the ips and had better pixel response.
    Plus is was 200 dollars cheaper, but stil not cheap at over 400 dollars. IN 2006.

    This IPS i'm talking about was actually pretty much legendary for it's time, and the only "gaming" Ips there was on the market. It was 16:10 and 20" and cost like 650 dollars. https://www.pcworld.com/article/125924/article.html People still having used them all these years.

    Well that thing sucked ass imo, the TN version was clearly subjectively better.
    https://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,1926798,00.asp

    Since then i knew IPS was also crap, all the BS about them being the best panel type was kind of bullshit. Fact was ALL Lcd were crap. SPVA included, and sadly, Tn that i thought was the worst actually wasn't that bad comparably.

    In certain content under the right conditions Ips are definitely the best for color reproduction. Just not under all, or even close to most of my conditions. TN is "good enough" 99% of the time under basically all my conditions.
    TN horizontal angles are good enough unless you go to the extreme, that no one would need to do or even complain about. Ips looks merely ok at an extreme angle with bright content but anything dark and it's shit.

    Fact is All three panel types glow to different degree. But i watch netflix on a TN from a pretty wide angle at night in a dark room as i'm going to sleep and the only change is it's slightly warmer. Certainly not immersion breaking or total image obscuring like IPS glow. It's a non issue on TN. And i don't need perfect color accuracy when i'm watching netflix. Also the farther you are away from Tn and at the right height the top to bottom gamma is basically gone to unnoticeable.

    I chose a TN as the successor to my Fw900's epic crts for very real and long contemplated reasons. I contemplated and toiled over it for really about 15 years as i feared the day my fw900's would die and i would be forced to make a choice.
    I wanted Glossy IPS with a/tw polariser or no glow panel. I wanted them to be good. But no amount of wishing will make it so. So Tn it is.

    Plus it cost less. If i'm paying money i'm certainly not paying 800 fucking dollars for a high end gaming IPS and looking at a tinted glowy ass screen. No thanks. I'd rather use a 99 dollar cheap ass TN panel, at least i feel less fucked in the ass.
    But whatever, Pick your poison.
    [​IMG]
     
    Meeho likes this.
  15. silverwolf0

    silverwolf0 Gawd

    Messages:
    613
    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2004
    I honestly think some people are just blind. People are sensitive to different things but the glow is there. Any objective camera that's not a potato will capture it. Whether your brain ignores it or not is another matter. Ditto VA contrast shift, which is even worse than IPS glow and triggers at a lower viewing angle. There's a reason why rtings.com rates all the high end VA televisions at a terrible 10-20 degrees. And yet there are people on the internet claiming their so and so VA monitor is perfect. It's like claiming anyone sensitive to PWM is an idiot and overblowing the issue. I have zero sensitivity to flickering and set my OLED phone and tablet to low brightness settings without issue even though if you record them on camera it shows this vomit inducing strobing. I fully acknowledge the issue even though it doesn't affect me.

    And then we have the idiots who don't realize glow intensity and color is different for every IPS monitor. Or that glow free monitors exist.

    I might stick with my ten year old glow free ips panasonic tv with polarizer for another year until oled prices fall.
     
  16. silverwolf0

    silverwolf0 Gawd

    Messages:
    613
    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2004
    For the slower people out there. This is taken with a fixed exposure. The display is a 32"
    AOC U3277PWQU with an AAS panel which is a type of VA. There are no light sources in front of the screen to throw shadows. That is the contrast shift at work. It's worse in person. The camera is barely moving a few inches to stimulate head movement even though it looks like more. Even straight on the sides are milkier than the middle. Also have it on low brightness. High brightness would accentuate it even more. The woman's face at the end constantly changes brightness just from a small tilt.




    That's actually considered "good" for a VA panel. The Samsung SVA panels are way worse. Plus curve is a nightmare. I have video of this as well as the x720e Sony TV that uses IPS that I'll upload when my computer arrives back.
     
    Absalom likes this.
  17. ors

    ors Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    164
    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2016
    True that, however you can have 4k ips monitors for $300 dollars now (https://www.amazon.com/LG-27UD58-B-27-Inch-Monitor-FreeSync/dp/B01IRQAYPE) and for the money I'm really pleased with it. IPS glow is present but manageable (it's light gray). I also tried VA but it's not for me, some dark scenes get butchered in games by them (massive trailing, seems like the whole screen changes brightness, most noticeable on foliage). OLED seems dead as well, Dell tried it, didn't seem to have panned out for them (huge price, burn in).

    At least we get decent resolutions now, we had to wait long enough for that as well, fonts are at last beautiful on desktop monitors as well... Maybe in another 10 years we also get decent panels if AR doesn't take over in the meantime...
     
  18. MistaSparkul

    MistaSparkul Gawd

    Messages:
    940
    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2012
    Lol if you tilt your head like that all the time sure. I almost never move my head when using my monitor.