Looking for home theater sound system

S

shaggy77

Gawd
Joined
Jul 2, 2005
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803
Hi,

My wife and I just bought a new TV. [Vizio 47 inch LED based LCD] We love the image quality. One thing we both agreed on is the sound. It is tinny and just horrible in general. So we are going to be in the market for a new sound system. Before relied on the TV's internal sound which on the Samsung we had was pretty good for our living room. So here is the layout.

room size 14 feet by 12 feet. We long ways from the TV. So we are approximately 10 feet from the TV. Floors are hardwood. Standard painted sheet rock walls and ceilings. 8 feet all. So a pretty standard room.

What kind of home theater system should I be looking for? What kind of wattage? Speaker arrangement? Pricing, I would like to keep it around $200-400ish. We are not trying to get crazy. Wiring arrangement is a big one. Fishing walls is doable. Am I looking at a trip to the local home improvement big box store for speaker wire? :)

I will be looking forward to seeing what the [H] has to say.
 
For your home theater speaker wire, banana jacks, plates covers, accessories, etc. I suggest monoprice. You won't beat the price.
 
200-400$ might be tough. Do you care about having 5.1 right away? If not a nice 3.1 setup should be doable and you can add rear speakers down the road. Do you want a HTIB or do you want to piece together a custom setup(which I recommend)
 
Vengance_01 said:
200-400$ might be tough.
Click to expand...

depends on his needs

Vengance_01 said:
Do you care about having 5.1 right away? If not a nice 3.1 setup should be doable and you can add rear speakers down the road. Do you want a HTIB or do you want to piece together a custom setup(which I recommend)
Click to expand...

3.1? What the hell? to get 3.1 you'd need a front left, a front right, a center, and a sub. that means you'll need a 5.1 capable receiver to do it. how much do you expect he'll be able to save by now getting 2 out of 6 speakers? and you're suggesting he piece one together, after tellign him that his budget is going to be tough (and it is, there's not much argument, there)? Hopefully that was a typo and you meant 2.1, not 3.1



Piecing together anything other than a very basic 2.1 setup is going to be out of his budget almost immediately. A separate sub alone can run$100-200, and a receiver for 2.1 will easily start around $100, itself. OP, I'd suggest you take a look at HTiB solutions like some of Onkyo's smaller setups. They still offer enough sound to fill a room and give very good sound, in addition to supporting 3D capable HDMI devices (1.4a built in repeater) and will come with everything you need to get started. down the road you could replace the speakers if you wanted to for a more robust sound, but these will get you going, and likely last you for a few years as well:

http://www.us.onkyo.com/model.cfm?m=HT-S3300&class=Systems&p=i
 
Personally, I'd look for a good used 2 channel reciever and a good pair of full range floorstanding speakers. If the floorstanders are efficient enough, even a simple T-amp could suffice. A speaker kit (like the TriTrix) from PartsExpress would be a great value and be in your budget.
 
Alright... I finally got my internet back so it will help to reply. :)

Here is what I am thinking. Floor stands are out of the question. The room's layout is not conducive to stands. My options are going to be a small wall mount style. I am thinking a front speaker setup. I would have to find some floor space for the sub woofer. Also need to find space for an already over crowded TV stand. Another consideration the fact my child's room is along the side the living room. So I don't need something very over powering especially for small room. My wife and I are just looking for a sound upgrade from the tinny sound from the TV speakers.

So I need to fish the walls it can be done. There is access from the attic and the basement. As for the items needed, home improvement store works since I got a pile of gift cards from Christmas. besides I just spent some dough on the new TV. ;) My father in law is pretty good with the home theater sound set up he has a pretty slick setup in his living room. I might have to see what he has to say.

Sabregen... I like your thinking. Home theater in a box might be the way to go. I will keep Onyko in mind. So many choices though.
 
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I second the recommendation for a HTIB. If you aren't looking for superb audio quality a HTIB setup from any of the larger electronics manufacturers will be light years ahead of the tv's built in speakers. By going with a HTIB you will also easily find something in your price range.
 
I'd advise you away from wall mounting if it's going to be a wall shared with a bedroom. I had a pair of small bookshelf speakers wall mounted in my daughter's room for quiet ambient music (pic) and the sound transmitted right through the wall into our bedroom due to the solid mounting.
 
Given the budget, I would suggest a lower level 5.1 receiver , and a set of book shelf speakers.
I would look for 2 things in the receiver, 1) Parametic EQ's, and 2) at least 3 HDMI inputs.
Do not be concerned about the "7.1 " or zones or other features that are useless to you.
Do not worry about wattage for them either, at this price level, and size of room it is not an issue. DO NOT be consumed by picking the receiver with the biggest wattage number.

Sound to me like the biggest issue 90% of the time is quality of vocal sound.

Later, if you like, you can add the sub, and all other speaker, (consider moving current one to rear, and getting new main L/R ones).
 
No, do not touch HTIB. Decent 2.1 is FAR better than ANY HTIB system. Look for used speakers if you have to like Paradigm... well, Paradigm anything basically as long as it's 90s or newer. (Sorry, but vintage speakers are almost all junk, and the only exceptions are non-dynamic, e.g. Apogee ribbons, etc.). Your room is almost/borderline too small for surround to begin with, and you can just add it later anyway. Besides, surround speakers can be cheap like Dayton B652s. Go with phantom (no) center.

Your receiver: http://www.amazon.com/Denon-AVR-391...1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1295462592&sr=1-1. Period. Accept no substitute.
 
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wow many different ideas are flowing here. Keep them coming. I understand where each side is coming from. HTIB crowd vs the build it by piece crowd.
 
Kind of tough at that budget, have you considered a soundbar? Vizio has one which does an ok job for general tv viewing. Not something I would normally recommend, but it will work (It's basically a line array which is meant to spread sound evenly regardless of your seating position) but regardless what you may have read or heard regarding soundbars, it does not replace a 5.1 setup.

If you can get an older Harman or Yamaha HTIB setup, that would be ideal at that budget. Then again :) you can get a soundbar and route the signal to a sub (BIC or a Dayton) I think that could possibly fit into your budget
 
Sixthsense said:
Go ahead and create a setup then under $400. Ready get set, go
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$400? I can do that.

Denon AVR391 $190

Dayton B652 $35

Dayton B652 $35

BIC V1020 $160

4.1 for around $400 including receiver. The B652s are not the best and I would sooner take a single set of, say, cheap Polk tower speakers over them for 2.1. But these things will still kill HTIBs and sound bars. But I do recommend spending more than $400 and getting better fronts.
 
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I agree with the posts recommending you to avoid HTIB if at all possible. But I also understand that some people aren't as into this hobby as the rest of us and we sometimes forget it. Thing you need to consider first is "Is 200-400 my ABSOLUTE budget, or is it my RIGHT NOW budget?" If it is your absolute, HTIB or small speaker/receiver set is the best route to go. If it is your right now budget, then look at a little bit better receiver and a pair of nice bookshelf speakers. A nice pair of bookshelves will create the illusion of a center channel so it's like getting a free center in the beginning. Down the road when the budget opens up some more, add a center and a sub. Then later add the rears. And once you decide which route you want to take, I'd highly recommend checking your local craigslist. You can get some smoking good deals on there sometimes.
 
dandragonrage said:
Why are you guys recommending junk like soundbars and HTIB sets? Stop it. Seriously.
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Because for 90% of people a HTIB or soundbar will suit their needs. The guy isn't looking for world class sound and his budget certainly won't get him that. He's looking for sound that is better then his tv's built in speakers. A HTIB would be perfect for his needs. Will it offer the best sound quality that money can buy? Absolutely not. Will it be a huge upgrade over his tvs sound? Absolutely.

Buying half of a setup now with plans to upgrade in the future is also a horrible idea. Shit pops up in life, especially when you have kids. Spend your budget now and get the best you can to meet your needs for the next 5-10 years.
 
dandragonrage said:
$400? I can do that.

Denon AVR391 $190

Dayton B652 $35

Dayton B652 $35

BIC V1020 $160

4.1 for around $400 including receiver. The B652s are not the best and I would sooner take a single set of, say, cheap Polk tower speakers over them for 2.1. But these things will still kill HTIBs and sound bars. But I do recommend spending more than $400 and getting better fronts.
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Looks solid minus the tops, no stands in the quote so i assume hes going to either fly them next to the tv or pony up for stands. Which will be ugly as sin conidering what the budget is.
 
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Eh, it's a cheap budget, not much else I can do. I'm sure they can be found for cheap used. Or they could be made for cheap though they wouldn't be the prettiest.
 
weuntouchable said:
Buying half of a setup now with plans to upgrade in the future is also a horrible idea. Shit pops up in life, especially when you have kids. Spend your budget now and get the best you can to meet your needs for the next 5-10 years.
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With an HTIB? LOL. He'll just have to replace it with stuff that isn't garbage. Do it right the first time. The system I posted is going to kill any HTIB and yet it's still low-end.
 
dandragonrage said:
With an HTIB? LOL. He'll just have to replace it with stuff that isn't garbage. Do it right the first time. The system I posted is going to kill any HTIB.
Click to expand...

I think your missing the bus here. Not everyone needs, wants, can afford, or can tell the difference between a $300 HTIB and a more expensive setup. There is a reason that HTIB setups are around and outsell dedicated receivers and components at least 100 to 1. Most people just want better sound than their tv offers and don't need the "best" sound possible. The OP budget limits him and he's looking to upgrade from the tvs built in speakers.

In your opinion a HTIB may be garbage, but for 90% of the world it suits their needs and it would be stupid and irresponsible to spend more. I may be wrong, but it sounds like the OP fits into the 90% of the world and not the 10% that classify themselves as audiophiles and think that the 90% of the world are inferior to them and their home theater setups that cost more then some people's cars.
 
I just linked parts to a $400 system that will blow away any HTIB. Pony up the extra $100. It's worth it.
 
Best bet is to go to an audio shop where they have systems set up properly that you can listen to. Listen to the Soundbars, listen to HTIB's, and listen to separates. Just remember, with soundbars and HTIB's, once you buy it, you're done and if you change your mind later, you buy all new equipment. If you buy separates, you can always start small and build up as time goes on.

The HTIB vs Soundbar vs Separates debate will go on all day but it's your ears that are doing the listening, and your wallet that is doing the spending. Sound systems are no different than cars in this sense. Is a Corvette better than a Civic? Sure, but if all you care about is not having to walk then both work and there is no need to spend more.
 
That would be good advice but you're not going to find all of the different options set up in the same environment at any store.You won't even find the B652s in retail stores (unless you live in Dayton, OH). Not that B652s are great or anything but they are what I needed to use to fit the $400 budget I was asked about.
 
I don't like home theather in a box, becuase this is a market that is focused one only 2 things.
1)cheap
2) LOOKS okay.

No home theather in a box cares even a little bit about the sound quility.

Home theater a box if CONVIENTANCE, and useful for people that don't know what they need, or what they are doing - this is not the profile of a {H} ard core kinda guy, the simple fact that you are able and willing to post on a internet forum to ask this question - means you are not the right person to sugest it too.


Kev.
 
dandragonrage said:
That would be good advice but you're not going to find all of the different options set up in the same environment at any store.You won't even find the B652s in retail stores (unless you live in Dayton, OH). Not that B652s are great or anything but they are what I needed to use to fit the $400 budget I was asked about.
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Depends where you are. There absolutely are places you can find all 3 setup to listen to. If you live in the midwest, check out American TV and Appliance. I used to work at one and if you could buy it, they had it set up to listen to. You might not find every brand, but the general setups to get an idea of what each sounds like and offers. HTIB's Soundbars and components all set up correctly so you knew exactly what you were getting. I'm sure there are these type of places all over if you're willing to look for them and no I'm not talking about Best Buys.
 
Hey all,

Wow lots of discussion going on. $200-500 is a range. I could go higher if needed. I just don't want to go crazy. One poster did mention my room is borderline to begin with which I very much agree with. The layout of the room makes for a limited choices. I cannot do floor stands for speakers. Wall mount or even something for the ceiling might be in order.

For the guys into sound bars. This is not an option. Two words. No Space.

I agree in doing it right the first time. However, the buy it by the piece is IMHO is not practical at this time. My wife and I were at wally world the other night and we saw a HTIB 5.1 with a Blu Ray set up. I was neutral about it. However, it would probably do the job for the size of the room and limited options I have right now. Maybe in the next house a by the piece set up will be the way to go.

So keep'em coming. If you guys and gals want more info, just say the word. The bird is the word. Ba ba ba bird bird bird Bird is the word. Great now I have Family Guy stuck in my head :)
 
Those small speakers will sound like garbage in any room. They will have no bass from anything but the subwoofer... the Bose Acoustimass/Lifestyle system, for example, has lower parts of voices coming from the subwoofer. Ugh!
 
shaggy77 said:
Hey all,

Wow lots of discussion going on. $200-500 is a range. I could go higher if needed. I just don't want to go crazy. One poster did mention my room is borderline to begin with which I very much agree with. The layout of the room makes for a limited choices. I cannot do floor stands for speakers. Wall mount or even something for the ceiling might be in order.

For the guys into sound bars. This is not an option. Two words. No Space.

I agree in doing it right the first time. However, the buy it by the piece is IMHO is not practical at this time. My wife and I were at wally world the other night and we saw a HTIB 5.1 with a Blu Ray set up. I was neutral about it. However, it would probably do the job for the size of the room and limited options I have right now. Maybe in the next house a by the piece set up will be the way to go.

So keep'em coming. If you guys and gals want more info, just say the word. The bird is the word. Ba ba ba bird bird bird Bird is the word. Great now I have Family Guy stuck in my head :)
Click to expand...

If that's the case I assume you want to mount your speakers similar to this?

dsc00493n.jpg


Granted the Athena's have been discontinued by Mirage . You could possibly find similar LCR's within your budget
 
I need to take some quick pics of the room to help everyone better understand the layout. The mounting I am thinking about is in the corners of the room facing towards the center. Whether on the ceiling. My other point about the all of this is anything really is going to be an upgrade. Supposedly, the sound on this particular TV was the biggest complaint. My wife and I agree with this.

Let me get some pictures taken and get them posted up. This way I can help you guys understand where I coming from. So far I do appreciate any help, information, suggestions coming in. Please do not take my posts the wrong way.
 
Why is that center channel mounted above the TV? That's wrong. and the L/R should be spread out more.
 
weuntouchable said:
I think your missing the bus here. Not everyone needs, wants, can afford, or can tell the difference between a $300 HTIB and a more expensive setup. There is a reason that HTIB setups are around and outsell dedicated receivers and components at least 100 to 1. Most people just want better sound than their tv offers and don't need the "best" sound possible. The OP budget limits him and he's looking to upgrade from the tvs built in speakers.

In your opinion a HTIB may be garbage, but for 90% of the world it suits their needs and it would be stupid and irresponsible to spend more. I may be wrong, but it sounds like the OP fits into the 90% of the world and not the 10% that classify themselves as audiophiles and think that the 90% of the world are inferior to them and their home theater setups that cost more then some people's cars.
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Thank you for the voice of reason. I agree, a lot of people are missing the point here. No one is arguing that a HTIB setup is better than one pieced together. The point is that for 90% of America, a HTIB setup is exactly what they are looking for.

Read the OP's posts. He has a wife and kid, and the setup is going in his living room. This means he probably doesn't have room for large floor standing speakers, and they probably won't be able to be placed in the ideal locations. Do you honestly think his wife and kid can tell the difference between a $400 HTIB setup and a $1000 custom built setup? Hell, I bet most of the time the OP won't even be able to tell because the subtle differences will be drowned out by the kid screaming, and the wife complaining that he hasn't fixed the washing machine yet. :D

Both custom built setups and HTIB setups have their markets. The OP falls squarely into the HTIB market. For $400 he can get a setup that gives him 5.1, and dramatically improved sound quality in comparison to his TV. Spending additional money will only give him improvements in sound quality. Given his circumstances and room environment, you are looking at diminishing returns.


I'm all for "Doing it right the first time" like someone mentioned earlier. This is why in my opinion, custom setups are primarily suited for the media room/man cave situation. "Doing it right" means paying attention to all of the details. Focusing on speaker quality and ignoring the room/listening environment is cutting off your nose to spite your face.
 
xFROSTx said:
This means he probably doesn't have room for large floor standing speakers, and they probably won't be able to be placed in the ideal locations. Do you honestly think his wife and kid can tell the difference between a $400 HTIB setup and a $1000 custom built setup?
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Nobody recommended either floor-standing speakers or a $1000 setup. I recommended a $400 non-HTIB setup.


xFROSTx said:
For $400 he can get a setup that gives him 5.1, and dramatically improved sound quality in comparison to his TV.
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5.1 that will sound much worse than the 4.1 I linked for the SAME PRICE. And it would be cheap to bring my 4.1 to 6.1 with another $35.

xFROSTx said:
Focusing on speaker quality and ignoring the room/listening environment is cutting off your nose to spite your face.
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Nobody ignored his room, and this comment doesn't really even make sense in context.
 
Well my wife and I are going to buy a HTIB. We looked into component set ups. It was at least double of what we were willing to spend at the moment. We visited several local home theater type places. We talked to my father in law. The "pros" and my father in law both agreed on one thing. The room will be pretty difficult to balance. One HT specialist came out and said it would cost more to balance the sound due to the layout or that's what he said. He said reality is a HTIB would be the route to go. Everyone basically said if you are going to design a room with the Home Theater in mind then go component. That way everything can do it right. That will be in the next house if we get that far.

I do appreciate all the input by everyone here. Once we saw what was out there and how to set up, HTIB would be the route to go. Sorry component guys. I thought going component would be the way in this case but not in the cards. Thanks everyone. You can keep the discussion going cause there are other people who are probably interested. Not everyone is an audiophile :)
 
Uhh... what? I linked you a component system at a similar price.

HTIBs are not easier to set up or balance the sound or anything here. You literally have NO advantages with HTIB. HTIB is not better for weird rooms or anything. It's still worse - in ANY room. ANY.

But whatever. Spend your similar amount of money for worse crap that will have to be totally tossed out if you want to upgrade in the future if you want to.
 
We wound up getting a Yamaha 5.1 with sub set up. The receiver that came with it is their entry level model for a component build. This also gives my family the opportunity to upgrade the speakers in the future if we don't like them. The receiver is not a "throw away" model either. My father in law was looking around and suggested it. The speakers sound great. Just got all the wire set up ready to trip anyone who is not paying attention. I am going to permanently install the system this week. I figure it would be a good idea since my wife and kid will be away for a couple of days.
 
Throw up some pictures once you get everything installed. I know a lot of people around here love to see other people's setups. Good choice on the Yamaha, it actually sounds like you got a receiver/speaker package rather than the HTIB you mentioned before.
 
Should have clarified it is a HTiB by Yamaha.YHT-493. It just happens to come with descent components. The receiver is the RX-V367 and the sub is one of their entry class units as well. Right now I am putting together a mono price parts list. Looking at getting speaker brackets, wire, Banana plugs and jacks, optical audio fiber, etc. I will make sure the camera is charged for the picture taking session. However I am enjoying the benefits of having 5.1 in the room. Sounds really good :)
 
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