London Police Chief Wants To Be Able To Stop Your Car Remotely

[Megalith]

Speaking on police tactics and how technology could be used to aid law enforcement, officials from across the pond want the privilege of disabling a vehicle with the push of a button. I can already picture compromised cars coasting straight into civilians, signs, trees, and storefronts.

The commissioner seemed to be suggesting that cars could be equipped with a police-accessible system that would allow the authorities to take control of the vehicle if needed. Clearly showing he doesn’t understand how modern, internet-technology works, Hogan-Howe’s suggestion would seem to slightly tread over the line of civil liberties and individual freedom, not to mention the right to privacy. But even if those aspects are completely ignored, the technological challenges involved in creating such a system and keeping it secure are huge. The question is reminiscent of the debate for a specially created backdoor into secure programs, that many governments would like to see implemented into our technology.

 

[Galvin]

Be great for hacking

 

[travbrad]

Yeah I'm sure such a system will never have any security vulnerabilities or be hacked/procured by people outside the police force. Sort of like the traffic signal preemption/changer devices that police use to turn all the lights green. Those totally aren't available to be used by anyone else. At least exploiting that system doesn't result in people suddenly losing control of their car though.

This really seems like something that could end up doing more harm than good if it falls into the wrong hands. Imagine suddenly shutting off a few people's cars on a fast busy motorway, in the middle of an intersection, etc

 

[Exavior]

being England I could see this happening.

 

[DrLobotomy]

They want us to be like cattle. Moo. Keep us in a pen and watch all our moves. If I don't eat my meat, I cant have any pudding. Sounds Great!!!

Where is the portable EMP gun? I thought that was gonna be used for things like this.

 

[Dekoth-E-]

I will never in my lifetime own a car with such a device installed.

 

[Tak Ne]

Ensure your getaway by remotely zapping police cars.

 

[lironmiron]

What for? That is England. They have cameras on every single corner watching every single inch. They can just let the perps go on their merry way and have the police calmly pick them up at their destination.

 

[TechLarry]

WTF is going on in Britain? I thought Kalifornistan was bad.

 

[thesmokingman]

Dumb ppl... in positions of power.

 

[Ducman69]

Aw man, they turned off my battery.

 

[Nenu]

It'll never happen.
Loonies with no idea about tech want stuff.

 

[Gorankar]

being England I could see this happening.

On the off chance it does happen, it will be hilarious when some hackers remote shut down every car in London.

 

[Ur_Mom]

Those silly brits.

 

[Chaos Machine]

Aren't OnStar enabled cars already wired for this?

 

[viscountalpha]

On the off chance it does happen, it will be hilarious when some hackers remote shut down every car in London.

Or when it comes back to bite them in the ass when a superior hacker disables the police car first.

 

[DrLobotomy]

Chris Christie wants one.

 

[Wrecked Em]

This is why I'm equipping my Tesla with a carburetor.

 

[Makaveli@BETA]

being England I could see this happening.

Bright idea's like this always come from england.

It seems they always try to take the easy route and the rest of you are right someone will hack this shit and they will have to shut it down for public safety.

 

[d8lock]

I thought most people walked or took public transit there.

 

[Stoly]

I can already picture compromised cars coasting straight into civilians, signs, trees, and storefronts.

You have to be really really stupid to crash your car if it looses power. Still, I'd rather have a speed limiter that gradually slows down the car down till it stops.

 

[Deleted member 108676]

England, not America. They have different laws over there.

You have to be really really stupid to crash your car if it looses power. Still, I'd rather have a speed limiter that gradually slows down the car down till it stops.

lol...Lewis Fucking Hamilton over here...

 

[Exavior]

Aren't OnStar enabled cars already wired for this?

yes, this isn't new technology but already exist in many cars on the road today as part of the antitheft built in. But shhh, obviously people here don't know that and are 100% convinced that this is a new thing so don't burst their bubble... All OnStar enabled cars since 2007 have had this feature built in where OnStar can disable the gas peddle of the car. Don't think Ford has this, not sure about any other people with OnStar type services.

Bright idea's like this always come from england.

It seems they always try to take the easy route and the rest of you are right someone will hack this shit and they will have to shut it down for public safety.

Lots of cars on the road have this now through the assistance programs in their cars. Don't see if being that widely abused so I honestly don't think that part is going to happen as much as everyone is thinking as it isn't happening today. My last 3 cars have all had this feature. Only difference is that OnStar would have needed to be the one to do this not the police. Will that extra piece make it less secure or more known to be to hijack, doubt it. So I don't think there is the level of risk everything thinks in regards to that.

As for my comment, I could see this happening as England is more of a policed state than say America. They already have cameras all over the place and they are fine with that as they view the loss of privacy vs the increased safety to be a fair trade. They are find with having more regulations over what could be sold to people vs safety. You might not be given a steak knife in a restaurant but that also means that nobody is going to randomly be stabbed with a sharp knife. So you are safer, just more inconvenienced trying to eat. So for that reason, I could see all cars systems tying into a police system that gives police the same level of control over the car system as say OnStar or Sync or anything else where they could interact with any car wouldn't be that much of a stretch for them as they are completely fine with doing anything that in the even if for making a safer country. And if allowing cops to disable the gas is going to make it safer I don't see the people there being against such a system.

 

[naib]

This would never be implemented (no matter what ppl think about the UK)
It would stomp on ppl rights and likewise it puts a car out of control

What you will find is this police chief will be wanting to run for some public office and there is probably a high vehicular related crime count... by coming out with such a statement, a statement he knows would never be implemented while he was in office is moot... the people that can vote for him would know he has voice an opinion implying he wants to tacking it

its all politics ...

 

[Dekoth-E-]

yes, this isn't new technology but already exist in many cars on the road today as part of the antitheft built in. But shhh, obviously people here don't know that and are 100% convinced that this is a new thing so don't burst their bubble... All OnStar enabled cars since 2007 have had this feature built in where OnStar can disable the gas peddle of the car. Don't think Ford has this, not sure about any other people with OnStar type services.



Lots of cars on the road have this now through the assistance programs in their cars. Don't see if being that widely abused so I honestly don't think that part is going to happen as much as everyone is thinking as it isn't happening today. My last 3 cars have all had this feature. Only difference is that OnStar would have needed to be the one to do this not the police. Will that extra piece make it less secure or more known to be to hijack, doubt it. So I don't think there is the level of risk everything thinks in regards to that.

As for my comment, I could see this happening as England is more of a policed state than say America. They already have cameras all over the place and they are fine with that as they view the loss of privacy vs the increased safety to be a fair trade. They are find with having more regulations over what could be sold to people vs safety. You might not be given a steak knife in a restaurant but that also means that nobody is going to randomly be stabbed with a sharp knife. So you are safer, just more inconvenienced trying to eat. So for that reason, I could see all cars systems tying into a police system that gives police the same level of control over the car system as say OnStar or Sync or anything else where they could interact with any car wouldn't be that much of a stretch for them as they are completely fine with doing anything that in the even if for making a safer country. And if allowing cops to disable the gas is going to make it safer I don't see the people there being against such a system.

This is also why I will never own a car with these types of "services" installed. I will never ever willingly trade potential freedom in the name of a little convenience. How easily some of you are bought is sad.

 

[buhbuhfet]

how would they do that without the autopilot and gps? where do they get a right to that?
thanks car companies for cooperating

 

[DocSavage]

You have to be really really stupid to crash your car if it looses power. Still, I'd rather have a speed limiter that gradually slows down the car down till it stops.

While you are correct for the most part, some vehicles are very difficult to steer without power steering and/or brake without power brakes.

Back when I had a pickup with a 454, the engine once died on me and it was a bitch and a half to get that thing off the main street and around a corner to a side street while it was coasting.

Also, haven't you seen any movie where the car dies? A dead engine means you instantly hit something and flip your car.

 

[Biznatch]

While you are correct for the most part, some vehicles are very difficult to steer without power steering and/or brake without power brakes.

Back when I had a pickup with a 454, the engine once died on me and it was a bitch and a half to get that thing off the main street and around a corner to a side street while it was coasting.

Also, haven't you seen any movie where the car dies? A dead engine means you instantly hit something and flip your car.

You forgot the fiery explosion.... There is always a fiery explosion after the minor fender bender.

 

[xorbe]

That would be target #1 for basically every hacker group on the planet ... no thanks

 

[Trepidati0n]

That would be target #1 for basically every hacker group on the planet ... no thanks

Which is why I hope they do it. One of two things will happen a) governments around the world will get their asses kicked causes massive backlash into their intrusion on our lives b) technology security will finally stop a joke and people will put real money into it. Either way...there is a win in there.

 

[Chaos Machine]

This is also why I will never own a car with these types of "services" installed. I will never ever willingly trade potential freedom in the name of a little convenience. How easily some of you are bought is sad.

Potential freedom to do what? Rob a bank? To me this is no different than having a governor pre-installed on your vehicle, besides, if you really wanted to you could make sure that OnStar antenna doesn't work. Turning off the gas pedal is not going to cause a crash. Obviously there is potential to if you are applying the brakes.

If my car gets stolen maybe I don't want to see it flying down the highway like a 4000lb missle being used to flee cops.

 

[Exavior]

That would be target #1 for basically every hacker group on the planet ... no thanks

Is it right now?

Potential freedom to do what? Rob a bank? To me this is no different than having a governor pre-installed on your vehicle, besides, if you really wanted to you could make sure that OnStar antenna doesn't work. Turning off the gas pedal is not going to cause a crash. Obviously there is potential to if you are applying the brakes.

If my car gets stolen maybe I don't want to see it flying down the highway like a 4000lb missle being used to flee cops.

I think what he is saying is that he doesn't want his car tracked period. So if stolen they can take it, he doesn't care they can take it and he will accept that fact that there is no way to track it or shut it down. Some people have the same feeling about phones and GPS. They don't want their phone knowing where they are as that is another way to be tracked. It all comes down to preference. Some view it as giving away a little of your freedom at a time for a price, others view it as a fair trade for convenience. There is an argument to have had for either side. If we want star trek to become real one day that is the cost though, we can't be teleported from anywhere to anywhere without them knowing where we are.

 

[Dekoth-E-]

Potential freedom to do what? Rob a bank? To me this is no different than having a governor pre-installed on your vehicle, besides, if you really wanted to you could make sure that OnStar antenna doesn't work. Turning off the gas pedal is not going to cause a crash. Obviously there is potential to if you are applying the brakes.

If my car gets stolen maybe I don't want to see it flying down the highway like a 4000lb missle being used to flee cops.

See Below, he summed it up. If my car is stolen, I don't care what they do with it. I have insurance for that. I don't have to be a criminal to not want to give the government unnecessary power. Your argument is a slippery slope and dangerous thinking.

Is it right now?



I think what he is saying is that he doesn't want his car tracked period. So if stolen they can take it, he doesn't care they can take it and he will accept that fact that there is no way to track it or shut it down. Some people have the same feeling about phones and GPS. They don't want their phone knowing where they are as that is another way to be tracked. It all comes down to preference. Some view it as giving away a little of your freedom at a time for a price, others view it as a fair trade for convenience. There is an argument to have had for either side. If we want star trek to become real one day that is the cost though, we can't be teleported from anywhere to anywhere without them knowing where we are.

 

[lcpiper]

Dumb ppl... in positions of power.

Wait a second, what's the problem here?

This cop isn't dumb, and frankly, at it's most basic level, what he is asking for isn't stupid and it isn't unreasonable.

The cops across much of the US won't even get into a high speed chase anymore because it's too damned dangerous for everyone else on the road. It's a simple wish the man has, and I can easily understand why.

The writer says;

The commissioner seemed to be suggesting that cars could be equipped with a police-accessible system that would allow the authorities to take control of the vehicle if needed. Clearly showing he doesn’t understand how modern, internet-technology works, Hogan-Howe’s suggestion would seem to slightly tread over the line of civil liberties and individual freedom, not to mention the right to privacy.

And I think this ass hat writer is a moron.

Why would internet technology have to come into play at all?

Anyone in a car running from the cops is actually in the middle of a criminal act, their civil liberties are not being violated, nore are their individual freedoms and it certainly does not have anything at all to do with their privacy.

How you make this real is the tricky part. There is a right way and a wrong way, and the wrong ways shouldn't make it passed the concept stage.

Wrong Ways;
Allows the cops to "take over and drive the car"
Relies on any device or system that is on the car. A criminal would just disable it.

Right ways;
The car is not totally disabled, not without a warning no different then many other failures cars naturally experience.
Does not rely on any device or system that is part of the car.

My favorite approach is a very fast drone, target the drone with a laser designation, whatever car you are pointing the laser at is the one the drone attaches itself too.
The flying part of the drone breaks off as soon as the drone lands on the car.
The remaining drone part is a small vehicle that is attached magnetically and it just drives/crawls it's way into the engine compartment, finds the generator/alternator and blows it out. The car will display it's warning indicator that the battery is discharging and when the battery is dead, the car is dead. In the meantime the bot acts as a tracking device so the cops can back off and watch where they are and when the car stops the cops can make their arrest.

Or ....
There is always the heat seeking potato missile up the tail pipe trick

 

[lcpiper]

I thought most people walked or took public transit there.

And how does that have anything at all to do with the cops wanting to be able to slow down a fleeing vehicle?

 

[lcpiper]

This would never be implemented (no matter what ppl think about the UK)
It would stomp on ppl rights and likewise it puts a car out of control

What you will find is this police chief will be wanting to run for some public office and there is probably a high vehicular related crime count... by coming out with such a statement, a statement he knows would never be implemented while he was in office is moot... the people that can vote for him would know he has voice an opinion implying he wants to tacking it

its all politics ...

Naib, why would this never be implemented?

It would not impact anyone's rights in England or in the US if done properly.

 

[sfsuphysics]

Is it right now?

Depends upon how layered the security is, if it's a matter of a password any police officer has that they probably write on the inside of their glovebox then sure. But if it's a matter of needing a warrant from a magistrate, then it can only be done from Scotland yard, etc etc,, not as uch

 

[Exavior]

Depends upon how layered the security is, if it's a matter of a password any police officer has that they probably write on the inside of their glovebox then sure. But if it's a matter of needing a warrant from a magistrate, then it can only be done from Scotland yard, etc etc,, not as uch

I think you misunderstood my question. As mentioned above this already exist in cars made by Chevy since 2007. So you have 9 years worth of cars that have this feature right now in them. Is OnStar the #1 target of every hacker in the world to take over cars and stop them? All you have to do is give them access into whatever the current system is. Right now police can contact OnStar and have them disable a car, here are some stories.

Police Can Disable New Cars on Demand





it is like any other car system though, you can show a proof of concept, but there are no wild spread issues of cars being hijacked over these systems right now.

 

[DocSavage]

I think you misunderstood my question. As mentioned above this already exist in cars made by Chevy since 2007. So you have 9 years worth of cars that have this feature right now in them. Is OnStar the #1 target of every hacker in the world to take over cars and stop them? All you have to do is give them access into whatever the current system is. Right now police can contact OnStar and have them disable a car, here are some stories.

Police Can Disable New Cars on Demand





it is like any other car system though, you can show a proof of concept, but there are no wild spread issues of cars being hijacked over these systems right now.

Like hackers would even want to steal a Chevy. Lol.