Linux started from a game

B00nie

B00nie

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Nov 1, 2012
Messages
9,327
Everyone is complaining how gaming on linux sucks but at the same time the origins of linux (unix) actually started from rewriting code in order to make a space game run better:

 
Ugh... Linux is not Unix. It's not some sort of evolution of Unix. It's not a derivative of Unix.

What it has is a lot of the feel of Unix. And most would now agree that Linux is better than Unix in many ways. What created Linux was the fact that Unix wasn't really accessible at the time (even BSD if you know the history).
 
cjcox said:
Ugh... Linux is not Unix. It's not some sort of evolution of Unix. It's not a derivative of Unix.

What it has is a lot of the feel of Unix. And most would now agree that Linux is better than Unix in many ways. What created Linux was the fact that Unix wasn't really accessible at the time (even BSD if you know the history).
Click to expand...
Well that's where you're wrong. Linux is considered to be in the 'unix family'. If you would have watched Brian Lundukes presentation you'd not make that argument. Unics was created in order to run a game better and all these OSes were either reverse engineered or directly ascended from that work.

Unix_history-simple.png
 
Linux was actually created as an alternative to Unix and it's licensing restrictions. Having said that, both operating systems are so remarkably similar Linux may as well be classed as a fork of Unix. I believe the open licensing of Linux is what killed Unix in the end, especially considering little retraining was necessary at the time.

Even macOS isn't really much of a fork of UNIX anymore.
 
Unix is a commercial operating system that conforms to a set of standards known as Postix. Postix is how way back in the 70s a bunch of big computer companies managed to build systems that where "mostly" inter changeable. I'm sure there are plenty of stories of night mare mash ups of hardware and software from the bigs like HP and IBM... but for the most part Postix kept everyone on aprox the same page.

The only real consumer OS that is 100% postix compliant is MacOS. For the most part 100% postix... is AIX, HP-US, Solaris and the like. Even stuff like FreeBSD can't claim 100% postix compliance anymore.

Linux was developed to basically replicate many of the Unix systems while using 100% open and free code. The easy option would have been to simply adopt closed source bits of code that had BSD licence. Linus and the early Linux developers instead choose to white room what they needed and create from scratch what they wanted... and expand what they thought made sense. Making Linux a OS heavily influenced by Unix but unlike Unix is 100% free and open.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux_Standard_Base

The LSB is the standard free and open Linux version of Postix. LSB is based on Postix but expands on it. So its fair to say Linux is "mostly" postix compliant. Which is also very true of the BSD operating systems like FreeBSD which are not in fact Unix.... they are unix like, and mostly postix compliant just like Linux.

It is also fair to say at this point... Linux is the OS influencing Unix. Even IBMs z/OS big iron unix uses the FHS (Filesystem Hierarchy Standard) maintained by the Linux foundation.
 
B00nie said:
Without Unics, linux would not exist. So I disagree.
Click to expand...
Can that be deduced? Possibly. Maybe in the way that Lamborghini wouldn't have made cars if Ferrari didn't first. They're both car manufacturers. They are similar to us in ways that both are sports cars and are operated similarly. But, they are completely different on the inside. Lamborghini cars are not a branch of Ferrari cars in much the same way that Linux is not a branch of Unix. Influenced? Yes. Branch? No.

Also, thank you for your post and the video. Always cool to learn and enjoy more about the history and future of technology. Man love their games! :D
 
Ah, Sun OS. How I really don't miss you... lol

Regardless of what your stance on desktop linux, I feel that if you work in the IT world you should have a solid linux foundation. Not only does it make you a stronger and more versitile worker, but the skills give you an excellent starting place if you get into unix, mac, and virtually all servers and such. Even most windows servers you work with nowadays are virtual running on a linux or unix system.
 
cjcox said:
Is this Brian? Anyway, without Adam and Eve, "Unics" wouldn't exist. So, I guess we're all in agreement then?
Click to expand...
The existence of Adam and Eve is highly debatable so I disagree. However Unics is well documented and a historical fact.
 
FNtastic said:
Can that be deduced? Possibly. Maybe in the way that Lamborghini wouldn't have made cars if Ferrari didn't first. They're both car manufacturers. They are similar to us in ways that both are sports cars and are operated similarly. But, they are completely different on the inside. Lamborghini cars are not a branch of Ferrari cars in much the same way that Linux is not a branch of Unix. Influenced? Yes. Branch? No.

Also, thank you for your post and the video. Always cool to learn and enjoy more about the history and future of technology. Man love their games! :D
Click to expand...
You are both kinda wrong, and also kinda right. Yes, you could easily make the argument that Linux wouldn't exist, at least as it does today, without the inspiration of design from Unix. The argument could also be made that if Unix hadn't existed, Linux could still exist but as something else entirely. This whole idea that Y wouldn't exist if X hadn't happened is a fallacy. That doesn't mean Y didn't get inspiration from X, but just because this is how things played out doesn't mean it's the only way they could have. If Edison and his team hadn't invented the light bulb, I bet someone else would've eventually. However, your supposition that Linux was a desire to create a free and open Unix alternative is not correct. If you listen to any number of interviews with Linus, he states that he created Linux mainly as an alternative to Minix, and it initially wasn't free and open. That decision was made, albeit early on in development, but only after members of the community convinced Linus to do so.
 
Lunar said:
You are both kinda wrong, and also kinda right. Yes, you could easily make the argument that Linux wouldn't exist, at least as it does today, without the inspiration of design from Unix. The argument could also be made that if Unix hadn't existed, Linux could still exist but as something else entirely. This whole idea that Y wouldn't exist if X hadn't happened is a fallacy. That doesn't mean Y didn't get inspiration from X, but just because this is how things played out doesn't mean it's the only way they could have. If Edison and his team hadn't invented the light bulb, I bet someone else would've eventually. However, your supposition that Linux was a desire to create a free and open Unix alternative is not correct. If you listen to any number of interviews with Linus, he states that he created Linux mainly as an alternative to Minix, and it initially wasn't free and open. That decision was made, albeit early on in development, but only after members of the community convinced Linus to do so.
Click to expand...
Maybe you quoted the wrong person? I never said linux wouldn't have existed without Unix. And, I also never said anything about linux being a desire to create a free and open Unix alternative...
The first part of what you said is essentially the statement that I already summarized in the post you quoted...
 
FNtastic said:
Maybe you quoted the wrong person? I never said linux wouldn't have existed without Unix. And, I also never said anything about linux being a desire to create a free and open Unix alternative...
The first part of what you said is essentially the statement that I already summarized in the post you quoted...
Click to expand...
Yup, You're absolutely right. Meant to quote Boonie one post up. Sorry :(
 
Whilst getting ready to move, I found my Linux Registered User card...

(Pssst, it's Portable Operating System Interface (POSIX).)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top