Leo Laporte and Chris Pirillo prefer Macs

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matsuya

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I don't know what [H] thinks of these guys. I've been following them since TechTV, mainly Leo Laporte and both have made the switch, even though they still use Windows.

For me I've had a PC since 1990 and have built high-end PC's since 2000. I've build custom watercooling rigs also. Currently I have a e8400 and 8800gt using Vista x64. I don't overclock anymore and don't play games anymore. The last game I played was Battlefield 2. BC2 looks good, but I haven't felt the need to get it.

So now I'm looking to upgrade. I was looking at a high end i7-930 setup (I tend to follow Danny_Bui's picks) but with some influence from listening to Leo Laporte and some other of these Tech Journalists, or however you see them, I've also been looking at Macs, specifically the iMac or MacPro. I'm not really comparing them cost wise.

I've read through PC forums and Mac forums and it's hard to make a decision. I've never actually used OSX and I don't think going to the Apple store and playing around with it is enough experience for me to make a decision.

Maybe there are people here who have gone through the same predicament.
 
if it makes sense to you, that is fine. for myself, I have 5 PCs in my house, tons of parts, tons of games, tons of software all requiring PCs. Switching would not work for me, although we all use iPods and i'd love to have an iPad.

That being said, I dislike people 'switching' like they are doing a religious conversion. Its just a product. An expensive and closed product, but many would say that those factors give advantages in terms of stability and exploits. That might make the mac a better deal for you.
 
I heard my name so I came over :)

Anyway, I really don't want to drawn into a Mac VS PC thread, again, but here's what I recommend:

Option 1 (Not so legal or ethical way): Build a Hackintosh (google how to do this) off an older or even current PC and play with OSX that way. May not be as stable but should give you an idea of what you're getting into in regards to the OSX OS.

Option 2: Find a store with a pretty good return policy and relatively long return period (2+ weeks IMO). Buy a Macboook, Macbook Pro, or even a Mac Mini. Use it and then return it before the return period is up. From your time with the Mac, decide whether or not you can handle/deal with/use OSX.
 
Danny Bui said:
I heard my name so I came over :)

Anyway, I really don't want to drawn into a Mac VS PC thread, again, but here's what I recommend:

Option 1 (Not so legal or ethical way): Build a Hackintosh (google how to do this) off an older or even current PC and play with OSX that way. May not be as stable but should give you an idea of what you're getting into in regards to the OSX OS.

Option 2: Find a store with a pretty good return policy and relatively long return period (2+ weeks IMO). Buy a Macboook, Macbook Pro, or even a Mac Mini. Use it and then return it before the return period is up. From your time with the Mac, decide whether or not you can handle/deal with/use OSX.
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I thought about option 1 but decided if I'm going to go through the trouble of building and tinkering, I would stay with Windows.

I might be able to borrow a friend's iMac 27" i7. I asked him if I could borrow it for a few weeks. We'll see what his wife says.

Have you used OSX and Macs?

I know it's almost impossible to start a thread like this and get unbiased opinions, but I hope I can get comments from people who have used both.
 
What exactly do you do with your computer?
I started to use OSX a couple of weeks ago and it is pretty nice, but I am so used to using Windows that I operate faster on my windows machines.
 
matsuya said:
Have you used OSX and Macs?
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I have but not extensively. Some of our school's computers are Macs so I've used them quite a bit to do reports/papers and such. OSX seems fine to me from the time I've used it.

With that said, I personally wouldn't buy a Mac as I'm a "best bang for the buck" kind of person. OSX and the supposed higher stability and quality of the Mac is simply not enough to warrant the higher costs. This is a opinion.
 
i've enjoyed both osx and windows.

this last time around, i was planning on buying a mac pro (have been very happy with my macbook pro), but due to some software i must use (professionally) windows was still going to be in the mix. i realized i could probably do better hardware for less money (and not have to deal with dual boot, or virtualization) if i just left osx out of the equation. so, abstractly, i think i prefer osx (although that was in comparison to xp). windows 7 has been a breath of fresh air. it's much better than i expected, runs what i need it to, and so i'm not missing osx one bit.

hope that helps.
 
absolute_zero said:
i've enjoyed both osx and windows.

this last time around, i was planning on buying a mac pro (have been very happy with my macbook pro), but due to some software i must use (professionally) windows was still going to be in the mix. i realized i could probably do better hardware for less money (and not have to deal with dual boot, or virtualization) if i just left osx out of the equation. so, abstractly, i think i prefer osx (although that was in comparison to xp). windows 7 has been a breath of fresh air. it's much better than i expected, runs what i need it to, and so i'm not missing osx one bit.

hope that helps.
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Yes, that helps.
 
Danny Bui said:
I have but not extensively. Some of our school's computers are Macs so I've used them quite a bit to do reports/papers and such. OSX seems fine to me from the time I've used it.

With that said, I personally wouldn't buy a Mac as I'm a "best bang for the buck" kind of person. OSX and the supposed higher stability and quality of the Mac is simply not enough to warrant the higher costs. This is a opinion.
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What have you come across that makes you believe that it isn't as Apple/Mac users make it out to be.
 
Leo Laporte is a bonehead and Chris Pirillo is a publicity hound, neither of them know much of anything of real use. I've met both in person, and honestly if they don't have some cue cards or a teleprompter in front of them (even when they do, oddly enough), they both just kind of "uh huh, uhmmm... right... yeah... uhmmm..."

I used to watch TechTV years past when it first came on, and pretty much every other word or sentence from Leo's mouth was inaccurate and completely wrong. I and many other people would phone in so often to complain or try and get directly on the air to contradict him and get people accurate information that our numbers got on a black list and they wouldn't even answer anymore, or someone would pick up and hang up immediately.

If there's one thing I can't stand in this world, it's people like either of these buffoons getting themselves into positions of authority or becoming recognized as 'tech experts" sad to say.

But it happens, all too often.
 
Bahamut said:
Leo Laporte is a bonehead and Chris Pirillo is a publicity hound, neither of them know much of anything of real use. I've met both in person, and honestly if they don't have some cue cards or a teleprompter in front of them (even when they do, oddly enough), they both just kind of "uh huh, uhmmm... right... yeah... uhmmm..."

I used to watch TechTV years past when it first came on, and pretty much every other word or sentence from Leo's mouth was inaccurate and completely wrong. I and many other people would phone in so often to complain or try and get directly on the air to contradict him and get people accurate information that our numbers got on a black list and they wouldn't even answer anymore, or someone would pick up and hang up immediately.

If there's one thing I can't stand in this world, it's people like either of these buffoons getting themselves into positions of authority or becoming recognized as 'tech experts" sad to say.

But it happens, all too often.
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Can you elaborate on Leo Laporte? Why do you think he switched to Mac. He seems almost a fanboy now.
 
matsuya said:
What have you come across that makes you believe that it isn't as Apple/Mac users make it out to be.
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I've seen a few dead Macs. Pretty much it. The latest Macbooks don't feel as higher quality than any other laptop I've seen.
 
I highly recommend going to the apple store and talking to someone there. Tell them that you are very familiar with computers, but have never used osx, and ask them to show you some of the differences. It might be a lesson in basic stuff, but I've had really good luck with apple store guys knowing their stuff. From there, there really isn't a huge difference between osx and windows 7. I've used both extensively every day for about 8 months now, and I don't notice the difference. The big reason I like my macbook is the hardware and the form factor. Unlike Danny Bui, I think the new macbook case is of an infinitely higher quality than 98% of the rest of the market. The iMac has a super nice screen and the form factor is amazing if you aren't needing to replace parts. Go play with it, and you'll have a better idea.
 
matsuya said:
and both have made the switch, even though they still use Windows.
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Well this isn't really a switch is it? "I switched, but I still use Windows."

To answer OP's question. Be prepared to learn how to do everything on an OS all over again. For several weeks your productivity will be down learning how to get around in the OS.
Personally, I don't think they're worth the money. Linux is every bit as good as MacOS (better imo) and it's got a nice price tag: free.

Other than that, +1 to Danny Bui.
 
xanvincent said:
Well this isn't really a switch is it? "I switched, but I still use Windows."
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Even though they still use Windows and say both are good for their uses, you can tell they think Mac/OSX is superior. I think they don't want to lose their PC audience.
 
matsuya said:
Can you elaborate on Leo Laporte? Why do you think he switched to Mac. He seems almost a fanboy now.
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I listen to the Windows Weekly podcast every now and then, and he does not come across as a fanboy.
 
matsuya said:
Can you elaborate on Leo Laporte? Why do you think he switched to Mac. He seems almost a fanboy now.
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Apple probably tossed one or a few his way, who knows. They're PCs, regardless of how Apple wants to market them, they have always been personal computers, and since the Intel switchover (like they had a choice or something) they truly ARE personal computers nowadays.

The day that Apple came out with Boot Camp that's when I knew for a fact that they already knew the war was over years ago; it was the only way they could survive.

If Boot Camp (primarily) and Parallels/Fusion had not happened along, Macs that only ran OSX and absolutely nothing else would not have the still meager market share they have today. Those options for running Windows are what saved Apple's personal computer division, not pretty looks, not even Intel-based hardware.

It's the fact that Apple knows they're never going to get anywhere without Windows that makes me smile every day of the week and twice on Sundays (and days when Apple stock hits new highs too). :D
 
I have two homebuilt pcs, plus two pc laptops and a macbook pro, and I use all of them on a daily basis. Mac OS is, in general, more user friendly and intuitive, though it's a hassle if you're only accustomed to Windows or Linux. It tends to be more stable, and the build quality of macs is usually exceptional. That said, they're f-------- expensive for what you're getting hardware wise, and the OS, though nice, isn't functionally superior to Win 7, at least IMHO.

Macs have their place but for your dollar it's hard to beat the homegrown pc:)
 
Bahamut said:
If Boot Camp (primarily) and Parallels/Fusion had not happened along, Macs that only ran OSX and absolutely nothing else would not have the still meager market share they have today. Those options for running Windows are what saved Apple's personal computer division, not pretty looks, not even Intel-based hardware.

It's the fact that Apple knows they're never going to get anywhere without Windows that makes me smile every day of the week and twice on Sundays (and days when Apple stock hits new highs too). :D
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That was the only way they would be able to compete, I agree. But that doesn't necessarily mean Mac/OSX isn't a better product. I'm just saying.

It seems that people who do end up using OSX end up using it more than Windows. I could be wrong.
 
matsuya said:
I've read through PC forums and Mac forums and it's hard to make a decision. I've never actually used OSX and I don't think going to the Apple store and playing around with it is enough experience for me to make a decision.
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It really isn't. Those quick sessions tend to end up giving you the wrong impression about OS X. Initially, you're confused about how to do things with it, and as you play around, you end up finding that it's really very similar to Windows (which it is, on the surface). And then you start thinking: well, then what's the point? Why not just keep using Windows?

The distinction becomes more apparent as you start diving deeper. Apple and Microsoft follow similar paths, though Apple does things just a little bit differently. I could rattle off a dozen examples, but if you spend time with OS X, those differences start to become apparent to you and you'll come to find out whether OS X suits you better than Windows or vice versa. So, yeah, what you need is time.

At the end of the day, though, Apple makes it easy to do both Windows and OS X, so you won't be stuck with a doorstop of a machine if you don't end up liking OS X. The hardware is rarely favorably priced compared to PCs, but there won't be anything stopping you from using an iMac or Mac Pro solely as a Windows machine. That's something important to keep in mind: this won't be one of those investments with no way out.

As for Leo, he's always seemed pretty straight-up. He isn't 'wrong' for preferring OS X just as someone who prefers Windows isn't 'wrong', so his opinion shouldn't hold too much sway over your decision. Your experience alone needs to drive your decision.

EDIT: Oh, and the Mac Pro just isn't a good value as far as consumer desktops go (as it's more of a workstation-class machine). Compared to the Mac Pro, the iMac is a significantly better value right now, particularly when you factor in the quality of the iMac displays. If you aren't doing any heavy lifting, the iMac is the machine you should be focusing on.
 
Mac video editing isn't really an excuse anymore. Theres much more software on the pc than the mac to make up for the difference. The mac is a dieing era. At first it was good for those games everyone use to play back in school but thats mostly it. Its only good for basic functions and word processing these days. My friends were all sold out on the name and the coolness of the imac. They all switched back to the pc once they couldn't run anything they wanted to run. Apple will sooner or later just sell the OS software on the side. Eventually just turn into a software company like Microsoft.
 
Conker said:
Mac video editing isn't really an excuse anymore. Theres much more software on the pc than the mac to make up for the difference. The mac is a dieing era. At first it was good for those games everyone use to play back in school but thats mostly it. Its only good for basic functions and word processing these days. My friends were all sold out on the name and the coolness of the imac. They all switched back to the pc once they couldn't run anything they wanted to run. Apple will sooner or later just sell the OS software on the side. Eventually just turn into a software company like Microsoft.
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I think this is what starts the Mac vs PC wars. I need educated responses.
 
matsuya said:
I think this is what starts the Mac vs PC wars. I need educated responses.
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lol i worked on macs before. I tried fixing one also and its impossible without sending it back. Those all in one monitor versions. Once it blows thats it. All your cash down the drain.
 
Conker said:
Mac video editing isn't really an excuse anymore. Theres much more software on the pc than the mac to make up for the difference. The mac is a dieing era. At first it was good for those games everyone use to play back in school but thats mostly it. Its only good for basic functions and word processing these days. My friends were all sold out on the name and the coolness of the imac. They all switched back to the pc once they couldn't run anything they wanted to run. Apple will sooner or later just sell the OS software on the side. Eventually just turn into a software company like Microsoft.
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obvious troll is obvious
 
Like anything else if a Mac suits your needs then get one, geez. I mean they do run Windows is you really nead it. For me, Macs just don't do what I need. Just get what you need or want and if that's a Mac so beit.
 
I've been a PC guy for a long time. I remember my first 100mhz Pentium HP system, and all the computers I built after that... When I went to college though, it was a primarily Mac school. We edited our films on top of the line Mac Pro's, while the graphic design students used huge gorgeous iMacs. I had always thought Mac's were pretty interesting machines but I never paid them much attention. Eventually though, I conceded, and when graduation came along, I got a Macbook Pro as a graduation gift. I have not gone back since.

I now work in a TV & Film production company that is about 90 percent Mac's. We do extremely high end graphic design with After Effects, and edit many of our videos in Final Cut Pro. We do have a few PC Avid suites, but I can not tell you how often we are fixing the bizarre and obtuse issues Windows pops up with. I'd say maybe 70-80 percent of the time, maybe more, Windows PCs are our biggest time wasters. We are constantly fixing them. We are now looking into investing a bit more to turn those Avid PCs into Avid Mac Pros, though we are now waiting for the next set of updates.

Yes, Apple products at an extreme premium, but coming from an techy stand-point (I am the IT Assistant at my job), you get what you pay for. The hardware is always top notch, the OS is not only extremely user friendly, but very robust, and full of tons and tons of nooks and crannies for those who love to tweak. Anyone who says there is software on the PC that isn't on the Mac is either lying or ignorant. I find there is so much more powerful, and better written third party on the Mac than on the PC. Not only do the app's look great, but they do so so much!

A lot of that money also goes towards support as well. Honestly, bar none, the best A+ #1 customer and tech service I've ever experienced. In person, on the phone, online, it's just phenomenal. Check out one of my previous posts in this forum for my list of experiences with Apple tech support. Not to mention a community full of dedicated and helpful users.

It's really true what they say, despite how people view us Apple fans... Once you go Mac, you never go back. Man that sounds so cultish, but damned if it isn't true.
 
I currently have a windows 7 desktop and white Macbook. The battery on the Macbook is dead (they're serious when they rate it at 300 cycles) and I'm thinking about just replacing it with a windows 7 machine. There are a few physical thing that annoy me about the Macbook but my experience with with OSX has been positive. So has my windows 7 experience, so much so that I don't consider OSX to really be any better. Different, yes, better, no. Just buy one so you can say you did it. There is nothing so offensive about OSX that you couldn't live with it for a few years.

Ironically, I'm still strongly considering a new Macbook because the hardware is fantastic, I am indifferent about the OS.

Final point: I don't like the Mac office version compared to windows.
 
I bought one of the original MacBooks - the black one - when they first came out back in late 2006. Got it home, unboxed it, thought it was "the cat's meow" with that matte black finish, it was awesome.

But then I started using it. And it got warm. And it got warmer. And even warmer, and warmer, and still even warmer as time went by. So warm that trying to use it as a "laptop" became quickly impractical, so it went on the desktop for use.

And then it started having issues with reading practically mint condition audio CDs that didn't have a visible defect or scratch on them at all. And then it started having issues reading practically mint condition retail DVDs that didn't have a visible defect of scratch on them at all.

And then... and then... and then... ("Dude, Where's My Car?" fans... you know this line...)

Anyway, after ~2 weeks of this, it was time to call it quits. I did a restore back to out-of-the-box condition - I had to use an external USB optical drive to restore it since the internal drive wouldn't read the OSX DVD - and packed it back up, not a fingerprint on it anywhere, no scratches, no damage at all, and took it back to the Apple Store in my town where I bought it with cash in the hand.

I got there, told one clerk what I was there to do, went back to the register, watched him unbox it, exchanged information, watched him take it in the back room for 15+ minutes, watched him come out and say "we can't find anything wrong with it, but if you'd like to return it that's fine..." He does some stuff on the iMac they run the store's POS system off, hands me a piece of paper to sign while he's reboxing the laptop, and I stare at this so-called receipt that shows them hitting me for a 15% restocking/return fee.

That was like $205 of the total purchase price at that time...

Talk about going from 0 to 200 MPH of lividity in no time flat. Angered doesn't cover it, rage isn't a strong enough word, pure unadulterated hate gets close, however.

This little whiny college puke is blowing me off as I'm restating my case that the laptop is defective, that I will not pay a restocking fee for defective merchandise being returned, that I paid cash in the hand for the defective product, that I expect a full cash in the hand refund, immediately, and I won't settle for anything less.

Of course, at that time, they didn't seem to know that I'd done research on those first gen MacBooks and discovered the fuck-up at the factory where someone fucked up the specifications in the assembly manual where it stated that the thermal compound on the CPU core should be approximately .01 grams of the stuff and instead printed out 1.1 grams of that compound which was causing the massive overheating issues - one of the reasons I was returning it.

They also didn't seem to know that the Matshita slot loading optical drive that Apple had chosen to put in those first gen MacBooks was considered an absolute piece of shit by almost everyone, including review websites like CDFreaks.com and many others, that Apple's own support forums were loaded with major consistent complaints about the drives failing, not reading CD/DVD media, burning bad disc after bad disc, etc.

None of that mattered to them because the simplistic bench test (basically turning the laptop on and waiting for the self-test diagnostics to say "Ok, we're booted into OSX, everything looks fine here, we're good to go") said it was fine and that was about it from their perspective.

I created a ruckus, on purpose, knowing that as I got louder, people in the store would take note and wonder "Hey, I thought Apple products just work, why is that guy so dismayed about his MacBook?" and that it would call the attention of the Manager. Oh, it did, and when he came out to "assist" me, it just got worse. He didn't want to do the return at all at that point, but instead was physically trying to push the MacBook box back at me with the original receipt now taped to the side.

I wouldn't have it. It was a defective product, it was being returned as such, and I wasn't leaving till I got my cash in the hand back - and to hell with paying any "fee" for returning it. Back and forth this went for 15 minutes or more, but eventually he capitulated and I "won" even though I seriously felt like I was being slammed of having dared say a Mac was broken or defective.

There was no decent support that day, certainly not even worthy of an F- rating, it was simply untenable overall. I got my refund, every cent of it, and I've yet to buy another Apple product since. They don't deserve my praise or my respect, on any level.

Some people never have problems, and that's perfectly fine, truly. But I did, and it soured the apple more than enoug (pun intended) for me to know I'll never take another bite...

YMMV, of course, but that's just how things go in life.
 
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Use what you want to use, if it works for you, fine.

These threads never end well.
 
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