The Last of Us: Part II

[pendragon1]

Nice job adding the word "evil" which I didn't use. I know this is where we have to keep in mind "opinions are like assholes" but this is one of those times where calling a game like this garbage is so fucking out of left field it's patently insane. But go ahead and jump on that bandwagon because the outrage soothes you

inserted based on your obvious rage that you think someone doesnt like something when that has never been said. didnt say it was garbage, read it again. so soothing to listen to the automatic jumps to "its the alt-right bigots" etc that is being thrown around.
edit: now that you have edit your post, point 4 is what im talking about. and where is this "the jews" crap coming from?!

I'm only 6.5 hours into it and would rate it the same as the first game, so take that as you will. It would be a 9.5 at least for me at least so far. Gameplay is considerably improved so far with the additional abilities and equipment alone. If you want to shit on the story, fine, but the game play, sound design, and production values are stellar by any metric.

i havent shit on anything, IF you actually read what i wrote...

 

[T4rd]

i havent shit on anything, IF you actually read what i wrote...

Sorry, I didn't mean you specifically, just like the people review bombing it on metacritic that obviously haven't even played the game and just want something to bitch about.

 

[pendragon1]

Sorry, I didn't mean you specifically, just like the people review bombing it on metacritic that obviously haven't even played the game and just want something to bitch about.

ok. possibly but i still dont believe it is that perfect 10/10 that all the "reviewers" gave it when their future access to review copies is on the line...

 

[scojer]

So far, the only thing I don't like is the story jumping between the two groups so much at the beginning. I wouldn't mind it if the scene changes were done better, they're just a bit jarring.

The music score though is fantastic and definitely sets the emotional tone of the game really well.

 

[T4rd]

ok. possibly but i still dont believe it is that perfect 10/10 that all the "reviewers" gave it when their future access to review copies is on the line...

That's fine, not I don't know why we have to keep having the same conversation about it; the same thing happened with the first game, so all you have to do is go off of that too gauge how good you think this game will be. Pretty much all the same reviewers gave it perfect scores to, so nothing has changed this time other than the perceived SJW narrative the review bombers are pushing.

But you seriously can't believe that any that 7 or 8/10 score (which this game clearly deserves by any rational gamer interested in this genre) would jeopardize a reviewers future review copies from a publisher.

So far, the only thing I don't like is the story jumping between the two groups so much at the beginning. I wouldn't mind it if the scene changes were done better, they're just a bit jarring.

The music score though is fantastic and definitely sets the emotional tone of the game really well.

There's only 2 jumps at the beginning, then you stay as Ellie for the next several hours at least.

 

[pendragon1]

But you seriously can't believe that any that 7 or 8/10 score (which this game clearly deserves by any rational gamer interested in this genre) would jeopardize a reviewers future review copies from a publisher.

yeah, i do. especially when no "critial" reviewers, or "alt-right" as you guys say, got any... but you dont want to have this convo so ill stop there.

 

[vegeta535]

Jesus Christ people. Why does everything have to become political nowadays. People just don't like fun anymore. Does the game deserve a perfect 10? Probably not. It still a hell of a good game.

 

[T4rd]

yeah, i do. especially when no "critial" reviewers, or "alt-right" as you guys say, got any... but you dont want to have this convo so ill stop there.

I've already said I have a critical reviewer that I typically go to, he just didn't get a review code, so we won't see how review for a few days at least. But he actually just put out an interesting video on the topic today:

 

[M76]

Yeah I got the game delivered 11:30 today, but couldn't sneak off from work until 14:30. Played from then until 21:30, only stopped to make dinner. That should tell you something already.

Graphics is pretty, characters look great, environment is a bit worse than in Ghost Recon Breakpoint but still good.

So far not much story happened that weren't already revealed by the leaks. Unfortuanately knowing what was going to happen made it quite anti-climactic.

The biggest improvement is in gameplay. I enjoy this game a thousand times more than the first. I tried re-playing the remastered edition just a few weeks ago and hated it still.
It is much more balanced with heavier emphasis on stealth and exploration.

Unfortunately the maps are pretty much linear, with the occasional small optional detour from the beaten path. First the map looked like as if it was going to be semi open in Seattle, but it quickly switched back to being completely linear.

There is no clear SJW agenda in the game thus far, and I can sniff out bad SJW writing from a mile. Just read what I thought about Chimera Squad for context on my blog. And you'll see I don't take kindly to political agendas.
Of course unless you consider the mere abundance of female characters an agenda. But thankfully it's not exclusive to positive characters. Half of the enemies are also female, which is a welcome change, I always found it stupid that all enemies were male in games.

For the first few hours the game kept switching between multiple playable characters, which I really liked, it kept things varied and interesting seeing things from multiple perspectives. But after that initial bit I've been "stuck" with Ellie for a while now, and I'm really eager for another jump now.

So far I have zero regrets buying the game.

 

[polonyc2]

I've already said I have a critical reviewer that I typically go to, he just didn't get a review code, so we won't see how review for a few days at least. But he actually just put out an interesting video on the topic today:

ACG is considered a critical reviewer?...he seems to like most games from what I've seen

 

[T4rd]

ACG is considered a critical reviewer?...he seems to like most games from what I've seen

Yes, he's not sponsored by anyone, he doesn't subscribe to giving scores to games, his reviews are 2-3 times longer than most, and he covers many aspects of games that many popular reviewers completely miss in their reviews. Unless you only define a critical reviewer as someone who never gives near-perfect scores, while also only using numerical scores, to review games, I'd say he's more critical than most.

 

[Colonel Sanders]

For the first few hours the game kept switching between multiple playable characters, which I really liked, it kept things varied and interesting seeing things from multiple perspectives. But after that initial bit I've been "stuck" with Ellie for a while now, and I'm really eager for another jump now.

I'm on that stretch with Ellie now, and yeah it goes on a lot longer than any of the "levels" in the first game. I don't mind playing as one character, but I'm about ready for a 10 minute long cutscene to break it up a little, lol

 

[vegeta535]

I been playing it for like 8 hours and love it so far. Only stopped cause my battery was dying lol. Fuck the whiny baby haters.

 

[Aireoth]

I love the assumptions on all sides.

don't agree, phob/altright/blahblah/reeree, do agree shill/agenda pusher/blahblah/reeree.

I find the average of games opinion is more accurate than reviewers. Hated Walking Stranding, Death walking simulator (Death Stranding for those impaired).

I'll wait on this, because I don't beleive anyone at this point (10/10 reviews or the 3.3 aggregate) and time will reveal all.

Ghostbusters 2018 was a firm 4/10, not the 7.4/10 reviewers gave it.

 

[M76]

Fuck the whiny baby haters.

What? Baby haters? That's new.

 

[vegeta535]

A swearing vegeta?! Now I've seen everything!

View attachment 255062

G'night lads, may the ultra peace be in your sleep. Don't stay and play for too long

Lol. My mom use actually buy that crap.

 

[M76]

About 10 hours into the game (didn't check exactly). Those jurnos who say this is a 10/10 are a disgrace, pathetic shills, nothing more. And those who say this is the worst game ever without actually seeing it or even hearing about the game before the drummed up "controversy" are equally bad.
Objectively the game cannot be a 10, regardless of the story. It's just too simplistic and old fashioned gameplay wise. A 10/10 should be somehing revolutionary, not a linear, sometimes annoying third person shooter that showed nothing new in the 10 hours I've played it. The final verdict is just up to the storytelling. So far it can go either way. If they really fuck up the ending it can be a 6/10, if they finish it the best possible way it can be a 9/10. But this is still a game that rides on the story, the gameplay is just a distraction between cutscenes.

 

[T4rd]

About 10 hours into the game (didn't check exactly). Those jurnos who say this is a 10/10 are a disgrace, pathetic shills, nothing more. And those who say this is the worst game ever without actually seeing it or even hearing about the game before the drummed up "controversy" are equally bad.
Objectively the game cannot be a 10, regardless of the story. It's just too simplistic and old fashioned gameplay wise. A 10/10 should be somehing revolutionary, not a linear, sometimes annoying third person shooter that showed nothing new in the 10 hours I've played it. The final verdict is just up to the storytelling. So far it can go either way. If they really fuck up the ending it can be a 6/10, if they finish it the best possible way it can be a 9/10. But this is still a game that rides on the story, the gameplay is just a distraction between cutscenes.

I'm just curious what you would give the first game then. Because this is the same game with improved game play and a new story and that's about it, which is still a 9.5/10 for me so far and I'm 12 hours into it. It seems most people can't rate the game as a whole and are only judging it by the story, which is pretty divisive to say the least.

The hyperbole about people giving perfect scores being shills only discredits you. I've seen the same reviewers give indie games perfect scores, of which I didn't care much for, but that doesn't make then shills or disgraceful whatsoever. You're free to feel however you want about the game, but the slander about others who enjoyed it much more than you (or others) is getting old.

 

[Colonel Sanders]

About 10 hours into the game (didn't check exactly). Those jurnos who say this is a 10/10 are a disgrace, pathetic shills, nothing more. And those who say this is the worst game ever without actually seeing it or even hearing about the game before the drummed up "controversy" are equally bad.
Objectively the game cannot be a 10, regardless of the story. It's just too simplistic and old fashioned gameplay wise. A 10/10 should be somehing revolutionary, not a linear, sometimes annoying third person shooter that showed nothing new in the 10 hours I've played it. The final verdict is just up to the storytelling. So far it can go either way. If they really fuck up the ending it can be a 6/10, if they finish it the best possible way it can be a 9/10. But this is still a game that rides on the story, the gameplay is just a distraction between cutscenes.

To me the storytelling IS the revolutionary part about this game, just as it was with the last game. We just don't get beautiful AAA games that do the kind of intimate character building (with a focus on "realistic" human emotion.) I've never played games before that are willing to spend long sections of the game in just letting two or three characters talk to each other and work through emotional confrontations. Don't get me wrong, I've played many, many games with brilliant, heartfelt stories, but the way a story is told matters a lot to me and these two games do it in a way that, to me, shows the real potential of games to connect dramatically like the best films do.

Now before you respond, please keep in mind this is what makes the TLoU games special in *MY* eyes. You don't see it that way, and that's perfectly fine. Just trying to shed a little light on what it is about these games that makes a lot of gamers feel so strongly about them.

 

[Colonel Sanders]

Mr.Kojima and metal gear would like to have a word with you, sir

Nah, his games have notoriously long cutscenes but that's NOT what I'm talking about. His games, like most Japanese games, have a weird hyper-exaggerated realism. It's more like watching an anime or a poorly written hollywood blockbuster. I'm talking about game storytelling more in line with what you'd see in a drama film. Totally different things.

 

[blackmomba]

should be a GOTY candidate...it'll be interesting who comes out on top at the end of the year- this or Cyberpunk 2077

This didn't age very well

 

[T4rd]

This didn't age very well

Still seems accurate to me.

 

[Colonel Sanders]

This didn't age very well

Why, because a bunch of trolls worked together to review bomb on metacritic despite obviously never having played the game to completion since the campaign takes at least 20 hours and they started reviewing it like 5 hours after launch?

Yesterday I saw a youtube video titled something like "Pewdiepie's reaction to TLoU2 speaks for ALL gamers!" ..... dunno what to even say about that. The alt right community has aimed their death star beam at this game

 

[blackmomba]

Trolls, always trolls ehq

Even if it's great, it won't even get close to GOTY given the hoopla

 

[Colonel Sanders]

Trolls, always trolls ehq

Even if it's great, it won't even get close to GOTY given the hoopla

Your head would have to be neck deep in your asshole to not realize a 3.4 user score on metacritic is from a bunch of trolls. And "GOTY" from critics at the end of the year to this crowd means nothing anyway because "gaming journos are just a bunch of paid shills"

 

[T4rd]

Even if it's great, it won't even get close to GOTY given the hoopla

Except it will. If anything, the controversy works in its favor for GOTY.

 

[Aireoth]

You guys are hilarious.

 

[blackmomba]

If you say so lol

 

[M76]

I'm just curious what you would give the first game then. Because this is the same game with improved game play and a new story and that's about it, which is still a 9.5/10 for me so far and I'm 12 hours into it. It seems most people can't rate the game as a whole and are only judging it by the story, which is pretty divisive to say the least.

The hyperbole about people giving perfect scores being shills only discredits you. I've seen the same reviewers give indie games perfect scores, of which I didn't care much for, but that doesn't make then shills or disgraceful whatsoever. You're free to feel however you want about the game, but the slander about others who enjoyed it much more than you (or others) is getting old.

LOL, you don't have to be so ridiculously defensive about it. I acually complimented the game and you take it as a diss, because I didn't go for maximum elation and didn't praise it to the moon? I said I reserve judgement depending on where they take the story. Since the game is about the story And I think the 10/10 reviews are false, becuause you can't objectively give a 10 out of 10 to a game with average gameplay.

And good news, so far the story didn't disappoint, I'm just afraid of the ending that's it.

If you really want to know I gave the first game 9/10. And that's still on the table for this one as well. Just not the 10/10, that is reserved for games that are excellent in every aspect, not just the storytelling.

 

[M76]

Now before you respond, please keep in mind this is what makes the TLoU games special in *MY* eyes. You don't see it that way, and that's perfectly fine. Just trying to shed a little light on what it is about these games that makes a lot of gamers feel so strongly about them.

I'm sorry you can't be more nuanced than that, I agree, the story makes the game special, and if not for the story the first game would've been an average shooter at best. If you judge the game objectively and not emotionally you realize that the 10/10 scores are really not warranted for this gameplay. Becaue it is literally the same gameplay we had in 2013 and it wasn't revolutionary even then. I almost felt nostalgic because of the QTEs, until I remembered how I hate those. When you give a game a score as a reviewer you are not supposed to judge only the story.

 

[M76]

Now for something more light hearted: That expression. LOL



Actually here are a bunch of screenshots I made. Sorry, the colors are a bit off as I was playing in HDR mode.

 

[Colonel Sanders]

I'm sorry you can't be more nuanced than that

Uhh, lol? I'm sorry you aren't able to appreciate what strong storytelling is and what value it brings to a game.

I think most people would agree a game doesn't have to revolutionize something to be exceptionally good and a 9/10 or 10/10. Look at the rave reviews Doom 2016 got. There was absolutely nothing revolutionary about that game, it's just your classic run n gun FPS with some extra visual flair. You can take an existing formula and fine tune it to the point of being great without doing anything particularly new. Hell you can throw almost any of the most critically acclaimed AAA games in this list.

 

[T4rd]

LOL, you don't have to be so ridiculously defensive about it. I acually complimented the game and you take it as a diss, because I didn't go for maximum elation and didn't praise it to the moon?

You misinterpreted me; I didn't really care what you thought about it, I just don't believe in insulting anyone else who believes it deserves a perfect score in a review.

You clearly think that 10/10 means absolutely perfect in some objective way. But games and other art forms are highly subjective material and can't be critiqued objectively in every way, thus those who rate it "perfect" are doing it within the bounds of their personal criteria and feel that any of the games potential shortcomings are more than negated by every other aspect of the game, which usually comes down to story, attention to detail, and other production values for games like this.

 

[Colonel Sanders]

You clearly think that 10/10 means absolutely perfect in some objective way. But games and other art forms are highly subjective material and can't be critiqued objectively in every way, thus those who rate it "perfect" are doing it within the bounds of their personal criteria and feel that any of the games potential shortcomings are more than negated by every other aspect of the game, which usually comes down to story, attention to detail, and other production values for games like this.

I also strongly believe that good games (like movies and other forms of art) are "more than the sum of their parts." If I took at TLoU (part 1) and dissected very specifically between gameplay, sound design, music, character perfomances, and story, even I couldn't give it a 10/10 because there are clearly some limitations in some areas. The game was very linear, the shooting mechanics were simple and even a little clumsy, the melee combat was not nuanced, etc. However, the gameplay as part of a whole game that included an amazingly well-written and well-performed story brings it all together where I say, "OK, there were some flaws here and there, but when I take what it did SO right and add it all together and look at the impact it had on me, that was a 10 out of 10."

Like T4rd, if you treat a 10/10 like a literal 100% "there are no perceivable objective flaws and all subjective components are... objectively perfect" no game would ever, EVER hit that mark. So when you KNOW that know game can ever achieve that "objective perfection" then the review scale shifts a little so 10 out of 10s are that rare once in a great while experience that makes a big impact in ways that the 9 out of 10s don't.

 

[pendragon1]

Now for something more light hearted: That expression. LOL

thats a "something caught in the zipper" face.



re "like a drama movie" is that what you really want in a game? more watching than playing?

 

[T4rd]

thats a "something caught in the zipper" face.



re "like a drama movie" is that what you really want in a game? more watching than playing?

As much dialog as there is, there's still significantly more game play than there is watching cutscenes. In fact most of the dialog probably happens while you're playing, some of which is while there's plenty of action going on as well, just like the Uncharted games really. This is not quite a Metal Gear game at least.

 

[Colonel Sanders]

thats a "something caught in the zipper" face.

oh like her penis got caught and it's really painful? yeah I could believe that, haha

re "like a drama movie" is that what you really want in a game? more watching than playing?

See, that's where I think you don't get the whole TLoU thing. Cutscenes are a part of the storytelling yes, but of course I don't mean I'd like to play a game that was mostly cutscenes. There are moments in these games that you're "playing" but they're not really gameplay in the usual sense. To avoid spoilers for TLoU 2 I'll bring up the TLoU DLC "Left Behind": there's a long section of that DLC where you're going through a mall with another character, doing... kid stuff. Going through a halloween store and trying different masks on, watergun fights, shit like that. It's the kind of stuff that any other game would just have you drop the controller and watch in a cutscene, but in TLoU you're controlling the character, making tiny choices about what mask to try on or where to go first. Like I said it's not gameplay in the usual sense, but the fact that you're in control of a really well-written character building moment is awesome and unique.

If you don't get what the appeal of that might be, then... yeah you'd probably not like TLoU 1 or 2, ever, because when you strip that stuff away, the combat + scavenging gameplay isn't particularly amazing (although there are aspects of it that are mindblowing like the animations and stuff, but that's not gameplay either.)

 

[Colonel Sanders]

holy fuck, playing TLoU 2 right now and I just got hit by one of the most well executed jump scares ever. If you're early-ish in the game, it's not the one you're thinking of

edit: also, awesome little detail: Ellie complained about a place smelling like ass, then I noticed I could hear her breathing through her mouth while in that area.

 

[M76]

You misinterpreted me; I didn't really care what you thought about it, I just don't believe in insulting anyone else who believes it deserves a perfect score in a review.

You clearly think that 10/10 means absolutely perfect in some objective way. But games and other art forms are highly subjective material and can't be critiqued objectively in every way, thus those who rate it "perfect" are doing it within the bounds of their personal criteria and feel that any of the games potential shortcomings are more than negated by every other aspect of the game, which usually comes down to story, attention to detail, and other production values for games like this.

You are perfectly allowed to have an emotional reaction, but whoever calls themselves professional journalists should absolutely be objective when reviewing a game, that's their freaking job. I find it hard to believe that they all so enjoyed the game, when otherwise they constantly whine about difficulty and violence, and now comes a relatively difficult and violent game, and they are giving it 10/10s. I think that is shilling and not even their honest, let alone objective judgement of the game.

 

[M76]

Uhh, lol? I'm sorry you aren't able to appreciate what strong storytelling is and what value it brings to a game.

That's not what I said, are you not even listening? I appreciate it, but I doesn't make me disregard everything else when scoring the game. You can have the best storytelling but ultimately have an objectively bad game. Like say Alpha Protocol. I loved the hell out of that game, but not in good conscience give it a higher score than 7, because it has serious shortcomings.

I think most people would agree a game doesn't have to revolutionize something to be exceptionally good and a 9/10 or 10/10. Look at the rave reviews Doom 2016 got. There was absolutely nothing revolutionary about that game, it's just your classic run n gun FPS with some extra visual flair. You can take an existing formula and fine tune it to the point of being great without doing anything particularly new. Hell you can throw almost any of the most critically acclaimed AAA games in this list.

An appeal to numbers? If appeal to numbers was a valid point, then that would mean TLOU2 is the worst game ever with a 3.6 score currently by the numbers, LOL
But good news: I'm not most people, and I'm happy for that. Take it or leave it. I found Doom 2016 exceptionally well crafted but bland and boring, didn't even finish it. Played it like two hours before calling it quits. Not because it was hard, I played it on ultra-violence, just felt zero motivation to continue. Exactly because a lack of compelling narrative. I think both gameplay and narrative needs to be top notch for an action game to be perfect. The only games where 10/10 is a possible otherwise are very specialized cases like say a pinball game, or a puzzle game. But even a sports game can be elevated by a good narrative / campaign mode. That's why I loved Virtua Tennis 4 for example.

I'm fine with using old recipes just don't expect me to give a perfect score for being unoriginal. I hate this mentality. When people think a 6/10 game can't still be enjoyable. And want to lynch you for not giving a 10/10 for their current favorite game. This is what caused the access media to vastly overvalue games, well this, and wanting to remain the access media. I'm not the access media, and I don't care about pleasing fanboys, so you can expect brutally honest opinions from me, and trying to be as objective as humanly possible. If that bothers you, too bad, so sad.

If my review will piss off both the haters and the fanboys I'm fine with that. I won't change my opinion to suit anyone.