LAN Center PC Build Thoughts

D

damstr

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jun 26, 2005
Messages
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First off if you are commenting on whether or not I should start a LAN center please don't post. I DON'T CARE. I'm only looking for input on build specs not business advice...

Anyway so I will be starting with around 42 gaming PC's. My biggest question is what video card to use. I would like the systems to last around 2-4 years before upgrading the GPU.

I originally thought the GTX 960 was good but then started thinking for $100 more I could get all 970's. The 980 would be roughly $300 more.

Here are the proposed specs:

Core i5 4460
Corsair H55
MSI Z97 G45 mobo
Kingston Beast 16GB
Asus GTX 960, 970, 980
Corsair 450D
EVGA SuperNOVA 650W 80+ Gold

GTX 980 seems too much money for not that much performance increase. For example a 980 is not twice as fast as a 960 @ 1080P but costs more than twice as much. Like I said before I think the 970 is the sweet spot for performance to $ ratio.
 
why not intels stock cooler?

is there a cheaper i5 model you could go with too? 16GB ram seems too much for just playing games as well, you shouldn't ever need to hit 8, this isnt a home pc where you'll have 10 chrome tabs, skype, music running, etc.

that case is also wayyy too expensive. ($120 on newegg).

100% do not go with the 980, its overkill.
 
DF-1 said:
why not intels stock cooler?

is there a cheaper i5 model you could go with too? 16GB ram seems too much for just playing games as well, you shouldn't ever need to hit 8, this isnt a home pc where you'll have 10 chrome tabs, skype, music running, etc.

that case is also wayyy too expensive. ($120 on newegg).

100% do not go with the 980, its overkill.
Click to expand...
I just want to ensure nothing overheats and have good reliability. Might switch to a regular after market heatsink.

I believe that's the cheapest model i5 I could find.

16GB of ram is actually ideal. Apparently using the LAN center software people can open up more than one game if not closed properly. That plus using Firefox or Chrome and system resources you can see how it would run out of memory really fast with only 8GB.

As for the case it's definitely not what I'm 100% going with just a place holder really. Need a good air cooled case.
 
Worked at a lan center from when it opened in 03' until it closed years later. We had 42 pc's as well with 6 50" hdtvs with all the consoles.. I wish system longevity lasted as long as it does now.

As DF-1 talked about, stay with the stock intel cooler. You won't have any issues. As long as you blow the dust out of the systems every month you shouldn't have a problem. Find the cheapest case you can that still will look aesthetically pleasing. You won't ever be inside it and you need to save money where you can. 8gb would probably be safe but I wouldn't go higher than 16. Any kind of budget motherboard but with rock steady stability and reliability. Imho your pretty close spec wise. I would personally stick with the 960's and plan for future video card upgrades down the line in about 2 years. Ready yourself to sell all the old ones to help cover costs. Find the most reliable PSU you can as well. Haven't used an EVGA but I swear by Corsair and Sparkle.

Everything in our lan center focused on reliability, stability, and cost while still offering a superior gaming experience. Good luck with your new business!
 
Ditch the H55. Even if you wanted to go with a CLC, the H55 is one of the worst choice possible for the money as there are cheaper air-cooling HSF that completely outperforms it. Personally, I would recommend getting an aftermarket HSF since it's a relatively cheap investment on your part to help maintain system longevity. Not to mention that it gives you more of a buffer between PC cleanings. So I recommend this HSF:
$31 - Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo HSF

Ditch that MSI Z97-G45 motherboard. You're not overclocking nor have you stated that you're going to need any of that motherboard's specific features. As such, I'm sure you'll be fine with this cheaper motherboard:
$98 - MSI Z97 PC MATE Intel Z97 ATX Motherboard

You're missing a SSD. I recommend this:
$85 - Crucial BX100 250GB SSD

Case wise, I have to agree with DF-1 in that the case is a bit overkill for your business. I recommend this cheaper but still good cooling case:
$70 - Corsair Graphite Series 230T Black ATX Case

As for the PSU, which eVGA SuperNova 650W are you talking about? There's the Supernova GS, Supernova G2, and Supernova G1 650W Gold PSUs. With that said, get the Supernova G2 as it's the better quality of the three eVGA Supernova 650W PSUs.

Finally the video card: Yes stay with the GTX 970.
 
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Dangman said:
Ditch the H55. Even if you wanted to go with a CLC, the H55 is one of the worst choice possible for the money as there are cheaper air-cooling HSF that completely outperforms it. Personally, I would recommend getting an aftermarket HSF since it's a relatively cheap investment on your part to help maintain system longevity. Not to mention that it gives you more of a buffer between PC cleanings. So I recommend this HSF:
$31 - Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo HSF

Ditch that MSI Z97-G45 motherboard. You're not overclocking nor have you stated that you're going to need any of that motherboard's specific features. As such, I'm sure you'll be fine with this cheaper motherboard:
$98 - MSI Z97 PC MATE Intel Z97 ATX Motherboard

You're missing a SSD. I recommend this:
$85 - Crucial BX100 250GB SSD

Case wise, I have to agree with DF-1 in that the case is a bit overkill for your business. I recommend this cheaper but still good cooling case:
$70 - Corsair Graphite Series 230T Black ATX Case

As for the PSU, which eVGA SuperNova 650W are you talking about? There's the Supernova GS, Supernova G2, and Supernova G1 650W Gold PSUs. With that said, get the Supernova G2 as it's the better quality of the three eVGA Supernova 650W PSUs.

Finally the video card: Yes stay with the GTX 970.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the reply.

Not sure if you didn't read the first post but all my workstations will be diskless meaning they don't need hard drives. They PXE boot from a network server off 1 single Windows image.

I definitely agree with everything else you mentioned though especially the H55.

That case is pretty much what I was looking for and the window model isn't too much more expensive. Thanks for that.

For the PSU the G2 was the one I was looking at.

As for overclocking definitely not. I want stability and things to last as well as run cool.
 
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damstr said:
First off if you are commenting on whether or not I should start a LAN center please don't post. I DON'T CARE. I'm only looking for input on build specs not business advice...

Anyway so I will be starting with around 42 gaming PC's. My biggest question is what video card to use. I would like the systems to last around 2-4 years before upgrading the GPU.

I originally thought the GTX 960 was good but then started thinking for $100 more I could get all 970's. The 980 would be roughly $300 more.

Here are the proposed specs:

Core i5 4460
Corsair H55
MSI Z97 G45 mobo
Kingston Beast 16GB
Asus GTX 960, 970, 980
Corsair 450D
EVGA SuperNOVA 650W 80+ Gold

GTX 980 seems too much money for not that much performance increase. For example a 980 is not twice as fast as a 960 @ 1080P but costs more than twice as much. Like I said before I think the 970 is the sweet spot for performance to $ ratio.
Click to expand...

If money is no object, then that seems fine. Personally I'd go for 8 gigs of ram on each machine, and a 970. I also would just use the stock Intel cooler which is more than adequate for anything that is not overclocked. That would save some money to put toward some nice reliable networking equipment.
 
damstr said:
Thanks for the reply.

Not sure if you didn't read the first post but all my workstations will be diskless meaning they don't need hard drives. They PXE boot from a network server off 1 single Windows image.
Click to expand...
Your first post in this thread doesn't mention anything about diskless. Obviously I read your first post in this thread, otherwise how could I have critiqued the build?

In any case, good luck with the builds.
 
Dangman said:
Your first post in this thread doesn't mention anything about diskless. Obviously I read your first post in this thread, otherwise how could I have critiqued the build?
Click to expand...

LOL

Looks like OP didn't read his own post... :D
 
Dammit I posted this in a few different forums but this was the first and I never mentioned it here obviously!

Fail.

Anyway thanks. I am updating my proposed build now.

EDIT: Also what is everyone's thoughts on 144Hz monitors? I was looking at the BenQ XL2411Z.
 
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damstr said:
EDIT: Also what is everyone's thoughts on 144Hz monitors? I was looking at the BenQ XL2411Z.
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sounds like you want to spend needless money and chasing needless upgrades and specs.

144hz? are you feeling okay? really want to buy a 980 ti? maybe 16gb ram isnt enough, go 64.



again, stock intel is fine, otherwise 95% of the world would be complaining. windows takes 2GB, a game takes 3GB max, thats 5. lets say your software takes a crazy amount... 1GB. you still have 2GB left. with 8GB ram

who is going to look at your cases? don't spend anything over $40 on a case.
Do a bulk/company purchase to get lower prices as well.

the point is to make money not spend it all. cheapest cost for best reliabillity and good (not ultra crysis 3 4k 144hz) performance. post #7 has got it right.

reliability > cost > performance >>>>> cool LEDs, that should be what you're aiming for.
 
144hz monitor is definitely overkill. Even enthusiasts don't care that much about it. Most people who would even frequent a lan center, probably wouldn't even notice the difference.

If you do want to go to the ultra side of things, I'd keep that to a minimum. Like 5 special machines or something, because all you'll end up doing is losing money on it if you go full tilt.

As for computer cases.... I doubt anyone is going to care. Get simple ones that allow airflow.
 
DF-1 said:
sounds like you want to spend needless money and chasing needless upgrades and specs.

144hz? are you feeling okay? really want to buy a 980 ti? maybe 16gb ram isnt enough, go 64.



again, stock intel is fine, otherwise 95% of the world would be complaining. windows takes 2GB, a game takes 3GB max, thats 5. lets say your software takes a crazy amount... 1GB. you still have 2GB left. with 8GB ram

who is going to look at your cases? don't spend anything over $40 on a case.
Do a bulk/company purchase to get lower prices as well.

the point is to make money not spend it all. cheapest cost for best reliabillity and good (not ultra crysis 3 4k 144hz) performance. post #7 has got it right.

reliability > cost > performance >>>>> cool LEDs, that should be what you're aiming for.
Click to expand...
16GB's of memory is because with the diskless clients, sometimes people tend to open more than 1 game at a time. Running 8GB's with 2 games open + Firefox/Chrome + the LAN center client software leaves very little to no memory for the OS and starts using the writeback disks across the network. Not ideal.

As far as cases I would imagine a lot of people. The way I have mine LAN center setup, the cases are out of reach but still highly visible. Trying to create an atmosphere.

For 144Hz monitors, I know a few that are using 144Hz panels so it's not something out of the ordinary.
 
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Intel Core i5-4460 3.2GHz Quad-Core Processor
Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler
MSI Z97 PC MATE ATX LGA1150 Motherboard
Kingston HyperX Fury Black 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR3-1866 Memory
Asus GeForce GTX 970 4GB STRIX Video Card
Corsair Graphite Series 230T Black ATX Mid Tower Case
EVGA SuperNOVA GS 650W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply
BenQ XL2411Z 144Hz 24.0" Monitor
Razer BlackWidow Ultimate Wired Gaming Keyboard
Razer DeathAdder 2013 Wired Optical Mouse

Alright here is the revised buildout.

Total is $1350 with mail in rebates. Not bad!
 
Mouse and KB seem like overkill...

Also, what's wrong with the stock Intel HSF everyone suggested?
 
MavericK96 said:
Mouse and KB seem like overkill...

Also, what's wrong with the stock Intel HSF everyone suggested?
Click to expand...

I mean I have a green/black/gray theme going on and it matches. What would suggest? This place is going to be sort of dark so stuff needs backlight.

I've experienced overheating on the stock Intel heatsink which is why I don't want to use them. Also they are loud when under load.
 
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Build looks good.
Nothing is really 'overkill' These are gaming PC's in a LAN center. Customers expect them to not HP keyboards and mice.
 
THUMPer1 said:
Build looks good.
Nothing is really 'overkill' These are gaming PC's in a LAN center. Customers expect them to not HP keyboards and mice.
Click to expand...


That's what I'm thinking. I mean save money where you can but don't cheap out on the things the customer directly interacts with.
 
You're doing it wrong. :)

You need to look at this from a business perspective, not just a techie one. Go to Dell, HP, etc and spec systems from them with a next business day warranty. Make sure you have an extra PC or two as a hot spare.

Don't go diskless: you'll kill the network. A small SSD should suffice.

Don't get premium peripherals: your customers will break them. Just get a standard £5 keyboard and £5 mouse. Fancy peripherals also mean imaging issues. Do you really want to have to keep creating new system images?

Are you down with the back end? Software licensing etc?

Think very carefully about how to minimise the on-going effort of running the business.
 
^Quartz has a good thought too. Buy an Asus ROG system from Best Buy. haha
 
Quartz-1 said:
You're doing it wrong. :)

You need to look at this from a business perspective, not just a techie one. Go to Dell, HP, etc and spec systems from them with a next business day warranty. Make sure you have an extra PC or two as a hot spare.

Don't go diskless: you'll kill the network. A small SSD should suffice.

Don't get premium peripherals: your customers will break them. Just get a standard £5 keyboard and £5 mouse. Fancy peripherals also mean imaging issues. Do you really want to have to keep creating new system images?

Are you down with the back end? Software licensing etc?

Think very carefully about how to minimise the on-going effort of running the business.
Click to expand...

I read this and have to wonder how much you really know about LAN centers and how they work. All the successful ones in the country are using gaming keyboards mice and headsets. Not Walmart brand stuff.

You say look at it from a business perspective which I am. Diskless means you have consistency across all computers. Running SSD's in all computers means each computer has to be updated with games and software as well as OS updates. Not sure how that is more efficient. Takes more time and requires more people to manage.

I suggest you look at the LAN centers around the world that run with 50-250 PC's. They are diskless.
 
damstr said:
I suggest you look at the LAN centers around the world that run with 50-250 PC's. They are diskless.
Click to expand...

I've set up classrooms and libraries. We tried diskless to start with but it was immediately obvious that it was an utter failure.
 
Quartz-1 said:
I've set up classrooms and libraries. We tried diskless to start with but it was immediately obvious that it was an utter failure.
Click to expand...

How so?

I'm just curious because there are a ton of successful LAN centers diskless.
 
Would a library or a classroom be even comparable to a lan center?
 
I assume with this small of a business (starting out), brands/vendors would not be willing to give a bulk discount in exchange for "sponsored by?"
 
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Since you are not going to overclock with a K series CPU, would you be able to get away without the other features the Z series motherboard has over an H series? That could potentially save thousands depending on if you could use H87/H97 or even H81. My only concern with H81 would be they are limited to 2 single-channel DIMM slots for RAM, but they could be had for under half the price of that Z97 board it seems. And it seems like the diskless stuff basically uses the RAM as a RAMDISK to load everything on?
 
GearChoices said:
I assume with this small of a business (starting out), brands/vendors would not be willing to give a bulk discount in exchange for "sponsored by?"
Click to expand...

Pretty much. The only one that has been really awesome to deal with so far is DX Racer. Gave me a 30% discount for ordering 60+ chairs which is around $6-$7k.
 
I think your systems are overkill.

Core i5 4460 CPU w/ Stock Cooler
MSI H97M-E35 Motherboard
8GB GSkill Value Series
MSI GTX960 Video Card
Corsair R100 Case
Corsair CX500 Power Supply
Acer G246HLAbd 24" 1920x1080 Monitor
CoolerMaster CM Storm Devastator Mouse/Keyboard Combo

http://pcpartpicker.com/p/sx9fLk

Total: $730.88 without any mail in rebates (you aren't going to get 42 mail in rebates) with ~$250 in savings coming from just Monitor/KB/M

This is half the cost of your setup with 90% of the capability. You are saving $25,000 by going with something like this. If you want to change a few things like insisting on 16GB instead of 8GB it is fine. You really need to save on things like the monitor, case, keyboard/mouse. I mean really, there is nothing wrong with this: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00DKXXAAQ and it is going to save you a ton. Putting that $25,000 into other things will probably be more beneficial in the long run.


You need to take a step back and think about what games are going to be most popular. It is probably going to be League of Legends, DOTA2, World of Warcraft, CS:GO, Call of Duty, and Battlefield. All of these can run fine on a GTX960 at 1080p.


EDIT: Are you also going to have gaming consoles? Only PC seems limiting for a LAN center with console games so popular these days.
 
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The most popular games may not be equal to the games people most likely want to go to a LAN center to play, just thinking.
 
Erasmus354 said:
I think your systems are overkill.

Core i5 4460 CPU w/ Stock Cooler
MSI H97M-E35 Motherboard
8GB GSkill Value Series
MSI GTX960 Video Card
Corsair R100 Case
Corsair CX500 Power Supply
Acer G246HLAbd 24" 1920x1080 Monitor
CoolerMaster CM Storm Devastator Mouse/Keyboard Combo

http://pcpartpicker.com/p/sx9fLk

Total: $730.88 without any mail in rebates (you aren't going to get 42 mail in rebates) with ~$250 in savings coming from just Monitor/KB/M

This is half the cost of your setup with 90% of the capability. You are saving $25,000 by going with something like this. If you want to change a few things like insisting on 16GB instead of 8GB it is fine. You really need to save on things like the monitor, case, keyboard/mouse. I mean really, there is nothing wrong with this: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00DKXXAAQ and it is going to save you a ton. Putting that $25,000 into other things will probably be more beneficial in the long run.


You need to take a step back and think about what games are going to be most popular. It is probably going to be League of Legends, DOTA2, World of Warcraft, CS:GO, Call of Duty, and Battlefield. All of these can run fine on a GTX960 at 1080p.


EDIT: Are you also going to have gaming consoles? Only PC seems limiting for a LAN center with console games so popular these days.
Click to expand...
I will keep that in mind that is a TON of money. What I think you are forgetting is more long term. You build a PC that is good for TODAY. What about 2-3 years from now? That GTX 960 will be struggling to play modern titles @ 1080P 60FPS. The GTX 970 is a good 30%+ faster maybe more and costs around $100 more. That is the sweet spot for performance to $. Upgrades = downtime.

Just because it can play the most popular games great doesn't mean its ok. I need it to play ALL games great so limiting the PC isn't going to benefit the LAN center at all.

Lastly I'm having Microcenter build this and warranty it through them. I'm not going to build 42 computers myself. Not only would that take awhile but any warranty work would be a nightmare. They will price match Newegg and some other retailers.

Also I know Newegg discounts when purchased in bulk. There is a few distributors that I've looked at such as D&H and MA Labs.

Yes I plan on having consoles as well. It's looking more like around 48 PC's. I know I'm definitely doing Xbox One and Wii U but not sure if I'm going to offer PS4 as well.

Looking at around 25-35 Consoles all together. I have the space.
 
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This sounds pretty awesome. Can I come out and help you set them up?
 
damstr said:
I will keep that in mind that is a TON of money. What I think you are forgetting is more long term. You build a PC that is good for TODAY. What about 2-3 years from now? That GTX 960 will be struggling to play modern titles @ 1080P 60FPS. The GTX 970 is a good 30%+ faster maybe more and costs around $100 more. That is the sweet spot for performance to $. Upgrades = downtime.

Just because it can play the most popular games great doesn't mean its ok. I need it to play ALL games great so limiting the PC isn't going to benefit the LAN center at all.

Lastly I'm having Microcenter build this and warranty it through them. I'm not going to build 42 computers myself. Not only would that take awhile but any warranty work would be a nightmare. They will price match Newegg and some other retailers.

Also I know Newegg discounts when purchased in bulk. There is a few distributors that I've looked at such as D&H and MA Labs.

Yes I plan on having consoles as well. It's looking more like around 48 PC's. I know I'm definitely doing Xbox One and Wii U but not sure if I'm going to offer PS4 as well.

Looking at around 25-35 Consoles all together. I have the space.
Click to expand...


I still believe the 960 is the card to go with. Look at the equivalent card from 2 years ago, the GTX 760. That card can still play any popular games you are likely to be running in a LAN center at 1920x1080 resolution. However, upgrading the RAM or Video Card would be one of the few places where I think splurging a bit is ok. I think you really need to cut back on the case / PSU (still reliable brand/quality though) / monitor / keyboard / mouse. You can save a lot of money in this area, and these are all items where your clientele is unlikely to notice a difference between the higher end items you have selected and the cheap offerings. Particularly after the keys have all been run down and worn out on your fancy 100$+ keyboards.
 
Erasmus354 said:
I think your systems are overkill.

Core i5 4460 CPU w/ Stock Cooler
MSI H97M-E35 Motherboard
8GB GSkill Value Series
MSI GTX960 Video Card
Corsair R100 Case
Corsair CX500 Power Supply
Acer G246HLAbd 24" 1920x1080 Monitor
CoolerMaster CM Storm Devastator Mouse/Keyboard Combo

http://pcpartpicker.com/p/sx9fLk

Total: $730.88 without any mail in rebates (you aren't going to get 42 mail in rebates) with ~$250 in savings coming from just Monitor/KB/M

This is half the cost of your setup with 90% of the capability. You are saving $25,000 by going with something like this. If you want to change a few things like insisting on 16GB instead of 8GB it is fine. You really need to save on things like the monitor, case, keyboard/mouse. I mean really, there is nothing wrong with this: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00DKXXAAQ and it is going to save you a ton. Putting that $25,000 into other things will probably be more beneficial in the long run.


You need to take a step back and think about what games are going to be most popular. It is probably going to be League of Legends, DOTA2, World of Warcraft, CS:GO, Call of Duty, and Battlefield. All of these can run fine on a GTX960 at 1080p.


EDIT: Are you also going to have gaming consoles? Only PC seems limiting for a LAN center with console games so popular these days.
Click to expand...
Going with a CX500 seems risky across 42 systems. Spending a little more on a PSU with better components and build quality is going to save you headaches in the long run. But I have to agree with you on everything else.
 
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Erasmus354 said:
I still believe the 960 is the card to go with. Look at the equivalent card from 2 years ago, the GTX 760. That card can still play any popular games you are likely to be running in a LAN center at 1920x1080 resolution. However, upgrading the RAM or Video Card would be one of the few places where I think splurging a bit is ok. I think you really need to cut back on the case / PSU (still reliable brand/quality though) / monitor / keyboard / mouse. You can save a lot of money in this area, and these are all items where your clientele is unlikely to notice a difference between the higher end items you have selected and the cheap offerings. Particularly after the keys have all been run down and worn out on your fancy 100$+ keyboards.
Click to expand...

All valid points. Nothing is 100% set in stone yet. I imagine PC's will probably be the last thing I buy. If I can do everything for cheaper than I'm expecting then I will be doing higher end hardware. If I need to save every penny possible then I will look into a build similar to yours.

I won't know for a few weeks when I know exactly what funds are and what I can work into the business plan.

defaultluser said:
I'm in Maryland. I'll have to come by after you set up shop :D

Where are you at?
Click to expand...

It will be located in Abingdon most likely. Still hunting around for locations.Possibly Annapolis or Columbia.
 
THUMPer1 said:
Indiana. But I'm looking for a vacation. :)

Also, I think the 970 is the better choice here.
Click to expand...

I really believe it is as well. Like I said in the previous post I'll know exactly how much money I have to work with soon.

If you call setting something like this up a vacation then sure you can come on over and help! haha
 
damstr said:
It will be located in Abingdon most likely. Still hunting around for locations.Possibly Annapolis or Columbia.
Click to expand...

You'd probably be set with spoiled kids in Bel Air or Columbia, although since Columbia is older, you've got competition already there:

http://www.redbranchgaming.com/

Does Annapolis have a big gaming scene? I know Severna Park is spoiled kid central, but the rest of the city is mostly people who like spending their money on boats :D

And oh yeah, Crofton has grown huge in the last decade, so you also might want to check that out.
 
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