Kimera Industries Cerberus: The 18L, mATX, USA-made enclosure

[Valantar]

There's 83mm between the motherboard and the frame front. So a single fan should fit just fine. There's no room for the second fan though, the case isn't wide enough for a 120mm fan/rad to overhang the motherboard.

Thanks for the reply! Good to know that there isn't enough width for any kind of overhanging fan. I'm not planning on running an X99 chip or OCing much, so using just a single fan should be sufficient anyhow.

 

[Aibohphobia]

Q&A is live! Discord

Thanks to everyone who joined us for the live Q&A! We'll be posting a recording of it for those who missed it sometime.

 

[Halfdan]

Damn, forgot about this. I'll have to check out the recording when it becomes available.

 

[Herstal]

This case is just what i want (no, need) - sorta kinda M1-style mATX. Got a few questions though, apologies if there are answers earlier in the thread, I admit I didn't have time to read it all.
1. I assume there is no space for a slim ODD anywhere? Not an issue, just wondering.
2. My goal would be to fit my 3930K with two upcoming full-die Pascals, but I'm wondering about power requirements and space. I'm not sure if a 700W SFX-L would be enough to power all this gear, so for now i'd have to stay with my current ST1000P and a front-mounted H110 for CPU cooling. Will this leave enough room for full-length video cards?
3. Alternatively, if I decided to go for an SFX-L build with a 4770K - am I correct in assuming, that it is possible to fit a 280mm rad in the side bracket with the PSU in the front? Or is it limited to 240 then? Can I fit another 120/140mm in the front under the PSU?
4. Is there enough space between the mobo plate and side plate to fit a couple of 7/9mm SSDs?

 

[Aibohphobia]

1. No ODD support.

2. Whether the 700W is enough for dual Pascal is unknown until we see reviews of the GTX 1080 or whatever they call it. The H110 will not fit on the front, a slim 240mm may fit with 10.5" cards:

3. A 240/280mm rad won't fit on the side with a power supply at the front. The mounting holes go all the way across the side bracket mostly for mounting the drive brackets. With a SFX-L up front, a 120mm rad may fit under it, with a SFX up front a 120mm rad almost certainly will fit, and a 140mm rad won't fit with either.

4. 2.5" drives mount in front of the motherboard on the inside of the tray, there is only 1mm between the tray and the back side panel:

 

[Herstal]

Thanks for the answers. So essentially, with a SFX-L air cooling seems the most reasonable way to go in this case, that's a bit disappointing. With a regular PSU, is it possible to install a 240/280 in the bottom with another 240/280 in the front? Also, what is the clearance for the CPU cooler (block/pump combo) with a rear-mounted ATX PSU? Will a Swiftech H220 pump fit?

EDIT:
I'm thinking about a following setup:
ATX PSU (160mm)
front slim 240 rad
bottom slim 240 rad
2x GPU
pump+res combo located on the side bracket, in front of the PSU
Would this work?

 

[Aibohphobia]

Dual 240mm rads is possible but it requires fairly compact rads and even then it's a tight fit:

From the top of the CPU to the ATX PSU it's about 48mm:

So I think the H220-X will fit with angled fittings, but the H220 won't.

 

[Herstal]

Hmmm, this would make pipe routing really difficult though, they woudl have to pass under the GPUs somehow. I guess the best option would be to just go with full air cooling - a 700W SFX-L, 4770K, Noctua C14S or similar.

 

[CompuG##K]

If I may add. With Pascal going with HBM2 memory, there's a possibility we may end up with somewhat shorter cards on the high end this time. This would definitely loosen the restrictions on front mounted 240mm radiators.

 

[Phuncz]

The Radeon Nano already offers high-end performance for an "ITX"-sized card, it's possible today thanks to HBM and a focus on SFF cards. Nvidia could just as well do a humpback like the GTX 670, that was a short card too but the cooler was huge.

 

[Aibohphobia]

Cerberus has landed, friends.

Starting today, and lasting until March 31st, enthusiasts can navigate to Kickstarter to read up on the case, our work, and the myriad tiers available to backers.

---

I'd encourage everyone to look at the page itself to see all the tiers and stretch goals available, and the details for each.

James and I have been looking forward to this day for well over a year, and it's simply crazy to us that the crowdfunding campaign has finally arrived. And although it's been a big push to properly prepare for today, we'll be working throughout the length of the Kickstarter campaign to do all that we can to promote our work, and give the campaign the best possible chance of success. Look forward to some appearances of our prototype with a few channels/publications - as well as some newfound press attention, if we're lucky!

Of course, there's much that you all can do to support our work, too, from pledging to receive a case (of course), to pledging to receive one of the art tiers, to even simply posting on social media and letting others know about Cerberus. This project has been a community-based one from the beginning, and as such, every dollar and every mention makes a tangible difference. Furthermore, even awareness that doesn't directly translate into pledges accomplishes one of our most important aspirations: so preach the philosophy behind our work, and show the industry what's possible with the right amount of passion and purpose.

Anyways, there's one more section I'd like to except from the Kickstarter page:

Finally, our thanks to everyone who made Cerberus possible
Cerberus is a passion product fueled by the enthusiast community we call home, but it’s just one of many ideas and designs we’ve worked on in the past year and a half. Even so, to get Cerberus to this point required that we stand on the shoulders of giants, and utilize a trove of community feedback throughout the development process. As such, we'd like to recognize those who got us here:

• The HardForum, LTT, and SFF Forum communities, which have contributed an unfathomable amount of commentary, criticism and praise over the past year.
• The NCASE team, and many other creators, for inspiring us and trailblazing the way community-designed products like Cerberus can be made.
• Protocase and Sliger Designs, for working with us endlessly to develop prototypes and the final design.
• Rick Trilling, for his superb pro bono legal counsel.
• Paul Lazarovich, for his assistance with editing our website copy, as well as for all of his advice on promoting and sharing our work.
• Jeffery Weber, for creating many of the digital assets used on our website.
• [Carissa Reynolds, for offering to do a commissioned work in support of Kimera Industries.
• Alexandra Zanca, for filming & editing our Kickstarter video.
• Anyone and everyone that has assisted or contributed to us, in ways big or small — whatever contribution you've made, know that we wouldn't have gotten here without it!

It's through all of our hard work, and the assistance of everyone above, that this project will be successful. Thank you!​

It's you all that have made our efforts meaningful, and you all that will make production of Cerberus a reality. Thanks again for the feedback, the enthusiasm, and support.

 

[Gene46]

First post.

Just wanted to say hi and great job on the case. Backed this on Kickstarter!

Best of luck.

 

[CompuG##K]

Just backed the Signature Edition! Can't wait to get ahold of this puppy!

To clarify, you mentioned that you may give the ATX version of the case the ability to transition to use SFX power supplies through the use of a bracket purchased separately? Would such a thing be an option with the Sig Edition? I'm gonna be doing SLI Pascal Titan and I'm still not sure if SFX would be enough even with the 700w model coming up. I'd rather be safe than sorry. I'd still like to be able to eventually transition to SFX for maximum flexibility though.

 

[vipz]

Couple notes - there doesn't seem to be a single picture showing the top of the enclosure closed with a good view of the front I/O. Also, is there any reason the SG09/10 are left out of the mATX comparison chart?

 

[majic12]

They did posted a link to a gallery Cerberus Photos where i see a few pictures showing the top(but yeah,no close ups).About the other cases i supose its a marketing thing+ there are a few others but since none match the quality i suspect there is no reason for naming all of them.For me the closest one that comes to nova is the jonsbo u3.
---------------------------
Aiboh,does the 250$ cover shiping?
And a small request.Can you post a photo of the white/black case in a normal environment(no fancy lightning.Im having difficult times to appreciate the paint job.

 

[Aibohphobia]

To clarify, you mentioned that you may give the ATX version of the case the ability to transition to use SFX power supplies through the use of a bracket purchased separately? Would such a thing be an option with the Sig Edition? I'm gonna be doing SLI Pascal Titan and I'm still not sure if SFX would be enough even with the 700w model coming up. I'd rather be safe than sorry. I'd still like to be able to eventually transition to SFX for maximum flexibility though.

If we do such an upgrade kit we'll make it available as an option to everyone.

Couple notes - there doesn't seem to be a single picture showing the top of the enclosure closed with a good view of the front I/O. Also, is there any reason the SG09/10 are left out of the mATX comparison chart?

Here's one:

The overly large cutouts in the top panel for the USB are only on the prototype.

Like majic12 says, the SG09 isn't in the chart for marketing. Personally I would have put it in there because I don't care about marketing but I'm not in charge of it

Aiboh,does the 250$ cover shiping?
And a small request.Can you post a photo of the white/black case in a normal environment(no fancy lightning.Im having difficult times to appreciate the paint job.

Shipping is separate.

I have this pic:

and some closeups:

 

[vpr]

Aibohphobia

Does the window weaken the overall structure? How is it attached to the panel? Also, is there a noticeable increase in noise w/ the windowed panel versus windowless?

 

[Aibohphobia]

Does the window weaken the overall structure? How is it attached to the panel? Also, is there a noticeable increase in noise w/ the windowed panel versus windowless?

The windowed panel isn't as strong as the normal panel I guess but it has no effect on the overall frame rigidity. The side bracket has the biggest effect on stiffening the left side of the frame and that's why I recommend leaving the side bracket on even if nothing is attached to it.

I haven't noticed a difference in noise between the different panels. I've mentioned this before, but the biggest limitation of building a quiet rig in Cerberus will be your components. There is plenty of ventilation so with careful part selection it's not that difficult to get a quiet build, except for high-end dual GPU setups at load. That configuration will be tricky to keep quiet at full load but that's not unique to Cerberus.

There are threaded studs around the edge of the window cutout that fit into holes cut in the window:

 

[WhiteRice]

Will there be an option to pay more for red if the strech goal is not hit?

 

[einmannbude]

Dual 240mm rads is possible but it requires fairly compact rads and even then it's a tight fit:

Maybe I am missing something, but isn't the internal depth 354mm? If a EK slim 240 radiator is mounted at the bottom, which will take 280mm away, then there are still 74mm left. Another slim radiator plus fans on the front panel will only be around 55mm. So there is 19mm tolerance. "Tight fit" is not the right term for that in the SFF environment, I think

 

[Aibohphobia]

Will there be an option to pay more for red if the strech goal is not hit?

The problem with more colors is it makes logistics more difficult due to the number of SKUs which is why we have it as a stretch goal, that way the extra funding will compensate for that extra difficulty. But having it as a more expensive tier is maybe doable, we'll consider it.

Maybe I am missing something, but isn't the internal depth 354mm? If a EK slim 240 radiator is mounted at the bottom, which will take 280mm away, then there are still 74mm left. Another slim radiator plus fans on the front panel will only be around 55mm. So there is 19mm tolerance. "Tight fit" is not the right term for that in the SFF environment, I think

354mm is from the front of the front panel to the back of the frame rear. From the inside of the frame front to the inside of the frame rear is 329mm, so with your example parts that would leave -6mm of space, which I would call a "tight fit"

 

[einmannbude]

354mm is from the front of the front panel to the back of the frame rear. From the inside of the frame front to the inside of the frame rear is 329mm

Thanks for the answer. I thought the first line on your spec sheet was the internals.

• H x W x D: 303 x 170 x 354mm, 18.2L
• H x W x D (overall): 320 x 170 x 364mm

That makes me curious about the other axes. Could you share the measurements from the inside of the frame on all axes, please?

I thought there was no problem in mounting 2x 240 radiators in the Cerberus. I mean, of cause it is not impossible - a Magicool rad is 272mm long and 27mm high - two of them will fit well, but I am concerend about the limitation in the choice of the radiators. EKs for example have 22fpi, Magicool "just" 16fpi. That means 37% more cooling capacity in theory if the case was 6mm longer. Do you have recommendations on which radiators to chose if the plan is to mount two 240s?

 

[Aibohphobia]

Thanks for the answer. I thought the first line on your spec sheet was the internals.

• H x W x D: 303 x 170 x 354mm, 18.2L
• H x W x D (overall): 320 x 170 x 364mm

That makes me curious about the other axes. Could you share the measurements from the inside of the frame on all axes, please?

The first line excludes the feet and rear PCI flange while the second line includes those. This is the same way the M1 and other SFF cases measure their volume.

That makes me curious about the other axes. Could you share the measurements from the inside of the frame on all axes, please?

PCI slots are 20.32mm tall so subtract that from the measurement if you're talking about the 5th slot.

Note: The vertical dimensions are from the inside of the top panel to the inside of the bottom panel but at the front and rear edges, the lip of the middle frame section and the threaded nuts for the screws reduce the available space by 3-4mm.

Dimensions are to the inside of the frame

Dimensions are to the inside of the middle frame section, there is another 1mm on top/bottom/left side if the rad is offset from the front by a fan.

Bottom vents

Also, all dimensions are rounded down.

I thought there was no problem in mounting 2x 240 radiators in the Cerberus. I mean, of cause it is not impossible - a Magicool rad is 272mm long and 27mm high - two of them will fit well, but I am concerend about the limitation in the choice of the radiators. EKs for example have 22fpi, Magicool "just" 16fpi. That means 37% more cooling capacity in theory if the case was 6mm longer. Do you have recommendations on which radiators to chose if the plan is to mount two 240s?

The main problem with dual 240mm rads is the bottom-front fan may interfere with the bottom rad so using a slim fan for that position makes things much more feasible. Cerberus was never intended to be used with dual 240mm rads though, that's only been made possible by the addition of ATX power supply support, which was done fairly late in the project. Making the case bigger would certainly help but there's always some config or part that would be made feasible by adding 2mm here or 5mm there and then before you know it the case is 25L.

 

[einmannbude]

Making the case bigger would certainly help but there's always some config or part that would be made feasible by adding 2mm here or 5mm there and then before you know it the case is 25L.

That's true and I understand.

Really appreciate the info in the pictures by the way. Thanks a lot. This helps planning before spending money.

 

[majic12]

Aiboh,a quick question.I know that there is still a good ammount of time left for the crowfund to end, but if by some chance you dont manage to collect the asked number of 150k will it mean backers wont get the case?I know its a technical question and the answer ¨¨depends¨¨ on the situation but i im interested in just to know if you guys have a backup plan just in case.

 

[Tyler Allan Schnadarle]

I'm building a pc rig from scratch and basing it on the design specs of this case, if anybody has a full build that will work please post the build specs.
I have been looking around at different mATX compatible motherboards and I am considering this one: ASRock ASRock Fatal1ty Gaming Fatal1ty X99M Killer LGA 2011-v3 Intel X99 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 Micro ATX Intel Motherboard - Newegg.com

 

[Aibohphobia]

Aiboh,a quick question.I know that there is still a good ammount of time left for the crowfund to end, but if by some chance you dont manage to collect the asked number of 150k will it mean backers wont get the case?I know its a technical question and the answer ¨¨depends¨¨ on the situation but i im interested in just to know if you guys have a backup plan just in case.

Backup plan is to discuss with those who have pledged and figure out what features to drop/modify in order to make a smaller production run feasible.

I'm building a pc rig from scratch and basing it on the design specs of this case, if anybody has a full build that will work please post the build specs.
I have been looking around at different mATX compatible motherboards and I am considering this one: ASRock ASRock Fatal1ty Gaming Fatal1ty X99M Killer LGA 2011-v3 Intel X99 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 Micro ATX Intel Motherboard - Newegg.com

As a note, the ASRock X99 mATX boards only have PCIe 3.0 x4 on the bottom slot so spaced SLI is not possible unless NVIDIA relaxes the x8 requirement for SLI with Pascal.

 

[themodernagenb]

Backup plan is to discuss with those who have pledged and figure out what features to drop/modify in order to make a smaller production run feasible.



As a note, the ASRock X99 mATX boards only have PCIe 3.0 x4 on the bottom slot so spaced SLI is not possible unless NVIDIA relaxes the x8 requirement for SLI with Pascal.

Maybe just have one case design instead of two - one for ATX and another for SFX. I would suggest just keeping the ATX design and selling a separate kit to turn it into SFX. Would that make a smaller production run feasible?

Maybe getting rid of the windowed option too.

 

[Aibohphobia]

Maybe just have one case design instead of two - one for ATX and another for SFX. I would suggest just keeping the ATX design and selling a separate kit to turn it into SFX. Would that make a smaller production run feasible?

Decisions like that will depend on the exact number of people wanting SFX vs ATX vs the ability to easily switch between.

 

[majic12]

I prefer only the sfx one as i loud use the back 92mm fan and the hole for the atx will remove it,but there are still 16 days left.Maybe just remove the handle and windowed option and leave the 2 cases?Time will tell.Just go berserk on all forums and avertise till people start to hate you
We are with you Aiboh!

 

[primordialpouch]

Hi, love what you've done with the case! Watched its development for a long time now.

Just had a few questions:
1) You tested this with a GTX780-DC2-3GD5 card before, right? I only ask because I was torn between this case and the M1 and others state you can't fit an Asus 970Strix in the M1 without modification to either the case or the GPU itself. So this is obviously pretty important to me.
Or I guess more specifically, do you know the exact height/width dimensions of a GPU? I know you list the max length.

2) Looking from the pictures, use of SFX power supply precludes the use of 2 front 120mm fans correct? You can only place a fan at the bottom of the front panel in this case when the SFX is used?
2.1) Can you use a bottom 140mm on the front panel bottom slot with an SFX or only 120mm?

3) When placing an order for the tier, if purchasing the Cerberus Pro, will we get a window panel and a regular panel or just a window panel?
3.1) Is it possible we can get an additional regular panel as well in case we hate the look of our build with a window? Doesn't have to be free, but the option would be nice.
3.2) How easily is the handle removed when all components are inside the case?

4) Will there be somewhere where we can obtain or request replacement parts if needed?

5) Are the 2.5" drive mounts on the MB tray to the right? Can you use the top one when the SFX power supply is in place?

EDIT: 6) I know someone else asked about what happens if the Kickstarter doesn't go through and you replied that you'd contact buyers to see how to make the production run feasible. Would we see an increase in price from what we're seeing on kickstarter though or will the prices stay relatively the same?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Deleted member 222586]

Mmmmmmmmmm. How is it possible that the shipping cost is so damn high? $120 for international shipping is HUGE. That plus taxes increases the price dramatically

 

[Aibohphobia]

Maybe just remove the handle and windowed option and leave the 2 cases?

The window and handle are already options.

You tested this with a GTX780-DC2-3GD5 card before, right? I only ask because I was torn between this case and the M1 and others state you can't fit an Asus 970Strix in the M1 without modification to either the case or the GPU itself.

The problem with that card and the 970 Strix is one of the side panel clips is in the way of the extended SLI finger section of the PCB. Cerberus on has clips along the top and bottom edge for the side panels so it fits just fine.

Looking from the pictures, use of SFX power supply precludes the use of 2 front 120mm fans correct?

Correct.

Can you use a bottom 140mm on the front panel bottom slot with an SFX or only 120mm?

A 120mm or 140mm should fit on the front under a SFX PSU. A 120 or even 140mm may fit with a SFX-L PSU if the connectors are offset enough to leave space for the fan:

That's a 140mm fan BTW.

When placing an order for the tier, if purchasing the Cerberus Pro, will we get a window panel and a regular panel or just a window panel?

Just the windowed panel. A spare non-windowed panel could probably be made available for extra cost.

How easily is the handle removed when all components are inside the case?

Trivial, the handle has two screws that screw in from above so you don't have to open the case at all. The bracket it mounts to is more tricky and depending on what all parts are in the way it may require removing the top frame section.

Will there be somewhere where we can obtain or request replacement parts if needed?

We'll order spares along with the production cases but once that supply of parts runs out there won't be any replacement parts available unless there's another production run.

Are the 2.5" drive mounts on the MB tray to the right? Can you use the top one when the SFX power supply is in place?

Not sure what you mean by "to the right". The SFX PSU is almost centered so it doesn't interfere with the top drive mount.

Would we see an increase in price from what we're seeing on kickstarter though or will the prices stay relatively the same?

It'll depend on what people want. We could keep the case exactly like it is but it'll be more expensive due to the smaller order volume, or we could figure out what features to drop/simplify to keep the price about the same.

How is it possible that the shipping cost is so damn high? $120 for international shipping is HUGE.

It's a big box. We're working on it and we think we can reduce the international shipping some but it's not going to be a drastic reduction.

 

[primordialpouch]

The window and handle are already options.



The problem with that card and the 970 Strix is one of the side panel clips is in the way of the extended SLI finger section of the PCB. Cerberus on has clips along the top and bottom edge for the side panels so it fits just fine.



Correct.



A 120mm or 140mm should fit on the front under a SFX PSU. A 120 or even 140mm may fit with a SFX-L PSU if the connectors are offset enough to leave space for the fan:

That's a 140mm fan BTW.



Just the windowed panel. A spare non-windowed panel could probably be made available for extra cost.



Trivial, the handle has two screws that screw in from above so you don't have to open the case at all. The bracket it mounts to is more tricky and depending on what all parts are in the way it may require removing the top frame section.



We'll order spares along with the production cases but once that supply of parts runs out there won't be any replacement parts available unless there's another production run.



Not sure what you mean by "to the right". The SFX PSU is almost centered so it doesn't interfere with the top drive mount.



It'll depend on what people want. We could keep the case exactly like it is but it'll be more expensive due to the smaller order volume, or we could figure out what features to drop/simplify to keep the price about the same.



It's a big box. We're working on it and we think we can reduce the international shipping some but it's not going to be a drastic reduction.

Thank you kind sir for your response.

1) One remaining question, would it be possible to make available a list of screw components being used in this case for purchasing of extras at another point in time? My pets like to eat things or move them and I've lost a fair number of screws for which the type was not explicitly given by the manufacturer.

 

[Aibohphobia]

There will be a list of screws and their thread types before the cases ship. The non-countersunk screws are M3, the countersunk screws for the frame are UNC #4-40 because those screws need 100 degree countersinks and M3 screws aren't readily available in anything but 90 degrees.

 

[primordialpouch]

There will be a list of screws and their thread types before the cases ship. The non-countersunk screws are M3, the countersunk screws for the frame are UNC #4-40 because those screws need 100 degree countersinks and M3 screws aren't readily available in anything but 90 degrees.

So I'm not brushed up on my technical vocabulary to know about the non-countersunk vs countersunk and 100˚ vs 90˚, but it's good to know we'll get a list similar to the NCase M1 so we can obtain replacement parts on our own if necessary. Again, thanks for the answers!

 

[dolkeng]

Is it possible to use the ATX configuration with a 240mm AIO in the front and a 120mm AIO in the bottom? Thinking of going with a Fury X.

 

[Aibohphobia]

Is it possible to use the ATX configuration with a 240mm AIO in the front and a 120mm AIO in the bottom? Thinking of going with a Fury X.

Assuming the 240mm AIO's block/tubing clear the PSU, yes that should work.

 

[Bense]

Hey Aibohphobia, not sure if this would be of use to you, but it looks like we finally have a way to extend the fast M.2 slot to another area. May be useful for your build if you were interested in running a fast PCIe 3.0 x4 device.

You can see see some of the pictures in my thread here. I'm not 100% certain this will work though.
MicroATX X99 Mini Workstation Build, riser cards galore

 

[Aibohphobia]

Oh nice, I have a case mod idea that could maybe use that. I'm using the ASUS X99-M WS right now though so can't do much with its M.2 slot.