[Kepler/GTX 680] Info's in... $400-450? + benches + thermals (56k warning)

That bench is obviously flawed and pointless to discuss. The ones that line up right are 3dmark extreme, performance, batman, and unigine. You get the idea.

680 enjoys the same 20-25% over the 7970 that the 7970 enjoys over the 580.

Then you get game specific where "7900 owns nvidia in metro" and Nvidia whoops 7900's in BF3 w/MSAA.
 
If NVIDIA has half a brain they will not go higher than $399 on the price of this new card.


If I ran the show at NVIDIA I would release this card at $329.99 and watch my sales blast past AMD and then watch AMD have a melt down and enjoy the moment while stuffing my pockets full of money and let the praise of the world feel my soul with happiness.
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You are pricing it with no knowledge of the cost of the 28nm process, packaging costs, marketing costs, R&D Costs. This generation is expensive and I believe (unfortuneatly) that Nvidia are AMD are pricing these cards to recoup the high prices of 28nm.
I do not know if they can price these cards much lower (I am sure they could price them 40 to 50 dollars lower max). I would rather that these two companies price these products in a way that they will not go bankrupt. maybe 4 to 5 months from now we will see some slight price drops.
 
jaredpace said:
That bench is obviously flawed and pointless to discuss. The ones that line up right are 3dmark extreme, performance, batman, and unigine. You get the idea.

680 enjoys the same 20-25% over the 7970 that the 7970 enjoys over the 580.

Then you get game specific where "7900 owns nvidia in metro" and Nvidia whoops 7900's in BF3 w/MSAA.
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What are you saying? The gaming benchmark shows both the 7970 and 680 being equal, so those are fake but the 3dmark 11 numbers are legit?

Why would a publication fake gaming benchmarks and then make legit 3dmark 11 numbers? Also, I don't remember the last time I played a game of 3dmark 11, how is that relevant to real world performance?
 
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i'm very, very curious. If these new nvidia cards do perform the way they advertise it (which is rare) then i might just put my 7970's up for sale and get 2 of those.

can't wait :)
 
{NG}Fidel said:
You are pricing it with no knowledge of the cost of the 28nm process, packaging costs, marketing costs, R&D Costs. This generation is expensive and I believe (unfortuneatly) that Nvidia are AMD are pricing these cards to recoup the high prices of 28nm.
I do not know if they can price these cards much lower (I am sure they could price them 40 to 50 dollars lower max). I would rather that these two companies price these products in a way that they will not go bankrupt. maybe 4 to 5 months from now we will see some slight price drops.
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It's ridiculous to think that in nearly the same amount of time-to-market it took to get Fermi out over GT200 as it took to get Kepler out over Fermi, production, R&D, and material costs doubled. Because that is basically what 28nm based video cards are approaching in cost per mm^2. 20-30% in overall cost increase per mm^2 is more in line with reality. AMD and Nvidia both are going to have enormous margins on $550 video cards with 350 and 300mm^2 GPU's. What they won't have, though, are large sales volumes.
 
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All AMD needs to do,is a refresh and they will kick nividias butt again. :p
AMD video cards back then had no competition.
It was normal that nvidia would tweak to match AMDs performance or even be better.
Hence the much higher mem clocks and core clock from nvidia cards.
Both cards are very good.you can just overclock the 7970 very easy,no sweat.
Lets see how much headroom the nvidia card haves.
 
Screw this mess. When are the real reviews?

I need a card ASAP since mine can't keep up.
 
So does this mean we can expect the paper launch very very soon? I hope so. Or maybe they'll skip the paper launch
 
xoleras said:
1. You cannot override or enhance MSAA in the driver for DX10/11 apps.
2. Using override AA in a game with native AA is a poor benchmarking methodology, because override AA is substantially unoptimized. Further, using override AA in a game that has *native* AA? Please, that is just stupid. Especially for a game with as many IQ options as bf3.
3. Anyone using override/enhance AA for bf3 needs to have their head examined. It is highly unlikely any review site would do such a thing.

So that leaves the conclusion:

1. The website is lying / review is fake
2. It is a typo

Lastly, if you want to champion this benchmark - it is like 1 fps faster than a stock 7970. Is that something you REALLY want to brag about?
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1. Im pretty sure they do work in dx10/11
2./3. Youre replying to the wrong person. I simply gave you the technical reasons for override not working in most cases. But to answer your question, no one is using override AA for BF3 benchmarking. Its either enhance mode (which AMD doesnt have an equivalent for anyway afaik) or its a typo.
 
Who is this guy that posted this graphs on the net?If this graphs are fake i wan't hardforum to ban him for life if he is a member in here. :D
 
There's a ton of rumors pointing to $550 launch price for GTX 680. TSMC 28nm isn't going well, judging by the way that they've actually had to fully stop production. Charlie said GTX 680 is going to be very hard to find.

Why do you guys think that NV is going to release a faster GPU with limited supply for $100 less? It makes no sense at all. If anything, I'd expect GTX 680 to go for $599 because it's faster. GTX 580 3GB was about 20% slower than 7970 and NV sold it at the same price for like two months. Do you really expect NV to come in as a white night when two months ago they had a 20% slower product for the same price? I realize 1.5GB GTX 580 has dropped in price, but that's not really competing with 7970.

Everyone keeps comparing this to previous releases, but I don't recall other releases having such big problems with TSMC. I know 40nm had problems but it doesn't seem as bad as 28nm.
 
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RealityCrunch said:
Again with the personal attacks. Let's keep things civil.
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Yes, gosh forbid you call anybody out for trolling or thread crapping/spamming as it seems the mods would rather ban the posters trying to stop it than the spamming rumor mongers... :rolleyes:
 
That would be fine, without the fanboy implication. I'm just getting tired of seeing all the "this guy must be a huge fanboy" comments, that then start to turn into flame wars, that then get threads locked :( But alas, have at it :)
 
RealityCrunch said:
That would be fine, without the fanboy implication. I'm just getting tired of seeing all the "this guy must be a huge fanboy" comments, that then start to turn into flame wars, that then get threads locked :( But alas, have at it :)
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Ok, tell us how to go about it without calling someone out and hurting their precious feelings? If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, swims like duck then it's probably a freaking duck, right? Man I can't wait until this darn card is released to stop the fanboy bickering...
 
$400 to $450? I find that to be bullshit...

If it was that price AND out performs the 7970, AMD is really in trouble, and that's a big IF.

But hey, better for the customer and would love to take advantage of the awesome new warranty system from EVGA.
 
RealityCrunch said:
That would be fine, without the fanboy implication. I'm just getting tired of seeing all the "this guy must be a huge fanboy" comments, that then start to turn into flame wars, that then get threads locked :(
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Most of the threads that get locked are full of crap anyways. Do you not remember the PDXLan thread? People were calling people fanboys because one user made a baseless claim that "NVIDIA has something special for you at PDXLan" is the same as "KEPLER IS BEING RELEASED AT PDXLAN!" and there was a 10+ page circlejerk about how it had to be true, and that it would be released at $299.

This thread is no different. The truth is that from these benches, GTX 680 is somewhat faster in TWIMTBP titles and equal in others. And yes, NV is doing this with a smaller die so they technically do have the better architecture, but that isn't the end all say all.

So now we have a big thread about how GTX 680 is 0% to 15% faster than 7970 and that magically means that the company that sold a 20% slower product for the same price as the competition has the "enthusiast's" best intentions at heart and will cannibalize it's own profits on something that is going to be in severely limited supply? And meanwhile you have the usually [H]ighly retarded users throwing fuel on the FUD and fairy tail circlejerk.

But it's fine, we only have a few more days until GTX 680 paper launches at $500+ and then this thread turns into a giant joke. Then it's locked, no posts are made, and it falls out of the database forever and the internet is spared from having to view this horrific wanna-be enthusiast circle jerk ever again.
 
tviceman said:
It's just like hitting the staples "easy" button! Presto! GPU's that have been out for 2 months are now refreshed!
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I'm definitely looking forward to the next couple of months and seeing how the landscape changes. AMD release, nVidia release, AMD refresh, nVidia ?? profit :p
 
fps4ever said:
Yes, gosh forbid you call anybody out for trolling or thread crapping/spamming as it seems the mods would rather ban the posters trying to stop it than the spamming rumor mongers... :rolleyes:
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Let me make something perfectly clear to you, you are not a moderator..its not your job to stop anything.

If you see what you perceive to be a problem, report it, do not respond to it, and do not try to correct it, doing so only causes more problems .
 
Wow... that killed the thread...

Anyways, still can't wait to see the final price and performance tests. Bring it on.
 
Looks great if this is true except for the price. With the type of performance it has, looks like the card will be 500-600 dollars.
 
If it ends up being ~10-15% faster than hd7970 at the same price, in my opinion it will only be a very minor improvement over Tahiti's disappointing price/performance bar. So instead of disappointing, it will be a letdown. A small price difference, even if only $50, would go quite a long ways. A $500 launch would look much better from a price/performance perspective. Especially considering that GTX580's are going for less than $400 before rebates now.
 
SonDa5 said:
If NVIDIA has half a brain they will not go higher than $399 on the price of this new card.


If I ran the show at NVIDIA I would release this card at $329.99 and watch my sales blast past AMD and then watch AMD have a melt down and enjoy the moment while stuffing my pockets full of money and let the praise of the world feel my soul with happiness.
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SonDa5 - I like your thinking. I like it a lot. Part of what I was gonna say later is this is nVIDIA's mid-range Kepler technicallly so...price it like a mid-range card and pull the rug out from under AMD. If nVIDIA keeps this card at even $350 (like the 570) the money will stack for nVIDIA because as the old saying goes: "The more you sell in quantity, the more you make in truckloads of money." At $325-$350 everybody would buy this card. nVIDIA wouldn't be able to keep it on the shelves. My further $.02. Out!
 
SonDa5 said:
If I ran the show at NVIDIA I would release this card at $329.99 and watch my sales blast past AMD and then watch AMD have a melt down and enjoy the moment while stuffing my pockets full of money and let the praise of the world feel my soul with happiness.
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You would also likely go bankrupt when the RMA's start pouring in from people frying their cards and trying to warranty them.

or, you could deny the warranty and go bankrupt when people stop buying your product.

There is a lot more to pricing an item than the initial cost and profit margin . :)
 
I don't see this getting released for less than 500 dollars. With all the production problems that are happening for 28nm there's literally no reason to release it for less than that. They're already going to have supply problems for the first two months most likely, just like the 7970 had, so why would they attempt to sell it for less?

Also, I keep seeing this "it's just their midrange product" but the only roadmap I've seen is this one

http://www.4gamer.net/games/120/G012093/20111124085/TN/005.jpg

And, yes, it shows this as the "midrange" as it is the highest single GPU product they have, as opposed to the eventual x2 that shows up for every generation. In that same regard, wouldn't the 7970 be "midrange" as well? Or is this roadmap just plain wrong or outdated? Unless you're including that GPU that won't be out for another year atleast.
 
Crosshairs said:
You would also likely go bankrupt when the RMA's start pouring in from people frying their cards and trying to warranty them.

or, you could deny the warranty and go bankrupt when people stop buying your product.

There is a lot more to pricing an item than the initial cost and profit margin . :)
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Or...you can get buyer's remorse..like i did twice on launch day (8800 GTS, HD7970 both for $600) and send them back anyway.

$329 for this puppy and it's a keeper.;)
 
heatlesssun said:
Huh? Prices for GPUs and practically all compute hardware are almost always based on overall performance, not VRAM or other factors.
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Yes in most cases. Though Kepler is going to be competing in the very high end where the extra VRAM will come into play.

Maybe I was just hoping for it to be under $500, as a number I told myself I won't spend over :eek:....But I doubt it will cost less. Then I'll wait for a Lightning/non-ref anyways.
 
Even at $500, 50 bucks less than the 7970 and is still faster is quite a feat. Even if they come out with the GTX 670, which if it is faster than the 7950 and 50 bucks cheaper at 400 (instead of 450) would be a great thing as well. It would force AMD to lower prices to continue being competitive.
 
Crosshairs said:

Let me make something perfectly clear to you, you are not a moderator..its not your job to stop anything.

If you see what you perceive to be a problem, report it, do not respond to it, and do not try to correct it, doing so only causes more problems .
Click to expand...

never mind...
 
RareAir23 said:
SonDa5 - I like your thinking. I like it a lot. Part of what I was gonna say later is this is nVIDIA's mid-range Kepler technicallly so...price it like a mid-range card and pull the rug out from under AMD. If nVIDIA keeps this card at even $350 (like the 570) the money will stack for nVIDIA because as the old saying goes: "The more you sell in quantity, the more you make in truckloads of money." At $325-$350 everybody would buy this card. nVIDIA wouldn't be able to keep it on the shelves. My further $.02. Out!
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This is why NVIDIA is pushing their CPU SoC efforts. It's very easy to see every young child and adult in the world own a small mobile computer device. There is alot more money to be made when you have a product that just about everybody could buy.
 
Well how about the GTX 670? That is supposed to be only slightly slower isn't it? That will probably be more reasonably priced, as I'm sure the $500+ card market is pretty small. Perhaps the the 670 will bring 7970ish performance for under $400.
 
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