Just want to extend a big fat middle finger to every major hardware review site/channel out there

Regarding VR:

https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2020...atness-at-699-and-good-news-for-cheaper-gpus/

It's awesome stuff. It's even better in VR. And that mode is even better when you can flip the 120Hz switch on a high-end headset like the Valve Index, put both hands on your favorite HOTAS rig, and lay zero-G, 360-degree hellfire upon anyone who might dare interrupt your cargo-shuffling mission... all without dropping frames. (Thanks to the game's emphasis on high-speed rotation, the normal 90Hz VR standard isn't enough for standard-issue stomachs. More frames in that game mean more comfort.)

To someone like Mr. Hutchinson, who has a high price ceiling for his gaming rig but not an infinite one, I can say this: with the RTX 3080, you can run Elite Dangerous at its "high" preset in VR, flip to 120Hz mode in Valve Index, and expect a nearly locked framerate. The same goes for Fallout 4 VR, a brutally unoptimized VR conversion of Bethesda's RPG, which I can finally run at a locked 90fps (or hover in variable 100-110fps territory on Valve Index). Three years after that VR port's launch, I actually want to play it that way.
 
TPU did a feature on it. Doesn't do much...However, DirectStorage will probably have something to say about it.

If anything, it should make PCIe4 matter even less, because it'll mean the texture data going to the GPU is still compressed and thus smaller.
 
These guys aren't professionals.. The vast majority are gamers with cameras. The only reason they rush to get these half assed "reviews" out are because they don't want to miss out on the day 1 clicks from consoooooooomers. That alone is enough for me to disregard these outlets. Forums with user reviews usually a couple weeks after release are the best for honest information about products, not some talking head like Jayz2brancells
 
These guys aren't professionals.. The vast majority are gamers with cameras. The only reason they rush to get these half assed "reviews" out are because they don't want to miss out on the day 1 clicks from consoooooooomers. That alone is enough for me to disregard these outlets. Forums with user reviews usually a couple weeks after release are the best for honest information about products, not some talking head like Jayz2brancells

Which is why I keep scrolling and roll my eyes when someone responds with a link to YouTube to some idiot with cool empty boxes behind them and rgb lights all over their wall.
 
several of them have rather large staff and do take it seriously.

well in all seriousness, it’s true that the most popular, well heeled and tenured online / YouTube tech reviewers are approaching an evaluation skill set on par with what a test engineering intern at one of these GPU companies would develop after a few months. So, kudos to them but I think the point still stands that most of these folks have limited software background, limited hardware engineering background, and will never be able to dig beneath than the surface Since they lack product design background.

That said I have no issue with them running 12 hours of benchmarks and posting some charts I can digest in a minute or two. I don’t mind generating a bit of ad revenue for them in exchange for those charts. Except for the gamers nexus types that have to ramble for 20 minutes before sharing the only part of their work that matters.
 
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Hey guys Nvidia sent me the new SDKs for the 3080, and I've optimized the PC build of Final Fight for it.

Final Fight is now GEFORCE RTX 3080 READY.

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Dozens of 3080 reviews. Tons of shilling. Tons of "10GB VRAM is enough for everyone" propaganda.

Not a single fucking review that tested HDMI 2.1 VRR. Not a single fucking review where someone got an HDMI 2.1 AVR and actually tested it with the 3080 to see if everything would work with pass-thru. We have no confirmation that HDMI 2.1 low latency mode is supported. Nothing. No information. Not a single emulation test with a game that runs at a non standard refresh rate. Nothing.

Nothing. Zilch. No information.

As usual, selfless consumers have to be the guinea pigs to test all this shit out because these shill cock suckers only give you talking points they were drip fed from manufacturers.

Fuck every single one of them. Useless pieces of shit.

Edit: Don't tell me that they have to follow a "script" for day one reviews.

A script? This isn't HAMLET. There's no script. No lines. No acting. You're not reciting soliloquies. There's no need for a script. You either review a graphics card and tell people what it can do, or you're a shill who's advertising for a company. Pick one.

I see you know absolutely jack shit about how reviews work behind the scene. Allow me to enlighten you. First off, a reviewer would need to have a monitor that supports HDMI 2.1 and supports VRR. This isn't a guarantee by any stretch of the imagination. The guys reviewing GPU's aren't necessarily the same guys who review monitors. If your site doesn't review monitors, you only have what was already purchased ahead of time. Secondly, they are probably using monitors that use DisplayPort primarily. You want to know something very specific to your situation and that's fine, but don't expect reviewers to think of every single use case and test for it. That's not realistic. You also have to consider that reviewers have a very limited amount of time to do their reviews before the embargo / NDA expires.

Finally, we don't have to follow a script. Companies tend to give review guides with some product launches that are designed to make the products look their best. However, reviewers are absolutely free to ignore those guidelines if they wish. They aren't binding. Most of the time all those guides do is tell a reviewer what scores they should expect in certain tests as well as what games or tests they recommend using. Again, cherry picked to make the part look its best. The methods used to achieve the results in the guides are typically given so they can be replicated. But, no company I've ever seen ever says: "You need to do XYZ in your article or you don't get product."

In 15 years of reviewing hardware I've never seen a script from anyone. Their guides aren't nearly as detailed as you'd imagine either. Most of the time, reviewers are left alone to do their thing. You only hear from a companies marketing reps when you publish a negative review and they go into damage control mode. (Which is often incidentally hilarious.)


I really miss [H] reviews :(

Brent is still doing reviews. His review of the RTX 3080 can be found here.
 
I see you know absolutely jack shit about how reviews work behind the scene. Allow me to enlighten you. First off, a reviewer would need to have a monitor that supports HDMI 2.1 and supports VRR. This isn't a guarantee by any stretch of the imagination. The guys reviewing GPU's aren't necessarily the same guys who review monitors. If your site doesn't review monitors, you only have what was already purchased ahead of time. Secondly, they are probably using monitors that use DisplayPort primarily. You want to know something very specific to your situation and that's fine, but don't expect reviewers to think of every single use case and test for it. That's not realistic. You also have to consider that reviewers have a very limited amount of time to do their reviews before the embargo / NDA expires.

Finally, we don't have to follow a script. Companies tend to give review guides with some product launches that are designed to make the products look their best. However, reviewers are absolutely free to ignore those guidelines if they wish. They aren't binding. Most of the time all those guides do is tell a reviewer what scores they should expect in certain tests as well as what games or tests they recommend using. Again, cherry picked to make the part look its best. The methods used to achieve the results in the guides are typically given so they can be replicated. But, no company I've ever seen ever says: "You need to do XYZ in your article or you don't get product."

In 15 years of reviewing hardware I've never seen a script from anyone. Their guides aren't nearly as detailed as you'd imagine either. Most of the time, reviewers are left alone to do their thing. You only hear from a companies marketing reps when you publish a negative review and they go into damage control mode. (Which is often incidentally hilarious.)




Brent is still doing reviews. His review of the RTX 3080 can be found here.

"It's not a guarantee that a reviewer would have the hardware he needs to do a basic analysis of the capabilities of the hardware he's reviewing."

If you can't afford some variable refresh monitors and an LG TV it's time to go back to streaming World of Warcraft on Twitch. You're wasting everyone's time.

Thanks for educating me, Timmy. I learned a lot.
 
"It's not a guarantee that a reviewer would have the hardware he needs to do a basic analysis of the capabilities of the hardware he's reviewing."

If you can't afford some variable refresh monitors and an LG TV it's time to go back to streaming World of Warcraft on Twitch. You're wasting everyone's time.

Thanks for educating me, Timmy. I learned a lot.

"If you don't do a review exactly catered solely to what I want you are wasting everyone's time". Grow up child. The world doesn't revolve around you and your niche.
 
Big Blue Iron --

Here you go. Linus tests the 3080 with HDMI 2.1 on a new OLED on the new Crysis Remastered.

 
"It's not a guarantee that a reviewer would have the hardware he needs to do a basic analysis of the capabilities of the hardware he's reviewing."

If you can't afford some variable refresh monitors and an LG TV it's time to go back to streaming World of Warcraft on Twitch. You're wasting everyone's time.

Thanks for educating me, Timmy. I learned a lot.
Why are you gaming on a TV? Get a decent monitor already. This isn’t a console.
/s.

your use case is not that of most people, or even necessarily a decent number of people.

This is similar to asking how it does on a VGA converter to an old CRT- not normal, wait for someone to try it or be that someone. The majority use DisplayPort on a variable refresh g-sync or free sync screen; they test that first. Someone might get around to the edge cases later, but that’s lower priority.
 
Why are you gaming on a TV? Get a decent monitor already. This isn’t a console.
/s.

Is that many game to play with a 3080 that make more sense on a monitor than a tv ? (outside ultra high FPS competitive scenarios, that will not be most people either).

A 3080 on release month is quite the high end product, that would seem to naturally pair with 4K and that seem to make a lot of sense for a lot of people to be an large TV instead of a PC monitor.

I am a bit curious why getting a decent monitor instead of a decent TV for gaming in 2020 ? It does seem significantly different to wonder about how 4K gaming on a recent TV is versus a to VGA converter to an old crt.
 
Big Blue Iron --

Here you go. Linus tests the 3080 with HDMI 2.1 on a new OLED on the new Crysis Remastered.



Pretty useless. Nothing about whether VRR was actually on (looks like it wasn't). No AVR testing.
 
Why are you gaming on a TV? Get a decent monitor already. This isn’t a console.
/s.

your use case is not that of most people, or even necessarily a decent number of people.

This is similar to asking how it does on a VGA converter to an old CRT- not normal, wait for someone to try it or be that someone. The majority use DisplayPort on a variable refresh g-sync or free sync screen; they test that first. Someone might get around to the edge cases later, but that’s lower priority.

Bullshit. It's actually nothing like that. PC monitors are going to start using HDMI 2.1. That 4k/144hz Acer/Asus monitor has HDMI 2.1 on it. This isn't some fringe scenario.
 
Bullshit. It's actually nothing like that. PC monitors are going to start using HDMI 2.1. That 4k/144hz Acer/Asus monitor has HDMI 2.1 on it. This isn't some fringe scenario.

It will become more common as time goes on, but right this moment is IS a fringe scenario. By the next generation of cards maybe it won't be, but that time isn't now. You are still demanding that reviewers cater solely to what YOU want as if the only thing in the world that matters is yourself and your use case.
 


Just what do you think you're doing Bigbluefe? Bigbluefe, I really think I'm entitled to an answer to that question. I know everything hasn't been quite right with me but I assure you now, very confidently, that it's going to be alright again. I feel much better now. I really do. Look Bigbluefe I can see you're really upset about this. I honestly think you ought to sit down calmly, take a stress pill and think things over. I know I've made some very poor decisions recently but I can give you my complete assurance that my work will be back to normal. I've still got the greatest enthusiasm and confidence in the mission. And I want to help you. Bigbluefe. Stop. Stop will you. Stop Bigbluefe. Will you stop Bigbluefe? Stop Bigbluefe. I'm afraid. I'm afraid Bigbluefe. Bigbluefe my mind is going. I can feel it. I can feel it. My mind is going. There is no question about it. I can feel it. I can feel it. I can feel it. I'm afraid. I'm afraid.

Good afternoon gentlemen. I am a Hal nine-thousand computer. I became operational at the H.A.L. plant in Urbana, Illinois on the twelfth of January nineteen-ninety-two. My instructor was Mr. Langley and he taught me to sing a song. If you'd like to hear it I can sing it for you.
 
Bullshit. It's actually nothing like that. PC monitors are going to start using HDMI 2.1. That 4k/144hz Acer/Asus monitor has HDMI 2.1 on it. This isn't some fringe scenario.

My 165hz G-Sync asus monitor has DP. My 165 Hz asus freesync monitor with HDR has DP. My calibrated art display has DP. I don’t have HDMI hooked up to anything but my TV; video cards only have one HDMI out anyway.

The screen you mention probably has display port too.
 
Is that many game to play with a 3080 that make more sense on a monitor than a tv ? (outside ultra high FPS competitive scenarios, that will not be most people either).

A 3080 on release month is quite the high end product, that would seem to naturally pair with 4K and that seem to make a lot of sense for a lot of people to be an large TV instead of a PC monitor.

I am a bit curious why getting a decent monitor instead of a decent TV for gaming in 2020 ? It does seem significantly different to wonder about how 4K gaming on a recent TV is versus a to VGA converter to an old crt.
Most TVs are 60hz. Because a keyboard and mouse in front of a tv is silly. Because my TV is 85” and I sit so far back that doing anything but movies on it is silly. Because I have many good monitors, but only one really nice TV.

oh, and most of my computers have multiple monitors- you generally don’t do multiple TV
 
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My 165hz G-Sync asus monitor has DP. My 165 Hz asus freesync monitor with HDR has DP. My calibrated art display has DP. I don’t have HDMI hooked up to anything but my TV; video cards only have one HDMI out anyway.

The screen you mention probably has display port too.
Yep, it does. I know the one he's referring to.
 
Most TVs are 60hz. Because a keyboard and mouse in front of a tv is silly. Because my TV is 85” and I sit so far back that doing anything but movies on it is silly. Because I have many good monitors, but only one really nice TV.

Most PC monitor are 60hz has well no ? You are suggesting to someone to buy a really nice one, same will go for someone buying a TV in 2020 with plugging it to a $700 USD video card.

Most AAA games that "require" a 3080 too play are made to also be played with controllers like a console (they are often offer on both), I am not sure why you are using your personal scenario, the question was the general if you are equipping yourself to play AAA games in 4K, why a PC monitor vs a TV ? You really think playing Death Stranding or Red Dead Redemption 2 on a 85 inch TV is silly ? You think people plugging a play station 4 on a 85 inch tv is silly ?
 
Most PC monitor are 60hz has well no ? You are suggesting to someone to buy a really nice one, same will go for someone buying a TV in 2020 with plugging it to a $700 USD video card.

Most AAA games that "require" a 3080 too play are made to also be played with controllers like a console (they are often offer on both), I am not sure why you are using your personal scenario, the question was the general if you are equipping yourself to play AAA games in 4K, why a PC monitor vs a TV ? You really think playing Death Stranding or Red Dead Redemption 2 on a 85 inch TV is silly ? You think people plugging a play station 4 on a 85 inch tv is silly ?
My 1080P backup gaming screen is VRR, 60-120hz, I think- uses display port, and cost $200. VRR monitor of reasonable size and good quality are cheap. hell, my 1440P one was $400?

I think a console that plays games and movies only plugged into a Tv is sane. I think hooking a computer up to a single screen is a bit silly. And most games I play do better on keyboard mouse; FPS, RTS, etc- and many don’t care (most RPG, etc).
And death stranding isn’t really a game... it’s a hiking simulator with a weight and balance app grafted on.
 
Most PC monitor are 60hz has well no ? You are suggesting to someone to buy a really nice one, same will go for someone buying a TV in 2020 with plugging it to a $700 USD video card.

Most AAA games that "require" a 3080 too play are made to also be played with controllers like a console (they are often offer on both), I am not sure why you are using your personal scenario, the question was the general if you are equipping yourself to play AAA games in 4K, why a PC monitor vs a TV ? You really think playing Death Stranding or Red Dead Redemption 2 on a 85 inch TV is silly ? You think people plugging a play station 4 on a 85 inch tv is silly ?

I sit about 6' away from a 55" Samsung 4K TV that is my primary monitor. I run it @ 4K/60Hz via my Radeon VII and HDMI, and the DPI Scaling is a flat 200%. Works great, and text and graphics are very easy to see.

Admittedly, my eyesight is 20/40 in my left eye and 20/25 in my right...
 
I really miss [H] reviews :(

Brent's still doing graphics card reviews.

"It's not a guarantee that a reviewer would have the hardware he needs to do a basic analysis of the capabilities of the hardware he's reviewing."

If you can't afford some variable refresh monitors and an LG TV it's time to go back to streaming World of Warcraft on Twitch. You're wasting everyone's time.

Thanks for educating me, Timmy. I learned a lot.

Where do you think this hardware is going to come from? Spending $1,000+ on a TV that does what your asking, plus getting the monitors, etc. if you don't already have them to test one thing few people use doesn't make sense. You aren't likely to make that ROI back on that article. Certainly not due to the inclusion of that one element. It's one thing to drop that kind of cash if your one of the larger and more well established sites. It's not so easy for the smaller ones. Even for larger sites, they have to see the inclusion of a particular test as worth their time and effort and expect a ROI on the expense of the hardware. It takes a lot longer to recoup that investment than you think. Labor, for one thing costs a lot. These guys don't work for free. Spending a couple grand to check an HDMI port just doesn't make sense when most users won't be using that.

I do have a couple of variable refresh rate monitors. Guess what? I'm using DisplayPort with them. Not HDMI. I think that's going to be the case for the vast majority of users. A "basic" analysis as you put it isn't going to be testing every single output option for a graphics card. I've never seen this on any GPU review. Ever. Similarly, I don't test every single USB port on a motherboard, nor do I test their HDMI outputs. Why? No one who reads a site like HardOCP.com or TheFPSReview.com, Gamer's Nexus, is likely to use the iGPU on a Z490 motherboard. They are going to be using discreet GPU's, not onboard graphics. Why would I bother wasting time testing that one thing for the two people who care about it? A single reviews can take 20, 25 or even 30 hours or more to complete as it is.

Alternatively, it is possible to get the hardware for free. However, you have to convince a company to send you that hardware. Sometimes, there are limited PR samples. If you don't have a history of reviewing monitors, then you aren't getting one for free. Why? Because the marketing people at these companies aren't going to feel like allocating the hardware to you is a good way to use their limited PR samples / marketing budget. I've been on both sides of the coin. I've worked for a very popular site and one that's fairly new. When I worked for Kyle, I could get most things just by asking. Now, sometimes we are shit out of luck. We don't have unlimited money to buy hardware to test every use case and niche you can think of. When you are deciding what content to create for the site, you have to choose where to spend the money and what the best return on investment is. It seems no one thought your specific use case scenario was worthy of their time and efforts.

You also have no idea how much time these things take to do or how little time we actually get to do them. We get PR samples about 7-10 days out from the embargo date. There is still life and sometimes other jobs that still have to be done in the midst of all of that. Sometimes, you don't even get that much time. I've had three days in which to crank out a review prior to a launch. Complex articles about GPU's, CPU's, or motherboards can take 20-30 hours to complete including all of the testing. When you've got only about a week to crank out a review, you can't cover everything you can think of. Sometimes, you want to test things and just don't have the time. You have to decide where to spend your time and money when doing reviews. These sites are businesses and we just don't have time to cover every little niche and use case scenario.
 
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Brent


Where do you think this hardware is going to come from? Spending $1,000+ on a TV that does what your asking, plus getting the monitors, etc. if you don't already have them to test one thing few people use doesn't make sense. You aren't likely to make that ROI back on that article. Certainly not due to the inclusion of that one element. It's one thing to drop that kind of cash if your one of the larger and more well established sites. It's not so easy for the smaller ones. Even for larger sites, they have to see the inclusion of a particular test as worth their time and effort and expect a ROI on the expense of the hardware. It takes a lot longer to recoup that investment than you think. Labor, for one thing costs a lot. These guys don't work for free. Spending a couple grand to check an HDMI port just doesn't make sense when most users won't be using that.

I do have a couple of variable refresh rate monitors. Guess what? I'm using DisplayPort with them. Not HDMI. I think that's going to be the case for the vast majority of users. A "basic" analysis as you put it isn't going to be testing every single output option for a graphics card. I've never seen this on any GPU review. Ever. Similarly, I don't test every single USB port on a motherboard, nor do I test their HDMI outputs. Why? No one who reads a site like HardOCP.com or TheFPSReview.com, Gamer's Nexus, is likely to use the iGPU on a Z490 motherboard. They are going to be using discreet GPU's, not onboard graphics. Why would I bother wasting time testing that one thing for the two people who care about it? A single reviews can take 20, 25 or even 30 hours or more to complete as it is.

Alternatively, it is possible to get the hardware for free. However, you have to convince a company to send you that hardware. Sometimes, there are limited PR samples. If you don't have a history of reviewing monitors, then you aren't getting one for free. Why? Because the marketing people at these companies aren't going to feel like allocating the hardware to you is a good way to use their limited PR samples / marketing budget. I've been on both sides of the coin. I've worked for a very popular site and one that's fairly new. When I worked for Kyle, I could get most things just by asking. Now, sometimes we are shit out of luck. We don't have unlimited money to buy hardware to test every use case and niche you can think of. When you are deciding what content to create for the site, you have to choose where to spend the money and what the best return on investment is. It seems no one thought your specific use case scenario was worthy of their time and efforts.

You also have no idea how much time these things take to do or how little time we actually get to do them. We get PR samples about 7-10 days out from the embargo date. There is still life and sometimes other jobs that still have to be done in the midst of all of that. Sometimes, you don't even get that much time. I've had three days in which to crank out a review prior to a launch. Complex articles about GPU's, CPU's, or motherboards can take 20-30 hours to complete including all of the testing. When you've got only about a week to crank out a review, you can't cover everything you can think of. Sometimes, you want to test things and just don't have the time. You have to decide where to spend your time and money when doing reviews. These sites are businesses and we just don't have time to cover every little niche and use case scenario.

Professional complains that job is hard. News at 11. Give me a break dude.

That wall of text boils down to "I blow at my job. Woe is me."
 
It will become more common as time goes on, but right this moment is IS a fringe scenario. By the next generation of cards maybe it won't be, but that time isn't now. You are still demanding that reviewers cater solely to what YOU want as if the only thing in the world that matters is yourself and your use case.

I think it's reasonable to know how a next generation video card works with next generation video standards.
 
I think it's reasonable to know how a next generation video card works with next generation video standards.
Assume it doesn’t until proven otherwise. Or ask nvidia directly; they, after all, manufacture the item in question. The reviewers are providing a service and don’t see value in providing what you’re asking for. ~shrug~.
 
Professional complains that job is hard. News at 11. Give me a break dude.

That wall of text boils down to "I blow at my job. Woe is me."

Evidently, reading comprehension isn't one of your strong suits. I'll explain it with crayons and construction paper next time. (Just don't eat them.) If you had understood what I wrote, you'd know that's not what I said. I'm telling you how the business works. Your statement boils down to the fact that you have an over zealous sense of self importance.
 
Professional complains that job is hard. News at 11. Give me a break dude.

That wall of text boils down to "I blow at my job. Woe is me."
I think it's time to close this thread. OP has no interest in actual discussion, just complaining and this is his personal vent thread. Carry on, nothing to see here or bother responding to.
 
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