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UnknownSouljer

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They should have called it the 7800, not 7900.

Makes them look impotent. I know it's just a name....
I would lean harder into the "it's just a name" part.

If there is another card that they want to release, they still have the space to do so and can name it whatever they want.

I think it's more odd that the 3090 and 4090 exist in terms of "name". But they probably figured out that they could make more money by calling it a **90 rather than "Titan".
But people are already complaining about a 4080 costing 1200 but not a 4090 costing 1600....
Eh, I think it has just as much to do with paying more money for the scaling instead of an equal amount with the 2 series and to some extent the 3 series. nVidia more or less took away all the multiplicative gains in terms of cost vs performance that people usually get when moving generationally. That's more or less what the GN video was about.

However, nVidia also needs to move old 3 series stock and THEY want to be the ones making all the money instead of scalpers. I have no doubt that if the 4080 was $800, it would fly off the shelves and be heavily scalped (honestly it's also kind of annoying that the 7900XTX is $1000, we can thank nVidia for artificially moving up the costs). However, then at least they'd be selling cards... sooooo. Whatever, your move nVidia.
 
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kamikazi

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
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Messages
1,470
I would lean harder into the "it's just a name" part.

If there is another card that they want to release, they still have the space to do so and can name it whatever they want.

I think it's more odd that the 3090 and 4090 exist in terms of "name". But they probably figured out that they could make more money by calling it a **90 rather than "Titan".

Eh, I think it has just as much to do with paying more money for the scaling instead of an equal amount with the 2 series and to some extent the 3 series. nVidia more or less took away all the multiplicative gains in terms of cost vs performance that people usually get when moving generationally. That's more or less what the GN video was about.

However, nVidia also needs to move old 3 series stock and THEY want to be the ones making all the money instead of scalpers. I have no doubt that if the 3080 was $800, it would fly off the shelves and be heavily scalped (honestly it's also kind of annoying that the 7900XTX is $1000, we can thank nVidia for artificially moving up the costs). However, then at least they'd be selling cards... sooooo. Whatever, your move nVidia.
I assume you mean 4080 would fly off the shelves at $800.
 

Lakados

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I think it's more odd that the 3090 and 4090 exist in terms of "name". But they probably figured out that they could make more money by calling it a **90 rather than "Titan".
Yes but not for the reasons you think, Education and parts of the Enterprise market were able to purchase the Titans make minor tweaks, and essentially end up with one of their Quadros with little effort and half the price. By dropping the Titan branding and slapping them with RGB Bling and names like Xtreme OMG Orgy Edition it guaranteed the 3090s wouldn't get past Auditing it looks too suspicious. When the IT department (many who are gamers) starts buying gaming parts it lights up red flags then Management and Accounting have to get involved and then paperwork appears, nobody comes out of that situation looking good so you just don't do it. So instead of buying the x090 parts, we have to buy the RTX workstation cards at much higher pricing.
 

KazeoHin

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Yes but not for the reasons you think, Education and parts of the Enterprise market were able to purchase the Titans make minor tweaks, and essentially end up with one of their Quadros with little effort and half the price. By dropping the Titan branding and slapping them with RGB Bling and names like Xtreme OMG Orgy Edition it guaranteed the 3090s wouldn't get past Auditing it looks too suspicious. When the IT department (many who are gamers) starts buying gaming parts it lights up red flags then Management and Accounting have to get involved and then paperwork appears, nobody comes out of that situation looking good so you just don't do it. So instead of buying the x090 parts, we have to buy the RTX workstation cards at much higher pricing.
Which goes to show you how much a name can influence public perception of a product.

By naming this not just the 7900, not just the 7900 XT, but the fucking 7900XTX they are basically saying "this is the best we can do"

And it looses HARD against the best that Nvidia can do. Once again, AMD is the 'wheat circles' to Nvidia's 'Cheerios'

Radeon is never going to pull its weight uess they can make their brand sexy. This is not a sexy product. It's a product that unsexy people buy to save money because they don't want to spend the money sexy people do.

Thats of course hyperbole and exaggeration, but you get the idea. You WANT to buy Nvidia, you HAVE to buy Radeon.
 

Marees

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Which goes to show you how much a name can influence public perception of a product.

By naming this not just the 7900, not just the 7900 XT, but the fucking 7900XTX they are basically saying "this is the best we can do"

Rumor was that AMD targetted higher clocks for the 7900 XT & XTX but due to a hardware design bug they had to scale back their ambitions.

Probably in another 6 to 9 months, you can expect a new revision (7950 ??) in time for a 4090 ti maybe
 

UnknownSouljer

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Part of my point that was overlooked, and was that if AMD wanted to make another part above the 7900xtx they could. They could make their own "Titan". They could name it the 7999XTX ULTRA XTREME nVIDIA KILLA. This is all perception. So fighting about what something is called is basically the biggest, dumbest, waste of time. (Especially arguing about what we think other people think about when buying a card, which even if we can predict, doesn't matter at all to us. What you buy has ZERO effect on me or anyone else, other than if there is a shortage).

Be pragmatic: buy the card that makes sense for you in the price bracket it’s in. If that's a 4090, fine. But most people ARE NOT buying a 4090. They're buying a 3060 or a 6600. Arguing that there is or there "isn't space" above a 7900XTX is stupid. Either way 99.99% of people aren't buying a $1000 video card. It's the biggest dick measuring contest ever against other nerds.

And it looses HARD against the best that Nvidia can do. Once again, AMD is the 'wheat circles' to Nvidia's 'Cheerios'
Whatever. That doesn't make any difference what-so-ever. Why don't we just start comparing Instinct vs Quadro cards for how little of a difference that makes for most people. How about we start comparing the top 100 super computers and see which computers use which "brands". What a waste of time. Even here on the [H]ard|forum, I doubt more than 5% of people here will have a 4090 (I bet it will still be around 1%).
The difference here with your analogy is that substantively they don't "taste differently" they just cost different amounts. Even before launch I'm pretty certain that a 7900XTX and 4080 will perform roughly the same. And their roughly equal performance doesn't matter when most people will never even see either card.

Edit: typos, not content.
 
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KazeoHin

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Part of my point that was overlooked, and was that if AMD wanted to make another part above the 7900xtx they could. They could make their own "Titan". The could name it the 7999XTX ULTRA XTREME nVIDIA KILLA. This is all perception. So fighting about what something is called is basically the biggest, dumbest, waste of time. (Especially arguing about what we think other people think about when buying a card, which even if we can predict, doesn't matter at all to us. What you buy has ZERO effect on me or anyone else, other than if there is a shortage).

Be pragmatic: buy the card that makes sense for you in the price bracket is in. If that's a 4090, fine. But most people ARE NOT buying a 4090. They're buying a 3060 or a 6600. Arguing that there is or there "isn't space" above a 7900XTX is stupid. Either way 99.99% of people aren't buying a $1000 video card. It's the biggest dick measuring contest ever against other nerds.


Whatever. That doesn't make any difference what-so-ever. Why don't we just start comparing Instinct vs Quadro cards for how littler of a difference that makes for most people. How about we start comparing the top 100 super computers and see which computers use which "brands". What a waste of time. Even here on the [H]ard|forum, I doubt more than 5% of people here will have a 4090 (I bet it will still be around 1%).
The difference here with your analogy is that substantively they don't "taste differently" they just cost different amounts. Even before launch I'm pretty certain that a 7900XTX and 4080 will perform roughly the same. And their roughly equal performance doesn't matter when most people will never even see either card.
It does matter though. I may have a bit better of a view to this, as I'm an IT professional in charge of hardware procurement as well as weekending behind the counter at a brick and mortar computer shop.

Perception MATTERS. Stocks can make or break a company and their value is 100% based on PERCEPTION. When a product is perceived as inferior, it will sell inferiorly.

"it doesn't matter what anyone else buys, just buy what you want"

In a perfect world, sure! But in this world, how well a product sells will influence the investment into that product and its future iterations. And what the market wants will influence what a competitive company will invest in brining to the marlet. In other words, what other people buy has an influence on WHAT YOU CAN BUY. I'm tired of pretending that this is not the case. The only way to break out of this Nvidia dominated market is if AMD manages to pull their pants up and compete well.

AAnd this product does not look like it's going to do that.
 

NightReaver

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AAnd this product does not look like it's going to do that.
And yet I bet it will sell just fine. I'm tired of this mentality that PC consumers have that if a company doesn't compete at the very top, then obviously everything else in their product stack must be shit, too. Maybe consumers should just stop being dumb and gullible.
 

UnknownSouljer

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It does matter though. I may have a bit better of a view to this, as I'm an IT professional in charge of hardware procurement as well as weekending behind the counter at a brick and mortar computer shop.

Perception MATTERS. Stocks can make or break a company and their value is 100% based on PERCEPTION. When a product is perceived as inferior, it will sell inferiorly.
I'll quote Kyle on this: AMD will sell every card they make this generation.
"it doesn't matter what anyone else buys, just buy what you want"

In a perfect world, sure! But in this world, how well a product sells will influence the investment into that product and its future iterations. And what the market wants will influence what a competitive company will invest in brining to the marlet. In other words, what other people buy has an influence on WHAT YOU CAN BUY. I'm tired of pretending that this is not the case. The only way to break out of this Nvidia dominated market is if AMD manages to pull their pants up and compete well.

AAnd this product does not look like it's going to do that.
I give a big *shrug* to all of this. Let's say what other people buy matters 100%. We're talking about the scale of 100,000's if not millions of cards. Whether it matters or not you have zero control. So I guess cry about it? We waste a lot of energy on things that either don't matter or we can't control. No wonder why we're all so unhappy. If you want to complain about it fine. But I won't join you.
Otherwise, it's time to Jeff Bezos it up and buy all the cards you can that you want to see succeed or convince everyone you know to buy the cards you want them to buy like an MLM. Or you know, just not care, focus on the things you actually can control, and have them all sellout anyway like Kyle said.
 
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sc5mu93

Gawd
Joined
Jul 11, 2018
Messages
984
Yes but not for the reasons you think, Education and parts of the Enterprise market were able to purchase the Titans make minor tweaks, and essentially end up with one of their Quadros with little effort and half the price. By dropping the Titan branding and slapping them with RGB Bling and names like Xtreme OMG Orgy Edition it guaranteed the 3090s wouldn't get past Auditing it looks too suspicious. When the IT department (many who are gamers) starts buying gaming parts it lights up red flags then Management and Accounting have to get involved and then paperwork appears, nobody comes out of that situation looking good so you just don't do it. So instead of buying the x090 parts, we have to buy the RTX workstation cards at much higher pricing.
Usually I buy reference cards, but your Xtreme OMG Orgy Edition has me intrigued. I would like to know more..
 

kamikazi

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Joined
Jan 19, 2006
Messages
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Usually I buy reference cards, but your Xtreme OMG Orgy Edition has me intrigued. I would like to know more..
Someone on here once referenced a Belle Dauphine bathwater pink dildo edition. Does that one ring your bell as well?
 
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