JOHN WICK 4 AND MATRIX 4 THREAD (All Keanu)

sc5mu93

Gawd
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I will be really effing annoyed if this whole new matrix is "in Neo's head" or a thing of his own creation.
which would mimic the reveal of Wandavision and how previously and clearly dead characters are back
otherwise, i think it will be good popcorn but not the groundbreaking moment of the first film.
 

WorldExclusive

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I will be really effing annoyed if this whole new matrix is "in Neo's head" or a thing of his own creation.
which would mimic the reveal of Wandavision and how previously and clearly dead characters are back
otherwise, i think it will be good popcorn but not the groundbreaking moment of the first film.
So he's still stuck in the train station? lol
It felt like John Wick is dreaming about the Matrix.
 

Verge

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I can accept Neo not being dead as he was never confirmed dead and just carried away by the Machines at the end of Resurrections...but they really should keep the original Trinity dead...maybe she's a copy or clone
Gotta have easy plot devices to move the story along. How about the fact the machines built a second matrix, yet the old red pill exploit still exists. Couldn't patch that? Neo also looks supremely powerful, shielding bullets and controlling rockets with his mind... why are people shooting at him at all?
 

noko

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From the first movie, follow the white rabbit, the movie theme, each movie took you down further. Trailer does look very good and I look forward taking my wife to the theater while I will be all excited, she will most likely start snoring.
 

WorldExclusive

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I thought I was over the Matrix, but that damn trailer gave me goosebumps!
This Neo seems like the "first" One that initially freed the first of them. But dreaming about it.
Maybe he's purposely going back in time to experience what he didn't remember.
 

noko

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This NEO seems like the "first" One that initially freed the first of them. But dreaming about it.
Maybe he's purposely going back in time to experience what he didn't remember.
Matrix within a Matrix, a web of universes to Control humankind or maybe to give what humans want. Anyways will be very interesting how the story progresses and if there is continuity between the first 3. Trinity may have died (or saved by machines after Neo left or cloned) OR she never died only to the lower level Matrix. Who knows, anyways I love the deep storyline that makes one make up interesting ideas and plots to make it all fit. Now maybe Neo is the true architect of the Matrix, reason for his abilities :D.
 

Colonel Sanders

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I really don't like how Morpheus is just some younger look-alike. Makes it feel like an SNL sketch or something. Either have Laurence Fishburne play Morpheus or don't have Morpheus in it at all.
 

pendragon1

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I really don't like how Morpheus is just some younger look-alike. Makes it feel like an SNL sketch or something. Either have Laurence Fishburne play Morpheus or don't have Morpheus in it at all.
i only saw him in the matrix, so maybe it will still be larry in the real.
 

Archaea

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Excellent Trailer for the new Matrix. I'm definitely down to watch that!

I still remember watching the original Matrix at the theater - such a good movie. The sequels were poor in comparison. I hope they get this right.
 

MavericK

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I can accept Neo not being dead as he was never confirmed dead and just carried away by the Machines at the end of Revolutions...but they really should keep the original Trinity dead...maybe she's a copy or clone
I'm pretty sure they implied heavily in Reloaded that everything was cyclical and Neo had shown up multiple times before, looking the same. Stands to reason the same could be said of Trinity...
 

Colonel Sanders

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I'm pretty sure they implied heavily in Reloaded that everything was cyclical and Neo had shown up multiple times before, looking the same. Stands to reason the same could be said of Trinity...
One thing I noticed watching the trailer a couple of times is that Morpheus seems to be being extracted/running from agents by the blue haired girl. In other words this might be (at least in part) a prequel showing us the origins of Morpheus.
 

pendragon1

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I'm pretty sure they implied heavily in Reloaded that everything was cyclical and Neo had shown up multiple times before, looking the same. Stands to reason the same could be said of Trinity...
i think the creator implied neo was the 7th cycle.
 

pendragon1

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One thing I noticed watching the trailer a couple of times is that Morpheus seems to be being extracted/running from agents by the blue haired girl. In other words this might be (at least in part) a prequel showing us the origins of Morpheus.
thought that too and is possible.

speaking of blue hair, someone complained about it and now i dont see it. the blue is in the matrix, not in the real, so it makes sense...
 

WorldExclusive

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Matrix within a Matrix, a web of universes to Control humankind or maybe to give what humans want. Anyways will be very interesting how the story progresses and if there is continuity between the first 3. Trinity may have died (or saved by machines after Neo left or cloned) OR she never died only to the lower level Matrix. Who knows, anyways I love the deep storyline that makes one make up interesting ideas and plots to make it all fit. Now maybe Neo is the true architect of the Matrix, reason for his abilities :D.
I really like this video:
 

chameleoneel

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Ill be honest, I didnt even know Matrix was doing a 4th.... wtf...

The first matrix was one of the best movies ive ever seen, but each additional Matrix got worse and worse. 2nd one was entertaining and ok I guess, but they lost something from the first one. The 3rd was so far gone it made me sad watching it. I would take a guess the 4th will be the worst one yet? Just a guess...
Amongst several forced moments: If I remember correctly, the second movie has a large plot beat where the story comes to a halt-----as they try to figure out how to give a girl an orgasm from a distance.

I've never seen Revolutions, because Reloaded was so terrible.

I just watched the trailer for the 4th. It doesn't really reveal anything direct, about the plot or personality of the movie (which is good for a trailer). It otherwise looks fine. I will check it out.
 

pendragon1

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Amongst several forced moments: If I remember correctly, the second movie has a large plot beat where the story comes to a halt-----as they try to figure out how to give a girl an orgasm from a distance.
yup. thats part of why i said it seemed oddly sexualized. revolutions is better than reloaded. it drops that and all the oddly placed one liners.
 

GreenLaser

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as long as it doesn't start preaching about vaccine or green energy being post-salvation for humanity it should be OK. The first captured the ether of the virtual world so this one needs to either explore that or introduce some new anomolous twist.
 

DPI

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looks awesome!!...young Morpheus (played by Yahya Abdul-Mateen II) seems perfectly cast!

The Matrix Resurrections– Official Trailer 1

in theaters and HBO Max on December 22...

I'll see it no matter what, but damn if it doesnt come off like CW's The Matrix

1631211202566.png
 

polonyc2

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I'll see it no matter what, but damn if it doesnt come off like CW's The Matrix

I don't get that vibe at all from the trailer...the newcomers Yahya Abdul-Mateen II and Jessica Henwick are around the same age as Keanu Reeves was in the first Matrix movie...
 
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i kinda agree but this is the kinda movie that deserves a YUGE screen and sound. it MIGHT make me leave the house...
My forum handle would be an outright lie and embarrassment if I didn't have that covered.
The Matrix Resurrections yes, John Wick 4 no. Warner is only offering simultaneous HBO Max releases until the end of 2021, and Wick doesn't premiere until May 2022.
well then. 50% phooey. (n)
 

DPI

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I don't get that vibe at all from the trailer...the newcomers Yahya Abdul-Mateen II and Jessica Henwick are around the same age as Keanu Reeves was in the first Matrix movie...
Wasn't a reference to anyone's ages but just the overall look of the production, almost like it's a Hulu original / made for TV type thing.

Doogie Houser and knockoff Morpheus aren't helping either. They should've CGI'd the real Fishburne to look younger.

And jumping off a building holding hands..? Right out of Hawaii Five-O: The Christmas Episode. I mean my god.

1631216091953.png
1631216296102.png
 
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sleepeeg3

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Trailer looks like 99% of new action movies - Michael Bay BS. As expected. Nostalgia cash-in for the millennials.

Please inform your [edit] late millennial/gen Z/alpha [/edit] kids that the majority of the great movies are NOT on Netflix/Amazon Prime/Hulu/Disney+. You are better off watching the originals. They used to have this thing called a "plot", but you have to buy this thing called "physical media."
 
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Colonel Sanders

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Looks like 99% of new action movies - Michael Bay BS. As expected. Nostalgia cash-in for the millennials.

Please inform your millennial kids that the majority of the great movies are NOT on Netflix/Amazon Prime/Hulu/Disney+. You have to buy this thing called "physical media."
i love how you have demonstrated a complete lack of understanding of what the word millennial means. like not even the vaguest notion
 

trasixes

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Back in the days, Dvd was the largest source of revenues and the one piracy destroyed more than box office tickets I think and I imagine still hold up.

Those example are mostly strange one but in the covid world it is a strange time.

That said still strange example to pick up, WW 1984-Widow-Cruise ?

Release
Date
TitleProduction
Budget
Opening
Weekend
Domestic
Box Office
Worldwide
Box Office
Dec 25, 2020Wonder Woman 1984$200,000,000$16,700,000$46,530,051$166,089,247
Jun 2, 2017Wonder Woman$150,000,000$103,251,471$412,563,408$818,058,221


Jul 9, 2021Black Widow$200,000,000$80,366,312$182,735,850$370,082,474
Jul 2, 2019Spider-Man: Far From Home$160,000,000$92,579,212$390,532,085$1,131,113,066
Apr 26, 2019Avengers: Endgame$400,000,000$357,115,007$858,373,000$2,797,800,564
Mar 8, 2019Captain Marvel$175,000,000$153,433,423$426,829,839$1,129,727,38

Wonder woman and Black widow will do less than 20% and less than 35% than what they would probably made in 2019, Shang-Chi an unknown character new entry will potential beat an established one in Black Widow at the box office.

Jungle Cruise is a 200m budget Dwayne Johnson Disney adventure movie that has yet to reach 200m WW at the box office, when the less expensive Tomorrowland did 210m in theater in 2015 it was considered one of the biggest flop on the year.

A Quiet Place 2 is the only theatrical success on that list and that was a theatrical exclusive release (i.e. a strong argument against your point).

Piracy in less rich market than the USA is really big (those market already had very little post theatrical revenues because of it)

Revenue figures are misleading in the pandemic - that's why I chose to use their box office position as a metric. It keeps everything relative to the times we are living in. I also left out whether the movie itself was bad - definitely the case in a couple of those.
 

trasixes

Gawd
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Messages
855
I don't understand how you can read my sentence, and then completely fixate on one part of it. Here is the quote again, heck i'm even gonna put it in bold and red for you.



Black widow, like i said earlier, had such a bad box office disney is getting sued. Quiet place part II... same thing. WW1984 grossed 166 million. The original Wonder Woman did more than that in 3 days!

These examples are, in my opinion, pretty poor.

I didn't fixate on one part of it - I just didn't see any merit in the rest of it.

WW1984 was panned as a horrendously bad follow-up to WW. Nothing to do with piracy, just a good old fashioned piece of crap, but it still hit the #1 spot at the box office upon release.

Black Widow also opened at number one in nearly all markets, and Disney is being sued for violating a contract to release in theaters only. You chose to extrapolate the reasoning to be "because it had such a bad box office" - Johansson might believe that she would've made more for a theater-only release, but that's an opinion.

You seem to ignore they opened at #1 - revenue isn't a valid metric in a pandemic because obviously so many aren't going to theaters. However, in relation to OTHER releases, the box office position and revenue certainly offers no support to your argument.

So from your replies, I can surmise that even if Matrix 4 opens at #1, and generates more revenue than other releases in the same period, it won't be a success. Gotcha.
 

chameleoneel

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Wasn't a reference to anyone's ages but just the overall look of the production, almost like it's a Hulu original / made for TV type thing.

Doogie Houser and knockoff Morpheus aren't helping either. They should've CGI'd the real Fishburne to look younger.

And jumping off a building holding hands..? This is some Hawaii Five-O The Christmas Episode shit.

View attachment 393481 View attachment 393483
It could be that they are expanding/re-defining Morpheus as a program like the Agents, which have multiple instances. And they all look very similar and dress the same. But have different names.
 

LukeTbk

[H]ard|Gawd
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Sep 10, 2020
Messages
1,497
Revenue figures are misleading in the pandemic - that's why I chose to use their box office position as a metric. It keeps everything relative to the times we are living in. I also left out whether the movie itself was bad - definitely the case in a couple of those.

Not sure their box office position can work well here in the sense of how little big movies without a day 1 release there is, but even in that metric:

1Ni Hao, Li Huan Ying
$841,674,419​
$841,674,419​
2F9: The Fast Saga
$710,856,160​
$172,887,160​
$537,969,000​
24.32%​
3Tang Ren Jie Tan An 3
$699,084,069​
$699,084,069​
4Godzilla vs. Kong
$467,826,620​
$100,563,133​
$367,263,487​
21.50%​
5Black Widow
$369,914,758​
$182,735,850​
$187,178,908​
49.40%​
6A Quiet Place: Part II
$269,082,779​
$160,072,261​
$109,010,518​
59.49%​
7Free Guy
$242,449,262​
$95,049,262​
$147,400,000​
39.20%​
8Cruella
$223,602,225​
$86,083,314​
$137,518,911​
38.50%​
9Chinese Doctors
$205,093,514​
$205,093,514​
10The Conjuring: The Devil Made Me Do It
$200,215,079​
$65,565,074​
$134,650,005​
32.75%​
11Jungle Cruise
$193,952,075​
$107,052,075​
$86,900,000​
55.20%​
12Xuan Ya Zhi Shang (悬崖之上)
$185,202,665​
$185,202,665​
13Nou fo
$181,218,702​
$325,806​
$180,892,896​
0.18%​
14The Suicide Squad
$161,238,380​
$54,653,214​
$106,585,166​
33.90%​
15Ci Sha Xiao Shuo Jia
$159,944,397​
$159,944,397​
16Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings
$157,491,884​
$101,291,884​
$56,200,000​
64.32%​
17Space Jam: A New Legacy
$155,117,406​
$70,117,406​
$85,000,000​
45.20%​
18Peter Rabbit 2: The Runaway
$153,130,817​
$40,391,464​
$112,739,353​
26.38%​
19Wo de jie jie
$133,612,234​
$133,612,234​
20Tom and Jerry
$132,557,782​
$46,000,271​
$86,557,511​
34.70%​

Theatrical exclusive like Fast 9, Free Guy and A Quiet Place 2 did much better relative to expectation than the Suicide Squad, Jungle Cruise, Black Widow type of movies with a day and date (and an high quality pirated version day 1), no ?

The smaller Free guy and A quiet place movie beating the giant $200m Dwayne Johnson Jungle Cruise and the $200M sequel of a 760m Suicide Squad hit, a big Marvel entry of an established characther not making has much a F9 without Dwayne Johnson in it.

At least it is hard to say looking at that list that it validate the very counterintuitive notion.

WW1984 was panned as a horrendously bad follow-up to WW. Nothing to do with piracy, just a good old fashioned piece of crap, but it still hit the #1 spot at the box office upon release.

Black Widow also opened at number one in nearly all markets, and Disney is being sued for violating a contract to release in theaters only. You chose to extrapolate the reasoning to be "because it had such a bad box office" - Johansson might believe that she would've made more for a theater-only release, but that's an opinion.

Giant blockbuster IP opening number one does not mean anything anymore, but specially in the bare market they did open in, there was zero competition. Disney contract did not had a theatrical only close, it had a wide theatrical release close, which back in the 2017 days did implied a theater only release without having to write it.
 

DPI

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Joined
Apr 20, 2013
Messages
11,946
To It could be that they are expanding/re-defining Morpheus as a program like the Agents, which have multiple instances. And they all look very similar and dress the same. But have different names.
To quote Steven King: "Story follows Character. Character doesn't follow story". All the juice and the magic is in the characters. And by all impressions, the story here isn't going to be so groundbreaking or mind bending that it will possibly make up for throwing away the built up capital in three movies worth of Fishburne character development. Massive oversight, IMO.
 
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trasixes

Gawd
Joined
Feb 18, 2010
Messages
855
Not sure their box office position can work well here in the sense of how little big movies without a day 1 release there is, but even in that metric:

1Ni Hao, Li Huan Ying
$841,674,419​
$841,674,419​
2F9: The Fast Saga
$710,856,160​
$172,887,160​
$537,969,000​
24.32%​
3Tang Ren Jie Tan An 3
$699,084,069​
$699,084,069​
4Godzilla vs. Kong
$467,826,620​
$100,563,133​
$367,263,487​
21.50%​
5Black Widow
$369,914,758​
$182,735,850​
$187,178,908​
49.40%​
6A Quiet Place: Part II
$269,082,779​
$160,072,261​
$109,010,518​
59.49%​
7Free Guy
$242,449,262​
$95,049,262​
$147,400,000​
39.20%​
8Cruella
$223,602,225​
$86,083,314​
$137,518,911​
38.50%​
9Chinese Doctors
$205,093,514​
$205,093,514​
10The Conjuring: The Devil Made Me Do It
$200,215,079​
$65,565,074​
$134,650,005​
32.75%​
11Jungle Cruise
$193,952,075​
$107,052,075​
$86,900,000​
55.20%​
12Xuan Ya Zhi Shang (悬崖之上)
$185,202,665​
$185,202,665​
13Nou fo
$181,218,702​
$325,806​
$180,892,896​
0.18%​
14The Suicide Squad
$161,238,380​
$54,653,214​
$106,585,166​
33.90%​
15Ci Sha Xiao Shuo Jia
$159,944,397​
$159,944,397​
16Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings
$157,491,884​
$101,291,884​
$56,200,000​
64.32%​
17Space Jam: A New Legacy
$155,117,406​
$70,117,406​
$85,000,000​
45.20%​
18Peter Rabbit 2: The Runaway
$153,130,817​
$40,391,464​
$112,739,353​
26.38%​
19Wo de jie jie
$133,612,234​
$133,612,234​
20Tom and Jerry
$132,557,782​
$46,000,271​
$86,557,511​
34.70%​

Theatrical exclusive like Fast 9, Free Guy and A Quiet Place 2 did much better relative to expectation than the Suicide Squad, Jungle Cruise, Black Widow type of movies with a day and date (and an high quality pirated version day 1), no ?

The smaller Free guy and A quiet place movie beating the giant $200m Dwayne Johnson Jungle Cruise and the $200M sequel of a 760m Suicide Squad hit, a big Marvel entry of an established characther not making has much a F9 without Dwayne Johnson in it.

At least it is hard to say looking at that list that it validate the very counterintuitive notion.



Giant blockbuster IP opening number one does not mean anything anymore, but specially in the bare market they did open in, there was zero competition. Disney contract did not had a theatrical only close, it had a wide theatrical release close, which back in the 2017 days did implied a theater only release without having to write it.

My comments are in regard to whether or not piracy kills the box office revenue - not arguing whether streaming has a negative effect. There was an early pirated release of FF9, for example, and it did very well.
 

LukeTbk

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Sep 10, 2020
Messages
1,497
My comments are in regard to whether or not piracy kills the box office revenue - not arguing whether streaming has a negative effect. There was an early pirated release of FF9, for example, and it did very well.
That sound like a strawman, what would kill mean here, going near 0 ? The debate is how large the negative effect is, not if it kill them.

Study have long shown that the quality of the piracy content (HD and so on) is quite important to how much it hurt, and it was always reducing non box office part of the revenues I think.
 

Youn

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jan 22, 2007
Messages
5,828
I only liked the first half of the trailer... makes sense, as I only really liked the first half of the original movie... once they start going all crazy with "it's all a program, but you hackz itz, neat" and start jumping around like monkeys I'm kinda out. Just feels like another mindless Michael Bay or pretentious Chris Nolan movie at that point, nothing mysterious or thought-provoking at all, just flash and "do you like me" vibes from whoever is making the movie
 
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