Is Paying For Antivirus A Waste Of Money?

nvgrim said:
This plus common sense is all you need. Seriously there is no reason why anyone should get a virus unless there was some zero-day vulnerability that nothing could stop. And reformatting every few months like that first guy is plain retarded, wtf do you look at on you computer? I haven't reformatted in like almost 2 years and still virus/malware free.
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You do realize that a lot of viruses and spyware are silent (harvesters and zombie machines)? And you do realize that even the best anti virus engines out there are like <90% effective at catching most virus payloads when tested by professional companies.

I don't reformat my big machine either. But my son uses it for school and youtube on a limited privilege account. And I don't surf with it.
 
DigitalGriffin said:
You do realize that a lot of viruses and spyware are silent (harvesters and zombie machines)? And you do realize that even the best anti virus engines out there are like <90% effective at catching most virus payloads when tested by professional companies.

I don't reformat my big machine either. But my son uses it for school and youtube on a limited privilege account. And I don't surf with it.
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Anyone can spot 99% of malicious payloads by monitoring processes and threads. The other 1% are so rare you'd need to be specifically targeted and in that case reformatting probably wouldn't help anyways.
 
Scizyr said:
Anyone can spot 99% of malicious payloads by monitoring processes and threads. The other 1% are so rare you'd need to be specifically targeted and in that case reformatting probably wouldn't help anyways.
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But then you're spending a lot of time not actually USING your computer.
 
Modred189 said:
But then you're spending a lot of time not actually USING your computer.
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Looking at processes and threads to find anomalies shouldn't take more than 10 minutes, unless you find something suspicious and need to research it.
 
So I tried to buy AV software but they all come bundled with additional shit I dont need. Like firewall etc. Every single one of those additional firewalls was a total POS. I always had to manually assign ports (vs the game installer poking a hole in the Windows firewall) and that became a hassle. Some like BitDefender could never let games from EA work. I gave up on them. I have MSDN and if the OS goes wonky. I reinstall the bitch.
 
polonyc2 said:
a reformat usually takes around 12 hours so it's not too big of a deal not having a machine for that long...I reformat not just to keep my machine clean of virus/spyware etc but also to just clear of it any junk from programs installed or games I don't play anymore etc
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I re-image with Clonezilla. Cuts down on time by.. A LOT!
 
polonyc2 said:
a fresh system is still better then a system that has been running for years without a reformat...1998 or 2016
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Only if you mess it up in the first place. I've doing some benchmark on this i stopped doing regular reformat ( reimage).
but ive seen plenty of machines where is true from less tech savy customers. horrible how ppl get old printer drivers/systray tools around etc etc
 
Used McAfee for a long time back in the day. Started becoming a resource hog so I switched to Norton. Same thing happened there so I switched to ZoneAlarm. I was happy with ZA until they started adding "features" trying to do more and more stuff. Finally got tired of the bloatware about 9 months after renewing a 2 year subscription. Now I just depend on my router and run MSE and a hosts file manager.
 
I've never paid for AV and even discarded free subscriptions for Kaspersky, symantec and Mcaffee.

Its been decades since I got a virus on my PC probably since windows 98.

Windows Defender is more than enough for my needs.

That said I wouldn't recommend any free AV for business PCs. We use Trend Micro at our office and most of our clients use that or Mcaffee
 
Scizyr said:
Anyone can spot 99% of malicious payloads by monitoring processes and threads. The other 1% are so rare you'd need to be specifically targeted and in that case reformatting probably wouldn't help anyways.
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I need that double face palm graphic...
 
Whach said:
Avast and Comodo Firewall. Best duo I've ever used.
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I can't recommend Comodo enough. If you need a more potent firewall, it should be on the shortlist. I used it at three different colleges where the networks were cesspools, and it did a hell of a job.
 
Kenjiwing said:
What is this 1998?
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Soeaking of, I found a Riva 128 in my office today. Anyone want it?

On topic: I use Kaspersky and paid Malwarebytes just to be safe when I have a brain fart and click on something impatiently. I use that combo for the non technical people I know too - maybe for me it's more of a 'I want to know what they're talking about' when someone in my family calls for support.
 
I only trust commercial antivirus software so I do pay for it now due to Norton not free after rebates anymore. Been using it since the inception back in the DOS days. I do question what is the point all the time but just like insurance, it is there for the just in case and what ifs. It doesn't bog my PC down so I install it and forget about it.

These days, virus detection is not good enough anymore. It is malware detection that is critical. Every PC should have Malwarebytes or typically security suite software installed instead of just antivirus specifically.
 
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Kaspersky and Malwarebytes for many years.
 
It depends. You can pick up a few year multi pc license off kinguin for < $20 and you can usually get better results than free stuff. What is on there varies over time.
 
Semantics said:
Just firewalls on router and os, windows defender, emet and common sense. So many infected computers come form people running questionable software and clicking yes to shit they shouldn't
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This, /Thread.

And yes. It is a waste of money.
 
Krenum said:
This, /Thread.

And yes. It is a waste of money.
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Windows malware defender/security essentials is good enough for a home user IMO. I think there's value in paying for AV in businesses though. I work for a small company and a while back we had no AV on employee computers. A couple times someone managed to infect the file share with crypto locker. There is a large cost when a virus installed by one affects many.

But, I still find it crazy how terrible AV is at detecting new viruses. It's also easy to tweak an existing virus so that it can bypass AV.
 
Okay. I run (and pay for) AVG in addition to using adblockers with some whitelisting.

The last time I had a problem was back in 2011. A rogue ad network on a trusted site drive-by'ed me, nuked my AV and fucked my system up.

I run AV and adblockers, not because I'm terrified of it happening again.

I run it because I want the extra layer of protection in there.

Not BECAUSE I need it, but JUST IN CASE I need it.

And with even a MODERATELY modern multicore computer, the amount of performance loss is just not worth crying over.
 
MRAB54 said:
But, I still find it crazy how terrible AV is at detecting new viruses. It's also easy to tweak an existing virus so that it can bypass AV.
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Why? Stuff like AVs and Anti-Malware packages are entirely REACTIVE security measures.

If they don't have definitions for a specific payload, they simply don't know it's there.

Also, a lot of these things are slipping in due to shoddy security in other parts of the system that an AV simply cannot protect from.

Plus, I defy you to find an AV/AM package that can overcome a determined stupid user.
 
mgulbran said:
I think the longest I've went is maybe 9-12 months since 1998. I don't understand all the get a life, you're wasting time, the assumptions you are diagnosing and fixing nothing, and blah blah garbage people are spewing about your decision. If you enjoy it go for it.
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Not sure what you're doing to a system that you need to reload once a year.

For a Win9*/ME system? Sure. I could see that. Those damn things went bad if you looked at them funny.

But for an NT-based system, Win2K and later? You have to be rather determinedly abusing the shit out of it.

And if you are, you'd likely be better off doing one of two things.

  1. Set up a regular system imaging schedule.
  2. Use virtualization for whatever crazy crap you're doing that's breaking down perfectly good systems in 9-12 months.
  3. BOTH
 
I've always used the free versions of virus scanners up until I happened to see an AVG, 2 year for 3 computers for 20 bucks offer. I grabbed that and now Both my parent's machines and mine are AVG protected.
 
Up until recently (ie this article) Windows Defender etc.. has been better than nothing, but reliably at the bottom of the free AV pile in terms of detection. GIven tests like AV Comparisons, VirusBulletin and the like, a few names routinely rise to the top for overall experience - its typically Kaspersky, ESET/Nod32, Bitdefender, and perhaps Avira. Some raise and fall, or have other issues (Avira detecting well, but the user experience is for crap etc).

Depending on how you browse, I think its worth it to have some layer of security. Now, maybe Windows 10's new Defender has arisen to the point it really "good enough", but comparing it to a lightweight anti-malware platform (with good heuristics, rootkit analysis etc..) will be important to see if it is worth paying for something new. Aside from a "primary" AV, I do see definite benefits in running things like MalwareBytes AntiMalware and other tools which coexist nicely. ClamAV / ClamWin is a nice little FOSS antivirus that is great as a tertiary option, as well (no live protection though, only on demand scanning, but it works great for many Linux appliances/gateways or for scanning Windows drives from Linux). Of course, all of this is bolstered by using Firefox (or at very least Chrome/ium) with proper addons like uBlock Origin, uMatrix or NoScript, Disconnect and others to help close the "window" by which malware ends up on many systems.

For those like myself who occasionally end up playing on the darker side of the web (ie in my youth I tried cracking copy protection for the fun of it and while I was never as efficient as the best of the 'scene', its notable how many executables today from non-scene sources can have some sort of unwanted element bundled secretly within - usually a cryptocurrency miner)., its worthwhile to have a decent anti-malware suite including a "good enough" primary AV. If that means (Windows side) that Windows Defender's engine has come close enough to the top of the heap, that would be great news, but I'd have to see proof of it.

...of course, you could always put your mind at ease and limit your vulnerability to common malware considerably...by using Linux! :)
 
I just use Avast and a lifetime sub to Malwarebytes. Of course, I also don't frequent shady websites. In fact, I'm pretty limited in the websites I even go to almost to the point of being boring hah.
 
Just found a bitcoin miner hiding in my appdata's deluge folder, Avast didn't detect it, MalwareBytes didn't detect it, hell the only thing that gave me a clue was the fact the video card fan was running hard and then I noticed my GPU monitor was pushing major usage.
 
No anti-virus/etc on mine, just a decent router, windows built-in firewall, a very locked down browser for random browsing, and a VM if I'm feeling paranoid.

also:
Original Install Date: 22/9/2012, 2:30:37 AM
Windows 7 SP1 x64

I do an occasional cleanup of old drivers/registry/etc
Boot time is under 30s; though that's mostly thanks to the Samsung 950 Pro, and ramdisk with startup programs.
 
polonyc2 said:
a reformat usually takes around 12 hours so it's not too big of a deal not having a machine for that long...I reformat not just to keep my machine clean of virus/spyware etc but also to just clear of it any junk from programs installed or games I don't play anymore etc
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Is that a typo? Your reformat takes you 12 hours? I can nuke basically any one of my "non-server" machines and have them back-up and running with all drivers, applications I use and files needed in like 1.5-2 hours? What on earth could you possibly be doing where it takes that long? Hell I just installed Win10 off of a flash drive the other day onto a new SSD and it took like 15 minutes from boot to desktop.

I'll admit having all of my important data on networked storage helps but still even if I had to restore it all it would only take another hour or so.....
 
I think it's always good to have an anti virus as a second layer defense, even if you always practice safe measures, common sense etc. None of them are 100% perfect, so it's always good to have multiple measures.

Malwares today are very damaging with stuff like ransomware, I'd rather pay for additional protection than to risk getting hit by one.
 
It depends.
A good paid for AV can be invaluable to the right person.

Most enthusiasts know how to avoid the malware pitfalls when browsing on the web, and even if they do snag a virus they know how to recover fairly quickly.

Then you have people like my father, who's real computer knowledge ended somewhere around windows 95, runs a small business via web and teaches on the side, and my mother works for another company from home all online. They can't afford downtime or me re-installing windows, all their apps, and getting a machine back to running order. I can't afford to constantly monitor their activities as I have a life too.
My father constantly catches virii from the college email system, most of it from idiot students. Always some horrific worm. I've got them using a NAS using RAID 1, both their boxes are set to image once a week, I burn shit onto blu-ray, and they are on paid AV subscriptions and paid Malwarebytes. I catch 99/100 of the bullshit they encounter, even though they are fairly tech savvy and keep constant backups.

Paid AV has made the difference between catching the bug before it spreads on a couple occasions. Even that 1 hour of wasted time as I reload last week's image from the NAS has been prevented on 2 separate occasions when Free AV didn't have the virus definitions yet. Granted, this was back a 3-4 years ago when Avast, MSE, Avira, and a few others were the rage, but I have decided to stick with this plan because an AV subscription is cheap compared to how little time I have left to spend with my family.

That means I get an extra hour of enjoying fine whiskey with my father and enjoying a college football game instead of everyone angry at eachother for computer downtime. My father is 65 and since he spent most of my childhood doing business trips, YOU BETTER FUCKING BELIEVE ITS MONEY WELL SPENT.
 
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mgulbran said:
I think the longest I've went is maybe 9-12 months since 1998. I don't understand all the get a life, you're wasting time, the assumptions you are diagnosing and fixing nothing, and blah blah garbage people are spewing about your decision. If you enjoy it go for it.
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I used to reformat more frequently but now I've slowed down to maybe twice a year on average...it's not even about fixing anything and more about just having a fresh/new system to play with
 
TheBlueChanell said:
Is that a typo? Your reformat takes you 12 hours? I can nuke basically any one of my "non-server" machines and have them back-up and running with all drivers, applications I use and files needed in like 1.5-2 hours? What on earth could you possibly be doing where it takes that long? Hell I just installed Win10 off of a flash drive the other day onto a new SSD and it took like 15 minutes from boot to desktop.

I'll admit having all of my important data on networked storage helps but still even if I had to restore it all it would only take another hour or so.....
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I don't use image backups...most of the time is spent downloading/installing games, other software and all the Windows Update patches (I have a fast 50/50 connection so speed is not an issue)...I prefer the old fashioned way of re-downloading everything versus images because sometimes Microsoft removes older updates and replaces them or there's a buggy update in there...same with games...I do save certain important drivers, game saves, programs etc but for the most part I always start fresh

no way, no how can anyone reformat their system from scratch with no image backups in 15 minutes to an hour...no way...I've done it tons of times and Windows Update alone takes 2-3 hours (including all the updates combined plus restarts etc)
 
I haven't used any antivirus in years. I don't see the need if you're not a freaking idiot and know what sites to not visit as well as what emails not to open.
 
Haven't paid for AV in over 10 years, used to run all the Norton products. After I realized that was essentially a waste of money and resources, switched between MSE, AVG and a few others until my ISP started offering KIS for free. Been using that for a couple years, no complaints.
 
My opinion, been building computers since 1996 and working in IT sine 2001 for LEVEL3 Communications. Yes, for personal use a Virus scanner is a waste of money plus a resource hog if you know how to protect your system. I have never used a virus scanner and I goes as far as disabling Windows defender on my computer.. Now for the rest of the population and corporate YES they need it :D
 
For years I've just kept a lookout for "free for X months" offers, but not less than 6 months. Other than that I've been loading Qihoo 360 TS on my families PCs and enabling the Bitdefender & Avira engine options.
 
I haven't used an AV for years. They're annoying and slow down the computer. I find it's a much better approach to dedicate the windows machine solely for games and those I get mainly through Steam. I'm surfing the web using either linux or OSX and I always have scriptblock and adblock running.
 
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