Is 290 better than GTX 780?

specops said:
On average, that makes the overclocked 780 2.7% faster than the overclocked 290X. At 1600p. With just a 78MHz core clock advantage. At 1440p the difference is a bit bigger and at 1080p more substantially so. Maybe some of you guys should refresh your view on on the GK110 vs Hawaii situation, saying things like "the vanilla 290 is clearly faster than the 780"...
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In my testing, the 290 is slower, and the 290x is more competitive, but also pricier, and with the driver situation, no thanks.

The 290 is definitely slower than a 780 though. The 290x is much closer, if you find a decently-cool running one with VRMs that don't glow red. ;)
 
Not really sure what' you're referring to, neither my 290 or 290xs have glowing red VRMs :) or VRMs that run hot. My 290 with an Accelero E3 has VRMs at 80 with mining and low 60s with gaming. I'd say that is a pretty good number.

Now as to the pissing match.

Right now I'd say the 290 is a better buy since you can find them for about $350 used. even new they are a good bit cheaper.

if they were both at the same price, I'd probably take the 780 due to the quietness factor, I could run the 780 with stock heatsink in my HTPC where as the 290 is a bit more annoying to my ears(for reference design).

So, is it a better card? No, is it worse? No. It really is up to you since they are so close. It's just the price and sound that differentiates them IMO(unless you like PhysX), though the game recording feature is cool too on NV.
 
Re: firestrike:

There are no R9 290(x or no) in the top 10 (for xfire/sli). Rangerjr's score is the highest of any AMD product and there is a 870(not ti) almost 1k points higher.

There are only 3 AMD cards in the whole top 100. There are 6 780s. Again this is xfire/sli. Given that AMD has the better marketshare, this shows that in this config and test, the 780 is more consistently fast.

I think rangerjr is probably:

1. a pretty solid overclocker
2. a guy who won the silicon lottery

http://www.3dmark.com/hall-of-fame-2/fire+strike+3dmark+score+performance+preset/version+1.1/2+gpu

In 1 gpu setups, the 290 actually looks somewhat better, with 4 cards getting high marks, but still 1000 points off the fastest 780.

http://www.3dmark.com/hall-of-fame-2/fire+strike+3dmark+score+performance+preset/version+1.1/1+gpu

Edit: i don't think i made a counting error, but i counted by hand...so SORRY if i miscounted :)
 
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Digital Viper-X- said:
Right now I'd say the 290 is a better buy since you can find them for about $350 used. even new they are a good bit cheaper.

if they were both at the same price, I'd probably take the 780 due to the quietness factor, I could run the 780 with stock heatsink in my HTPC where as the 290 is a bit more annoying to my ears(for reference design).

So, is it a better card? No, is it worse? No. It really is up to you since they are so close. It's just the price and sound that differentiates them IMO(unless you like PhysX), though the game recording feature is cool too on NV.
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I had to go back and check the first post and he only asked about raw power.
I think in terms of straight performance (with overclocking) the 780 is without a doubt the winner.

Price notwithstanding.

Given that AMD has the better marketshare
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You lost me here.
I would say 3 290's vs 6 780's is a huge win for AMD given how many more 780's are in gaming rigs than 290's.

780 has been out 6 months longer, and most of the 6 months of the 290's current existance has been spent at $600+ and inside mining rigs.
28,000 290 results.
97,000 780 results.
 
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TaintedSquirrel said:
You lost me here.
I would say 3 290's vs 6 780's is a huge win for AMD given how many more 780's are in gaming rigs than 290's.

780 has been out 6 months longer, and most of the 6 months of the 290's current existance has been spent at $600+ and inside mining rigs.
28,000 290 results.
97,000 780 results.
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Fair point, i guess. The "market analysis" suggests that AMD has more GPU marketshare about ~3%.

To me, this suggests that there are more AMD cards out there, but fewer of them are high scorers in 3dMark.

I do realize that mining setups are not going to end up in 3dmark...
 
cubsfan-budman said:
Re: firestrike:

There are no R9 290(x or no) in the top 10 (for xfire/sli). Rangerjr's score is the highest of any AMD product and there is a 870(not ti) almost 1k points higher.

There are only 3 AMD cards in the whole top 100. There are 6 780s. Again this is xfire/sli. Given that AMD has the better marketshare, this shows that in this config and test, the 780 is more consistently fast.

I think rangerjr is probably:

1. a pretty solid overclocker
2. a guy who won the silicon lottery

http://www.3dmark.com/hall-of-fame-2/fire+strike+3dmark+score+performance+preset/version+1.1/2+gpu

In 1 gpu setups, the 290 actually looks somewhat better, with 4 cards getting high marks, but still 1000 points off the fastest 780.

http://www.3dmark.com/hall-of-fame-2/fire+strike+3dmark+score+performance+preset/version+1.1/1+gpu

Edit: i don't think i made a counting error, but i counted by hand...so SORRY if i miscounted :)
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That non Ti score is cooled by LN2, mine where on water.
 
Digital Viper-X- said:
Not really sure what' you're referring to, neither my 290 or 290xs have glowing red VRMs :) or VRMs that run hot. My 290 with an Accelero E3 has VRMs at 80 with mining and low 60s with gaming. I'd say that is a pretty good number.
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I had an XFX 290x DD and VRM1 ran at about 104 degrees C after 15 minutes in BF4.

I also tried an MSI 290 Gaming and the VRM1 was fine but the GPU itself peaked out at 85 degrees C under stress.
 
Brent_Justice said:
I wouldn't have believed it unless I tested it myself, 780 really is > 290 now. I don't think it started off that way, but it sure has ended up that way.
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Considering the clocks on that Pny 780, I'm not too surprised. LOL.
 
Brent_Justice said:
I wouldn't have believed it unless I tested it myself, 780 really is > 290 now. I don't think it started off that way, but it sure has ended up that way.
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I don't think that's completely fair, you tested a non-reference heatsink loaded 780 vs a Reference 290.

Does the 290 not throttle on the factory heatsink?

IMO something more like this would make sense(Both OC'd cards, non-reference cooling)

http://www.amazon.com/NVIDIA-GeForc...qid=1399324346&sr=1-16&keywords=Nvidia+GTX780

http://www.amazon.com/Gigabyte-GDDR...TF8&qid=1399324301&sr=8-4&keywords=AMD+R9+290

Just my opinion :)

Starrbuck said:
I had an XFX 290x DD and VRM1 ran at about 104 degrees C after 15 minutes in BF4.

I also tried an MSI 290 Gaming and the VRM1 was fine but the GPU itself peaked out at 85 degrees C under stress.
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What kind of stress for the 290 gaming(not that I like that card, but I doubt it was gaming "Stress") and XFX is known to have the worst VRM cooling known to man, not really AMDs fault (or specifically the 290s)
 
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for what it is worth my R9-290 never throttled at its default settings.

It was even the XFX Black Edition which ran at higher clocks (980mhz core).

They don't really throttle unless you have a poor ventilated case,or high ambient temperature. The noise? what noise? I didn't consider it loud or annoying. Was just a gentle noise of air moving. Hell of alot quieter than my reference 7950.
 
It's interesting the metrics you see used for comparing cards when one can't win on pure performance. :D

Bottom line is the 290 is as fast or faster (it's certainly not slower), has 4gig vs. 3gig of VRAM, and is cheaper (in most places, there are always exceptions I guess.). As far as noise and temp there are plenty of custom cooled cards that are still cheaper than a reference 780. I wouldn't recommend a reference card from either camp except under circumstances where needing to exhaust the heat out of the case outweighs all other considerations.
 
There is no contest amd just wins.2 for the price of 1.Can not be beat ever.

You can actually buy 2 R9 290x for the same price of one 780TI.
My cheapest 780TI non reference card I bought against my most expensive non-reference 290X card I bought.


Gigabyte GV-R929XOC-4GD-R9 290X - 408 Canadian or 372 US

image hoster

Zotac 780Ti Amp Edition Feb 14 2014 for 824 Canadian or 743 USA dollars
780ti.jpg
 
Umm, this thread is about the 780, not 780 Ti. We know the 780 Ti is much more expensive. The 780 is only a bit more expensive, so the chatter is around is the 780 worth the price premium over a 290.
 
Starrbuck said:
Umm, this thread is about the 780, not 780 Ti. We know the 780 Ti is much more expensive. The 780 is only a bit more expensive, so the chatter is around is the 780 worth the price premium over a 290.
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If you go for non-reference, the price difference is about $40, so is shadowplay and physx worth $40 to you? that is the question at that point. For me, it's not a bad deal for $40, shadowplay anyway. :)
 
If someone gives you 2 steaks and one is a 3 dollar Sizzler steak and one is a 50 dollar filet mignon, you don't say that the 3 dollar steak is better because its less expensive.

You may buy the 3 dollar steak, but you wish you had the filet.
 
I'd go with R9 290 since it's more future proof when you're ready for multiple GPUs and the greater 4GB VRAM. I know BF4 with less than 4GB VRAM runs into a performance wall when you increase resolution scaling and graphics quality. To be fair a R9 290X ~$540 is more comparable in cost to GTX 780 ~$500.

Here's a good performance comparison of multiple GPUs. Fyi, it doesn't factor in Mantle which offers even better performance.

http://udteam.tistory.com/585
 
cubsfan-budman said:
If someone gives you 2 steaks and one is a 3 dollar Sizzler steak and one is a 50 dollar filet mignon, you don't say that the 3 dollar steak is better because its less expensive.

You may buy the 3 dollar steak, but you wish you had the filet.
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Worst analogy ever.

More like, if someone gave you two steaks, one labeled as filet mignon, and the other as a t-bone, to you they both taste the same, but one is 10% cheaper, which one would you go for?

You get no improvement in gameplay settings going from a 290 to a 780, you might get 3-4fps, but that won't let you increase any settings and still get the same game play. so the $40 gets you some NV only features, and AMD gets you some AMD only features.
(I'm referring to the PNY XLR8 780 in the [H] Review, not a reference 780)
 
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Digital Viper-X- said:
Worst analogy ever.

More like, if someone gave you two steaks, one labeled as filet mignon, and the other as a t-bone, to you they both taste the same, but one is 10% cheaper, which one would you go for?

You get no improvement in gameplay settings going from a 290 to a 780, you might get 3-4fps, but that won't let you increase any settings and still get the same game play. so the $40 gets you some NV only features, and AMD gets you some AMD only features.
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The fanboys managed to turn you over to actually believe a 780 is faster? Jesus christ this forum...
 
Rangerjr1 said:
The fanboys managed to turn you over to actually believe a 780 is faster? Jesus christ this forum...
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This 780 is a bit faster, read the review. But we are comparing a non-reference 780 with a factory OC to a reference 290 with no OC. considering how close they are normally, I'd expect the 780 to be a bit faster, and it's under MSRP to boot. I wouldn't personally go for the XLR8, I'd probably go with an EVGA card if I was going for NV($40 cheaper).
 
Digital Viper-X- said:
Worst analogy ever.

More like, if someone gave you two steaks, one labeled as filet mignon, and the other as a t-bone, to you they both taste the same, but one is 10% cheaper, which one would you go for?

You get no improvement in gameplay settings going from a 290 to a 780, you might get 3-4fps, but that won't let you increase any settings and still get the same game play. so the $40 gets you some NV only features, and AMD gets you some AMD only features.
(I'm referring to the PNY XLR8 780 in the [H] Review, not a reference 780)
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My statement was a bit trollish, but my point was a bit different than you gathered. My point is that something isn't usually considered "better" just because its cheaper, unless all other things are equal.
 
The 780 is faster at max OC
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at what point did we start to use overclocking as an argument ?
i expect superior performance out of the box from nvidias price point

like arguing that a 780ti overclocked justifys its high price, if you can buy almost two 290s as an alternative
 
VonGriffin said:
at what point did we start to use overclocking as an argument ?
i expect superior performance out of the box from nvidias price point

like arguing that a 780ti overclocked justifys its high price, if you can buy almost two 290s as an alternative
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at what point did we start to use stock non-reference coolers as an argument?

OC-ability is a feature of the card, right?

where do you begin/end with an apples-to-apples comparison?
 
I thought the 780 was faster than the 290, but that the 290x was faster than the 780, and the 780ti was faster than the 290x?


Stock speeds.
 
The reason OC should be a factor is that every 780 that someone comments on achieves significant OC speeds. These chips OC like a beast. I am not saying everyone of them is golden, I just don't see anyone complain about getting a dud. Now memory OC is more of a gamble. Seen those results all across the board.

Yes I agree we need a head to head shootout of custom cooled cards running no less than 2560x1440. I paid under $500 for my Asus 780 new, so I'm fairly happy. Had the 290s been at the current price, I would be lying if I said I wouldn't consider it.

I will add, that unless thermals are super sensitive, every 780 owner is doing themselves a disservice if they are not OC'ing that chip.
 
Relayer said:
We need [H] to do a review. Custom 290 vs. custom 780 max O/C's. Pick 2 with the best coolers and PCB's and go at it.
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Still wouldn't tell you much. Your playing the silicon lottery. They would have to try a few cards to get a average overclock then compare the cards with speeds set at the average overclock.

spinejam said:
^^^ This! ^^^
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No
Goride said:
I thought the 780 was faster than the 290, but that the 290x was faster than the 780, and the 780ti was faster than the 290x?

Stock speeds.
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290 trades blows with 780, 290x is faster, 780 ti is faster than the 290x At stock speeds and single card setups.
 
ebduncan said:
Still wouldn't tell you much. Your playing the silicon lottery. They would have to try a few cards to get a average overclock then compare the cards with speeds set at the average overclock.
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you could just do this by checking out 3dmark.com.

780 wins.
 
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