IPS Craze - I Don't get it - for Gamers

philstat

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jan 31, 2012
Messages
142
I've personally owned two of the better IPS panels - the Dell U2711 and the HP LP2475w and both were great overall monitors. I also have two Eizos and a 30-inch ACD at work. Though I see so many gamers on here mongering for the next IPS - I honestly just don't get it. IMO, there are several TN panels that are just as good for gaming, and most likely even better. I have two Asus TN monitors and both have been stellar for gaming. I can definitely see the merits of IPS if you need to edit, publish, photography, drafting, engineering - CAD, though for the everyday user, I just don't see it. I feel one of my Asus displays, the VE258Q is better for overall gaming than either of the two IPS displays I personally owned. Much clearer, no need for coarse AG, great colors, not overly saturated, though not muted by an overly applied AG, blacks are tremendously better and the response time is exceptional.

I'm not overly knocking IPS, though on this forum, they seem to be greatly hyped to the point of nirvana, LOL. To each his own, though you don't have to break the bank to get a nice looking display. I also own an Asus VG236HE, and in 2D mode, calibrated it looks better than either of my two IPS displays for gaming. I mostly play RTS games - though I have a lot of FPS games as well. I always thought IPS monitors would be better suited for RTS games, just not true, both Asus displays look better than the two IPS's I owned for Starcraft II, AOE-III/Online, Warhammer, C&C3, Red Alert 3 and many others.
 
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Only reason why I opt IPS over TN for gaming is because of TNs vertical gamma shift that makes dark scenes in games look terrible. Seeing a ceiling details or stars fade into darkness as they travel towards the top of the screen is very distracting and it was impossible to not notice it.

Though this may have gotten better. My experience with TNs is from several years ago.
 
Why do people pay for expensive computer parts?
Same reason they pay for expensive car parts, stereo parts, etc. etc.
ITS A HOBBY, and some people are willing to pay for better parts.

Some people want the better color representation while having a monitor that doesn't have a horrendous input lag. Some people do things with their computers other than gaming such as art, photography, video editing, etc., that necessitate the better picture quality. With a very minimal trade off in response time and input lag, a decent IPS monitor is really a jack of all trades.
 
Only reason why I opt IPS over TN for gaming is because of TNs vertical gamma shift that makes dark scenes in games look terrible. Seeing a ceiling details or stars fade into darkness as they travel towards the top of the screen is very distracting and it was impossible to not notice it.

Though this may have gotten better. My experience with TNs is from several years ago.

I notice a tiny bit of shift on my 950D, not remotely as bad as you have described though.
 
Why do people pay for expensive computer parts?
Same reason they pay for expensive car parts, stereo parts, etc. etc.
ITS A HOBBY, and some people are willing to pay for better parts.

Some people want the better color representation while having a monitor that doesn't have a horrendous input lag. Some people do things with their computers other than gaming such as art, photography, video editing, etc., that necessitate the better picture quality. With a very minimal trade off in response time and input lag, a decent IPS monitor is really a jack of all trades.

Your arguments may apply to the IPS vs TN discussion, but are not all that relevant to the OP. He never criticized their price. Price vs performance may be somewhat relevant, but your argument seems to be strictly about price. Also, he makes it clear that he is strictly talking about gaming.

I definitely notice some slight gamma shift on my TN panel, and its quite bad if I'm slouching, but if I'm sitting normally, it's not really that bad.
 
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Only reason why I opt IPS over TN for gaming is because of TNs vertical gamma shift that makes dark scenes in games look terrible. Seeing a ceiling details or stars fade into darkness as they travel towards the top of the screen is very distracting and it was impossible to not notice it.

Though this may have gotten better. My experience with TNs is from several years ago.


So true, its the vertical gamma shift on TNs that make me wanna go IPS for gaming. Dark scenes are definitely marred by tn panels.
 
Your arguments may apply to the IPS vs TN discussion, but are not all that relevant to the OP. He never criticized their price. Price vs performance may be somewhat relevant, but your argument seems to be strictly about price. Also, he makes it clear that he is strictly talking about gaming.

I definitely notice some slight gamma shift on my TN panel, and its quite bad if I'm slouching, but if I'm sitting normally, it's not really that bad.
He did criticize their price...
To each his own, though you don't have to break the bank to get a nice looking display.

And you completely missed the second half of my argument where I state some people use their gaming computers for things other than gaming...
 
I'm not criticizing their price, just saying for the most part it's an unnecessary expense for what's probably not the best option in the first place. I've personally had better gaming experiences with TN panels than IPS.
 
Dunno, different trains of thought, I'd guess. I didn't get an IPS panel outright for gaming, but then again, I don't play any twitch FPS games, either, so the extreme end of response time and refresh rates don't mean much to me. If you think TN looks better, then I dunno. I am sure some people might point out and blame the AG coating on the two IPS panels you've had (well... I know the U2711 does).
 
I got an IPS because I wanted a 30" monitor. That said, all my smaller monitors are IPS too. Doing something as simple as watching a movie is superior not only due to the better color reproduction, but then more than one person can watch off of it as well without experiencing annoying color shift.

I've never found the slower response time to be an issue or anything. I usually am top 5 in a bf3 server so it doesn't have a tangible effect to me at least..

For pricing, it seems to be coming down a lot. Anandtech reviewed a $200 23" IPS LED from AOC (http://www.anandtech.com/show/5469/aoc-i2353ph-ips-for-a-nice-low-price). While it obviously isn't as good as like a u2711, they said it was still a decent IPS and way way better than the TN monitors. Should trickle down to smaller and cheaper displays I imagine as well.
 
Dunno, different trains of thought, I'd guess. I didn't get an IPS panel outright for gaming, but then again, I don't play any twitch FPS games, either, so the extreme end of response time and refresh rates don't mean much to me. If you think TN looks better, then I dunno. I am sure some people might point out and blame the AG coating on the two IPS panels you've had (well... I know the U2711 does).

Good points, definitely the AG on the U2711 is the most extreme I've seen, it's much less noticeable on the HP. I think the black levels on some of the recent LED TN panels make a big difference.
 
I'm not a graphic artist, just a "pro-sumer", but I simply love using my 25.5" NEC LCD2690WUXi for everyday usage and gaming. Very little color shift, consistent backlight (thanks to ColorComp), and pretty accurate colors. I prefer playing games on it even though my other 25.5" H-IPS panel monitor (Planar PX2611w) has slightly faster response times (5ms).

My 1st monitor was a 19" S-PVA panel Planar PX191 back in 2002. I decided to get rid of it back in 2008 and decided to replace it a TN panel Asus VK246H monitor. Yeah, it was cheap @ around $240 after rebates and it had 2ms response time and I don't really use it that often, about 6 hours per month. It's attached to my HTPC which I use to monitor some processes from time to time. However, eventually I developed "buyer's remorse", bad enough I need to deal with a TN panel in a laptop, but after a while I didn't want to deal with it's limitation on a desktop...

Even though I only use that Asus monitor 6 hours a month, I am most likely going to replace it with a P-IPS or H-IPS panel monitor this year. Maybe I'll stoop as low as getting an e-IPS panel monitor.

I hope my NEC lasts me a long time, 'cause I can't seem to find a suitable replacement for it in the event it dies. I've been keeping up with IPS monitors. Hopefully it will last until 2017; it's 10 year anniversary since I bought it.
 
I've cycled through TN, IPS, and PVA I would say PVA is the best. There is basically no color shift, and great view angles. Sure the response time is high, but I don't see it detracting from my games.
 
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For me, a "good" TN panel costs too much, I mean the 950D was a good monitor, but it costs $600, the $450 750D might be good too, and still I found the IQ slightly better on my 2412s, and the contrast / brightness was a little easier on my eyes on the IPS as well.

I guess if you do nothing but gaming a TN should do you fine, but at least get a 120hz one :p
 
I made the compromise myself, 5ms 8-bit IPS @ 75Hz with great contrast - also my FPS never really goes above 75 at 1080p. I still prefer image quality over response time (input lag would be issue but this basically has none). Though, I'm not quite sure about 6-bit IPS panels. The only advantage in that case would be viewing angles - which do make difference even when looked straight. That will always be more or less issue for TN panels.

Games with grey tones looks effin fantastic. Makes gaming easier too because of that. I don't have to look at yellowish/brownish dithered banding mess. Colours are vibrant and it's like there's no more dull filter. I'm not saying that every TN panel look as crap but every TN panel I have seen looks like that when it comes to dark tones.

It's all about making the right compromise for you. It's impossible to say that x is better than y generally.
 
Because I like a good image. I want things to look and sound good, it makes me happy. So I have an expensive display, and speakers.
 
So I've owned multiple IPS, PVA, and TN monitors. I prefer both IPS and PVA for gaming.

On the TN panels that I've owned, playing a game with dark sets was horrible. The blacks were totally crushed to the point that I could not see any details in the shadows. Combine that with a glossy panel and I couldn't see enemies hiding in the dark. Perhaps I just had a bad TN panel, it was a highly recommended one at the time though.

Now I mostly use my computer for graphic design so IPS is a clear choice over TN.

OP, I completely get what you're saying. I'm just stating the above as my personal preference. Some of the TN panels are fun and I can see their use in gaming. It's just not for me. I do think some people take the IPS>TN argument too far around here though.
 
Though I see so many gamers on here mongering for the next IPS - I honestly just don't get it.

Welcome to [H]ardOCP. We are gamers cut from a better quality cloth. If you think that TN dogfood is going to cut it here... well.. no. *kicks back in $1400 desk chair, lights Cuban cigar with $100 bill*

I'm not fussy between a good PVA and IPS really. My current gaming panel is IPS because it was on sale for a really good price. The IPS part was just icing on the cake.
 
TN 120 Hz is way better for gaming than IPS.

Except the viewing angles in large panels would kill it. In the 27" and up market space, it's IPS or bust. Granted we don't have anything that's 120Hz there.
 
So I've owned multiple IPS, PVA, and TN monitors. I prefer both IPS and PVA for gaming.

On the TN panels that I've owned, playing a game with dark sets was horrible. The blacks were totally crushed to the point that I could not see any details in the shadows. Combine that with a glossy panel and I couldn't see enemies hiding in the dark. Perhaps I just had a bad TN panel, it was a highly recommended one at the time though.

Now I mostly use my computer for graphic design so IPS is a clear choice over TN.

OP, I completely get what you're saying. I'm just stating the above as my personal preference. Some of the TN panels are fun and I can see their use in gaming. It's just not for me. I do think some people take the IPS>TN argument too far around here though.
From my experience, they are either crushed or they will looks like there's some kind of posterization effect or the colour accuracy and gamma is beyond horrible (dithering all over the place). Even if my old TN panel was capable of showing the darkest tones (way too clearly, with dithering and yellowish/brown colour) it looked absolutely horrible in practice and because of that picture looked washed out crap all the time.
 
Went from a 30" ZR30w IPS to a 27" S27A750D TN 120hz for gaming. Playing BF3 on Ultra at 100-120 fps is Amazing!
 
1. Color shift/viewing angle drives me nuts. Especially in portrait mode, which I do use fairly often. I notice this more on larger screens. Some TN are worse than others for this, so IPS ensures I don't have the problem.

2. Better color, more likely to be true 8-bit color. I'm red-green color blind and an IPS screen can be the difference between seeing darker reds on a dark background and not noticing anything is there for me. This can be fairly important for MMOs, and some shooters too.
 
I was going to get the Samsung S27A750D but TigerDirect isn't getting anymore and their $399 price was ideal. $499 everywhere else so I'm going with the U2412M IPS, cheaper, 16:10, and still has a good response time.
 
1. Color shift/viewing angle drives me nuts. Especially in portrait mode, which I do use fairly often. I notice this more on larger screens. Some TN are worse than others for this, so IPS ensures I don't have the problem.

2. Better color, more likely to be true 8-bit color. I'm red-green color blind and an IPS screen can be the difference between seeing darker reds on a dark background and not noticing anything is there for me. This can be fairly important for MMOs, and some shooters too.

If you're brave, try an asus vg236h or s23a950 or better s27a950d

after return here and tell me if you are able to return on crappy slow ips panel....

my friend force me to try a 120hz... and i ebayed all of my ips monitor.... the last are an U2711.....
 
quote!

120hz... is simply the most amazing think after ssd in the last 5 years of pc technology.


Which is kinda odd thing to say because above 60hz refresh rates were a norm back then when we were (and some still do) using CRTs. :p
 
just personal opinion/experience...
I have a U22 P22 U22 set up for my gaming rig and U27 for my workstation
I have tried to game on just the U22 and P22 before... IPS vs TN
I personally prefer the P22 over the U22 when it comes to gaming
(I will skip all those fancy words... it is just simply faster, looks great and does the job)
but of course the color is a little "off" and it is more red-ish compare to the U22 ( didnt bother to calibrate the P22 still lol )
but this is why I ended up with my U22 P22 U22 set up because most of the game I only use the center "main" monitor to game which is the P22 and some games uses eyefinity which is why the U22 on the sides
as for the viewing angle it doesnt bothers me as much when it is in landscape mode for the P22 but when it comes to portrait mode with the P22... it becomes hell and this is where the U22 shines hahah
 
i absolutely can not stand the gamma shift. i used a 26" asus TN for about 6hrs... my eyes burned like hell and i had a terrible head ache. i boxed up that asus and went back to my old dell 2001fp. now im on an hp zr24w. and i dont think anyone could ever pay me to go back to a TN panel.
 
Well if you're actually working on consumable media IPS is grade F ass next to a calibrated plasma display or an older CRT. The contrast is poor, normally they have obnoxious AG coatings, and they still lag. PVA is marginally better for everything but lag/refresh.

LCDs basically suck. TNs are the worst, but you're still missing a lot even with the NEC monitors. They're iffy and relatively inaccurate when working with shadow detail. The backlights are still crappy and bleed. The initial LCD tech was not ever designed to do what they're doing with them now, it's like trying to make wheels out of cubes.

I'd rather have an IPS panel than the TN panel for my work machine, but I can't really justify spending much on another LCD which I'll inevitably not like. People buy IPS because it's like having a choice between a Yugo, a Gremlin, and a 1985 Corolla. They're all pieces of shit, but at least the Corolla might not make you kill yourself.
 
I hooked up my Xbox 360 to a CRT HDTV the other day, it looked outstanding. Pixel for pixel quality is substantially better than a typical LCD.
 
Welcome to [H]ardOCP. We are gamers cut from a better quality cloth. If you think that TN dogfood is going to cut it here... well.. no. *kicks back in $1400 desk chair, lights Cuban cigar with $100 bill*

I'm not fussy between a good PVA and IPS really. My current gaming panel is IPS because it was on sale for a really good price. The IPS part was just icing on the cake.

Like mine?

409138266603456510710833004583.jpg


FWIW I just upgraded from a pretty good TN (245BW) to a 2412M because I couldn't stand the vertical shift and lack of color calibration.

To give an example of just how bad it is, center that picture of my chair in your monitor. When I'm looking dead on, I can see all of the black plastic support structure on the back of the chair (the "pixel" things that look like intelocking "H"). If I move my head just three inches lower, the entire top 30% of the chair fades to solid black and I can't pick out the support structures from the mesh. It's just a black blob.

And that's with a TN that's been calibrated with a colorimeter. Frankly, TN's can be bright and fast and have decent colors, but they absolutely suck to look at.
 
I hooked up my Xbox 360 to a CRT HDTV the other day, it looked outstanding. Pixel for pixel quality is substantially better than a typical LCD.

I have a 1080i CRT at home right now. Problem is it overscans like a beast, and only accepts 30 hz in over hdmi.
 
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